[Biofuel] Acetone as a diesel additive?

[busyditch]

http://www.lubedev.com/smartgas/additive.htm


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Re: [Biofuel] acetone

[stwyk]

Hello 
Randall,
A 
quick question if I may. I'd just like to confirm that the by gas you talk about 
petrol. Here in S.A. gas is gas(LPG). Are you useing gas(LPG) or 
petrol?

Stephan
South 
Africa.

  -Original Message-From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of ROY 
  WashbishSent: 21 November 2005 07:55To: 
  Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: Re: [Biofuel] 
  acetone
  Please allow me to butt in here.
  I used 2 1/2 oz Acetone per 10 gal of gas in both my cars for two tank 
  fulls. What I found, as I see it, was that the system got clean and my mileage 
  improved. After I went back to just gas, same station, same pump, the 
  improvement was still there. 
  My conclusion: Acetone is a very inexpensive fuel system cleaner. 
  Itwill only improve mileage if it can 
  clean the fuel system. 
  So, there you have my two cents.
  Roy Washbish
  
  Randall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  I 
tried several tanks in a 1997 Ford Crown Victoria P71 (retired police 
cruiser) running about 2oz per 10 gallons. I know it wasn't very 
scientific (strict controls on amounts, driving conditions, etc) and I 
found almost no difference in my fuel economy.4/30/2005 83757 1 
17.674 2.39 93 4 yes 0.05658 2 oz/10 gallons, initial acetone 
addition5/6/2005 83964 207 10.7 2.39 93 2 yes 19.34579 1/2 tank of gas 
to fill5/26/2005 84284 320 17.94 2.29 93 3.5 yes 17.83724 frequent 
leadfoot driving, mostly city, mostly 70F+6/11/2005 84605 321 18.1 
2.27 93 3.5 yes 17.73481 running the ac frequently now6/18/2005 
84983 378 16.9 2.15 93 3.5 yes 22.36686 trip to the mountains - 
MIL6/30/2005 85268 285 17.1 2.32 93 0 yes 16.7 no acetone this 
tank - still MIL7/8/2005 85596 328 17.4 2.29 93 0 yes 18.85057 no 
acetone this tank - still MIL7/18/2005 85899 303 16.67 2.27 93 2 yes 
18.17636 partial highway, part city7/20/2005 86241 342 14.84 2.37 93 
0 yes 23.04582 mostly highway, mountains, slow rain 
travel--RandallCharlotte, NC- Original 
Message - From: "Alt.EnergyNetwork" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: <BIOFUEL@SUSTAINABLELISTS.ORG>Sent: 
Sunday, November 20, 2005 1:51 PMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] 
acetoneHi Derick,thanks for the update. Anyone else trying 
acetone?regardstallex ---Original 
Message--- From: Derick Giorchino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone 
Sent: 20 Nov '05 05:03 I have used the acetone on dino fuel 
with 2.5 gpm increase I also have  tried it on bio and found 
a net loss of about the same 2.5 gpm but I only tried it one time at 
2 oz per 10 gal on both fuels. Derick. -Original 
Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of  
Alt.EnergyNetwork Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 1:06 PM 
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers 
choose hydrogen power- now acetone Hi, Yes I 
was wondering about the acetone experiments also. As far as I know a 
few people on 2 or 3 other lists were going to  document 
their experiments. Anybody hear of any updates? 
tallex Get your daily alternative energy 
news Alternate Energy Resource Network 1000+ news 
sources-resources updated daily 
http://www.alternate-energy.net 
Next Generation Grid 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/next_generation_grid/ 
Tomorrow-energy 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tomorrow-energy/ 
Alternative Energy Politics 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Alternative_Energy_Politics/ 
 ---Original Message---  From: bob allen 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose 
hydrogen power- now acetone  Sent: 18 Nov '05 20:47 
  while we are on this thread, might we wander back a few 
months to a  related issue? That is the claim that addition of 
small amounts of  acetone to both compression and spark ignition 
engines would result in  dramatic increases in fuel efficiency, 
as much as 35 % increases  claimed  by some. 
  
http://www.pureenergysystems.com/news/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/ 
  Anybody have any well-controlled results to 
report?  
robert luis rabello wrote:   William Adams wrote: 
David,
 Thanks for the correction of air intake. Agreed, it would be good 
to look at   the beast. Can the anecdotes can be 
believed ? And, is the concept  for real?  
   The concept of supplemental hydrogen injection IS a 
valid one.   Whether or not this can be accomplished with 
any real gains in power   and fuel economy using an onboard 
electrolyzer makes me very  skeptical.   
robert luis rabello   "The Edge 
of Justice"   Adventure for Your Mind   
http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger 
Supercharger Project Pa

Re: [Biofuel] acetone

[Randall]

Stephan,

The car uses petrol /gasoline. It is 
not the model that uses LPG or other flex fuels.

--Randall
Charlotte, NC

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  stwyk 
  
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:41 
  AM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] acetone
  
  Hello Randall,
  A 
  quick question if I may. I'd just like to confirm that the by gas you talk 
  about petrol. Here in S.A. gas is gas(LPG). Are you useing gas(LPG) or 
  petrol?
  
  Stephan
  South Africa.
  
-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of ROY 
WashbishSent: 21 November 2005 07:55To: 
Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: Re: [Biofuel] 
acetone
Please allow me to butt in here.
I used 2 1/2 oz Acetone per 10 gal of gas in both my cars for two tank 
fulls. What I found, as I see it, was that the system got clean and my 
mileage improved. After I went back to just gas, same station, same pump, 
the improvement was still there. 
My conclusion: Acetone is a very inexpensive fuel system cleaner. 
Itwill only improve mileage if it can 
clean the fuel system. 
So, there you have my two cents.
Roy Washbish

Randall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
I 
  tried several tanks in a 1997 Ford Crown Victoria P71 (retired police 
  cruiser) running about 2oz per 10 gallons. I know it wasn't very 
  scientific (strict controls on amounts, driving conditions, etc) and I 
  found almost no difference in my fuel economy.4/30/2005 83757 
  1 17.674 2.39 93 4 yes 0.05658 2 oz/10 gallons, initial acetone 
  addition5/6/2005 83964 207 10.7 2.39 93 2 yes 19.34579 1/2 tank of gas 
  to fill5/26/2005 84284 320 17.94 2.29 93 3.5 yes 17.83724 frequent 
  leadfoot driving, mostly city, mostly 70F+6/11/2005 84605 321 18.1 
  2.27 93 3.5 yes 17.73481 running the ac frequently now6/18/2005 
  84983 378 16.9 2.15 93 3.5 yes 22.36686 trip to the mountains - 
  MIL6/30/2005 85268 285 17.1 2.32 93 0 yes 16.7 no acetone this 
  tank - still MIL7/8/2005 85596 328 17.4 2.29 93 0 yes 18.85057 no 
  acetone this tank - still MIL7/18/2005 85899 303 16.67 2.27 93 2 
  yes 18.17636 partial highway, part city7/20/2005 86241 342 14.84 
  2.37 93 0 yes 23.04582 mostly highway, mountains, slow rain 
  travel--RandallCharlotte, NC- Original 
  Message - From: "Alt.EnergyNetwork" 
  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: <BIOFUEL@SUSTAINABLELISTS.ORG>Sent: 
  Sunday, November 20, 2005 1:51 PMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] 
  acetoneHi Derick,thanks for the update. Anyone else trying 
  acetone?regardstallex ---Original 
  Message--- From: Derick Giorchino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone 
  Sent: 20 Nov '05 05:03 I have used the acetone on dino 
  fuel with 2.5 gpm increase I also have  tried it on bio 
  and found a net loss of about the same 2.5 gpm but I only tried it 
  one time at 2 oz per 10 gal on both fuels. Derick. 
  -Original Message- From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of  
  Alt.EnergyNetwork Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 1:06 PM 
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers 
  choose hydrogen power- now acetone Hi, Yes 
  I was wondering about the acetone experiments also. As far as I 
  know a few people on 2 or 3 other lists were going to  
  document their experiments. Anybody hear of any 
  updates? tallex Get your 
  daily alternative energy news Alternate Energy Resource 
  Network 1000+ news sources-resources updated 
  daily 
  http://www.alternate-energy.net 
  Next Generation Grid 
  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/next_generation_grid/ 
  Tomorrow-energy 
  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tomorrow-energy/ 
  Alternative Energy Politics 
  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Alternative_Energy_Politics/ 
   ---Original Message---  From: bob allen 
  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose 
  hydrogen power- now acetone  Sent: 18 Nov '05 20:47 
while we are on this thread, might we wander back a few 
  months to a  related issue? That is the claim that addition of 
  small amounts of  acetone to both compression and spark 
  ignition engines would result in  dramatic increases in fuel 
  efficiency, as much as 35 % increases  claimed  by 
  some.   
  http://www.pureenergysystems.com/news/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/ 
Anybody have any well-controlled results to 
  report?  
  robert luis rabello wrote:   William Adams wrote: 
  David,
   Thanks for the correction of air intake. Agreed, it would be good 
  to look at   the beast. Can the anecdotes can 
  be believ

Re: [Biofuel] acetone

[Randall]

I tried several tanks in a 1997 Ford Crown Victoria P71 (retired police 
cruiser) running about 2oz per 10 gallons.  I know it wasn't very scientific 
(strict controls on amounts, driving conditions, etc) and I found almost no 
difference in my fuel economy.

