Re: [Biofuel] American diesels
Would this be the same for a 2006 350 with a diesel as the powerplant? Jonathanlres1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ford have had for several years not only the availability to Mazda Diesel engines but also the derivative of the Daimler Puch Styre engine. The Landrover Discoveries and others run with this now Ford engine. It has all but the same power to weight as petrol but is very expensive in parts and technology. There is no connection to the engine other than by electronics in the throttle/accelerator. The unit is solely computerized. See an earlier article I wrote. US$22,000 for the test and diagnostic equipment for the Fords all up last quote. Have not seen the specs on the latest Ford light trucks and pickups but presume them to be operating the derivatives of either Mazda or Styre (Daimler Puch). Would very much like to know the engine configuration if you have the information.Being me I would wander if Ford were just after the machining and equipment as an engine factory from Cummins. Seems with new laws coming in for diesel emissions that the Cummins would need a total face lift to comply, not just a Cat added to the exhausts. Where Ford alreadyhas the engine, the know how and needs the place and name.Doug - Original Message - From: Craig Harris To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 10:29 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] American diesels Ford planning on buying Cummins and also introducing a hybrid diesel. F150 are all ready running in target cities with diesels.- Original Message - From: Mike Weaver To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 5:52 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] American diesels The smallest one is the Jeep Liberty - fairly heavy and still no stick shift model.The last US build diesels were the ill-fated 5.7 liter conversions of the 70's. Miserable cars.The Dodge Cummins diesel trucks are fine, as are most of the Fords. The GM;s 6.2's were weak - the later models better.there were many models available 20 years or so ago - Isuzu, Toyota, Mazda, MB and VW. ONly VW and still offer diesel cars.bob allen wrote:about the only american made diesels are trucks with engine displacements of about 7 liters. No small trucks and no sedans.Jan Warnqvist wrote: Hello everybody in the Americas! I have one question for you concerning BD and the cars consuming it. It seems as if you all are prefering European cars for fueling BD instead of American diesels. Is that true, and in this case why? Arn´t GM:s diesels good for BD ? Jan WarnqvistBEGIN:VCARDVERSION:2.1N:Warnqvist;JanFN:Jan WarnqvistORG:AGERATEC ABTEL;WORK;VOICE:+46 11 33 53 70TEL;CELL;VOICE:+46 70 4993845URL;WORK:http://www.ageratec.comEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:[EMAIL PROTECTED]REV:20060518T194543ZEND:VCARD___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.392 / Virus Database: 268.6.0/342 - Release Date: 5/17/2006 ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:MailScanner has detected a possible fraud attempt from "journeytoforever.org" claiming to be http://journeytoforeverorg/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/-- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Lao Telecom MailScanner with NOD32, and is believed to be clean. ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/-- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Lao Telecom MailScanner with NOD32, and is believed to be clean. ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
Re: [Biofuel] Conversion tyo diesel
I am a newbe to this. However, will this work on a Jeep YJ??? Thank you, JonathanJJJN [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks Dave now you have me drooling,lres1 wrote:Jim,Very easy to put into the early Jeeps and keep the original gear box andtransfer box as well as the 4 wheel drive.There are two different early jeeps, well quite a lot really. Made by Fordand many other companies, the original designer got zippo for his troublesin designing them. The basic difference is the bonnet a high bonnet and alow bonnet. That is one has a bonnet that is about 8 Inches high and thusthe radiator etc to match, the other has a bonnet about 2 inches high at themost. Am at present rebuilding one with the low bonnet. Have just finished aCJ5 series with a Nissan Diesel and gear box as the front end was rubbish.Low bonnet: Your limit here is the height to clear the sump from the frontend and the throttle cable to clear the bonnet as the throttle cable sits ontop of the engine over the breather pipes thus it being the highest part ofthe engine. Mine is the CJ-5 version made by Willys. The bonnet is taller than the CJ-2A and Lower than a CJ-3B (High Hood) However it is much more than the Ford Mutt.High bonnet: All but any thing in the way of a 4 cylinder will fit as thatextra 6 inches leaves a lot more room to play with and keep all intact.Removal of the fan shroud also leaves a lot more room to the front where thecramping would normally take place. An overhead cam belt drive 2.2 or 2.4Ldoes very well in the high and low bonnet. Need to modify the sump and oilpickups plus a few other items, especially in the low bonnet version, andmake the bellhousing/adapter plate. However all this is quite easy.Need also to know if it is Ford or other make of the original engine. Onehas part of the bellhousing as part of the cylinder block casting one has aflat finish to the rear of the block, very easy to see the difference in theblocks. Original Willys Flat head Four Cylinder 30K miles. original.The intake manifold for these engines was from memory the first toincorporate the NZ design of a "hotbox" for more fuel economy. If your jeepis original it is easy to run on Ethanol due to the manifold system if ithas the NZ design fitted as original. The original has the manifold comingup slightly from the carburetor and sits on top bolted to the exhaustmanifold. Very easy for water injection and ethanol this system. Flat headside valve 4 cylinder no oil filter but an accessory fitted later. Now you make me want to start thinmking ethanol. Do i have to make modifications?As above is very easy to fit a Toyota 2.2 or 2.4 NA engine into thesevehicles. Did you want the four wheel drive still working as original? Yes, I want to keep it as is as it is so practical for this area. It is also the only thing I can still work on. LOLDoug Doug,would it be possible to put a Toyota diesel into a 1958 Willys Jeep?Jimlres1 wrote: Hello all,If any one wants to make a light truck or 4 wheel drive such as Ford,Chev or Jeep conversion to a Toyota or some such Diesel engine thereare some quite easy steps to achieving it using the originaltransmission etc. Can do this on the JtF sight as can give picturesand instructions.If you want to know how to fabricate the adapters we can do it on theJtF sight. If this is okay with the admin.Doug-- This message has been scanned for viruses anddangerous content by Lao Telecom *MailScanner* with NOD32, and isbelieved to be clean.___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/-- This message has been scanned for viruses anddangerous content by Lao Telecom MailScanner with NOD32, and isbelieved to be clean. ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden DunlapIS Network Systems AnalystYour PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209Inglewood, California 90309-4209323-779-2752/HomeThe information contained in this transmission is
Re: [Biofuel] American diesels
Thank you! I can use this information. Jonathanlres1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Jeep Diesel engine was the Italian VM engine, the same that was fittedto some European cars. VM was connected with Jeep/Chrysler but was takenover by GM causing the parts prices for the VM through Jeep to go throughthe roof.The Chev Blazer Diesels had 6 volts for the glow plugs, 12 volts for runningand 24 volts for starting in the earlier stages. The control systems forthis very basic GM engine was over the top as was a modified truck engine tofit the smaller 4 wheel drive. The injector pump was a bit of a problem inmany areas including the glass ball that fitted to the air bleed backsystem. Very troublesome removing burnt glow plugs if the engine had beenjump started incorrectly. Very noisy when running.The Fords should not be too much of a problem as in many parts of the worldFord is connected to Mazda and thus the smaller Mazda Diesel engines.Toyota Diesel engines are the best option we have here. The are easilyfitted to Jeeps, Fords and others onto the original transmissions.Doug The smallest one is the Jeep Liberty - fairly heavy and still no stick shift model. The last US build diesels were the ill-fated 5.7 liter conversions of the 70's. Miserable cars. The Dodge Cummins diesel trucks are fine, as are most of the Fords. The GM;s 6.2's were weak - the later models better. there were many models available 20 years or so ago - Isuzu, Toyota, Mazda, MB and VW. ONly VW and still offer diesel cars. bob allen wrote: about the only american made diesels are trucks with engine displacementsof about 7 liters. No small trucks and no sedans. Jan Warnqvist wrote: Hello everybody in the Americas! I have one question for you concerning BD and the cars consuming it. It seems as if you all are prefering European cars for fueling BD instead of American diesels. Is that true, and in this case why? Arn´t GM:s diesels good for BD ? Jan Warnqvist BEGIN:VCARD VERSION:2.1 N:Warnqvist;Jan FN:Jan Warnqvist ORG:AGERATEC AB TEL;WORK;VOICE:+46 11 33 53 70 TEL;CELL;VOICE:+46 70 4993845 URL;WORK:http://www.ageratec.com EMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:[EMAIL PROTECTED] REV:20060518T194543Z END:VCARD ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.392 / Virus Database: 268.6.0/342 - Release Date: 5/17/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Lao Telecom MailScanner with NOD32, and is believed to be clean.-- This message has been scanned for viruses anddangerous content by Lao Telecom MailScanner with NOD32, and isbelieved to be clean.___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden DunlapIS Network Systems AnalystYour PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209Inglewood, California 90309-4209323-779-2752/HomeThe information contained in this transmission is priviledged and confidential in nature and intended only for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any distribution, copying, disclosure or taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this transmission is strictly prohibited and review by any individual other than the intended recipient shall not constitute waiver of privilege. If you have received this transmission in error, please notify us immediately and completely remove the original transmission. Ring'em or ping'em. Make PC-to-phone calls as low as 1¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
Re: [Biofuel] my opinion of Northern Tool
Good day, Thank you for the FYI! Thank you, Jonathan[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Keith, et. al.,I cannot not in good conscience recommend the vendor Northern Tool. They market products of poor quality, sell warranties quickly for the same products and when those products fail- won't deliver per the terms of the warranty.Respectfully submitted, MichaelThe British philosopher Bertrand Russell once wrote that "the trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt."Michael Lendzian___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden DunlapIS Network Systems AnalystYour PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209Inglewood, California 90309-4209323-779-2752/HomeThe information contained in this transmission is priviledged and confidential in nature and intended only for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any distribution, copying, disclosure or taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this transmission is strictly prohibited and review by any individual other than the intended recipient shall not constitute waiver of privilege. If you have received this transmission in error, please notify us immediately and completely remove the original transmission. Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1/min.___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] PBS Green Building show
Mike, Thanks! I am adding to one of my homes. I am adding Solar and batteries to reduce my power bill and will now think about what I will use to the addition. Thanks, JonathanMichael Luich [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.buildinggreentv.com/Apparently PBS is picking up a 13 episode series about building greenhomes. It hasn't been scheduled yet but is supposed to be this summer.I'll keep my eye out for airdates and should be able to share theepisodes.Mike Luich---Producers Michael Mattioli and Kevin Contrerasof Special Finish Films, present "Building Green," the PBS homeimprovement television series about creating gorgeous homes that arehealthier, more energy efficient, and better for the environment. Every phase of sustainable construction is presented by host KevinContreras, who explores green building from all angles, sharinginformation and showing lots of in depth, "how-to" build greenerhomes. Natural home products and techniques like straw bale buildingare covered in detail to show the infinite ways to build a healthyhouse. Segments like "Saving Green" and "Easy Steps" show viewerswhat they can do in real world circumstances to make choices to buildgreen. Buildinggreentv.comis a guide to integrating green building products, services, and otherresources into living green.Building Green World Premieresat the Santa Barbara Film Festival!Building Green Goes MainstreamAt "Building Green" we are committed to bringing you the bestinformation on technology, people, products, and ideas to make yourhome healthier, your life more enjoyable and your footprint lighter onthe planet. That is why we are constantly talking to the best andbrightest minds in green building, researching the newest inventions,rediscovering ancient techniques, and attending workshops andconferences around the world. We stay informed to keep you informed.Our projected air date is Summer 2006, and we are speaking with themost forward thinking corporations on the planet about joining forcesto help bring the American people this vital information. Beyond thatwe are shooting more footage every week and turning out more episodes.We are pleased and honored to be doing this work to connect peoplewith manufacturers, experts, and like-minded individuals to helpcreate better living and working spaces for each person.We have been inundated by calls from friends like you about BuildingGreen's growing popularity. We are so encouraged to find out about thegreat work being done around the country and world with respect togreen building. Every week we read a new article about how it isbecoming mainstream and see that people are ready for the significantchanges green building is making our world.American business is learning that it is possible to "do well by doinggood" with economics driving the market towards sustainability,creating positive social and environmental change in the process!Around the world businesses specializing in green products are poppingup and doing very well. Architects and builders are becoming greenerby the moment. International corporations are realizing that themarket is demanding cleaner, greener products and watching that thosecompanies conduct their business in ways that are more environmentallyfriendly.We want people to know that "Building Green" is about mindful choices,addressing family health and quality of life issues with everydecision made within any given budget. In this case, it definitely isthe thought that counts!!What we think, do, and teach shapes the universe in powerfullyprofound ways beyond our imagination and comprehension. We hope thatwe can help direct this power to ends that benefit us as a planet, ashumans, and as living beings on this earth, stewards of her delicatelybalanced and integrated beauty, giving back no more than what we take,keeping and honoring that balance with every concious act.___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden DunlapIS Network Systems AnalystYour PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209Inglewood, California 90309-4209323-779-2752/HomeThe information contained in this transmission is priviledged and confidential in nature and intended only for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any distribution, copying, disclosure or taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this transmission is strictly prohibited and review by any individual other than the intended recipient shall not constitute waiver of privilege. If you have received this transmission in
[Biofuel] Have anyone used this machine?