  4/30/2005 83757 1 17.674 2.39 93 4 yes 0.056582 oz/10 gallons, 
initial acetone addition
  5/6/2005 83964 207 10.7 2.39 93 2 yes 19.34579   1/2 tank of gas 
to fill
  5/26/2005 84284 320 17.94 2.29 93 3.5 yes 17.83724   frequent 
leadfoot driving, mostly city, mostly 70F+
  6/11/2005 84605 321 18.1 2.27 93 3.5 yes 17.73481running the 
ac frequently now
  6/18/2005 84983 378 16.9 2.15 93 3.5 yes 22.36686trip to the 
mountains - MIL
  6/30/2005 85268 285 17.1 2.32 93 0 yes 16.7no acetone this 
tank - still MIL
  7/8/2005 85596 328 17.4 2.29 93 0 yes 18.85057no acetone this 
tank - still MIL
  7/18/2005 85899 303 16.67 2.27 93 2 yes 18.17636partial 
highway, part city
  7/20/2005 86241 342 14.84 2.37 93 0 yes 23.04582mostly 
highway, mountains, slow rain travel


--Randall
Charlotte, NC


- Original Message - 
From: Alt.EnergyNetwork [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 1:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] acetone


Hi Derick,
thanks for the update. Anyone else trying acetone?
regards
tallex


  ---Original Message---
  From: Derick Giorchino [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone
  Sent: 20 Nov '05 05:03

  I have used the acetone on dino fuel with 2.5 gpm increase I also have 
 tried
  it on bio and found a net loss of about the same 2.5 gpm but I only tried
  it one time at 2 oz per 10 gal on both fuels.
  Derick.

  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of 
 Alt.EnergyNetwork
  Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 1:06 PM
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone


  Hi,
  Yes I was wondering about the acetone experiments also.
  As far as I know a few people on 2 or 3 other lists were going to 
 document
  their experiments.
  Anybody hear of any updates?

  tallex



  Get your daily alternative energy news

  Alternate Energy Resource Network
  1000+ news sources-resources
  updated daily

  http://www.alternate-energy.net






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   ---Original Message---
   From: bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone
   Sent: 18 Nov '05 20:47
  
   while we are on this thread, might we wander back a few months to a
   related issue? That is the claim that addition of small amounts of
   acetone to both compression and spark ignition engines would result in
   dramatic increases in fuel efficiency, as much as 35 % increases 
 claimed
   by some.
  
   http://www.pureenergysystems.com/news/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/
  
   Anybody have any well-controlled results to report?
  
  
  
  
   robert luis rabello wrote:
William Adams wrote:
   
David,
   
Thanks for the correction of air intake. Agreed, it would be good to
  look at
the beast. Can the anecdotes can be believed ? And, is the concept 
 for
  real?
   
The concept of supplemental hydrogen injection IS a valid one.
Whether or not this can be accomplished with any real gains in power
and fuel economy using an onboard electrolyzer makes me very 
 skeptical.
   
   
robert luis rabello
The Edge of Justice
Adventure for Your Mind
http://www.newadventure.ca
   
Ranger Supercharger Project Page
http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/
   
   
___
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  http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
   
Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
   
Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
  messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
   
   
   
   
  
  
   --
   Bob Allen
   http://ozarker.org/bob
  
   Science is what we have learned about how to keep
   from fooling ourselves - Richard Feynman
  
   ___
   Biofuel mailing list
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 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
  
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   Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
  messages):
   http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org

Re: [Biofuel] acetone

[ROY Washbish]

Please allow me to butt in here.  I used 2 1/2 oz Acetone per 10 gal of gas in both my cars for two tank fulls. What I found, as I see it, was that the system got clean and my mileage improved. After I went back to just gas, same station, same pump, the improvement was still there.   My conclusion: Acetone is a very inexpensive fuel system cleaner. Itwill only improve mileage if it can clean the fuel system.   So, there you have my two cents.  Roy WashbishRandall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  I tried several tanks in a 1997 Ford Crown Victoria P71 (retired police cruiser) running about 2oz per 10 gallons. I know it wasn't very scientific (strict controls on amounts, driving conditions, etc) and I found almost no
 difference in my fuel economy.4/30/2005 83757 1 17.674 2.39 93 4 yes 0.05658 2 oz/10 gallons, initial acetone addition5/6/2005 83964 207 10.7 2.39 93 2 yes 19.34579 1/2 tank of gas to fill5/26/2005 84284 320 17.94 2.29 93 3.5 yes 17.83724 frequent leadfoot driving, mostly city, mostly 70F+6/11/2005 84605 321 18.1 2.27 93 3.5 yes 17.73481 running the ac frequently now6/18/2005 84983 378 16.9 2.15 93 3.5 yes 22.36686 trip to the mountains - MIL6/30/2005 85268 285 17.1 2.32 93 0 yes 16.7 no acetone this tank - still MIL7/8/2005 85596 328 17.4 2.29 93 0 yes 18.85057 no acetone this tank - still MIL7/18/2005 85899 303 16.67 2.27 93 2 yes 18.17636 partial highway, part city7/20/2005 86241 342 14.84 2.37 93 0 yes 23.04582 mostly highway, mountains, slow rain travel--RandallCharlotte, NC- Original Message - From: "Alt.EnergyNetwork" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To:
 Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 1:51 PMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] acetoneHi Derick,thanks for the update. Anyone else trying acetone?regardstallex ---Original Message--- From: Derick Giorchino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone Sent: 20 Nov '05 05:03 I have used the acetone on dino fuel with 2.5 gpm increase I also have  tried it on bio and found a net loss of about the same 2.5 gpm but I only tried it one time at 2 oz per 10 gal on both fuels. Derick. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of  Alt.EnergyNetwork Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 1:06 PM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen
 power- now acetone Hi, Yes I was wondering about the acetone experiments also. As far as I know a few people on 2 or 3 other lists were going to  document their experiments. Anybody hear of any updates? tallex Get your daily alternative energy news Alternate Energy Resource Network 1000+ news sources-resources updated daily http://www.alternate-energy.net Next Generation Grid http://groups.yahoo.com/group/next_generation_grid/ Tomorrow-energy http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tomorrow-energy/ Alternative Energy Politics http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Alternative_Energy_Politics/  ---Original Message---  From:
 bob allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone  Sent: 18 Nov '05 20:47   while we are on this thread, might we wander back a few months to a  related issue? That is the claim that addition of small amounts of  acetone to both compression and spark ignition engines would result in  dramatic increases in fuel efficiency, as much as 35 % increases  claimed  by some.   http://www.pureenergysystems.com/news/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/   Anybody have any well-controlled results to report?  robert luis rabello wrote:   William Adams wrote: David, Thanks for the correction of air intake. Agreed, it would be good to look
 at   the beast. Can the anecdotes can be believed ? And, is the concept  for real? The concept of supplemental hydrogen injection IS a valid one.   Whether or not this can be accomplished with any real gains in power   and fuel economy using an onboard electrolyzer makes me very  skeptical.   robert luis rabello   "The Edge of Justice"   Adventure for Your Mind   http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger Supercharger Project Page   http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/   ___   Biofuel mailing list   Biofuel@sustainablelists.org  
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever:   http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):   http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/--  Bob Allen  http://ozarker.org/bob   "Science is what we have learned about how to keep  from fooling ourselves" - Richard Feynman   ___  Biofuel mailing list  Biofuel@sustainablelists.org   http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org   Biofuel at Journey to
 Forever:  http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html   Search the combined Biofuel and 

Re: [Biofuel] acetone

[bob allen]

Howdy Roy, would you care to speculate on why you have better mileage 
with a cleaner fuel system? And just how much did your mileage improve? 
I am not trying to be mean-spirited here, just questioning.

If in fact the mileage improves, then why was it lower before addition 
of acetone? Were the hydrocarbons passing thru system uncombusted? I 
wonder if in states where volatile organic carbon is tested for in 
exhaust emissions, that the voc's would go down in an engine using  a 
trace of acetone blended with the fuel?  I really think this could be 
simply tested with an exhaust gas analyzer or a dynamometer without the 
difficulty of controlling all the highway variables.


I have my own ideas on this, and nothing personal to you or anyone else 
that has posted on the subject, but I don't think most folks understand 
how difficult it is to control the variables involved in this type of 
experiment. Just a few degrees difference in air temperatures affect 
tire pressure which can have an effect on mileage, as just one example.


My bottom line- acetone in small amounts does nothing, and any 
observation of a positive effect can be attributed to uncontrolled 
variables.


ROY Washbish wrote:
 Please allow me to butt in here.
 I used 2 1/2 oz Acetone per 10 gal of gas in both my cars for two tank 
 fulls. What I found, as I see it, was that the system got clean and my 
 mileage improved. After I went back to just gas, same station, same 
 pump, the improvement was still there.
 My conclusion:  Acetone is a very inexpensive fuel system cleaner. 
 It will only  improve mileage *_if _*it can clean the fuel system.
 So, there you have my two cents.
 Roy Washbish
  
 
 
 */Randall [EMAIL PROTECTED]/* wrote:
 
 I tried several tanks in a 1997 Ford Crown Victoria P71 (retired police
 cruiser) running about 2oz per 10 gallons. I know it wasn't very
 scientific
 (strict controls on amounts, driving conditions, etc) and I found
 almost no
 difference in my fuel economy.
 
 4/30/2005 83757 1 17.674 2.39 93 4 yes 0.05658 2 oz/10 gallons,
 initial acetone addition
 5/6/2005 83964 207 10.7 2.39 93 2 yes 19.34579 1/2 tank of gas
 to fill
 5/26/2005 84284 320 17.94 2.29 93 3.5 yes 17.83724 frequent
 leadfoot driving, mostly city, mostly 70F+
 6/11/2005 84605 321 18.1 2.27 93 3.5 yes 17.73481 running the
 ac frequently now
 6/18/2005 84983 378 16.9 2.15 93 3.5 yes 22.36686 trip to the
 mountains - MIL
 6/30/2005 85268 285 17.1 2.32 93 0 yes 16.7 no acetone this
 tank - still MIL
 7/8/2005 85596 328 17.4 2.29 93 0 yes 18.85057 no acetone this
 tank - still MIL
 7/18/2005 85899 303 16.67 2.27 93 2 yes 18.17636 partial
 highway, part city
 7/20/2005 86241 342 14.84 2.37 93 0 yes 23.04582 mostly
 highway, mountains, slow rain travel
 
 
 --Randall
 Charlotte, NC
 
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Alt.EnergyNetwork
 To:
 Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 1:51 PM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] acetone
 
 
 Hi Derick,
 thanks for the update. Anyone else trying acetone?
 regards
 tallex
 
 
   ---Original Message---
   From: Derick Giorchino
   Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone
   Sent: 20 Nov '05 05:03
  
   I have used the acetone on dino fuel with 2.5 gpm increase I also
 have
   tried
   it on bio and found a net loss of about the same 2.5 gpm but I
 only tried
   it one time at 2 oz per 10 gal on both fuels.
   Derick.
  
   -Original Message-
   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
   Alt.EnergyNetwork
   Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 1:06 PM
   To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone
  
  
   Hi,
   Yes I was wondering about the acetone experiments also.
   As far as I know a few people on 2 or 3 other lists were going to
   document
   their experiments.
   Anybody hear of any updates?
  
   tallex
  
  
  
   Get your daily alternative energy news
  
   Alternate Energy Resource Network
   1000+ news sources-resources
   updated daily
  
   http://www.alternate-energy.net
  
  
  
  
  
  
   Next Generation Grid
   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/next_generation_grid/
  
  
  
  
  
   Tomorrow-energy
   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tomorrow-energy/
  
  
  
  
   Alternative Energy Politics
   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Alternative_Energy_Politics/
  
  
  
---Original Message---
From: bob allen
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone
Sent: 18 Nov '05 20:47
   
while we are on this thread, might we wander back

Re: [Biofuel] acetone

[ROY Washbish]

Howdy yourselfBob   My SPECULATION:  "My conclusion: Acetone is a very inexpensive fuel system cleaner. It will only improve mileage *_if _*it can clean the fuel system"  Bob, maybe it is nothing more than CLEAN injectors or something small like that.  I feel that IF the acetone did anything more than CLEAN SOMETHING the results would have REVERSED when Acetone was not used. THEY DID NOT.  I sure agree that a scientific study would be much more accurate but that's not what I can do.  Bob, I have a fell grasp on how difficult it is to TESTwith anything other than a TEST HIWAY with the proper equipment and I'll bet that most people here do also. That's not what we as ordinary people posses. We do accept anecdotal experiences and go with that info and do our own tests just as I have done here.  It's not the best but that's
 all most of us have.  If you feel that this is less than what you want to find here then maybe YOU can offer more. We all (I expect) would be very open to that.  Let me make one more statement. Let me quote you first.  "My bottom line- acetone in small amounts does nothing, and any observation of a positive effect can be attributed to uncontrolled variables."  IF what I did was "a positive effect (that) can be attributed to uncontrolled variables." why did the results not reverse when I went back to NO ACETONE???  Bob I'm not one to make statements too soon, I hope. Here's an example of why I say my mileage did increase.  My wife and I make a particular trip on the same road about the same time of day about once a month.It's about 140 miles round trip.I have been using a mileagedisplaying device that displays what the car computer knows (if you will) from prior to Acetone to the
 present. My mileage INCREASED 3 mpg in my wife's car, which is the only one we use for this trip. My car did about the same thing but the test was not as scientific   There you have it.  Now it's YOUR TURN to not to be offended. I would feel bad if you were as we are just putting things on the table here for people to do with as they will.  Your thoughts please.  My BEST to You  Roy Washbish  bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  Howdy Roy, would you care to speculate on why you have better mileage with a cleaner fuel system? And just how much did your mileage improve? I am not trying to be mean-spirited here, just questioning.If in fact the mileage
 improves, then why was it lower before addition of acetone? Were the hydrocarbons passing thru system uncombusted? I wonder if in states where volatile organic carbon is tested for in exhaust emissions, that the voc's would go down in an engine using a trace of acetone blended with the fuel? I really think this could be simply tested with an exhaust gas analyzer or a dynamometer without the difficulty of controlling all the "highway" variables.I have my own ideas on this, and nothing personal to you or anyone else that has posted on the subject, but I don't think most folks understand how difficult it is to control the variables involved in this type of experiment. Just a few degrees difference in air temperatures affect tire pressure which can have an effect on mileage, as just one example.My bottom line- acetone in small amounts does nothing, and any observation of a positive effect can be attributed to
 uncontrolled variables.ROY Washbish wrote: Please allow me to butt in here. I used 2 1/2 oz Acetone per 10 gal of gas in both my cars for two tank  fulls. What I found, as I see it, was that the system got clean and my  mileage improved. After I went back to just gas, same station, same  pump, the improvement was still there. My conclusion: Acetone is a very inexpensive fuel system cleaner.  It will only improve mileage *_if _*it can clean the fuel system. So, there you have my two cents. Roy Washbish*/Randall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>/* wrote:  I tried several tanks in a 1997 Ford Crown Victoria P71 (retired police cruiser) running about 2oz per 10 gallons. I know it wasn't very scientific (strict controls on amounts, driving conditions, etc) and I found almost no(SNIP)
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Re: [Biofuel] acetone

[Randall]

Ooops...sorry...forgot to paste the column headers.  :-)

  Date Mileage Distance Gallons Price   Octane Oz Acetone Full tank? MPG 
Comments
 83756
  4/30/2005 83757 1 17.674 2.39 93 4 yes 0.05658 2 oz/10 
gallons, initial acetone addition
  5/6/2005 83964 207 10.7 2.39 93 2 yes 19.34579 1/2 tank of gas 
to fill
  5/26/2005 84284 320 17.94 2.29 93 3.5 yes 17.83724 frequent 
leadfoot driving, mostly city, mostly 70F+
  6/11/2005 84605 321 18.1 2.27 93 3.5 yes 17.73481 running the 
ac frequently now
  6/18/2005 84983 378 16.9 2.15 93 3.5 yes 22.36686 trip to the 
mountains - MIL
  6/30/2005 85268 285 17.1 2.32 93 0 yes 16.7 no acetone 
this tank - still MIL
  7/8/2005 85596 328 17.4 2.29 93 0 yes 18.85057 no acetone this 
tank - still MIL
  7/18/2005 85899 303 16.67 2.27 93 2 yes 18.17636 partial 
highway, part city
  7/20/2005 86241 342 14.84 2.37 93 0 yes 23.04582 mostly highway, 
mountains, slow rain travel



--Randall
Charlotte, NC

- Original Message - 
From: Alt.EnergyNetwork [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 1:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] acetone


Hi Derick,
thanks for the update. Anyone else trying acetone?
regards
tallex


  ---Original Message---
  From: Derick Giorchino [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone
  Sent: 20 Nov '05 05:03

  I have used the acetone on dino fuel with 2.5 gpm increase I also have 
 tried
  it on bio and found a net loss of about the same 2.5 gpm but I only tried
  it one time at 2 oz per 10 gal on both fuels.
  Derick.

  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of 
 Alt.EnergyNetwork
  Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 1:06 PM
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone


  Hi,
  Yes I was wondering about the acetone experiments also.
  As far as I know a few people on 2 or 3 other lists were going to 
 document
  their experiments.
  Anybody hear of any updates?

  tallex



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   ---Original Message---
   From: bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone
   Sent: 18 Nov '05 20:47
  
   while we are on this thread, might we wander back a few months to a
   related issue? That is the claim that addition of small amounts of
   acetone to both compression and spark ignition engines would result in
   dramatic increases in fuel efficiency, as much as 35 % increases 
 claimed
   by some.
  
   http://www.pureenergysystems.com/news/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/
  
   Anybody have any well-controlled results to report?
  
  
  
  
   robert luis rabello wrote:
William Adams wrote:
   
David,
   
Thanks for the correction of air intake. Agreed, it would be good to
  look at
the beast. Can the anecdotes can be believed ? And, is the concept 
 for
  real?
   
The concept of supplemental hydrogen injection IS a valid one.
Whether or not this can be accomplished with any real gains in power
and fuel economy using an onboard electrolyzer makes me very 
 skeptical.
   
   
robert luis rabello
The Edge of Justice
Adventure for Your Mind
http://www.newadventure.ca
   
Ranger Supercharger Project Page
http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/
   
   
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Re: [Biofuel] acetone

[Alt.EnergyNetwork]

Hi Derick,
thanks for the update. Anyone else trying acetone?
regards
tallex


  ---Original Message---
  From: Derick Giorchino [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone
  Sent: 20 Nov '05 05:03
  
  I have used the acetone on dino fuel with 2.5 gpm increase I also have tried
  it on bio and found a net loss of about the same 2.5 gpm  but I only tried
  it one time at 2 oz per 10 gal on both fuels.
  Derick.
  
  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Alt.EnergyNetwork
  Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 1:06 PM
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone
  
  
  Hi,
  Yes I was wondering about the acetone experiments also.
  As far as I know a few people on 2 or 3 other lists were going to document
  their experiments.
  Anybody hear of any updates?
  
  tallex
  
  
  
  Get your daily alternative energy news
  
  Alternate Energy Resource Network
    1000+ news sources-resources
     updated daily
  
  http://www.alternate-energy.net
  
  
  
  
  
  
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  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/next_generation_grid/
  
  
  
  
  
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  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tomorrow-energy/
  
  
  
  
  Alternative Energy Politics
  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Alternative_Energy_Politics/
  
  
  
    ---Original Message---
    From: bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
    Subject: Re: [Biofuel] truckers choose hydrogen power- now acetone
    Sent: 18 Nov '05 20:47
    
    while we are on this thread, might we wander back a few months to a
    related issue?  That is the claim that addition of small amounts of
    acetone to both compression and spark ignition engines would result in
    dramatic increases in fuel efficiency, as much as 35 % increases claimed
    by some.
    
    http://www.pureenergysystems.com/news/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/
    
    Anybody have any well-controlled results to report?
    