I have just received a catalog from Hardy Diesel and I was looking at the "FuelMeister Personal Biodiesel Processors" It cost about 3K. Has anyone used this one and if so would you recommend it? Thanks, Jon Yahoo! Mail Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] No Child Left Unquestioned by Homeland Security!!
JMichael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ãAfter four years more in this office I want people to look back and say, ÎThe world is a more peaceful place,âä Mr. Bush told supporters at a community college in Iowa. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/07/20/politics/main630752.shtml "No Child Left Behind"? Civics Student...or Enemy of America? By Matthew Rothschild, The Progressive. Posted October 7, 2005. http://www.alternet.org/walmart/26503/#thumbtack Selina Jarvis is the chair of the social studies department at Currituck County High School in North Carolina, and she is not used to having the Secret Service question her or one of her students. But that's what happened on September 20. Jarvis had assigned her senior civics and economics class "to take photographs to illustrate their rights in the Bill of Rights," she says. One student "had taken a photo of George Bush out of a magazine and tacked the picture to a wall with a red thumb tack through his head. Then he made a thumb's-down sign with his own hand next to the President's picture, and he had a photo taken of that, and he pasted it on a poster." According to Jarvis, the student, who remains anonymous, was just doing his assignment, illustrating the right to dissent. But over at the Kitty Hawk Wal-Mart, where the student took his film to be developed, this right is evidently suspect. An employee in that Wal-Mart photo department called the Kitty Hawk police on the student. And the Kitty Hawk police turned the matter over to the Secret Service. On Tuesday, September 20, the Secret Service came to Currituck High. "At 1:35, the student came to me and told me that the Secret Service had taken his poster," Jarvis says. "I didn't believe him at first. But they had come into my room when I wasn't there and had taken his poster, which was in a stack with all the others." She says the student was upset. "He was nervous, he was scared, and his parents were out of town on business," says Jarvis. She, too, had to talk to the Secret Service. "Halfway through my afternoon class, the assistant principal got me out of class and took me to the office conference room," she says. "Two men from the Secret Service were there. They asked me what I knew about the student. I told them he was a great kid, that he was in the homecoming court, and that he'd never been in any trouble." Then they got down to his poster. "They asked me, didn't I think that it was suspicious," she recalls. "I said no, it was a Bill of Rights project!" At the end of the meeting, they told her the incident "would be interpreted by the U.S. attorney, who would decide whether the student could be indicted," she says. The student was not indicted, and the Secret Service did not pursue the case further. "I blame Wal-Mart more than anybody," she says. "I was really disgusted with them. But everyone was using poor judgment, from Wal-Mart up to the Secret Service." When contacted, an employee in the photo department at the Wal-Mart in Kitty Hawk said, "You have to call either the home office or the authorities to get any information about that." Jacquie Young, a spokesperson for Wal-Mart at company headquarters, did not provide comment within a 24-hour period. Sharon Davenport of the Kitty Hawk Police Department said, "We just handed it over" to the Secret Service. "No investigative report was filed." Jonathan Scherry, spokesman for the Secret Service in Washington, D.C., said, "We certainly respect artistic freedom, but we also have the responsibility to look into incidents when necessary. In this case, it was brought to our attention from a private citizen, a photo lab employee." Jarvis uses one word to describe the whole incident: "ridiculous." Matthew Rothschild is the editor of The Progressive. ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Calculating the Solar Budget for any place
Hey there, Siemens are daily. I would only guess that yours would be the same. Happy holidays, Jonathan Randal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've been working on how to calculate the solar budget for any number of square feet in anyplace. Well, my place. Do people buy that an average figure of 636 watts of solar radiation /sq. meter reach the surface? I have that in an illustration I found, but it does not give the frequency. Would that be daily? Any leads on how to proceed would be appreciated. R -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.289 / Virus Database: 265.4.2 - Release Date: 11/24/2004 ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: Re[2]: [Biofuel] Gardening and Compost
Hey! What part of Africa? What Country??? Jonathan addy abslew [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: HELLO, AAL OUT THERE, This is just what happens in city rubbish piles here in Africa where farmers go to pack compost soil from under. Nobody turns the piles and everyday there is compost fot the urban farmers. But i want to do composting of mainly sawdust and much less farm stubbles in a really fast way. I have read of a stock made out of cassava by a now late farmer in Asia. This stock speeds up compostimg. Any one who can tell how to make this stock and use it in composting? Thanks to all you guys who care to give answers. - Original Message - From: Gustl Steiner-Zehender To: Keith Addison Subject: Re[2]: [Biofuel] Gardening and Compost Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 08:47:59 -0500 Hallo Keith, We're sort of passive aerobic here. We just keep piling stuff on the top and taking what we need from the bottom. Never turn it and never water it and we have always had plenty for our needs. It probably takes longer this way but it suits our needs. Happy Happy, Gustl Wednesday, 24 November, 2004, 08:31:59, you wrote: Hi, To speed up the decomposition, you have to add some water and turn the material once a day to introduce oxygen. KA Certainly no need to turn once a day, if ever. It needs water, yes, KA but not too much water or it will go anaerobic, very difficult to KA recover - that's probably the most common reason for failure. Water KA content should be about 60-65%, overall carbon/nitrogen ratio should KA be 25-30:1, and it needs plenty of air. Surface area is important - KA the greater the surface area of the materials, ie the smaller the KA bits are, the easier it is for the microorganisms to attack them, BUT KA the smaller the bits are the less the aeration through the heap. -- Je mehr wir haben, desto mehr fordert Gott von uns. Mitglied-Team AMIGA ICQ: 22211253-Gustli The safest road to Hell is the gradual one - the gentle slope, soft underfoot, without sudden turnings, without milestones, without signposts. C. S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters Es gibt Wahrheiten, die so sehr auf der Straße liegen, daß sie gerade deshalb von der gewöhnlichen Welt nicht gesehen oder wenigstens nicht erkannt werden. Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music. George Carlin The best portion of a good man's life - His little, nameless, unremembered acts of kindness and of love. William Wordsworth ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ -- ___ Get your free email from www.doramail.com with 30 Megs of disk space in webhosting and e-mail storage! Powered by Outblaze ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Solar Water Heater Revisited
How about in a word doc Gustl Steiner-Zehender [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hallo Folks, I have been trying to load this page for half an hour but it will not load: http://www.green-trust.org/2000/solar/sunontap/page9.htm Can anyone load the thing and send it to me or load it, convert it to a .pdf and send it to me? Any help would be appreciated. Thank you kindly. Happy Happy, Gustl -- Je mehr wir haben, desto mehr fordert Gott von uns. Mitglied-Team AMIGA ICQ: 22211253-Gustli The safest road to Hell is the gradual one - the gentle slope, soft underfoot, without sudden turnings, without milestones, without signposts. C. S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters Es gibt Wahrheiten, die so sehr auf der Straße liegen, daß sie gerade deshalb von der gewöhnlichen Welt nicht gesehen oder wenigstens nicht erkannt werden. Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music. George Carlin The best portion of a good man's life - His little, nameless, unremembered acts of kindness and of love. William Wordsworth ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Solar Water Heater Revisited
Please support WebConX by visiting this sponsor. brackets will be mounted: Take one of the four tank support brackets and center it five inches to the right of the plywood's center line; place another one five inches to the left. Position the brackets so that they're square to the plywood's factory edge, with their inner corners just touching the tank's circle. Mark this location for future reference. That's it. Now you're ready to put your pencil marks to use. Cutting The Involutes Take the sheet of plywood you've been working on, and place it on top of the duplicate piece you cut earlier. Clamp or lightly nail the two sheets together (rough side to rough side), and use a saber saw to cut along the modified involute curve. Because you're cutting through both sheets of plywood at once, you'll end up with two virtually identical involute patterns, and that's just what you want. (Save the pieces of scrap plywood. They can be used later on.) Drill one 3/8-inch hole at each of the support bracket mounting locations, making sure you drill through both sheets of plywood. Then unclamp and separate the involute patterns. Later on, these patterns and the entire reflector assembly will be covered with a mirrorlike layer of aluminized Mylar (a plastic). Cutting the Mylar to fit these complex curves would be very difficult to do when the reflector is completely assembled. Instead, it makes much more sense to cut the Mylar now, and set it aside for later use. Photo Three shows how: Cover an area of the floor with newspaper and unroll the Mylar so that the side with the aluminized coating is facing up and the clear plastic side is down. (To determine which side is which, take a pencil eraser or a rag covered with a small amount of white toothpaste and rub one side of the Mylar. If the eraser or the cloth turns black, you have rubbed the side that has the thin, shiny coat of aluminum.) Place one of the involute patterns on the Mylar, kneel on the pattern, and using a utility knife, cut through the Mylar along the perimeter of the plywood. When you're done, use a felt-tipped pen to mark the letter A on both the pattern and the Mylar. Next, repeat the entire operation and cut a second piece of Mylar, this time using the second involute pattern as a template. Mark both these second pieces B, then set the Mylar aside. Above The cusp's original sharp angle must be altered to 90 degrees so that a square 2 X 2-inch reflector center support can be used as the backbone of the assembly. In later steps, aluminum flashing will be added to recreate the initial shape of the cusp. Building The Reflector Now (at last) you're ready to begin some actual construction, adding the top cleats, center cleats, and tank support bracket cleats onto the involute patterns. Photo Four illustrates this step. First, cut out all the cleats to the correct dimensions. Next, using wood glue and one-inch nails, fasten one top cleat to each of the plywood involute patterns. The cleat should be mounted on the rough side of the plywood, flush with the factory edge, and with an equal amount of overhang to either side of the pattern. (Nail in from the plywood.) Next, cut and mount the two center cleats. (These cleats can be cut from corners of the scrap plywood left over from cutting the involute patterns.) The point of the cleat should extend about 2'/4 inches into the space between the involute halves, as shown in Photo Four. (A precise measurement is unnecessary.) Again, use wood glue and nails to secure the cleats. The tank support bracket cleats are the last to be mounted. They should be positioned flush against the top cleat and spaced so that they fall squarely over the 3/8-inch bracket mounting holes you drilled earlier into the plywood. Once the bracket cleats are mounted, use the bracket holes as a guide, and drill through the cleats at the same location. (The 3/8-inch bracket holes must extend through both the plywood and the cleat.) With the addition of the two reflector side boards, the assembly begins to take on a recognizable form. First, cut the side boards to length. Then stand the two involute patterns on their factory ends (as shown in Photo Five) and glue and nail the side boards into the top cleats. Use 8d nails, two per joint. Photo Five also shows the addition of the reflector center support and two sheets of hardboard reflector backing: Cut the center support and both sheets of hardboard to length. Because each hardboard sheet will form half of the curved reflector area, the width of each sheet must equal half the perimeter of the involute curve. However, as Illustration D shows, one of the hardboard sheets will overlap the other by 1/8 inch, so one of the sheets must be trimmed by this amount. Use a tape measure or a length of wire to measure the length of one half of the involute curve (the distance along the perimeter between the point of the cusp and the
Re: Re[2]: [Biofuel] Solar Water Heater Revisited