    
    
    
    robert luis rabello wrote:
     William Adams wrote:
    
     David,
    
     Thanks for the correction of air intake. Agreed, it would be good to
  look at
     the beast. Can the anecdotes can be believed ? And, is the concept for
  real?
    
       The concept of supplemental hydrogen injection IS a valid one.
     Whether or not this can be accomplished with any real gains in power
     and fuel economy using an onboard electrolyzer makes me very skeptical.
    
    
     robert luis rabello
     The Edge of Justice
     Adventure for Your Mind
     http://www.newadventure.ca
    
     Ranger Supercharger Project Page
     http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/
    
    
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[Biofuel] acetone

[Andrew Tracey]

Be prepared to buy at least one new fuel filter, i replaced two in nine weeks. 
The first one was chocker block with rust and crud. The second one i replaced 
after 8 weeks just to be sure. The motor was starting to miss occasionally, now 
it's power on. Look forward to your upcoming results. AT
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[subramanian D.V]

Thank you Mr. Jain, for the encouraging infmn. I will premix the acetone with 
some petrol before putting it into the tank.
 
Will keep in touch after 2 months of regular use in petrol driven car.
Regards,
DVS


Y. K. JAIN [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Dear Mr. Subramanian,

I tried commercial acetone (the one commonly available in India with chemists 
and used as nail polish remover) in my diesel car @ 0.2% with ordinary diesel. 
The result as noticed by me under identical conditions of daily commuting was 
increase in kmpl from 17 to 19.5 . Additional effect noticed was cooler running 
of the engine and reduction in noise. During highway driving, while overtaking 
vehicles,
I noticed better pick-up (the diesel cars are a bit sluggish as compared to 
gasoline cars) similar to gasoline cars. A quantitative check could, however be 
made only in laboratory conditions.

A tip here: the acetone may be premixed with fuel to, say, a 5% or 10% mixture 
so that while it is being added to the fuel tank, it does not damage the tank 
hose as it flows down; it does not emit fumes that could be inhaled; the 
measurement accuracy is better (the quantity to be measured and added to the 
fuel tank does not remain too small to cause appreciable error) and the 
possibility of damage to car
paint by its accidental spillage is reduced.

The 0.2 % addition to fuel is not expected to do any damage to the rubber 
hoses. However, the risk perception and risk taking is personal in nature and, 
here also, laboratory tests would be required to establish long term effects. 
Anyway, I am already proceeding with acetone doped fuel for my car.

Y. K. Jain



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begin:vcard 
n:;Y.K. JAIN, 
tel;cell:9810031075, 9818683570
tel;home:PHONE (R) 0120-2624480,95120-2624480 from Delhi
tel;work:PHONE (O) 011-26107996
x-mozilla-html:TRUE
org:ENGINEERS INDIA LIMITED, 
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email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
title:DGM (Vigilance)
adr;quoted-printable:;;5th floor, E.I. Bhawan,=0D=0A1, Bhikaiji Cama Place,;New 
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[Y. K. JAIN]

Dear Mr. Subramanian,

I tried commercial acetone (the one commonly available in India with chemists 
and used as nail polish remover) in my diesel car @ 0.2% with ordinary diesel. 
The result as noticed by me under identical conditions of daily commuting was 
increase in kmpl from 17 to 19.5 . Additional effect noticed was cooler running 
of the engine and reduction in noise. During highway driving, while overtaking 
vehicles,
I noticed better pick-up (the diesel cars are a bit sluggish as compared to 
gasoline cars) similar to gasoline cars. A quantitative check could, however be 
made only in laboratory conditions.

A tip here: the acetone may be premixed with fuel to, say, a 5% or 10% mixture 
so that while it is being added to the fuel tank, it does not damage the tank 
hose as it flows down; it does not emit fumes that could be inhaled; the 
measurement accuracy is better (the quantity to be measured and added to the 
fuel tank does not remain too small to cause appreciable error) and the 
possibility of damage to car
paint by its accidental spillage is reduced.

The 0.2 % addition to fuel is not expected to do any damage to the rubber 
hoses. However, the risk perception and risk taking is personal in nature and, 
here also, laboratory tests would be required to establish long term effects. 
Anyway, I am already proceeding with acetone doped fuel for my car.

Y. K. Jain

subramanian D.V wrote:

 Hi ,

 Gasolene( petrol ) costs in India about 95 cents a liter, roughly twice of 
 its price in U.S. And is edging up towards a dollar and more. The possibility 
 of getting more mileage by mixing with a small dose of acetone came up from a 
 mail posted in this list. As one of the middle class using a car  trying to 
 balance my budget I decided to give it a try. Iâve not even asked anybody 
 else to try and report.

 I only put a harmless query about the difference between commercial acetone 
 and lab quality acetone and added a footnote whether anybody else has tried 
 this acetone mix  with what results. I seem to have caused a minor Tsunami.

 If my experiment does not measure upto expectation, I have not hurt anybody 
 else O.K.

 Thank you all for yr comments.
 Regards,
 D.V.S


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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii;
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Content-Disposition: attachment;
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[dwoodard]

These reports of better economy with an admixture of acetone in diesel
fuel are extremely interesting. I surmise that something is going on
besides reducing unburned fuel, and that the acetone is improving the
speed of combustion, resulting in more energy being released close to top
dead centre, and a higher average expansion ratio.

Normally one would be suspicious of a possible increase in peak pressure.
The reduction in noise reported by Mr. Jain suggests that possibly this is
not the case although the possibility of an increase remains. If there is
an increase in peak pressure, it would likely be significant for engine
durability only at high power levels in relation to rpm, i.e. large
amounts of fuel burned per cycle, and fast acceleration of cars.

It would be extremely interesting to see a pressure diagram (these show
cylinder pressure over the cycle). Perhaps some university
department of mechanical engineering could be perusaded to run
such a test; it should be quick and cheap. I suspect also that Indian
universities may have a more enterprising attitude to exploring
efficiency improvements than those in North America or Europe.

Doug Woodard
St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada


On Wed, 20 Apr 2005, Y. K. JAIN wrote:

 Dear Mr. Subramanian,

 I tried commercial acetone (the one commonly available in India with chemists 
 and used as nail polish remover) in my diesel car @ 0.2% with ordinary 
 diesel. The result as noticed by me under identical conditions of daily 
 commuting was increase in kmpl from 17 to 19.5 . Additional effect noticed 
 was cooler running of the engine and reduction in noise. During highway 
 driving, while overtaking vehicles,
 I noticed better pick-up (the diesel cars are a bit sluggish as compared to 
 gasoline cars) similar to gasoline cars. A quantitative check could, however 
 be made only in laboratory conditions.

 A tip here: the acetone may be premixed with fuel to, say, a 5% or 10% 
 mixture so that while it is being added to the fuel tank, it does not damage 
 the tank hose as it flows down; it does not emit fumes that could be inhaled; 
 the measurement accuracy is better (the quantity to be measured and added to 
 the fuel tank does not remain too small to cause appreciable error) and the 
 possibility of damage to car
 paint by its accidental spillage is reduced.

 The 0.2 % addition to fuel is not expected to do any damage to the rubber 
 hoses. However, the risk perception and risk taking is personal in nature 
 and, here also, laboratory tests would be required to establish long term 
 effects. Anyway, I am already proceeding with acetone doped fuel for my car.

 Y. K. Jain

 subramanian D.V wrote:

  Hi ,
 
  Gasolene( petrol ) costs in India about 95 cents a liter, roughly twice of 
  its price in U.S. And is edging up towards a dollar and more. The 
  possibility of getting more mileage by mixing with a small dose of acetone 
  came up from a mail posted in this list. As one of the middle class using a 
  car  trying to balance my budget I decided to give it a try. Iâve not even 
  asked anybody else to try and report.
 
  I only put a harmless query about the difference between commercial acetone 
  and lab quality acetone and added a footnote whether anybody else has tried 
  this acetone mix  with what results. I seem to have caused a minor Tsunami.
 
  If my experiment does not measure upto expectation, I have not hurt anybody 
  else O.K.
 
  Thank you all for yr comments.
  Regards,
  D.V.S
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[dwoodard]

Acetone is a perfectly good motor fuel ingredient, all other things being
equal. Sir Harry Ricardo and colleagues used it in Castrol R motor
racing fuel in the early 1920's, a mixture designed to have extreme heat
of vapourization and charge density with high knock resistance. They used
the acetone to get a soluble mixture incorporating benzene (I think)
and water, plus ethanol if memory serves. See Ricardo's memoirs, Memories
and Machines.

What worries me is that acetone is a super solvent, and I suspect it would
have drastic effects on any plastic parts (gaskets?) or rubber parts
(o-rings?) in your fuel system. If they don't dissolve, they might swell.

Also, the purported function of the acetone in this case (reducing
unburned fuel) makes no engineering sense to me at all. In a gasoline
engine in good condition and good tune, there should not be enough
unburned fuel to be of more than negligible *thermodynamic* significance.
The suggested mechanism by which the acetone is said to reduce unburned
fuel dosn't make any sense to me. It does though have a certain family
resemblance to miracle carburetor hype which I have encountered.

Doug Woodard
St. Catharines, Ontario


On Sun, 17 Apr 2005, Keith Addison wrote:

 Hi D.V.

 Hi ,
 
 Gasolene( petrol ) costs in India about 95 cents a liter, roughly
 twice of its price in U.S. And is edging up towards a dollar and
 more. The possibility of getting more mileage by mixing with a small
 dose of acetone came up from a mail posted in this list. As one of
 the middle class using a car  trying to balance my budget I decided
 to give it a try. I’ve not even asked anybody else to try and report.
 
 I only put a harmless query about the difference between commercial
 acetone and lab quality acetone and added a footnote whether anybody
 else has tried this acetone mix  with what results. I seem to have
 caused a minor Tsunami.
 
 If my experiment does not measure upto expectation, I have not hurt
 anybody else O.K.