Please support WebConX by visiting this sponsor. brackets will be mounted: Take one of the four tank support brackets and center it five inches to the right of the plywood's center line; place another one five inches to the left. Position the brackets so that they're square to the plywood's factory edge, with their inner corners just touching the tank's circle. Mark this location for future reference. That's it. Now you're ready to put your pencil marks to use. Cutting The Involutes Take the sheet of plywood you've been working on, and place it on top of the duplicate piece you cut earlier. Clamp or lightly nail the two sheets together (rough side to rough side), and use a saber saw to cut along the modified involute curve. Because you're cutting through both sheets of plywood at once, you'll end up with two virtually identical involute patterns, and that's just what you want. (Save the pieces of scrap plywood. They can be used later on.) Drill one 3/8-inch hole at each of the support bracket mounting locations, making sure you drill through both sheets of plywood. Then unclamp and separate the involute patterns. Later on, these patterns and the entire reflector assembly will be covered with a mirrorlike layer of aluminized Mylar (a plastic). Cutting the Mylar to fit these complex curves would be very difficult to do when the reflector is completely assembled. Instead, it makes much more sense to cut the Mylar now, and set it aside for later use. Photo Three shows how: Cover an area of the floor with newspaper and unroll the Mylar so that the side with the aluminized coating is facing up and the clear plastic side is down. (To determine which side is which, take a pencil eraser or a rag covered with a small amount of white toothpaste and rub one side of the Mylar. If the eraser or the cloth turns black, you have rubbed the side that has the thin, shiny coat of aluminum.) Place one of the involute patterns on the Mylar, kneel on the pattern, and using a utility knife, cut through the Mylar along the perimeter of the plywood. When you're done, use a felt-tipped pen to mark the letter A on both the pattern and the Mylar. Next, repeat the entire operation and cut a second piece of Mylar, this time using the second involute pattern as a template. Mark both these second pieces B, then set the Mylar aside. Above The cusp's original sharp angle must be altered to 90 degrees so that a square 2 X 2-inch reflector center support can be used as the backbone of the assembly. In later steps, aluminum flashing will be added to recreate the initial shape of the cusp. Building The Reflector Now (at last) you're ready to begin some actual construction, adding the top cleats, center cleats, and tank support bracket cleats onto the involute patterns. Photo Four illustrates this step. First, cut out all the cleats to the correct dimensions. Next, using wood glue and one-inch nails, fasten one top cleat to each of the plywood involute patterns. The cleat should be mounted on the rough side of the plywood, flush with the factory edge, and with an equal amount of overhang to either side of the pattern. (Nail in from the plywood.) Next, cut and mount the two center cleats. (These cleats can be cut from corners of the scrap plywood left over from cutting the involute patterns.) The point of the cleat should extend about 2'/4 inches into the space between the involute halves, as shown in Photo Four. (A precise measurement is unnecessary.) Again, use wood glue and nails to secure the cleats. The tank support bracket cleats are the last to be mounted. They should be positioned flush against the top cleat and spaced so that they fall squarely over the 3/8-inch bracket mounting holes you drilled earlier into the plywood. Once the bracket cleats are mounted, use the bracket holes as a guide, and drill through the cleats at the same location. (The 3/8-inch bracket holes must extend through both the plywood and the cleat.) With the addition of the two reflector side boards, the assembly begins to take on a recognizable form. First, cut the side boards to length. Then stand the two involute patterns on their factory ends (as shown in Photo Five) and glue and nail the side boards into the top cleats. Use 8d nails, two per joint. Photo Five also shows the addition of the reflector center support and two sheets of hardboard reflector backing: Cut the center support and both sheets of hardboard to length. Because each hardboard sheet will form half of the curved reflector area, the width of each sheet must equal half the perimeter of the involute curve. However, as Illustration D shows, one of the hardboard sheets will overlap the other by 1/8 inch, so one of the sheets must be trimmed by this amount. Use a tape measure or a length of wire to measure the length of one half of the involute curve (the distance along the perimeter between the point of the cusp and the
Re: Re[2]: [Biofuel] Solar Water Heater Revisited
Gustl Steiner-Zehender [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hallo Jonathan, Tuesday, 16 November, 2004, 10:07:02, you wrote: JD How about in a word doc A Word doc will work. I can convert it to .pdf myself. Thank you very kindly friend. Happy Happy, Gustl -- Je mehr wir haben, desto mehr fordert Gott von uns. Mitglied-Team AMIGA ICQ: 22211253-Gustli The safest road to Hell is the gradual one - the gentle slope, soft underfoot, without sudden turnings, without milestones, without signposts. C. S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters Es gibt Wahrheiten, die so sehr auf der Straße liegen, daß sie gerade deshalb von der gewöhnlichen Welt nicht gesehen oder wenigstens nicht erkannt werden. Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music. George Carlin The best portion of a good man's life - His little, nameless, unremembered acts of kindness and of love. William Wordsworth ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Meet the all-new My Yahoo! Try it today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: Re[2]: [Biofuel] Solar Water Heater Revisited
I have tried a few times now and it has not worked. However, I did pasted it into the email. I hope this helps. Jonathan Gustl Steiner-Zehender [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hallo Jonathan, Tuesday, 16 November, 2004, 10:07:02, you wrote: JD How about in a word doc A Word doc will work. I can convert it to .pdf myself. Thank you very kindly friend. Happy Happy, Gustl -- Je mehr wir haben, desto mehr fordert Gott von uns. Mitglied-Team AMIGA ICQ: 22211253-Gustli The safest road to Hell is the gradual one - the gentle slope, soft underfoot, without sudden turnings, without milestones, without signposts. C. S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters Es gibt Wahrheiten, die so sehr auf der Straße liegen, daß sie gerade deshalb von der gewöhnlichen Welt nicht gesehen oder wenigstens nicht erkannt werden. Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music. George Carlin The best portion of a good man's life - His little, nameless, unremembered acts of kindness and of love. William Wordsworth ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Meet the all-new My Yahoo! Try it today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
RE: [Biofuel] about God
Very well said... Jonathan Tim Ferguson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gabriel, You are obviously a profound thinker so I will pose a troubling question to you. Which cam first? The Chicken..or the Egg? Best wishes, Tim -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Gabriel Proulx Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 9:54 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Biofuel] about God I saw that some people are talking about God. I just want to express my point of view about God: it's total bullshit! It's told that God can create and do anything, as he wish. Following the logic of this statement, he could create a rock which is impossible to lift even for him because he can do anything he wants. But if he can't lift that rock, this mean he can't do anything he wants. Seems that we got a paradox here. Seems that the Bible is not telling the truth. Some peole will say: it's impossible to create a rock which is impossible to lift even God can't do that. That directly say that god can't do anything and that the Bible was not right. Don't it smell like bullshit? Think about that and tell me if paradox can be true. Stop wasting your life and energy in this ridiculous story. It's all about collecting beliver's money. Help the world evolve instead. __ ___ Gardez le contrôle grâce à la protection contre les fenêtres pop-up articulée sur la technologie brevetée Microsoft SmartScreen http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=fr-capage=features/ popup Commencez dès maintenant à profiter de tous les avantages de MSN Premium et obtenez les deux premiers mois GRATUITS*. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ - Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
RE: [Biofuel] 4 more years
And the song said... I get by with a little help from my friends Many thanks Peggy. Please have a wonderful weekend, Jonathan Peggy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Johathan, The point is well taken about the present being the point of power. The past is malleable according to individual perspectives; the future is imagined. The only place one can actively participate is in the present moment. Therefore, in our regards to our perceptions and ability to know what is happening, the ONLY thing we can do is ACT right now for the best possible scenario in our behalf. Hopefully that action is in the will to good for global consciousness. I think this could be another way of verbalizing what you are saying... Best wishes, Peggy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan Dunlap Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 11:17 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Biofuel] 4 more years Yes! And can never forget them. One thing... I never said I was for the guy. Did not vote for him this time nor the last time! However, what is done is done. Somehow we all must make the best of it. Every one I know do not believe he won. Most people I know, here in the US and elsewhere in the World thinks he stole it again. So what do we do as a Country? As a citizen, I will do the very best for myself family, teach my kids the right way and try to make this place a better place. This guy, the President reminds me of the movie The Emperor's Club I think it was called. In short, it's about a guy who Dad's is well known in politics and how his brat of a kid gets by the easy way and never changes even in adulthood. Well. This time I'm done! Best Regards, Jonathan DHAJOGLO wrote:Together or Divided one thing is for suer... Regan-esque deficit spending coupled with [corporate] tax-cuts will make for high inflation and a bad economy. Surley you remember the 80s? My dear brother, I believe I understand what you are saying here. However, we as citizens of this United States of America must unite not only under this President for the next four years, but under every one that follows after him. United We Stand. Divided We Fall. That is how I see it from this side of the tracks, Jonathan ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: Re[2]: [Biofuel] 4 more years
Good day Gustl, I appreciate your comments on this issue. For a brief moment, I felt misunderstood and it was as if I was wasting my time. However, you Peggy and some others changed that for me. Some of the things that are going on with the highest office in our Country is not good and moving will not make it better. Anytime there is a very large percentage of citizens that feels something under-hand took place with an election, it will never be of any good. Therefore, I pray for us all. Again, I thank you all, Jonathan Gustl Steiner-Zehender [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Hallo Jonathan, Thursday, 04 November, 2004, 23:07:47, you wrote: Our problem is that we are having trouble coming together as a species right now. I do see that it is getting slowly better and better, but very slowly. People are so slow to understand and quick to anger. If someone criticizes the actions of the Republicans they are automatically labelled a liberal. I someone criticizes the actions of the Israeli zionists they are labelled anti-semitic. I a white man criticizes the actions of a black man they are labelled racist. Without even giving a thought to it, without rational and unbiased examination, without even a care as to the validity of the criticism. What appears to be happening is that folks are not so much concerned with the correctness of the proposition, but rather with their winning the argument at any cost. My side wins. How sorry is that? What about truth wins, right wins, morality wins? For myself, I like it when I am proven wrong about something because that gives me the opportunity to change my beliefs and position to be more in line with what is right and true. I don't like being wrong about things and am more than willing to adjust to what is right. I don't think a lot of folks are like that. It seems that somehow they have more of an investment in winning the argument than in really being right. Competition has its limits and drawbacks and is over rated. Given the choice between cooperation and competition I would choose cooperation. A person has to want to understand before a rational conversation, discussion or argument can get underway. Over in a neighboring town there is a guy who refuses to understand anyone who disagrees with him. I have spoken with him and I get more and more simple in my explainations to the point where a child could understand what I am saying and he refuses to understand because he would then lose his position and it would force him to change and he is unwilling to to this. We just need to keep on trying, and for those of us believing in such things, praying, and have faith that a brighter and better day will come. And yes, friend, peace to us all. Happy Happy, Gustl JD Man... JD Dubya??? JD Unite = join, fuse, mix, bone, Come together I could go on and on JD If We as a Country do not Unite is some way then we as a Country are weak. We all do not have to agree on every issue. That is the very thing that makes this Country unique. Remember Freedom of JD speech, religious conviction JD Look The only thing I want to get across is that I did not like the out come of this election. However, as an American, I feel that we all must seek some sort of common ground. JD Without it, I dont see us moving forward. The past is just that! The past. We need to learn from it and move forward. JD Peace to us all, JD Jonathan JD Ken Provost wrote: JD on 11/4/04 4:06 PM, Jonathan Dunlap at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe I understand what you are saying here. However, we as citizens of this United States of America must unite not only under this President for the next four years, but under every one that follows after him. ?United We Stand? Divided We Fall?. JD I will never unite (whatever that means) with anyone under Dubya JD or any other jerk who may come along. If that means we fall (whatever JD THAT means), sobeit. JD California oughta be a separate country anyway -- I'd hardly call that JD falling. -K -- Je mehr wir haben, desto mehr fordert Gott von uns. Mitglied-Team AMIGA ICQ: 22211253-Gustli The safest road to Hell is the gradual one - the gentle slope, soft underfoot, without sudden turnings, without milestones, without signposts. C. S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters Es gibt Wahrheiten, die so sehr auf der Straße liegen, daß sie gerade deshalb von der gewöhnlichen Welt nicht gesehen oder wenigstens nicht erkannt werden. Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music. George Carlin The best portion of a good man's life - His little, nameless, unremembered acts of kindness and of love. William Wordsworth ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http
Re: [Biofuel] 4 more years
My dear brother, I believe I understand what you are saying here. However, we as citizens of this United States of America must unite not only under this President for the next four years, but under every one that follows after him. United We Stand Divided We Fall. That is how I see it from this side of the tracks, Jonathan Ware, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, My fellow countrymen have spoken at the polls and since I was born here and live here I choose to accept the majorities decision(until I can come up with an alternative). I am very unhappy to know that more than 50% of those who took the time to vote approve of: 1) waging aggressive war on the whim of the president. 2) indiscriminate bombing of civilians using depleted uranium(so called dirty bombs) as well as cluster bombs and land mines. 3) building and maintaining concentration camps, i.e, Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib and other detention camps around the world. 4) the indefinite detention with no charges being presented with no access to a legal system of anyone the President chooses to detain. 5) torturing prisoners. 6) the taking away of my freedom of speech. If I wrote what I really believed, I'd end up in prison. 7) considering the actions of our government above the rule of law and not participating in a international court where war criminals are brought to justice(I won't mention any names here). 8) ignoring the consequences to the environment for the short term gains of industry. 9) supporting governments(with military and other aid) which have policies of human rights abuses I don't want to be just a complainer; I want to find solutions. Most any system can be improved by an iterative process of test, evaluation and implemention of improvements. We can't become a better country by only talking about the good things we have done in the past. If we ignore the problems, they are not going to just go away. We need to discuss our mistakes and our flaws in order to come up with solutions for improvement. John Ware ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com/a ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] the vote
Something to think about. Friedrich Friesinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Hey Brian, dont you forget,that GWB has good connections to the Bin Laden Family! How about he asked for that Tape to support his reelection? Fritz - Original Message - From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 12:42 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] the vote I'm surprised that none of the talking heads are talking about the effect that the Osama video possibly had on the election. i think it scared some people into the Bush camp. I think that was exactly the intention of the video. The fact that it read like a Kerry campaign speech makes that even more obvious. Osama was afraid of losing HIS base, and did what he needed to assure that his choice for President was re-elected. And, the mindless sheep lined up to follow. Ultimately, I am more convinced than ever that even demonstrations of hundreds of thousands against the horrific war in Iraq will not be effective in moving public opinion in the US until massive numbers of US forces are killed and astounding numbers of Iraqis and other Arab people are slaughtered with still no end to the war in sight. American casualties do not matter to this administration, as long as they are not obstructed in the acheivement of their goals. And, I do not believe that any of us know what their goals even are. We all have guesses, but I think that we think in far too simple of terms. As for Arab casualties, I don't think that there is any hope for that to sway the public. Americans have far too much of a we're number 1 attitude, and I fear that the majority view every Arab death as a point for the home team. It's a horrible realization to come to, but to the average American Arabs are the enemy, and as a group we do not have the capacity to see them as human beings with the same goals that we have. So, until they start scoring more points than we do, the American public will not be moved. That is the kind of arrogance with which we live. Brian ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com/a ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] 4 more years
Man... Dubya??? Unite = join, fuse, mix, bone, Come together I could go on and on If We as a Country do not Unite is some way then we as a Country are weak. We all do not have to agree on every issue. That is the very thing that makes this Country unique. Remember Freedom of speech, religious conviction Look The only thing I want to get across is that I did not like the out come of this election. However, as an American, I feel that we all must seek some sort of common ground. Without it, I dont see us moving forward. The past is just that! The past. We need to learn from it and move forward. Peace to us all, Jonathan Ken Provost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: on 11/4/04 4:06 PM, Jonathan Dunlap at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe I understand what you are saying here. However, we as citizens of this United States of America must unite not only under this President for the next four years, but under every one that follows after him. ?United We Stand? Divided We Fall?. I will never unite (whatever that means) with anyone under Dubya or any other jerk who may come along. If that means we fall (whatever THAT means), sobeit. California oughta be a separate country anyway -- I'd hardly call that falling. -K ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] 4 more years
I feel what you are saying and in many ways I agree. However, I ask you this What is your solution to this issue? Im all ears Jonathan Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Unity? Hah!!! That was Shrub's empty promise four years ago. The man will say whatever it takes to get what he wants and then move on - the quintesential flip-flopper and not one to be trusted or left unwatched. I believe the mantra for the next four years of turmoil, arrogance and oppression exerted by this shyster within his own borders will be: I'll hug your elephant when you kiss my ass. (Helps to include the visual of both parties' mascots, elephant and donkey.) Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: Ken Provost To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 9:15 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] 4 more years on 11/4/04 4:06 PM, Jonathan Dunlap at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe I understand what you are saying here. However, we as citizens of this United States of America must unite not only under this President for the next four years, but under every one that follows after him. ?United We Stand? Divided We Fall?. I will never unite (whatever that means) with anyone under Dubya or any other jerk who may come along. If that means we fall (whatever THAT means), sobeit. California oughta be a separate country anyway -- I'd hardly call that falling. -K ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com/a ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] 4 more years
Yes! And can never forget them. One thing... I never said I was for the guy. Did not vote for him this time nor the last time! However, what is done is done Somehow we all must make the best of it. Every one I know do not believe he won. Most people I know, here in the US and elsewhere in the World thinks he stole it again. So what do we do as a Country? As a citizen, I will do the very best for myself family, teach my kids the right way and try to make this place a better place. This guy, the President reminds me of the movie The Emperors Club I think it was called. In short, its about a guy who Dads is well known in politics and how his brat of a kid gets by the easy way and never changes even in adulthood. Well This time Im done! Best Regards, Jonathan DHAJOGLO [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Together or Divided one thing is for suer... Regan-esque deficit spending coupled with [corporate] tax-cuts will make for high inflation and a bad economy. Surley you remember the 80s? My dear brother, I believe I understand what you are saying here. However, we as citizens of this United States of America must unite not only under this President for the next four years, but under every one that follows after him. United We Stand Divided We Fall. That is how I see it from this side of the tracks, Jonathan ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Kerry Won
Only in America! F. Desprez [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Keith Addison a écrit : http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1104-36.htm Published on Thursday, November 4, 2004 by TomPaine.com Kerry Won by Greg Palast (...) An answer from a friend of mine (just kidding, we love you quand meme from the other side of Atlantic) http://www.lnreview.co.uk/news/004550.php FD ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com/a ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] OT: Solar Water Heater?
Hey Brian, Check out this site... http://shop.altenergystore.com/index.asp?cartId=9315923O-EVEREST-HSHH661tpc=url=IND This may do it for you... Best regards, Jonathan Brian Ziems [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Everyone, My family is going to be putting an addition on our house, and I wanted to set up a solar water heating system for that part of the house. I wanted to know if any of the list members had any recommendations of brand, type, websites with info,...etc. The capacity needed would be 60 gallons. Thanks in advance. Brian Z __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Express yourself with Y! Messenger! Free. Download now. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Electric Yard Tools (was Trees and power companies)
Please check the web address and resend it to us please This one is not working. Thank you, Jonathan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, found the Alternative Energy store on web http//shop.altenergystore.com/ you's all know about this for small turbines, composting toilets, loads of gizmos? dino's dead - long live bio... dD _ Sign up for eircom broadband now and get a free two month trial.* Phone 1850 73 00 73 or visit http://home.eircom.net/broadbandoffer ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Electric Yard Tools (was Trees and power companies)
Okay everyone... This is it http://www.altenergystore.com/ Jonathan Jonathan Dunlap [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please check the web address and resend it to us please This one is not working. Thank you, Jonathan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, found the Alternative Energy store on web http//shop.altenergystore.com/ you's all know about this for small turbines, composting toilets, loads of gizmos? dino's dead - long live bio... dD _ Sign up for eircom broadband now and get a free two month trial.* Phone 1850 73 00 73 or visit http://home.eircom.net/broadbandoffer ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Electric Yard Tools (was Trees and power companies)
Thanks! I also found this one http://www.aeromaxenergy.com/ Jonathan Hakan Falk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://shop.altenergystore.com/ At 02:40 AM 10/27/2004, you wrote: Please check the web address and resend it to us please This one is not working. Thank you, Jonathan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, found the Alternative Energy store on web http//shop.altenergystore.com/ you's all know about this for small turbines, composting toilets, loads of gizmos? dino's dead - long live bio... dD _ Sign up for eircom broadband now and get a free two month trial.* Phone 1850 73 00 73 or visit http://home.eircom.net/broadbandoffer ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
RE: [Biofuel] How to choose a Biodiesel car or van???
Good day, I live in Los Angeles. How can I become member of the Alternative Fuels Vehicle Network (AFVN) in my area? Thank you, Jonathan Peggy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Subject: [Biofuel] How to choose a Biodiesel car or van??? I am interested in purchasing a vehicle I can run as a biodiesel--the problem is that where I live in South Florida, the choices for new diesel vehicles are severely limited. I would prefer a minivan, as my wife and I are avid mountain bikers and scuba divers, so I need the space. I don't really need a huge Dodge Sprinter van or the monster Econoline Vans that sell as diesels. Does anyone know about reasonable imports from Europe, of a mfg of minivans or equivalent? Hi Dan, If you can find a nearby member of the Alternative Fuels Vehicle Network (AFVN), then that person can most likely assist you. That group should be able to conduct vehicle fleet, fuel usage and operation analysis. AFVN should have access to a data base that will allow selection of potential pumping stations for alternative fuels. Furthermore, they sometimes sponsor awareness program in the area of alternative energy and its impact on the community in which it is produced and used. Many times an education and awareness program is needed to more fully involve the community and its residents and may help many more people than just you. I was also surprised to find out that this group offers training and workshops to potential auto sellers and pumping facilities. It is reported that AFVN has access to training CDs for E85 vehicle dealerships (including sales and purchasing decisions affecting the flex fuel vehicle), government officials and community organizations. Sorry that I don't know the particulars If you become involved, you can teach the rest of us. Having people active in the production and distribution is necessary for end-users to enjoy their convenience. Thanks for supporting all levels of alternative fuel production and use. It all relates to much more than producing alternative fuels. Once someone in your area agrees to work on a feasibility study that could be sponsored by your state, then please let us know. We would love to set up a production facility in Florida. Because our research associates have already demonstrated in a university study over 1000 gallons of fuel ethanol production per acre of cattail, it is a natural next step to set up a growing and production facility. If you own a bog in Florida, let's talk. Best wishes, Peggy ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
RE: [Biofuel] How to choose a Biodiesel car or van???
Thank you I'll give it a try! Jonathan Peggy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Jonathan, Try to google them. That is what I will do. If we don't have any luck, then I will track down the person who is a member from another state. Let us know how it goes with contacting their headquarters. We are interested to know the details and possibly forward their good work. Peggy Subject: RE: [Biofuel] How to choose a Biodiesel car or van??? Good day, I live in Los Angeles. How can I become member of the Alternative Fuels Vehicle Network (AFVN) in my area? Thank you, Jonathan Peggy wrote: Subject: [Biofuel] How to choose a Biodiesel car or van??? I am interested in purchasing a vehicle I can run as a biodiesel--the problem is that where I live in South Florida, the choices for new diesel vehicles are severely limited. I would prefer a minivan, as my wife and I are avid mountain bikers and scuba divers, so I need the space. I don't really need a huge Dodge Sprinter van or the monster Econoline Vans that sell as diesels. Does anyone know about reasonable imports from Europe, of a mfg of minivans or equivalent? Hi Dan, If you can find a nearby member of the Alternative Fuels Vehicle Network (AFVN), then that person can most likely assist you. That group should be able to conduct vehicle fleet, fuel usage and operation analysis. AFVN should have access to a data base that will allow selection of potential pumping stations for alternative fuels. Furthermore, they sometimes sponsor awareness program in the area of alternative energy and its impact on the community in which it is produced and used. Many times an education and awareness program is needed to more fully involve the community and its residents and may help many more people than just you. I was also surprised to find out that this group offers training and workshops to potential auto sellers and pumping facilities. It is reported that AFVN has access to training CDs for E85 vehicle dealerships (including sales and purchasing decisions affecting the flex fuel vehicle), government officials and community organizations. Sorry that I don't know the particulars If you become involved, you can teach the rest of us. Having people active in the production and distribution is necessary for end-users to enjoy their convenience. Thanks for supporting all levels of alternative fuel production and use. It all relates to much more than producing alternative fuels. Once someone in your area agrees to work on a feasibility study that could be sponsored by your state, then please let us know. We would love to set up a production facility in Florida. Because our research associates have already demonstrated in a university study over 1000 gallons of fuel ethanol production per acre of cattail, it is a natural next step to set up a growing and production facility. If you own a bog in Florida, let's talk. Best wishes, Peggy ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Express yourself with Y! Messenger! Free. Download now. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
RE: [Biofuel] How to choose a Biodiesel car or van???