 Certainly you haven't. I don't think anyone was trying to get at you.
 There are a lot of scams and bad information about magic bullets that
 boost fuel economy, so it's as well that any such claims get a close
 examination. But you've had some encouragement too. I very much agree
 with Roy's reply to you, I'd guess that most list members do. It's
 unlikely that you'll do your car any harm, please go ahead with your
 plan, and please do keep us informed of the results.

 By the way, I'm sure you don't need lab-quality acetone, I think the
 first message in the thread implied that by saying it was a widely
 available chemical, easy to get. Try it with commercial-grade.

 Best wishes

 Keith


 Thank you all for yr comments.
 Regards,
 D.V.S
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[subramanian D.V]

Thank you Doug, 
The experiment is for  on the road driving under normal driving conditions 
for two months and only to see whether there is a mileage increase or not.
I'll certainly keep an eye on plastic and rubber parts. 
 
Thank you Keith for yr encouragement and infmn that comml acetone is OK 
 
Regards,
 
D.V.S


[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

What worries me is that acetone is a super solvent, and I suspect it would
have drastic effects on any plastic parts (gaskets?) or rubber parts
(o-rings?) in your fuel system. If they don't dissolve, they might swell.


Doug Woodard
St. Catharines, Ontario


On Sun, 17 Apr 2005, Keith Addison wrote:


  It's
 unlikely that you'll do your car any harm, please go ahead with your
 plan, and please do keep us informed of the results.

 By the way, I'm sure you don't need lab-quality acetone, I think the
 first message in the thread implied that by saying it was a widely
 available chemical, easy to get. Try it with commercial-grade.

 Best wishes

 Keith



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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[subramanian D.V]

Thank you Mr. Roy for yr helpful comments
 
Regards,
DVS

ROY Washbish [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi DVS
It was YOUR question but it sure interests me also. 
I sure hope no one was REALLY put out by your use of acetone. I feel that they 
were actually looking for someone with TEST equipment of offer to do a more 
accepted engineering test. I guess we have a bunch of engineers here and that's 
fine. We could get some better info in the long run from them but in the mean 
time we could do as you have and do our own testing in our cars or whatever we 
have and share the info.
~BEST~
Roy

subramanian D.V wrote:

Hi ,

Gasolene( petrol ) costs in India about 95 cents a liter, roughly twice of its 
price in U.S. And is edging up towards a dollar and more. The possibility of 
getting more mileage by mixing with a small dose of acetone came up from a mail 
posted in this list. As one of the middle class using a car  trying to balance 
my budget I decided to give it a try. I’ve not even asked anybody else to try 
and report. 

I only put a harmless query about the difference between commercial acetone and 
lab quality acetone and added a footnote whether anybody else has tried this 
acetone mix  with what results. I seem to have caused a minor Tsunami.

If my experiment does not measure upto expectation, I have not hurt anybody 
else O.K.

Thank you all for yr comments.
Regards,
D.V.S


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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[Chris]

I doubt the independent retailers know about, or care about fuel
efficiency


If it worked, somebody small would have bought a 55 gallon drum of the stuff 
and repackaged it as the newest miracle.  The label wouldn't say what the 
active ingredient is probably.  Heck, if it works, I'll do it.


Chris K
Cayce, SC





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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[Kenneth Kron (CEO)]

   Selling fuel is a stable low risk business.  The independent retailers
   don't generally see radical change as part of their business model.
   Otherwise why aren't they all selling B20?
   There are two or three groups where people report their mileage and
   some people are reporting good results, some people are reporting no
   change.  At this point based purely on the end user reports I believe
   there may be particular circumstances under which Acetone does improve
   your mileage, of course it could be placebo effect of people just
   paying more attention to their driving but if you have to buy a little
   acetone with every fillup in order to drive more efficiently then I'm
   OK with that also.
   I tried testing it myself but I don't have a working odometer and
   since we don't retail by the gallon I don't have a pump that is
   accurate enough to get any good data.  It did appear to help the
   opacity of my exhaust but that's all I can report about adding acetone
   to B100.
   kk
   bob allen wrote:

 there are a lot of independent retailers out there who would love
 to sell more gas if they could advertise it as providing 30 %
 better mileage.  They could even a couple of cents to the price and
 be ahead on cost/distance.
 enny Dunn wrote:

 Except that the petro industry doesn't really have any interest in
 you getting
 better mileage.  They certainly aren't telling us any ways to send
 them less
 money.
 $.02,
 Ken
 Michael Redler [1][EMAIL PROTECTED] said:

 You're making sense Bob.

 bob allen [2][EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 if it really worked, which I highly doubt, don't you think somebody
 would be blending and selling the mix already?

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   [9]Johann Wolfgang von Goethe.

References

   1. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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   4. http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[subramanian D.V]

Hi ,

Gasolene( petrol ) costs in India about 95 cents a liter, roughly twice of its 
price in U.S. And is edging up towards a dollar and more. The possibility of 
getting more mileage by mixing with a small dose of acetone came up from a mail 
posted in this list. As one of the middle class using a car  trying to balance 
my budget I decided to give it a try. I’ve not even asked anybody else to try 
and report. 

I only put a harmless query about the difference between commercial acetone and 
lab quality acetone and added a footnote whether anybody else has tried this 
acetone mix  with what results. I seem to have caused a minor Tsunami.

If my experiment does not measure upto expectation, I have not hurt anybody 
else O.K.

Thank you all for yr comments.
Regards,
D.V.S


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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[ROY Washbish]

Hi DVS
It was YOUR question but it sure interests me also. 
I sure hope no one was REALLY put out by your use of acetone. I feel that they 
were actually looking for someone with TEST equipment of offer to do a more 
accepted engineering test. I guess we have a bunch of engineers here and that's 
fine. We could get some better info in the long run from them but in the mean 
time we could do as you have and do our own testing in our cars or whatever we 
have and share the info.
~BEST~
Roy

subramanian D.V [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hi ,

Gasolene( petrol ) costs in India about 95 cents a liter, roughly twice of its 
price in U.S. And is edging up towards a dollar and more. The possibility of 
getting more mileage by mixing with a small dose of acetone came up from a mail 
posted in this list. As one of the middle class using a car  trying to balance 
my budget I decided to give it a try. I’ve not even asked anybody else to try 
and report. 

I only put a harmless query about the difference between commercial acetone and 
lab quality acetone and added a footnote whether anybody else has tried this 
acetone mix  with what results. I seem to have caused a minor Tsunami.

If my experiment does not measure upto expectation, I have not hurt anybody 
else O.K.

Thank you all for yr comments.
Regards,
D.V.S


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Roy Washbish 
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[Keith Addison]

Hi ,

Gasolene( petrol ) costs in India about 95 cents a liter, roughly 
twice of its price in U.S. And is edging up towards a dollar and 
more. The possibility of getting more mileage by mixing with a small 
dose of acetone came up from a mail posted in this list. As one of 
the middle class using a car  trying to balance my budget I decided 
to give it a try. I’ve not even asked anybody else to try and report.


I only put a harmless query about the difference between commercial 
acetone and lab quality acetone and added a footnote whether anybody 
else has tried this acetone mix  with what results. I seem to have 
caused a minor Tsunami.


If my experiment does not measure upto expectation, I have not hurt 
anybody else O.K.


Certainly you haven't. I don't think anyone was trying to get at you. 
There are a lot of scams and bad information about magic bullets that 
boost fuel economy, so it's as well that any such claims get a close 
examination. But you've had some encouragement too. I very much agree 
with Roy's reply to you, I'd guess that most list members do. It's 
unlikely that you'll do your car any harm, please go ahead with your 
plan, and please do keep us informed of the results.


By the way, I'm sure you don't need lab-quality acetone, I think the 
first message in the thread implied that by saying it was a widely 
available chemical, easy to get. Try it with commercial-grade.


Best wishes

Keith



Thank you all for yr comments.
Regards,
D.V.S


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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[1 palm]

Hello members,
 
The acetone post is very interesting. will it harm catalytic converter ,oxygen 
sensor and fuel injection system?
 
oilpalm1

subramanian D.V [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hello members,

The information below came in one of the Emails. 

http://pesn.com/2005/03/ 17/6900069_Acetone/ 

Acetone In Fuel Said to Increase Mileage 15-35%

Readily-available chemical added to gas tank in small proportion improves the 
fuel's ability to vaporize completely by eliminating the surface tension that 
causes some particulates to note fully vaporize. 

by Louis LaPointe Adapted by Sterling D. Allan with LaPoint's permission for 
Pure Energy Systems News

Acetone (CH3COCH3), also called dimethylketone or propanone, is a product that 
can be purchased inexpensively in most locations around the world, such as in 
the common hardware store. Added to the fuel tank in tiny amounts, it aids in 
the vaporization of the gasoline or diesel, increasing fuel efficiency, 
engine longevity, and performance -- as well as reducing hydrocarbon 
emissions

 How Much to Use

Add in tiny amounts from about one part per 5000 to one part per 500, 
depending on the vehicle -- just a few ounces per ten gallons of gas than 
demand….

 I have never seen a problem with acetone, and I have used ACETONE in gasoline 
 and diesel fuel and in jet fuel (JP-4) for 50 years.

 See also

Acetone as a Fuel Additive (index at PESWiki) Fuel

The qty of acetone to be mixed with petrol works out 2cc to 20 cc per 10 litres 
of petrol. The PESWiki link mentioned does not give any guidance about the 
mixing ratio. I am about to try this on our family car . Acetone is available 
in the local chemicals market in 2 qualities-- commercial quality at the lower 
price equivalent of 2 U.S.dollars a litre and the one for laboratory use at 6 
dollars a litre. 

Could any of the members of this forum tell me the difference between 
commercial quality and laboratory quality acetone? Does the ratio mentioned 
above for mixing with gasoline apply to commercial or lab quality acetone?

Anybody else had the same positive result ?