This is what I have found so far... http://www.nyserda.org/afvprogram.html http://www.gm.com/automotive/innovations/altfuel/ http://facultystaff.vwc.edu/~gnoe/avd.htm Please let me know if you come up with anything else. Thanks, Jonathan Peggy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Jonathan, Try to google them. That is what I will do. If we don't have any luck, then I will track down the person who is a member from another state. Let us know how it goes with contacting their headquarters. We are interested to know the details and possibly forward their good work. Peggy Subject: RE: [Biofuel] How to choose a Biodiesel car or van??? Good day, I live in Los Angeles. How can I become member of the Alternative Fuels Vehicle Network (AFVN) in my area? Thank you, Jonathan Peggy wrote: Subject: [Biofuel] How to choose a Biodiesel car or van??? I am interested in purchasing a vehicle I can run as a biodiesel--the problem is that where I live in South Florida, the choices for new diesel vehicles are severely limited. I would prefer a minivan, as my wife and I are avid mountain bikers and scuba divers, so I need the space. I don't really need a huge Dodge Sprinter van or the monster Econoline Vans that sell as diesels. Does anyone know about reasonable imports from Europe, of a mfg of minivans or equivalent? Hi Dan, If you can find a nearby member of the Alternative Fuels Vehicle Network (AFVN), then that person can most likely assist you. That group should be able to conduct vehicle fleet, fuel usage and operation analysis. AFVN should have access to a data base that will allow selection of potential pumping stations for alternative fuels. Furthermore, they sometimes sponsor awareness program in the area of alternative energy and its impact on the community in which it is produced and used. Many times an education and awareness program is needed to more fully involve the community and its residents and may help many more people than just you. I was also surprised to find out that this group offers training and workshops to potential auto sellers and pumping facilities. It is reported that AFVN has access to training CDs for E85 vehicle dealerships (including sales and purchasing decisions affecting the flex fuel vehicle), government officials and community organizations. Sorry that I don't know the particulars If you become involved, you can teach the rest of us. Having people active in the production and distribution is necessary for end-users to enjoy their convenience. Thanks for supporting all levels of alternative fuel production and use. It all relates to much more than producing alternative fuels. Once someone in your area agrees to work on a feasibility study that could be sponsored by your state, then please let us know. We would love to set up a production facility in Florida. Because our research associates have already demonstrated in a university study over 1000 gallons of fuel ethanol production per acre of cattail, it is a natural next step to set up a growing and production facility. If you own a bog in Florida, let's talk. Best wishes, Peggy ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] 31 Similarities Between Hitler and President Bush
Thanks! The links are very good and makes one think! Jonathan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [1]= 31 Similarities Between Hitler and President Bush by Edward Jayne [2]www.dissidentvoice.org August 29, 2004 (revised from an earlier version posted March 29, 2003) When President Bush decided to invade Iraq, his spokesmen began comparing Saddam Hussein to Adolph Hitler, the most monstrous figure in modern history. Everybody was therefore shocked when a high German bureaucrat turned the tables by comparing Bush himself with Hitler. As to be expected, she (the bureaucrat) was forced to resign because of her extreme disrespect for an American president. However, the resemblance sticks--there are too many similarities to be ignored, some of which may be listed here. Like Hitler, President Bush was not elected by a majority, but was forced to engage in political maneuvering in order to gain office. Like Hitler, Bush began to curtail civil liberties in response to a well-publicized disaster, in Hitler's case the Reichstag fire, in Bush's case the 9-11 catastrophe. Like Hitler, Bush went on to pursue a reckless foreign policy without the mandate of the electorate and despite the opposition of most foreign nations. Like Hitler, Bush has increased his popularity with conservative voters by mounting an aggressive public relations campaign against foreign enemies. Just as Hitler cited international communism to justify Germany's military buildup, Bush has used Al Qaeda and the so-called Axis of Evil to justify our current military buildup. Paradoxically none of the nations in this axis--Iraq, Iran and North Korea--have had anything to do with each other. Like Hitler, Bush has promoted militarism in the midst of economic recession (or depression as it was called during the thirties). First he used war preparations to help subsidize defense industries (Halliburton, Bechtel, Carlyle Group, etc.) and presumably the rest of the economy on a trickle-down basis. Now he turns to the very same corporations to rebuild Iraq, again without competitive bidding and at extravagant profit levels. Like Hitler, Bush displays great populist enthusiasm in his patriotic speeches, but primarily serves wealthy investors who subsidize his election campaigns and share with him their comfortable lifestyle. As he himself jokes, he treats these individuals at the pinnacle of our economy as his true political base. Like Hitler, Bush envisages our nation's unique historic destiny almost as a religious cause sanctioned by God. Just as Hitler did for Germany, he takes pride in his providential role in spreading his version of Americanism throughout the entire world. Like Hitler, Bush promotes a future world order that guarantees his own nation's hegemonic supremacy rather than cooperative harmony under the authority of the United Nations (or League of Nations). Like Hitler, Bush quickly makes and breaks diplomatic ties, and he offers generous promises that he soon abandons, as in the cases of Mexico, Russia, Afghanistan, and even New York City. The same goes for U.S. domestic programs. Once Bush was elected, many leaders of these programs learned to dread his making any kind of an appearance to praise their success, since this was almost inevitably followed by severe cuts in their budgets. Like Hitler, Bush scraps international treaties, most notably the Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty, the Biological Weapons Convention, the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty, the Convention on the Prohibition of Land Mines, the Chemical Weapons Convention, the Kyoto Global Warming Accord, and the International Criminal Court. Like Hitler, Bush repeats lies often enough that they come to be accepted as the truth. Bush and his spokesmen argued, for example, that they had taken every measure possible to avoid war, than an invasion of Iraq would diminish (not intensify) the terrorist threat against the U.S., that Iraq was linked with Al Qaeda, and that nothing whatsoever had been achieved by U.N. inspectors to warrant the postponement of U.S. invasion plans. All of this was false. They also insisted that Iraq hid numerous weapons it did not possess since the mid-190s, and they refused to acknowledge the absence of a nuclear weapons program in Iraq since the early nineties. As perhaps to be expected, they indignantly accused others of deception and evasiveness. Like Hitler, Bush incessantly shifted his arguments to justify invading Iraq--from Iraq's WMD threat to the elimination of Saddam Hussein, to his supposed Al Qaeda connection, to the creation of Iraqi democracy in the Middle East as a model for neighboring states, and back again to the WMD threat. As soon as one excuse for the war was challenged, Bush advanced to another, but only to shift back again at another time. Like Hitler, Bush and his cohorts emphasize the ruthlessness of their enemies in order to justify their own. Just as Hitler cited the threat of communist violence to justify
[Biofuel] Some good news....
LAX now has an Hydrogen Station! Im sure some one will have comments Best regards, Jonathan __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Trade in your bicycle on one of these
LOL! Good one... Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:(...joke) http://money.cnn.com/2004/09/13/pf/autos/monster_truck/ New Navistar pickup towers over offerings from Hummer, Ford - Sep. 13, 2004 Truck maker will sell giant pickup Navistar starts marketing cement mixer-based truck that dwarfs the Hummer and the F-350. September 13, 2004: 3:07 PM EDT By Chris Isidore, CNN/Money senior writer NEW YORK (CNN/Money) - For the driver looking for more in a pickup -- one that dwarfs the Hummer and the Ford F-350 -- Navistar has just the ride for you. The new CXT -- short for commercial extreme truck and built from the same platform as the heavy-truck maker's typical tow truck or cement mixer -- will be sold starting this week by Navistar's International Truck Engine subsidiary. At 258 inches, or 21-1/2 feet long, the CXT is about 4-1/2 feet longer than the new Hummer H2 pickup, and about 2 inches longer than the F-350 Crew Cab. But the way it really towers over what's on the road now is in height. At 108 inches, or 9 feet, the CXT stands only a foot below a basketball rim and more than two feet above the Hummer or the F-350. It's not going to fit into the standard garage, said Mark Oberle, a spokesman for Navistar, based in Warrenville, Ill., outside Chicago. We can see it as a vehicle for business people who want to make a distinct impression. For personal use, it's for people who want to make a statement. One statements: The buyer has a great deal of money to spend. The price for the CXT ranges from about $93,000 to $115,000 fully loaded, with such creature comforts as a DVD player and leather upholstery. Buyers will also have to have a fair amount of money to fill it up -- it's projected to get between 6 and 10 miles per gallon of diesel fuel. The vehicle weighs about seven tons empty and can carry another six tons in its truck bed. What Navistar doesn't see is the vehicle being mass-produced. It expects to sell only about 50 this year, and it doesn't expect the CXT to challenge the market niche of the H2 sport/utility vehicle, which saw sales of 34,529 units last year. By comparison, the Ford F-series, which includes everything from the nation's best-selling vehicle, the F-150, up through the F-350, had sales of 845,586 vehicles last year. Navistar first showed the CXT in March at the Mid-America Trucking Show, the industry's premier event. It has sold a few already and starts marketing the vehicle to the general public this week. But Oberle said he doubts the marketing effort will include television ads or other mass-market efforts. The vehicle will be available through International Truck's 345 dealerships, which operate 850 locations nationwide. Oberle said he couldn't say how many dealers will be ordering the vehicles. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ - Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] [Biofuels] Hydrogen or Biofuels?
Good one! Jonathan MH [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hydrogen or Biofuels? September / October 2004 By Amory Lovins and David Morris Utne magazine http://www.utne.com/cgi-bin/udt/im.display.printable?client.id=utnestory.id=11334 Two experts go head-to-head on the future of energy In our January-February 2004 issue, we reprinted from Alternet an essay by local-economy advocate David Morris, vice president of the Institute for Local Self-Reliance, in which he takes aim at the advocates of a hydrogen-based economy, asserting, among other things, that because large energy interests are poised to dominate the process of generating hydrogen from substances like gas, oil, and coal, the push to hydrogen will actually be a setback for renewable energy from wind power, biomass, and other sources. Energy analyst Amory B. Lovins, CEO of the Rocky Mountain Institute in Snowmass, Colorado, and a prominent advocate of hydrogen fuel cell technology, responds. FROM AMORY LOVINS In voicing skepticism about the role of hydrogen in our energy future, my valued friend David Morris makes several points: He is understandably frustrated that hydrogen will initially be made mainly from natural gas, as 96 percent of U.S. hydrogen is now. But he wrongly thinks this will waste energy and increase carbon dioxide emissions. Because fuel cells are two to three times more efficient than gasoline engines, CO2 per mile will actually drop by 40 to 67 percent compared with today's gasoline cars -- and much more with efficient car designs. He's irritated that nuclear advocates claim they'll be the hydrogen producers. But they won't be -- their option costs far too much. He's worried that hydrogen might come from coal. This is a real possibility later, but by then we will have good ways to keep the carbon out of the air. Because General Motors likes fuel cells, he assumes that car and oil companies are preparing for an oil-based hydrogen future. Generally, they're not. He thinks hydrogen will be too costly to distribute. Wrong -- the Swiss study he cites [which claimed that the compacting of this very light and diffuse element for storage and transport is too costly and energy-intensive] considered only the clearly uneconomic options and ignored hydrogen's advantage of more efficient use. He thinks a hydrogen transition will need hundreds of billions of dollars of new infrastructure. This is a vast overestimate. He doesn't recognize hydrogen's important potential to accelerate the adoption of renewable energy. Many environmentalists suspect the Bush administration's enthusiasm for hydrogen serves mainly to distract attention from the short-term energy steps they're unwilling to take. It's impossible to tell from the outside whether that's true or not, but if it is, this self-inflicted wound is not a reason to reject a sound hydrogen transition as a complementary part of a broader energy strategy starting with aggressive efficiency, renewable energy, and distributed resources. Many other good and usually well-informed people have written similar critiques of hydrogen. A well-documented response, Twenty Hydrogen Myths, is free at http://www.rmi.org FROM DAVID MORRIS My esteemed colleague Amory Lovins and I agree and disagree. We both focus on the transportation sector. We both favor a dramatic improvement in vehicle efficiency and the replacement of gasoline with a domestically produced, environmentally benign fuel. We disagree on how to achieve these objectives. Amory advocates fuel cell vehicles that run on hydrogen. I propose hybrid electric vehicles fueled by electricity and biofuels like ethanol. I believe my strategy is far cheaper and far quicker to implement than Amory's. Hybrid vehicles, which use electric motors as well as an engine for power, are commercially available. They already achieve fuel efficiencies as great as those promised by fuel cell cars. With modest modifications, hybrids can be made to plug into the electric grid to charge their batteries. That allows electricity to become their primary fuel and reduces by some 85 percent the amount of fuel needed by the engine. In turn, this allows us to think of biofuels like ethanol as replacements for gasoline rather than, as now, simply additives to it. Unlike hydrogen, ethanol is already widely available. Ethanol is half the price of hydrogen today and may have a still lower price a decade from now. Cars that operate on either ethanol or gasoline -- or any combination of the two -- can be made at an additional cost of $150 per vehicle. More than 4 million are on the road right now. The most optimistic estimate of the additional cost for a fuel cell car in 2015 is $10,000; most estimates are considerably higher. Ethanol refueling stations cost 90 percent less than hydrogen refueling stations. Hydrogen advocates should be applauded for proposing a solution commensurate with the problem. But a better strategy exists. Much more detail can be found in my recent
Re: [Biofuel] Short-range hydrogen
YES!!! You said my favorite word in the World! TAX-FREE People here in the US need to take note! Jonathan Walt Patrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 02:25 PM 10/11/04 -0400, you wrote: Did you consider how many kWh it would have taken for that 30 miles on hydrogen, then compared how many miles that amount of kWh would have taken you on a pure EV? More than 60 miles .. But a vehicle with a range of 60 miles is of less utility to me than one which can do 30 miles on home-produced, tax-free H2, and then make it home on commercial fuel. Note that when I say tax-free I'm thinking more about the taxes I have to pay on income (fed, state, unemp, socsec, etc.) than just road taxes. You're right that there are hidden costs in producing one's one fuel, but there are also a lot of hidden cost involved in working for a paycheck and then using net income to buy fuel. Walt http://www.windward.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ - Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen
Hey man If you can get it to work Then you will be Okay! I would not worry about Mr. Bush anyway! Jonathan MH [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Does anyone how this would effect hydrogen in Mr. Bush's FreedomCAR program? Steve Spence wrote: Hydrogen isn't, and won't be anything that will help us save our Earth. That's the whole point these folks are missing. It's not that it can't be done, it's that it shouldn't be done, since they are throwing away a majority of the energy they are producing, and renewables are typically much higher priced, so you want to be as stingy as possible. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ - Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen
Thanks for the article! Jonathan MH [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: US FreedomTruck -- Powered by sunlight Student project leaps into future Bob Golfen The Arizona Republic Oct. 1, 2004 12:00 AM The ungainly looking Chevy pickup parked in the courtyard at Central High School, with a huge set of solar panels mounted on top, may not look so futuristic. But it certainly points the way. Hand-built on a shoestring budget by a Central physics teacher and a team of students, the truck is one of a kind, a demonstration of how future transportation can be self-sustaining and pollution-free. The truck is hydrogen-powered and creates its own fuel from solar energy and water, a technical feat that rivals the advanced technology being researched by major auto companies and universities. The four-cylinder engine is tuned to run on hydrogen, which is produced by a hand-built electrolysis system mounted in the bed. Teacher Cory Waxman and his students took four years to build the experiment, believed to be the only self-sustaining hydrogen vehicle that uses a conventional internal-combustion engine. Nobody has ever made a car that runs on sunlight and water, Waxman said. There are other cars that run on hydrogen, but they don't make their own fuel. Built for less than $10,000, the project has caught the attention of experts in alternative-fuel research. Over the past three years of research in hydrogen, I've been more impressed with what they did than anything else I've seen around the world, said Scottsdale inventor Bryan Beaulieu, who is building a hydrogen-powered house in north Scottsdale. With practically no resources, they are doing something everybody says it's going to take 20 years to do. Although the truck performs as planned, it's more of a demonstration project than a practical vehicle. The four solar panels and hydrogen-generating system create only enough fuel per day to travel a few miles. But that was expected, Waxman said, and the students have a motto that underlines the pioneering nature of the project: How far did the first airplane fly? When the vehicle's tanks are filled with compressed hydrogen from an outside source, it has the range of a conventional vehicle, though that defeats the purpose of showing that hydrogen can be created from clean, sustainable sources, then used to fuel vehicles. The truck also can be shifted to conventional power using a dashboard switch, which changes the fuel system over to a gasoline tank and fuel-injection. The students in the Environmental Technology Club who built the hydrogen truck recognize its experimental nature. We want to inform the public that there are different alternative fuels and what can be accomplished, said Nicolas Paredes, a 17-year-old senior. Most of the club members are new this year, the previous years' members having graduated. Nine students attended a recent after-school meeting to access the condition of the hydrogen truck, which was parked all summer and requires some repair, and make plans to advance the project. During the meeting, Waxman said the group plans to make improvements to the existing solar-hydrogen truck plus tackle a new project: a self-sustaining solar-hydrogen vehicle that uses fuel cells to power an electric drive system. The main challenge of building the solar-hydrogen truck was research, with much of the hydrogen-generating system designed by trial and error, Waxman said. The problem is there's no manual that says how to do this, the 39-year-old teacher said. We had to investigate how to make hydrogen for this. Last spring, the project won a first prize and grand prize at the Central Arizona Regional Science and Engineering Fair and was a finalist in May at the International Science and Engineering Fair in Portland, Ore. Graduating senior Soroush Farzin, a leader in the project, entered it in the fairs. Much of the solar-hydrogen truck project was completed through private donations and volunteer labor, including solar panels donated by Beaulieu. Mechanical work and technical assistance was provided by Kevin Fern of AFVTech, which stands for Alternative Fuel Vehicle Technology. Waxman and Fern gave a tour of the vehicle, showing how the solar panels create energy for the six electrolysis units mounted in a complex-looking maze of tubes and wires that make up the solar-hydrogen production unit. From there, the hydrogen is filtered for impurities and stored in two large air tanks. The hydrogen is fed into the engine using stainless-steel lines, a pressure regulator and fuel injectors similar to what might be found in a vehicle powered by propane or natural gas. An electronic control unit had to be specially tuned so that the four-cylinder engine could use the hydrogen efficiently. It's really a simple process, Fern said of the engine conversion. The programming (of the electronic control unit) was the only difficulty. Beyond learning about solar energy and hydrogen power, the club
Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen
Good question! That is what they are getting to, I'm sure... Jonathan Legal Eagle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When the vehicle's tanks are filled with compressed hydrogen from an outside source, it has the range of a conventional vehicle, though that defeats the purpose of showing that hydrogen can be created from clean, sustainable sources, then used to fuel vehicles. Yes, but if one were to set up a hydrogen system at one's home using the same solar panels(or more) and hydrogen unit and then stock the hydrogen tanks of the truck, still equiped with it's own system, wouldn't that make it run just like any other ? Luc - Original Message - From: MH To: Sent: Sunday, October 10, 2004 11:24 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen US FreedomTruck -- Powered by sunlight Student project leaps into future Bob Golfen The Arizona Republic Oct. 1, 2004 12:00 AM The ungainly looking Chevy pickup parked in the courtyard at Central High School, with a huge set of solar panels mounted on top, may not look so futuristic. But it certainly points the way. Hand-built on a shoestring budget by a Central physics teacher and a team of students, the truck is one of a kind, a demonstration of how future transportation can be self-sustaining and pollution-free. The truck is hydrogen-powered and creates its own fuel from solar energy and water, a technical feat that rivals the advanced technology being researched by major auto companies and universities. The four-cylinder engine is tuned to run on hydrogen, which is produced by a hand-built electrolysis system mounted in the bed. Teacher Cory Waxman and his students took four years to build the experiment, believed to be the only self-sustaining hydrogen vehicle that uses a conventional internal-combustion engine. Nobody has ever made a car that runs on sunlight and water, Waxman said. There are other cars that run on hydrogen, but they don't make their own fuel. Built for less than $10,000, the project has caught the attention of experts in alternative-fuel research. Over the past three years of research in hydrogen, I've been more impressed with what they did than anything else I've seen around the world, said Scottsdale inventor Bryan Beaulieu, who is building a hydrogen-powered house in north Scottsdale. With practically no resources, they are doing something everybody says it's going to take 20 years to do. Although the truck performs as planned, it's more of a demonstration project than a practical vehicle. The four solar panels and hydrogen-generating system create only enough fuel per day to travel a few miles. But that was expected, Waxman said, and the students have a motto that underlines the pioneering nature of the project: How far did the first airplane fly? When the vehicle's tanks are filled with compressed hydrogen from an outside source, it has the range of a conventional vehicle, though that defeats the purpose of showing that hydrogen can be created from clean, sustainable sources, then used to fuel vehicles. The truck also can be shifted to conventional power using a dashboard switch, which changes the fuel system over to a gasoline tank and fuel-injection. The students in the Environmental Technology Club who built the hydrogen truck recognize its experimental nature. We want to inform the public that there are different alternative fuels and what can be accomplished, said Nicolas Paredes, a 17-year-old senior. Most of the club members are new this year, the previous years' members having graduated. Nine students attended a recent after-school meeting to access the condition of the hydrogen truck, which was parked all summer and requires some repair, and make plans to advance the project. During the meeting, Waxman said the group plans to make improvements to the existing solar-hydrogen truck plus tackle a new project: a self-sustaining solar-hydrogen vehicle that uses fuel cells to power an electric drive system. The main challenge of building the solar-hydrogen truck was research, with much of the hydrogen-generating system designed by trial and error, Waxman said. The problem is there's no manual that says how to do this, the 39-year-old teacher said. We had to investigate how to make hydrogen for this. Last spring, the project won a first prize and grand prize at the Central Arizona Regional Science and Engineering Fair and was a finalist in May at the International Science and Engineering Fair in Portland, Ore. Graduating senior Soroush Farzin, a leader in the project, entered it in the fairs. Much of the solar-hydrogen truck project was completed through private donations and volunteer labor, including solar panels donated by Beaulieu. Mechanical work and technical assistance was provided by Kevin Fern of AFVTech, which stands for Alternative Fuel Vehicle Technology. Waxman and Fern gave a tour of the vehicle, showing how the solar
Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen
My friend, you have a very valid point here. The cost in taking your home off grid will be a costly investment. However, that is what it is. An investment in your home and the future! It will save you in the not so distance future in the cost of power for your lights and heating. One can then (If they are using gas) change their heating of their home and water to electric forms of heating reducing the usage of fossil fuels. Every little bit will count in saving our Earth. What we have here is NOT an endless supply. Im currently working on just that for my home here in L.A., CA. Im open to any ideas and I will contribute with information as well. My home will be off grid by this time 2005 and I will post PICs as the work is being done. It will be a very wonderful thing when we advance to that point and the only thing we have to do is add another device to create fuel for your transportation. I can only see that as we progress with this technology, it will only be one that we can use to save money and our Earth. Best regards, Jonathan Legal Eagle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Here's another scenario that could eliminate that conclusion or at least aleviate it (maybe?) Should one's home already be off-grid (as yours is) but running a solar system, wouldn't it be feasible top simply detour a portion of that prodcued energy to a hydrogen capacitor of some sort and then pressure up the truck's tanks from that ? Kinda putting an laready existing sytem to double use ? I know nothing of these things and these are just ideas that sem to make sense, so please feel free to wade in and correct me. Luc - Original Message - From: To: Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 9:24 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen They will soon realize that the expenditure in solar equipment to make that vehicle go more than a few miles will cost much more than anyone will want to pay. Seems silly to spend 100x as much on solar panels (not including the fuel cell costs) than the electric it produces would have cost for the life of the vehicle from conventional sources. You can't beat liquid fuels for tranportation, and hydrogen is a loser no matter how you make it. But, some folks keep thinking they can beat the laws of physics . = = = Original message = = = Good question! That is what they are getting to, I'm sure... Jonathan Legal Eagle wrote: When the vehicle's tanks are filled with compressed hydrogen from an outside source, it has the range of a conventional vehicle, though that defeats the purpose of showing that hydrogen can be created from clean, sustainable sources, then used to fuel vehicles. Yes, but if one were to set up a hydrogen system at one's home using the same solar panels(or more) and hydrogen unit and then stock the hydrogen tanks of the truck, still equiped with it's own system, wouldn't that make it run just like any other ? Luc - Original Message - From: MH To: Sent: Sunday, October 10, 2004 11:24 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen US FreedomTruck -- Powered by sunlight Student project leaps into future Bob Golfen The Arizona Republic Oct. 1, 2004 12:00 AM The ungainly looking Chevy pickup parked in the courtyard at Central High School, with a huge set of solar panels mounted on top, may not look so futuristic. But it certainly points the way. Hand-built on a shoestring budget by a Central physics teacher and a team of students, the truck is one of a kind, a demonstration of how future transportation can be self-sustaining and pollution-free. The truck is hydrogen-powered and creates its own fuel from solar energy and water, a technical feat that rivals the advanced technology being researched by major auto companies and universities. The four-cylinder engine is tuned to run on hydrogen, which is produced by a hand-built electrolysis system mounted in the bed. Teacher Cory Waxman and his students took four years to build the experiment, believed to be the only self-sustaining hydrogen vehicle that uses a conventional internal-combustion engine. Nobody has ever made a car that runs on sunlight and water, Waxman said. There are other cars that run on hydrogen, but they don't make their own fuel. Built for less than $10,000, the project has caught the attention of experts in alternative-fuel research. Over the past three years of research in hydrogen, I've been more impressed with what they did than anything else I've seen around the world, said Scottsdale inventor Bryan Beaulieu, who is building a hydrogen-powered house in north Scottsdale. With practically no resources, they are doing something everybody says it's going to take 20 years to do. Although the truck performs as planned, it's more of a demonstration project than a practical vehicle. The four solar panels and hydrogen-generating system create only enough fuel per day to travel a few miles. But
Re: [Biofuel] Sustainable Farming
Thanks! This is great info!!! Jonathan Legal Eagle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was just emailed this link that deals with sustainable farming. http://www.factoryfarm.org/ Luc ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen
Okay... Thanks for your input. I'm still open for anything that will help us save our Earth. Jonathan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm off grid. There is no way I would divert my few and precious kWh's into producing hydrogen. What a boondoggle. Ethanol and biodiesel would put me yards ahead in the game. Steve www.green-trust.org = = = Original message = = = My friend, you have a very valid point here. The cost in taking your home ~off grid will be a costly investment. However, that is what it is. An investment in your home and the future! It will save you in the not so distance future in the cost of power for your lights and heating. One can then (If they are using gas) change their heating of their home and water to electric forms of heating reducing the usage of fossil fuels. Every little bit will count in saving our Earth. What we have here is NOT an endless supply. I~m currently working on just that for my home here in L.A., CA. I~m open to any ideas and I will contribute with information as well. My home will be off grid by this time 2005 and I will post PIC~s as the work is being done. It will be a very wonderful thing when we advance to that point and the only thing we have to do is add another device to create fuel for your transportation. I can only see that as we progress with this technology, it will only be one that we can use to save money and our Earth. Best regards, Jonathan Legal Eagle wrote:Here's another scenario that could eliminate that conclusion or at least aleviate it (maybe?) Should one's home already be off-grid (as yours is) but running a solar system, wouldn't it be feasible top simply detour a portion of that prodcued energy to a hydrogen capacitor of some sort and then pressure up the truck's tanks from that ? Kinda putting an laready existing sytem to double use ? I know nothing of these things and these are just ideas that sem to make sense, so please feel free to wade in and correct me. Luc - Original Message - From: To: Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 9:24 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen They will soon realize that the expenditure in solar equipment to make that vehicle go more than a few miles will cost much more than anyone will want to pay. Seems silly to spend 100x as much on solar panels (not including the fuel cell costs) than the electric it produces would have cost for the life of the vehicle from conventional sources. You can't beat liquid fuels for tranportation, and hydrogen is a loser no matter how you make it. But, some folks keep thinking they can beat the laws of physics . = = = Original message = = = Good question! That is what they are getting to, I'm sure... Jonathan Legal Eagle wrote: When the vehicle's tanks are filled with compressed hydrogen from an outside source, it has the range of a conventional vehicle, though that defeats the purpose of showing that hydrogen can be created from clean, sustainable sources, then used to fuel vehicles. Yes, but if one were to set up a hydrogen system at one's home using the same solar panels(or more) and hydrogen unit and then stock the hydrogen tanks of the truck, still equiped with it's own system, wouldn't that make it run just like any other ? Luc - Original Message - From: MH To: Sent: Sunday, October 10, 2004 11:24 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen US FreedomTruck -- Powered by sunlight Student project leaps into future Bob Golfen The Arizona Republic Oct. 1, 2004 12:00 AM The ungainly looking Chevy pickup parked in the courtyard at Central High School, with a huge set of solar panels mounted on top, may not look so futuristic. But it certainly points the way. Hand-built on a shoestring budget by a Central physics teacher and a team of students, the truck is one of a kind, a demonstration of how future transportation can be self-sustaining and pollution-free. The truck is hydrogen-powered and creates its own fuel from solar energy and water, a technical feat that rivals the advanced technology being researched by major auto companies and universities. The four-cylinder engine is tuned to run on hydrogen, which is produced by a hand-built electrolysis system mounted in the bed. Teacher Cory Waxman and his students took four years to build the experiment, believed to be the only self-sustaining hydrogen vehicle that uses a conventional internal-combustion engine. Nobody has ever made a car that runs on sunlight and water, Waxman said. There are other cars that run on hydrogen, but they don't make their own fuel. Built for less than $10,000, the project has caught the attention of experts in alternative-fuel research. Over the past three years of research in hydrogen, I've been more impressed with what they did than anything else I've seen around the world, said Scottsdale inventor Bryan Beaulieu, who is building a hydrogen-powered house in north
Re: [Biofuel] Solar Hydrogen
LOL... Okay... Baby steps. We have to start somewhere! Jonathan Ken Provost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Oct 11, 2004, at 8:59 AM, Jonathan Dunlap wrote: Okay... Thanks for your input. I'm still open for anything that will help us save our Earth. Good luck! Let's start by getting world population down to about 500 million, then limiting reproduction to 1 child per person. Then dismantle all nation states. Fuels are a very small part of the REAL problem, though they may be one of the more painful in the short term... - K ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Solar.....