Regards,

D.V.Subramanian.

Chennai, India . 





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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[bob allen]

would be blending and selling the mix already?

1 palm wrote:

Hello members,
 
The acetone post is very interesting. will it harm catalytic converter ,oxygen sensor and fuel injection system?




--
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[Michael Redler]

You're making sense Bob.
 
Mike

bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
if it really worked, which I highly doubt, don't you think somebody 
would be blending and selling the mix already?

1 palm wrote:
 Hello members,
 
 The acetone post is very interesting. will it harm catalytic converter 
 ,oxygen sensor and fuel injection system?



-- 
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http://ozarker.org/bob

Science is what we have learned about how to keep
from fooling ourselves — Richard Feynman
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[Kenny Dunn]

Except that the petro industry doesn't really have any interest in you getting
better mileage.  They certainly aren't telling us any ways to send them less
money.

$.02,
Ken

Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] said:

 You're making sense Bob.

 bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 if it really worked, which I highly doubt, don't you think somebody 
 would be blending and selling the mix already?

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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[bob allen]

sell more gas if they could advertise it as providing 30 % better 
mileage.  They could even a couple of cents to the price and be ahead on 
cost/distance.



enny Dunn wrote:

Except that the petro industry doesn't really have any interest in you getting
better mileage.  They certainly aren't telling us any ways to send them less
money.

$.02,
Ken

Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] said:



You're making sense Bob.




bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
if it really worked, which I highly doubt, don't you think somebody 
would be blending and selling the mix already?



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Science is what we have learned about how to keep
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RE: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[Steve Hess]

I doubt the independent retailers know about, or care about fuel
efficiency

steve

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of bob allen
Sent: Friday, April 15, 2005 10:00 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%


there are a lot of independent retailers out there who would love to 
sell more gas if they could advertise it as providing 30 % better 
mileage.  They could even a couple of cents to the price and be ahead on

cost/distance.


enny Dunn wrote:
 Except that the petro industry doesn't really have any interest in you

 getting better mileage.  They certainly aren't telling us any ways to 
 send them less money.
 
 $.02,
 Ken
 
 Michael Redler [EMAIL PROTECTED] said:
 
 
You're making sense Bob.
 
 
bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
if it really worked, which I highly doubt, don't you think somebody
would be blending and selling the mix already?
 
 
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 http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
 
 
 


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Science is what we have learned about how to keep
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[Michael Redler]

Hi Bob,
 
Everything you're saying sounds very reasonable. But, sometimes the conspiracy 
theorist in me keeps coming out. Do you think that the oil industry has enough 
political horsepower to influence the possibility of this happening -- even if 
it works? Maybe I'm getting ahead of myself and should find out if the idea 
actually works.
 
I'm not trying to sound facetious. These are just a couple of things I'm 
wondering about.
 

Mike

bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
there are a lot of independent retailers out there who would love to 
sell more gas if they could advertise it as providing 30 % better 
mileage. They could even a couple of cents to the price and be ahead on 
cost/distance.


enny Dunn wrote:
 Except that the petro industry doesn't really have any interest in you getting
 better mileage. They certainly aren't telling us any ways to send them less
 money.
 
 $.02,
 Ken
 
 Michael Redler said:
 
 
You're making sense Bob.
 
 
bob allen wrote:
if it really worked, which I highly doubt, don't you think somebody 
would be blending and selling the mix already?
 
 
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 http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
 
 
 


-- 
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Science is what we have learned about how to keep
from fooling ourselves — Richard Feynman
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[Keith Addison]

Mike

bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
if it really worked, which I highly doubt, don't you think somebody
would be blending and selling the mix already?


Why don't you tell us why you doubt it Bob? I'm sure that would be appreciated.

I'm afraid I have no such faith in the magic of the marketplace or 
whatever, if it worked they would be doing it already. Maybe, maybe 
not, and since discussion of it so far hasn't quite ruled out that it 
might work (yet), it's good to see someone here setting out to test 
it, as D.V. Subramanian plans to do in Chennai:


http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/46029/
Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

I hope D.V. keeps us informed, then we'll know. If it does work at 
all, then 1 palm's questions are good ones.


Regards

Keith



1 palm wrote:
 Hello members,

 The acetone post is very interesting. will it harm catalytic 
converter ,oxygen sensor and fuel injection system?




--
Bob Allen
http://ozarker.org/bob

Science is what we have learned about how to keep
from fooling ourselves — Richard Feynman


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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[fox mulder]

 --- 1 palm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
 Hello members,
  
 The acetone post is very interesting. will it harm
 catalytic converter ,oxygen sensor and fuel
 injection system?
  
 oilpalm1
 
 subramanian D.V [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hello members,
 
 The information below came in one of the Emails. 
 
 http://pesn.com/2005/03/ 17/6900069_Acetone/ 
 
 Acetone In Fuel Said to Increase Mileage 15-35%
 
 Readily-available chemical added to gas tank in
 small proportion improves the fuel's ability to
 vaporize completely by eliminating the surface
 tension that causes some particulates to note fully
 vaporize. 
 
 by Louis LaPointe Adapted by Sterling D. Allan with
 LaPoint's permission for Pure Energy Systems News
 
 Acetone (CH3COCH3), also called dimethylketone or
 propanone, is a product that can be purchased
 inexpensively in most locations around the world,
 such as in the common hardware store. Added to the
 fuel tank in tiny amounts, it aids in the
 vaporization of the gasoline or diesel, increasing
 fuel efficiency, engine longevity, and performance
 -- as well as reducing hydrocarbon emissions
 
  How Much to Use
 
 Add in tiny amounts from about one part per 5000 to
 one part per 500, depending on the vehicle -- just a
 few ounces per ten gallons of gas than demand·.
 
  I have never seen a problem with acetone, and I
 have used ACETONE in gasoline and diesel fuel and in
 jet fuel (JP-4) for 50 years.
 
  See also
 
 Acetone as a Fuel Additive (index at PESWiki) Fuel
 
 The qty of acetone to be mixed with petrol works out
 2cc to 20 cc per 10 litres of petrol. The PESWiki
 link mentioned does not give any guidance about the
 mixing ratio. I am about to try this on our family
 car . Acetone is available in the local chemicals
 market in 2 qualities-- commercial quality at the
 lower price equivalent of 2 U.S.dollars a litre and
 the one for laboratory use at 6 dollars a litre. 
 
 Could any of the members of this forum tell me the
 difference between commercial quality and laboratory
 quality acetone? Does the ratio mentioned above for
 mixing with gasoline apply to commercial or lab
 quality acetone?
 
 Anybody else had the same positive result ?
 
 Regards,
 
 D.V.Subramanian.
 
 Chennai, India . 

No acetone is very volatile. It will vaporize before
it gets to catalytic converter. People pour it on
their nails t remove nail varnish. It should not harm
anything

fox 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[bob allen]

a century now right?  And folks have been burning anything and 
everything that will flow thru a tube.  I can't imagine that others 
haven't tried all sorts of mixtures already.  also, more mileage is 
achieved by getting more energy out of your fuel.  This would suggest 
that a significant amount of fuel is not burning, thus going out the 
tail pipe. Uncombusted hydrocarbons are easily measured in tailpipe 
emissions, and don't add up to the energy losses which must be occurring 
if acetone is to help that much.


2. again consider the source:

  http://pureenergysystems.com/

is one of the sources touting the efficacy of acetone/gasoline.  also on 
the site are magnetic motors,


Mann was hoping to come upon a way to use the entire magnetic force for 
motive power. However, this present design requires at least half of the 
magnet power to be used to counter-act one magnet with another, the 
remaining is tappable for power. He doesn't think more than that can be 
tapped. Perhaps someone will show him wrong someday, even as he is 
showing the present models of physics to be incorrect.




and overunity devices:

 He reports a 30 to 1 overunity ratio with piezoelectric 
sonoluminescence. The higher the power you put in, the more you get out.




if just one of these guys ever started selling power to the grid, I 
would believe it.  I know this has nothing to do with acetone/gasoline 
but everything to do with credibility.



3. gasoline has a very low surface tension, and I doubt that acetone 
will lower it any significant amount.


4. the fuel value and vapor pressure of acetone are both lower than 
gasoline.


5. I have seen no supporting evidence other than relatively uncontrolled 
tests by individuals sticking it in and watching their mileage for a few 
tanks.  Ie, I an not swayed by the testing so far.



Disclaimer:  if somebody proves me wrong by reproducible testing on a 
dynamometer, I will do everything I can to promote its use. In fact I 
really do believe that people would pay for a fuel mixture which 
provided 30% better millage.   This could reduce  oil imports to the usa 
by millions of barrels per day, reduce carbon emissions by the megaton, 
etc.  Hell, in a country that cared, ie just about anywhere but the us, 
use of acetone would suffice to meet kyoto agreement goals.  You would 
think that somebody would have tested and published.  an hour or two on 
a test engine with proper controls should yield an answer. Any 
automotive engineering students out their?  You can be famous overnight!




but I really just don't think so.




Keith Addison wrote:



Why don't you tell us why you doubt it Bob? I'm sure that would be 
appreciated.




--
Bob Allen
http://ozarker.org/bob

Science is what we have learned about how to keep
from fooling ourselves  Richard Feynman
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[bob allen]

post: the vapor pressure of acetone is greater than that of gasoline.
(not that it matters really)

--
Bob Allen
http://ozarker.org/bob

Science is what we have learned about how to keep
from fooling ourselves  Richard Feynman
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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[Keith Addison]

You got attacked the other day for a critique of the source rather 
than the content, but I really disagree with that. The source is not 
always relevant, but it's certainly relevant sometimes, and it's 
worth pointing out this time, thanks.


We reach similar conclusions - I don't think it's very likely either, 
but it would be good to see some tests. Preferably a dynamometer, 
sure, but if someone here did it and watched their mileage for a few 
tanks that would be interesting.


Best wishes

Keith


1. Spark ignition internal combustion engines have been around for 
about a century now right?  And folks have been burning anything and 
everything that will flow thru a tube.  I can't imagine that others 
haven't tried all sorts of mixtures already.  also, more mileage is 
achieved by getting more energy out of your fuel.  This would 
suggest that a significant amount of fuel is not burning, thus going 
out the tail pipe. Uncombusted hydrocarbons are easily measured in 
tailpipe emissions, and don't add up to the energy losses which must 
be occurring if acetone is to help that much.


2. again consider the source:

 http://pureenergysystems.com/

is one of the sources touting the efficacy of acetone/gasoline. 
also on the site are magnetic motors,


Mann was hoping to come upon a way to use the entire magnetic force 
for motive power. However, this present design requires at least 
half of the magnet power to be used to counter-act one magnet with 
another, the remaining is tappable for power. He doesn't think more 
than that can be tapped. Perhaps someone will show him wrong 
someday, even as he is showing the present models of physics to be 
incorrect.




and overunity devices:

 He reports a 30 to 1 overunity ratio with piezoelectric 
sonoluminescence. The higher the power you put in, the more you get 
out.




if just one of these guys ever started selling power to the grid, I 
would believe it.  I know this has nothing to do with 
acetone/gasoline but everything to do with credibility.



3. gasoline has a very low surface tension, and I doubt that acetone 
will lower it any significant amount.


4. the fuel value and vapor pressure of acetone are both lower than gasoline.

5. I have seen no supporting evidence other than relatively 
uncontrolled tests by individuals sticking it in and watching their 
mileage for a few tanks.  Ie, I an not swayed by the testing so far.



Disclaimer:  if somebody proves me wrong by reproducible testing on 
a dynamometer, I will do everything I can to promote its use. In 
fact I really do believe that people would pay for a fuel mixture 
which provided 30% better millage.   This could reduce  oil imports 
to the usa by millions of barrels per day, reduce carbon emissions 
by the megaton, etc.  Hell, in a country that cared, ie just about 
anywhere but the us, use of acetone would suffice to meet kyoto 
agreement goals.  You would think that somebody would have tested 
and published.  an hour or two on a test engine with proper controls 
should yield an answer. Any automotive engineering students out 
their?  You can be famous overnight!




but I really just don't think so.




Keith Addison wrote:



Why don't you tell us why you doubt it Bob? I'm sure that would be 
appreciated.




--
Bob Allen
http://ozarker.org/bob

Science is what we have learned about how to keep
from fooling ourselves — Richard Feynman


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[Biofuel] Acetone in fuel increases mileage by 15 -35%

[subramanian D.V]

Hello members,
 
The information below came in one of the Emails. 

http://pesn.com/2005/03/ 17/6900069_Acetone/  

Acetone In Fuel Said to Increase Mileage 15-35%

Readily-available chemical added to gas tank in small proportion improves the 
fuel's ability to vaporize completely by eliminating the surface tension that 
causes some particulates to note fully vaporize. 

by Louis LaPointe Adapted by Sterling D. Allan with LaPoint's permission for 
Pure Energy Systems News

Acetone (CH3COCH3), also called dimethylketone or propanone, is a product that 
can be purchased inexpensively in most locations around the world, such as in 
the common hardware store. Added to the fuel tank in tiny amounts, it aids in 
the vaporization of the gasoline or diesel, increasing fuel efficiency, 
engine longevity, and performance -- as well as reducing hydrocarbon 
emissions

 How Much to Use

Add in tiny amounts from about one part per 5000 to one part per 500, 
depending on the vehicle -- just a few ounces per ten gallons of gas than 
demand….

 I have never seen a problem with acetone, and I have used ACETONE in gasoline 
 and diesel fuel and in jet fuel (JP-4) for 50 years.

 See also

Acetone as a Fuel Additive (index at PESWiki) Fuel

The qty of acetone to be mixed with petrol  works out 2cc to 20 cc per 10 
litres of petrol.  The PESWiki link mentioned does not give any guidance about 
the mixing ratio.  I am about to try this on our family car . Acetone is 
available in the local chemicals market in 2 qualities-- commercial quality at 
the lower price equivalent of 2 U.S.dollars a litre and the one for laboratory 
use at 6 dollars a litre. 

Could any of the members of this forum tell me the difference between 
commercial quality and laboratory quality acetone? Does the ratio mentioned 
above for mixing with gasoline apply to commercial or lab quality acetone?

Anybody else had the same positive result ?

Regards,

D.V.Subramanian.

Chennai, India . 





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Re: [Biofuel] Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%

[TSTEVIC]

Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 23:22:02 -0400
From: Dan Volker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Content-Type: text/plain;   charset=us-ascii

Kirk,
Do you have any idea of the effects of acetone on a Honda Insight? I
believe the carburetion is slightly different in this car than the
average. While I get good mileage with my Insight, I'd be happy to do
better still if the acetone will do no harm...
Regards,
Dan Volker 


AG

Does anyone know how to [SNIP]?

Dan,
Your 4 line question what followed by SEVEN HUNDRED AND SIXTY lines of
text!

Give us digest readers a break. Please???

Tom Stevic


   (watch)

[snip]

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RE: [Biofuel] Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%

[Dan Volker]

Kirk,
Do you have any idea of the effects of acetone on a Honda Insight? I believe
the carburetion is slightly different in this car than the average.
While I get good mileage with my Insight, I'd be happy to do better still if
the acetone will do no harm...
Regards,
Dan Volker 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Kirk McLoren
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 6:12 PM
To: biofuel
Subject: [Biofuel] Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%



I have my doubts

Kirk



Aerielle Louise
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%

http://pesn.com/2005/03/
17/6900069_Acetone/

Acetone In Fuel Said to Increase Mileage 15-35%

Readily-available chemical added to gas tank in small proportion improves
the fuel's ability to vaporize completely by eliminating the surface tension
that causes some particulates to note fully vaporize.

by Louis LaPointe Adapted by Sterling D. Allan with LaPoint's permission for
Pure Energy Systems News

Acetone (CH3COCH3), also called dimethylketone or propanone, is a product
that can be purchased inexpensively in most locations around the world, such
as in the common hardware store. Added to the fuel tank in tiny amounts, it
aids in the vaporization of the gasoline or diesel, increasing fuel
efficiency, engine longevity, and performance -- as well as reducing
hydrocarbon emissions.

How it Works

Complete vaporization of normal fuel is far from perfect in today's cars. A
certain amount of fuel in most engines remains liquid in the hot chamber. In
order to become a true gas and be fully combusted, fuel must undergo a phase
change.

Surface tension present an obstacle to vaporization.
For instance the energy barrier from surface tension can sometimes force
water to reach 300 degrees before it vaporizes. Similarly with gasoline.

Acetone drastically reduces the surface tension. Most fuel molecules are
sluggish with respect to their natural frequency. Acetone has an inherent
molecular vibration that stirs up the fuel molecules, to break the surface
tension. This results in a more complete vaporization with other factors
remaining the same.
More complete vaporization means less wasted fuel, hence the increased gas
mileage from the increased thermal efficiency.

That excess fuel was formerly wasted past the rings or sent out the tailpipe
but with acetone it gets burned.

Acetone allows gasoline to behave more like the ideal automotive fuel which
is PROPANE. The degree of improved mileage depends on how much unburned fuel
you are presently wasting. You might gain 15 to 35-percent better economy
from the use of acetone. Sometimes even more.

How Much to Use

Add in tiny amounts from about one part per 5000 to one part per 500,
depending on the vehicle -- just a few ounces per ten gallons of gas.





Figure 1: Percentage MILEAGE GAIN when a tiny amount of acetone is added to
fuel. The curves A B C show the effect on three different cars using
different gasolines. Some engines respond better than others to acetone. The
D curve is for diesel fuel. Too much acetone will decrease mileage slightly
due to adding too much octane to the fuel. Too much also upsets the mixture
ratio because acetone (like alcohol) is a light molecule.

After you find the right amount for your car per ten gallons, and you are
happy with your newfound mileage, you might want to try stopping the use of
acetone for a couple of tanks. Watch the drop in mileage. It will amaze you.
That reverse technique is one of the biggest eye openers concerning the use
of acetone in fuel.

In a 10-gallon tank of gasoline, use two to three ounces of pure acetone to
obtain excellent mileage improvements. In a ten-gallon tank of diesel fuel,
use from 1 to 2 ounces of acetone. Performance went up too.
Use about a teaspoon of acetone in the fuel tank of a lawnmower or
snowblower.

Where to Get Acetone

The pure acetone label is the only additive suggested and is easily
available from most stores in 16-ounce plastic bottles and in one-gallon
containers from some large farm supply stores. But any acetone source is
better than none. Containers labeled acetone from a hardware store are
usually okay and pure enough to put in your fuel. We prefer cans or bottles
that say 100-percent pure. The acetone in gallons or pints we get from Fleet
Farm are labeled 100% pure. The bottles from Walgreen say 100% pure. Never
use solvents such as paint thinners or unknown stuff in your gas. Toluene,
benzene and xylene are okay if they are pure but may not raise mileage
except when mixed with acetone.

Additional Benefits

In addition to increased mileage acetone added to fuel boasts other benefits
such as increased power, engine life, and performance. Less unburned fuel
going past the rings keeps the rings and engine oil in far better condition.

A tiny bit of acetone in diesel fuel can stop the black smoke when the rack
is all the way at full throttle.
You will notice that the exhaust soot will be greatly

RE: [Biofuel] Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%

[dwoodard]

I would be very wary of acetone contacting rubber or plastic.

The mode of action sounds unlikely to me. One doesn't get that much of a
mileage improvement with say natural gas compared to gasoline, unless one
exploits the high knock resistance and the capacity for lean burning of
the natural gas; even there it would depend on the gasoline use for
comparison.

The talk about a large amount of fuel being unburned in a normal gasoline
engine in good tune is so much blather.