Hi there, No problem at all. I have a contact at Expo Power Systems, Inc. Because of the number Im buying, Im able to get them at this price. The web site is, www.expopower.com For just a moment here I did not think anyone would ever answer the post. This was not what I was looking for. However, Im more than happy to help if I can. Jonathan joão martins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Jonathan, Can you tell me where you have those price? Best Regards João Martins www.martinsportscar.com www.luzsolar.pt --- Jonathan Dunlap wrote: Good day all, Anyone have info on Solar panels? I need 1000 to 5000 units at 120 or 80 Watts. Need this at wholesale. Best price so far is $2.70 per Watt. Any help would be great, Jonathan J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Solar.....
Here is one that is very good and will work in Bangladesh. http://www.wholesalesolar.com/products.folder/module-folder/shell/sm110_12P.html Best regards, Jonathan MASUD OMAR [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear All, Could some one please introduce me with some manufacturers of solar home system,which could be used in Bangladesh. Best regards. Masud Omar At 01:12 PM 10/8/04 -0700, you wrote: Hi there, No problem at all. I have a contact at Expo Power Systems, Inc. Because of the number Im buying, Im able to get them at this price. The web site is, www.expopower.com For just a moment here I did not think anyone would ever answer the post. This was not what I was looking for. However, Im more than happy to help if I can. Jonathan joão martins wrote: Hi Jonathan, Can you tell me where you have those price? Best Regards João Martins www.martinsportscar.com www.luzsolar.pt --- Jonathan Dunlap wrote: Good day all, Anyone have info on Solar panels? I need 1000 to 5000 units at 120 or 80 Watts. Need this at wholesale. Best price so far is $2.70 per Watt. Any help would be great, Jonathan J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Solar.....
Another place to check http://seasunlighting.en.alibaba.com/product/50032635/50149366/Solar_Chargers/Solar_Panel.html Jonathan Dunlap [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Here is one that is very good and will work in Bangladesh. http://www.wholesalesolar.com/products.folder/module-folder/shell/sm110_12P.html Best regards, Jonathan MASUD OMAR wrote: Dear All, Could some one please introduce me with some manufacturers of solar home system,which could be used in Bangladesh. Best regards. Masud Omar At 01:12 PM 10/8/04 -0700, you wrote: Hi there, No problem at all. I have a contact at Expo Power Systems, Inc. Because of the number Im buying, Im able to get them at this price. The web site is, www.expopower.com For just a moment here I did not think anyone would ever answer the post. This was not what I was looking for. However, Im more than happy to help if I can. Jonathan joão martins wrote: Hi Jonathan, Can you tell me where you have those price? Best Regards João Martins www.martinsportscar.com www.luzsolar.pt --- Jonathan Dunlap wrote: Good day all, Anyone have info on Solar panels? I need 1000 to 5000 units at 120 or 80 Watts. Need this at wholesale. Best price so far is $2.70 per Watt. Any help would be great, Jonathan J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Re: Jewish settlers atttack US christians
Very well said... Again, something to think about. Jonathan Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tim, Thank you for your qualifiers as to the unreliability of all or almost all news institutions. Your first post didn't give the same perspective. In the words of Ronald Reagan, trust, but verify is sound policy in almost every venue. As for agreeing to disagree relative to Aljazeera? They're certainly no more or less reliable than CBS and certainly no more slanted than Fox or any number of others. I think that if you were to treat all news agencies with the same criteria and candor that there would be far less cause to take exception to the perspective you print. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: Tim Ferguson To: Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2004 10:08 AM Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Re: Jewish settlers atttack US christians Todd, I'm not saying that the beating did or did not take place. And it is not an opinion as to the credibility of the source but rather a fact. Your point would be better served and received citing several sources rather than one. Especially one that is for the most part State Run. It's not that I don't include Aljazeera in my daily diet of news sources because I do for just the reason you stated. Getting unreported stories or rather a different perspective of commonly reported stories. However, with the way the media tends to cover and spin stories to support their agendas I find it best to have some form of validation and not rely on any single source and accept what that source might state as truth. This helps to reduce the spin. And finally I hope that we can agree to disagree on the merit of Aljazeera's reporting. Tim -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Appal Energy Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2004 11:10 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Re: Jewish settlers atttack US christians Tim, So you're saying that the beating didn't take place, simply because you don't care for the source? How many other times have such events not been reported by your choice media? And after thousands of failures of non-reporting you would care to imply that they're far more reliable and/or less biased than any other? Aljazeera is, whether you like it or not, a news agency - a far cry above and beyond the pale of a White House press secretary. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: Tim Ferguson To: Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2004 7:56 AM Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Re: Jewish settlers atttack US christians I can't believe that someone would actually use Aljazeera as a news source. LOL. I know it's difficult to find news sources having any degree of intergrity in reporting, but really.Aljazeera? You might as well take the White House spokesman's word as the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Tim -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of fox mulder Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2004 3:55 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Biofuel] Re: Jewish settlers atttack US christians Jewish settlers attack US Christians By Khalid Amayreh in the West Bank Thursday 30 September 2004, 2:24 Makka Time, 23:24 GMT Palestinian children fear attacks from settlers Jewish settler immigrants from North America have attacked and severely beat American Christian peace volunteers near the village of Yatta south west of Hebron. Palestinian and Israeli sources said the attack occurred on Wednesday. According to the Hebron-based Christian Peace Making Team (CPT), five settlers carrying iron chains and baseball clubs, assaulted two male and female volunteers who were escorting Palestinian schoolchildren to their school at the village of Tuba near the settlement of Maon in the southern Hebron hills. The assailants reportedly beat the two volunteers and robbed them. The pair were evacuated by an Israeli ambulance to a hospital in the southern Israeli town of Be'ir Sheva were their condition is said to be moderate. The assailants also stole a bag belonging to a female volunteer named Kim Lamberty. The bag contained a passport, money and a cellular phone. It is not clear if the settlers had wanted to attack Palestinian schoolchildren who fled to their homes. Volunteers severly beaten CPT spokesperson in Hebron, Cal Carpenter told Aljazeera.net that one of the volunteers had a collapsed lung while a woman volunteer had sustained cuts and bruises. Asked why he thought the settlers assaulted his colleagues, Carpenter said the settlers didn't like what we were doing, namely escorting Palestinian kids to their schools. They apparently were unhappy to see us stand by the kids whom the settlers want to abuse¡Ä
[Biofuel] Solar.....
Good day all, Anyone have info on Solar panels? I need 1000 to 5000 units at 120 or 80 Watts. Need this at wholesale. Best price so far is $2.70 per Watt. Any help would be great, Jonathan J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Re: Jewish settlers atttack US christians
Something to think about Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Tim, So you're saying that the beating didn't take place, simply because you don't care for the source? How many other times have such events not been reported by your choice media? And after thousands of failures of non-reporting you would care to imply that they're far more reliable and/or less biased than any other? Aljazeera is, whether you like it or not, a news agency - a far cry above and beyond the pale of a White House press secretary. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: Tim Ferguson To: Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2004 7:56 AM Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Re: Jewish settlers atttack US christians I can't believe that someone would actually use Aljazeera as a news source. LOL. I know it's difficult to find news sources having any degree of intergrity in reporting, but really.Aljazeera? You might as well take the White House spokesman's word as the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Tim -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of fox mulder Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2004 3:55 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Biofuel] Re: Jewish settlers atttack US christians Jewish settlers attack US Christians By Khalid Amayreh in the West Bank Thursday 30 September 2004, 2:24 Makka Time, 23:24 GMT Palestinian children fear attacks from settlers Jewish settler immigrants from North America have attacked and severely beat American Christian peace volunteers near the village of Yatta south west of Hebron. Palestinian and Israeli sources said the attack occurred on Wednesday. According to the Hebron-based Christian Peace Making Team (CPT), five settlers carrying iron chains and baseball clubs, assaulted two male and female volunteers who were escorting Palestinian schoolchildren to their school at the village of Tuba near the settlement of Maon in the southern Hebron hills. The assailants reportedly beat the two volunteers and robbed them. The pair were evacuated by an Israeli ambulance to a hospital in the southern Israeli town of Be'ir Sheva were their condition is said to be moderate. The assailants also stole a bag belonging to a female volunteer named Kim Lamberty. The bag contained a passport, money and a cellular phone. It is not clear if the settlers had wanted to attack Palestinian schoolchildren who fled to their homes. Volunteers severly beaten CPT spokesperson in Hebron, Cal Carpenter told Aljazeera.net that one of the volunteers had a collapsed lung while a woman volunteer had sustained cuts and bruises. Asked why he thought the settlers assaulted his colleagues, Carpenter said the settlers didn't like what we were doing, namely escorting Palestinian kids to their schools. They apparently were unhappy to see us stand by the kids whom the settlers want to abuse¡Ä they thought that we were frustrating their efforts. Carpenter said the CPT volunteers wouldn't be intimidated by the Jewish settlers savagery. We will go to the village tomorrow and we will escort the kids to their school. According to Palestinian locals, the settlers in the area despise the Christian activists for helping the Palestinians stay in the area. 'Disrupting efforts' The settlers believe the Christians are disrupting their efforts to get the Palestinians to leave the area, one local told Aljazeera.net. The incident came less than 48 hours after a Jewish settler from a settlement near the Northern West Bank town of Nablus murdered a Palestinian driver and father of eight children. The settler, however, has been freed from police custody and placed under temporary house arrest. The Israeli army, in concert with settler leaders in the area, have been trying to expel several hundred Palestinian families from the area for the purpose of expanding the settlement of Maon. Two years ago, the army destroyed hundreds of caves and many cisterns belonging to Palestinians in order to force them to leave. Relations between the settlers and the Christian volunteers have never been good. Jewish settlers, indoctrinated by a staunchly anti-Christian ideology, routinely throw rocks and shout obscenities at the volunteers. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ __ _ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel
Re: [biofuel] Pig Manure Converted to Crude Oil
For what ever the reason, the link in not working well. However, if you would click on Home Page you will find the story there. Sorry, Jonathan Jon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey everyone, I received this from nationalgeographic news. Check out the link... http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/07/0701_040702_pigoil.htm l?c=Newslettersn=2Q04_Insider2t=internal Every bit helps, Jonathan Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Pig Manure Converted to Crude Oil
I should have known Keith! Thanks, Jonathan Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: For what ever the reason, the link in not working well. However, if you would click on Home Page you will find the story there. Sorry, Jonathan Jon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey everyone, I received this from nationalgeographic news. Check out the link... http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/07/0701_040702_pigoil.htm l?c=Newslettersn=2Q04_Insider2t=internal Every bit helps, Jonathan Hello Jon The link does work, but urls often get broken in email transmission, especially long ones. There's a hard-return breaking that one. Copy and paste it somewhere else, a word processor document, and join the two lines up again, then it'll work. Standard procedure with emailed urls. One way of avoiding the problem is to go here: http://tinyurl.com/ TinyURL.com Making long URLs useable Anyway, this pig manure to crude oil story has been covered before, a couple of times. No reason not to cover it again, but have a look at previous comment: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/33476/1/ Best wishes Keith Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Like to Introduce Myself - Ethanol Maker
Hey now... I'm doing the same at this time. I like large trucks, not the gas mileage. With an diesel engine and Biodiesel I can have the best of both worlds. I also would like to use another fuel for my cars. Save some money and our Earth... What could be better! Jonathan av snips [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Glenn! Just so you don't feel all alone here on the JTF list, I'm also interersted in the distilling of ethanol. What type of equipment are you using? I'm not distilling at this point too many other projects to get through but am gathering information to make conversions for ECM equipped vehicles to make them in effect an FFV. Glad to see another ethanol devotee. If we get enough of us maybe we can convert Keith and get him off biodiesel . hehehehhe. Best. Dennis Nelson __ Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Palm oil...