Doug Woodard
St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada



On Wed, 6 Apr 2005, Dan Volker wrote:

 Kirk,
 Do you have any idea of the effects of acetone on a Honda Insight? I believe
 the carburetion is slightly different in this car than the average.
 While I get good mileage with my Insight, I'd be happy to do better still if
 the acetone will do no harm...
 Regards,
 Dan Volker

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
 Of Kirk McLoren
 Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 6:12 PM
 To: biofuel
 Subject: [Biofuel] Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%



 I have my doubts

 Kirk



 Aerielle Louise
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%

 http://pesn.com/2005/03/
 17/6900069_Acetone/

 Acetone In Fuel Said to Increase Mileage 15-35%

 Readily-available chemical added to gas tank in small proportion improves
 the fuel's ability to vaporize completely by eliminating the surface tension
 that causes some particulates to note fully vaporize.

 by Louis LaPointe Adapted by Sterling D. Allan with LaPoint's permission for
 Pure Energy Systems News

 Acetone (CH3COCH3), also called dimethylketone or propanone, is a product
 that can be purchased inexpensively in most locations around the world, such
 as in the common hardware store. Added to the fuel tank in tiny amounts, it
 aids in the vaporization of the gasoline or diesel, increasing fuel
 efficiency, engine longevity, and performance -- as well as reducing
 hydrocarbon emissions.

 How it Works

 Complete vaporization of normal fuel is far from perfect in today's cars. A
 certain amount of fuel in most engines remains liquid in the hot chamber. In
 order to become a true gas and be fully combusted, fuel must undergo a phase
 change.

 Surface tension present an obstacle to vaporization.
 For instance the energy barrier from surface tension can sometimes force
 water to reach 300 degrees before it vaporizes. Similarly with gasoline.

 Acetone drastically reduces the surface tension. Most fuel molecules are
 sluggish with respect to their natural frequency. Acetone has an inherent
 molecular vibration that stirs up the fuel molecules, to break the surface
 tension. This results in a more complete vaporization with other factors
 remaining the same.
 More complete vaporization means less wasted fuel, hence the increased gas
 mileage from the increased thermal efficiency.

 That excess fuel was formerly wasted past the rings or sent out the tailpipe
 but with acetone it gets burned.

 Acetone allows gasoline to behave more like the ideal automotive fuel which
 is PROPANE. The degree of improved mileage depends on how much unburned fuel
 you are presently wasting. You might gain 15 to 35-percent better economy
 from the use of acetone. Sometimes even more.

 How Much to Use

 Add in tiny amounts from about one part per 5000 to one part per 500,
 depending on the vehicle -- just a few ounces per ten gallons of gas.





 Figure 1: Percentage MILEAGE GAIN when a tiny amount of acetone is added to
 fuel. The curves A B C show the effect on three different cars using
 different gasolines. Some engines respond better than others to acetone. The
 D curve is for diesel fuel. Too much acetone will decrease mileage slightly
 due to adding too much octane to the fuel. Too much also upsets the mixture
 ratio because acetone (like alcohol) is a light molecule.

 After you find the right amount for your car per ten gallons, and you are
 happy with your newfound mileage, you might want to try stopping the use of
 acetone for a couple of tanks. Watch the drop in mileage. It will amaze you.
 That reverse technique is one of the biggest eye openers concerning the use
 of acetone in fuel.

 In a 10-gallon tank of gasoline, use two to three ounces of pure acetone to
 obtain excellent mileage improvements. In a ten-gallon tank of diesel fuel,
 use from 1 to 2 ounces of acetone. Performance went up too.
 Use about a teaspoon of acetone in the fuel tank of a lawnmower or
 snowblower.

 Where to Get Acetone

 The pure acetone label is the only additive suggested and is easily
 available from most stores in 16-ounce plastic bottles and in one-gallon
 containers from some large farm supply stores. But any acetone source is
 better than none. Containers labeled acetone from a hardware store are
 usually okay and pure enough to put in your fuel. We prefer cans or bottles
 that say 100-percent pure. The acetone in gallons or pints we get from Fleet
 Farm are labeled 100% pure

RE: [Biofuel] Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%

[Kirk McLoren]

The talk about a large amount of fuel being unburned in a normal gasoline
engine in good tune is so much blather.

I think you are right
Kirk

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I would be very wary of acetone contacting rubber or plastic.

The mode of action sounds unlikely to me. One doesn't get that much of a
mileage improvement with say natural gas compared to gasoline, unless one
exploits the high knock resistance and the capacity for lean burning of
the natural gas; even there it would depend on the gasoline use for
comparison.

The talk about a large amount of fuel being unburned in a normal gasoline
engine in good tune is so much blather.

Doug Woodard
St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada



On Wed, 6 Apr 2005, Dan Volker wrote:

 Kirk,
 Do you have any idea of the effects of acetone on a Honda Insight? I believe
 the carburetion is slightly different in this car than the average.
 While I get good mileage with my Insight, I'd be happy to do better still if
 the acetone will do no harm...
 Regards,
 Dan Volker

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
 Of Kirk McLoren
 Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 6:12 PM
 To: biofuel
 Subject: [Biofuel] Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%



 I have my doubts

 Kirk



 Aerielle Louise
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%

 http://pesn.com/2005/03/
 17/6900069_Acetone/

 Acetone In Fuel Said to Increase Mileage 15-35%


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[Biofuel] Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%

[Kirk McLoren]

I have my doubts

Kirk



Aerielle Louise
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Acetone Increases Mileage 15-35%

http://pesn.com/2005/03/ 
17/6900069_Acetone/

Acetone In Fuel Said to Increase Mileage 15-35%

Readily-available chemical added to gas tank in small
proportion improves the fuel's ability to vaporize
completely by eliminating the surface tension that
causes some particulates to note fully vaporize.

by Louis LaPointe Adapted by Sterling D. Allan with
LaPoint's permission for Pure Energy Systems News

Acetone (CH3COCH3), also called dimethylketone or
propanone, is a product that can be purchased
inexpensively in most locations around the world, such
as in the common hardware store. Added to the fuel
tank in tiny amounts, it aids in the vaporization of
the gasoline or diesel, increasing fuel efficiency,
engine longevity, and performance -- as well as
reducing hydrocarbon emissions.

How it Works

Complete vaporization of normal fuel is far from
perfect in today's cars. A certain amount of fuel in
most engines remains liquid in the hot chamber. In
order to become a true gas and be fully combusted, fuel
must undergo a phase change.

Surface tension present an obstacle to vaporization.
For instance the energy barrier from surface tension
can sometimes force water to reach 300 degrees before
it vaporizes. Similarly with gasoline.

Acetone drastically reduces the surface tension. Most
fuel molecules are sluggish with respect to their
natural frequency. Acetone has an inherent molecular
vibration that stirs up the fuel molecules, to break
the surface tension. This results in a more complete
vaporization with other factors remaining the same.
More complete vaporization means less wasted fuel,
hence the increased gas mileage from the increased
thermal efficiency.

That excess fuel was formerly wasted past the rings or
sent out the tailpipe but with acetone it gets burned.

Acetone allows gasoline to behave more like the ideal
automotive fuel which is PROPANE. The degree of
improved mileage depends on how much unburned fuel you
are presently wasting. You might gain 15 to 35-percent
better economy from the use of acetone. Sometimes even
more.

How Much to Use

Add in tiny amounts from about one part per 5000 to one
part per 500, depending on the vehicle -- just a few
ounces per ten gallons of gas.





Figure 1: Percentage MILEAGE GAIN when a tiny amount of
acetone is added to fuel. The curves A B C show the
effect on three different cars using different
gasolines. Some engines respond better than others to
acetone. The D curve is for diesel fuel. Too much
acetone will decrease mileage slightly due to adding
too much octane to the fuel. Too much also upsets the
mixture ratio because acetone (like alcohol) is a light
molecule.

After you find the right amount for your car per ten
gallons, and you are happy with your newfound mileage,
you might want to try stopping the use of acetone for a
couple of tanks. Watch the drop in mileage. It will
amaze you. That reverse technique is one of the biggest
eye openers concerning the use of acetone in fuel.

In a 10-gallon tank of gasoline, use two to three
ounces of pure acetone to obtain excellent mileage
improvements. In a ten-gallon tank of diesel fuel, use
from 1 to 2 ounces of acetone. Performance went up too.
Use about a teaspoon of acetone in the fuel tank of a
lawnmower or snowblower.

Where to Get Acetone

The pure acetone label is the only additive suggested
and is easily available from most stores in 16-ounce
plastic bottles and in one-gallon containers from some
large farm supply stores. But any acetone source is
better than none. Containers labeled acetone from a
hardware store are usually okay and pure enough to put
in your fuel. We prefer cans or bottles that say
100-percent pure. The acetone in gallons or pints we
get from Fleet Farm are labeled 100% pure. The bottles
from Walgreen say 100% pure. Never use solvents such as
paint thinners or unknown stuff in your gas. Toluene,
benzene and xylene are okay if they are pure but may
not raise mileage except when mixed with acetone.

Additional Benefits

In addition to increased mileage acetone added to fuel
boasts other benefits such as increased power, engine
life, and performance. Less unburned fuel going past
the rings keeps the rings and engine oil in far better
condition.

A tiny bit of acetone in diesel fuel can stop the black
smoke when the rack is all the way at full throttle.
You will notice that the exhaust soot will be greatly
reduced.

Acetone can reduce hydrocarbon emissions up to
60-percent. In some older cars, the HC readings with
acetone went from say 440 PPM to 195, as just one
example. Though mileage gains taper off with too much
acetone, hydrocarbon emissions are nevertheless greatly
reduced. Pure acetone is an extremely clean burning
fuel that burns in air with a pretty blue, smokeless
flame.

Acetone reduces the formation of water-ice crystals in
below-zero weather which damage the fuel filter.

There