Yeah Very bad for ones health. However, I know this can be used for the making of Biofuel. But will it form any deposits in the engine? Jonathan Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It was refined palm oil, straight vegetable oil. It's so hard to find the WVO in here because the people still use it for their food. Aarghhh! Not good for their health! But I know it happens, not just in Indonesia. No, we still apply B10 and B20, I don't think B100 will be save to vehicle without any change especially in plastic part. Unless it's a very old vehicle it'll be fine, as long as you wash the biodiesel properly first. Please see: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_vehicle.html#rubber Biodiesel and your vehicle Compatibility: Rubber Have a look at Maria Alovert's comment (Girl Mark). We agree with that, that's what we've found too. Even if it does happen (unlikely), it won't be sudden, you'll have plenty of warning. Just put it in and go! Of course, we put a sign. Good! Mr. Keith, do you know any idea how to refine the glycerin lye. Depends what you mean. Have you seen this? Separating glycerin http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_glycerin.html#separate Purifying glycerin http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_glycerin.html#purify I think vacuum distillation still expensive for small scale purpose. I think so too. But it all depends on what you can find a market for and how the economics of it work out. In our case, it doesn't bother us, we use it all up! By the way, please, no need for Mr, and my apologies, did I get your name the wrong way round? Mochammad is your family name and Ircham your given name? Please pardon my asking. Best wishes Keith regards, Ircham Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Palm oil...
Thanks for your input. Now if and when I use the palm oil, I will be in West Africa and I will only use it there to make Biofuel or Biodiesel. Here in the States... I don't know what I'm going to do just yet. I have to think about the same issues as you. Jonathan Sumit [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The main problem with SVO using Palm oil is that it gums up. You'll get a white sticky hue and it crystalizes as well leaving residue in the engine and fuel lines. Cetane rating on Palm oil is quite high but I don't use it because it does gum up. It has to be turned into BD to be used properly. If you are going to use it as SVO a B20 is about as high as I'd push it and that would be in warm weather. I'm using Soya oil as a B50 SVO in a volkswagon TDI (2003) during the summer time, but in winter it's no more than B20. Palm oil is alot heavier than soy or cannolla and the weather plays a big part in how rich the SVO ratio will be. You also have to look at costs, since Palm oil is also a cooking oil, it's going to set you back a pretty penny even if you could use it as a B100. As for refining, I'm looking around at some of the smaller kits but have not made a purchase yet. Just something about storing chemicals in the garage in todays day and age -might give people the wrong impression of what's going on in the kitchen. Especially being a minority. Have fun! SM - Original Message - From: Jonathan Dunlap [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, June 28, 2004 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Palm oil... Thanks! I don't know what to do just yet But I will very soon! Jonathan Mochammad Ircham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It was refined palm oil, straight vegetable oil. It's so hard to find the WVO in here because the people still use it for their food. No, we still apply B10 and B20, I don't think B100 will be save to vehicle without any change especially in plastic part. Ofcourse, we put a sign. Mr. Keith, do you know any idea how to refine the glycerine lye. I think vacuum distillation still expensive for small scale purpose. regards, Ircham __ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group
Re: [biofuel] Palm oil...
YES! Man... Thanks a lot! This was just what the Dr. ordered! I forward the links to the people I know in West Africa as well Thank you very much Keith, Jonathan Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hm... I think you should read these: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_SVO-Allen.html Straighter-than-straight vegetable oils as diesel fuels http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_SVO-palm.html Palm Oil as a Fuel for Agricultural Diesel Engines The main problem with SVO using Palm oil is that it gums up. You'll get a white sticky hue and it crystalizes as well leaving residue in the engine and fuel lines. It doesn't gum up. There are two different things here. You need to understand what the Iodine Value of oils is and what it means. It's fully explained here: Iodine Values http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_yield.html#iodine You really have to understand this if you're going to deal with SVO and biodiesel. Oils with high Iodine Values have low gelling temperatures and vice versa. BUT - oils with high Iodine Values are also drying oils: they polymerise, especially with heat. Oils with low Iodine Values don't polymerise, they're not drying oils, but they have higher gelling points. Gelling means it sets solid, like lard, no use for fuel - unless you heat it, then it melts again. Polymerisation of a drying oil means it hardens irreversibly into a plastic-like solid - heating it won't melt it again. This is why drying oils with high Iodine Values like linseed or tung oil are used in paints. Not what you want in your motor, whether as SVO or as biodiesel. Think of polyester resin used for glass fibre - for gelling, think of butter. Palm oil has a low Iodine Value and will not dry. It will however gel at quite a high temperature. And that's what's happening to you - the white hue is the stearin and palmitin in the palm oil. It's not gumming up, it's waxing up. You can't use palm oil in Canada. You can't use palm oil biodiesel in Canada either. What you seem to be missing is that Ircham is in Indonesia, and Jonathan is talking of using it in West Africa, not places where it gets cold. Palm oil will be just fine for them. Cetane rating on Palm oil is quite high but I don't use it because it does gum up. It has to be turned into BD to be used properly. If you are going to use it as SVO a B20 is about as high as I'd push it and that would be in warm weather. I'm using Soya oil as a B50 SVO in a volkswagon TDI (2003) during the summer time, but in winter it's no more than B20. Maybe you should read this too: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_TDI.html The TDI-SVO controversy You should at least be pre-heating your SVO (in which case you could use palm oil too wihout it gumming up). Palm oil is alot heavier Heavier? than soy or cannolla and the weather plays a big part in how rich the SVO ratio will be. You also have to look at costs, since Palm oil is also a cooking oil, it's going to set you back a pretty penny even if you could use it as a B100. West Africa and Indonesia are major world producers of palm oil. Anyway your point isn't very clear - both soy and canola are also cooking oils. As for refining, I'm looking around at some of the smaller kits but have not made a purchase yet. You mean for making biodiesel? Beware! Make your own! Best Keith Just something about storing chemicals in the garage in todays day and age -might give people the wrong impression of what's going on in the kitchen. Especially being a minority. Have fun! SM - Original Message - From: Jonathan Dunlap [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, June 28, 2004 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Palm oil... Thanks! I don't know what to do just yet But I will very soon! Jonathan Mochammad Ircham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It was refined palm oil, straight vegetable oil. It's so hard to find the WVO in here because the people still use it for their food. No, we still apply B10 and B20, I don't think B100 will be save to vehicle without any change especially in plastic part. Ofcourse, we put a sign. Mr. Keith, do you know any idea how to refine the glycerine lye. I think vacuum distillation still expensive for small scale purpose. regards, Ircham __ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email
Re: [biofuel] Palm oil...
Thanks! I don't know what to do just yet But I will very soon! Jonathan Mochammad Ircham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It was refined palm oil, straight vegetable oil. It's so hard to find the WVO in here because the people still use it for their food. No, we still apply B10 and B20, I don't think B100 will be save to vehicle without any change especially in plastic part. Ofcourse, we put a sign. Mr. Keith, do you know any idea how to refine the glycerine lye. I think vacuum distillation still expensive for small scale purpose. regards, Ircham __ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Palm oil...
Keith, Thank you very much! This will help a lot!!! Jonathan Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Jonathan Hey everyone, I'm very new to the group, the idea of using something other than fossil fuels, the whole thing. Therefore I'm more than sure I'll sound dumb to most of you if not all! Not at all, everyone has to start somewhere. The only dumb question is the one you don't ask. However, I have to do something! I don't like the price of gas and did not know I had other choices for fuel. I spend some of my time in West Africa. Palm oil is something I can get a lot of. Is it true that ANY oil can be used to make Biofuel without doing some damage to a Diesel Engine? Avoid the drying oils -see Iodine Values: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_yield.html#iodine Certainly you can use palm oil to make biodiesel. You might need more methanol - see How much methanol?, scroll down to Excess: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_meth.html Try some small test batches first - start here: Where do I start? http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html#start Palm oil has a high Cloud Point, in other words it goes solid at about 14 deg C (57 deg F), and biodiesel made from it also has a high Cloud Point, no use for cold countries, fine for West Africa. Crude palm oil though, the raw product as it's produced before refining, is another matter. CPO can have very high Free Fatty Acid levels and is difficult to process. It can be done though - do a search at the Biofuels-biz archives for high FFA oils or Allen: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuels-biz/ Hope this helps. Best wishes Keith Trying to learn something new, Jonathan Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: Re[2]: [biofuel] Raschig rings
These stoves... I saw a lot of people in Sierra Leone use kerosene stoves to cook with everyday Something to think about Gustl Steiner-Zehender [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Hallo Folks, Friday, 25 June, 2004, 17:27:31, you wrote: JD Thanks! All I know is that I have to do something. Fossil is JD nolonger the way... Money for them, yet very bad for OUR Earth! JD Jonathan I downloaded the still.pdf and sent it to Jonathan and while looking at the plans for the thing I came across the boiler section in which they say that the boiler has to be either electric or propane/natural gas. That got me to thinking. The Amish use kerosene stoves. I don't see why a kerosene stove couldn't be used using biodiesel as fuel. Any ideas on this? Happy Happy, Gustl -- Je mehr wir haben, desto mehr fordert Gott von uns. Mitglied-Team AMIGA ICQ: 22211253-Gustli The safest road to Hell is the gradual one - the gentle slope, soft underfoot, without sudden turnings, without milestones, without signposts. C. S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters Es gibt Wahrheiten, die so sehr auf der Stra§e liegen, da§ sie gerade deshalb von der gewhnlichen Welt nicht gesehen oder wenigstens nicht erkannt werden. Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music. George Carlin The best portion of a good man's life - His little, nameless, unremembered acts of kindness and of love. William Wordsworth Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Raschig rings
Thanks! All I know is that I have to do something. Fosil is nolonger the way... Money for them, yet very bad for OUR Earth! Jonathan Hunt, Adam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had the same problem. Have you looked around the site? There is plenty of good info at http://www.moonshine-still.com/page2.htm -Original Message- From: Jonathan Dunlap [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2004 9:32 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [biofuel] Raschig rings This link is not working http://www.moonshine-still.com/still.pdf, Jonathan Martin Klingensmith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Ben! You've asked a good question maybe you should check this out: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/distillers/?keywords=raschig+ring+sources many hits including alternatives such as glass beads or steel pot scrubbers. benjinsl wrote: Greetings all, I am planning to build a small ethanol still, http://www.moonshine-still.com/still.pdf, and would like to know if anyone can recommend a reputable source of raschig rings, or have any ideas of substitutes? (steel wool?) Ben -- -- Martin Klingensmith http://infoarchive.net/ http://nnytech.net/ Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Raschig rings
This link is not working http://www.moonshine-still.com/still.pdf, Jonathan Martin Klingensmith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Ben! You've asked a good question maybe you should check this out: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/distillers/?keywords=raschig+ring+sources many hits including alternatives such as glass beads or steel pot scrubbers. benjinsl wrote: Greetings all, I am planning to build a small ethanol still, http://www.moonshine-still.com/still.pdf, and would like to know if anyone can recommend a reputable source of raschig rings, or have any ideas of substitutes? (steel wool?) Ben -- -- Martin Klingensmith http://infoarchive.net/ http://nnytech.net/ Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Anybody there?
Well Ken, I'm here and very new to the whole thing. However, I have to do something. I have a 450 SEL with a BIG V8 and plan to buy a Ford F350 with a diesle in it to use biofuel that I plan to make. So any advise would be very helpful! Thanks, Jonathan Ken Provost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm just waitin for 300 messages to show up -- but they haven't yet. I actually had a virus attack over the weekend -- watched my emails disappear upwards before my very eyes, just like a spy film (y'know, Clear Present Danger, where one guys tryin to delete faster than the other guy can save off -- SPOOKY, and that's on a MAC!) Anyway, are we back to normal yet? Will we ever be normal AGAIN?:-) -K Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. J.J.A.M., Inc. Jonathan Lynden Dunlap IS Network Systems Analyst Your PC Linux Specialist P.O. Box 4209 Inglewood, California 90309-4209 323-779-2752/Home - Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
