Re: [Tagging] New rag to draw node name with rotate angle
On 10/11/2018 15:08, Greg Troxel wrote: Dave F writes: On 10/11/2018 14:46, Greg Troxel wrote: Dave F writes: Every tag is for the renderer, otherwise all maps would be black lines & dots. As your link clearly states: /"Don't deliberately enter data *incorrectly* for the renderer" / The tag 'layer' is purely to aid renderings. That's not true. It represents things being above and below each other, And is used solely by renders to distinguish what you said. However 'Layer' provides no real world interpretation of height distance between objects. It does not provide height, but it provides ordering. ...for the renderer. Who else do you think uses this data Which is still real world data, just less granularity. In the case of tag saying what angle to draw something, that's a specific drawing instruction, and I don't think it belongs. Along with an angle, a position tag for the label would be useful to avoid annoyances where it renders outside the perimeter of irregular.shaped polygons. So would saying that a particular object should be green. Once you add specific drawing instructions, I don't see how to draw the line. https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:colour but that doesn't make it compulsory. These meta tags are a *aid* or suggestion. Can this really not be computed by renderers? It just seems like an optimization problem. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] New rag to draw node name with rotate angle
Dave F writes: > On 10/11/2018 14:46, Greg Troxel wrote: >> Dave F writes: >> >>> Every tag is for the renderer, otherwise all maps would be black lines >>> & dots. As your link clearly states: >>> /"Don't deliberately enter data *incorrectly* for the renderer" >>> / >>> >>> The tag 'layer' is purely to aid renderings. >> That's not true. It represents things being above and below each other, > > And is used solely by renders to distinguish what you said. However > 'Layer' provides no real world interpretation of height distance > between objects. It does not provide height, but it provides ordering. Which is still real world data, just less granularity. >> In the case of tag saying what angle to draw something, that's a >> specific drawing instruction, and I don't think it belongs. > > Along with an angle, a position tag for the label would be useful to > avoid annoyances where it renders outside the perimeter of > irregular.shaped polygons. So would saying that a particular object should be green. Once you add specific drawing instructions, I don't see how to draw the line. Can this really not be computed by renderers? It just seems like an optimization problem. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] New rag to draw node name with rotate angle
On Sat, Nov 10, 2018 at 2:47 PM Greg Troxel wrote: In the case of tag saying what angle to draw something, that's a > specific drawing instruction, and I don't think it belongs. Not on labels. On (some) objects such as benches and tourist maps we already have tags to represent the direction they face. Those directional tags currently have no effect on the standard carto but could do so in the future (particularly if we move to vector tiles). Those direction tags describe reality on the ground in greater detail and may or not be reflected by the renderer. Labels are not reality on the ground but a cosmetic feature which should be up to the renderer, not the tagger. The fix to labels, if one is necessary, should be implemented in the renderer, not by tagging. -- Paul ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] New rag to draw node name with rotate angle
On 10/11/2018 14:46, Greg Troxel wrote: Dave F writes: Every tag is for the renderer, otherwise all maps would be black lines & dots. As your link clearly states: /"Don't deliberately enter data *incorrectly* for the renderer" / The tag 'layer' is purely to aid renderings. That's not true. It represents things being above and below each other, And is used solely by renders to distinguish what you said. However 'Layer' provides no real world interpretation of height distance between objects. In the case of tag saying what angle to draw something, that's a specific drawing instruction, and I don't think it belongs. Along with an angle, a position tag for the label would be useful to avoid annoyances where it renders outside the perimeter of irregular.shaped polygons. Cheers DaveF ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] New rag to draw node name with rotate angle
Dave F writes: > Every tag is for the renderer, otherwise all maps would be black lines > & dots. As your link clearly states: > /"Don't deliberately enter data *incorrectly* for the renderer" > / > > The tag 'layer' is purely to aid renderings. That's not true. It represents things being above and below each other, which is useful for more than drawing. In the case of tag saying what angle to draw something, that's a specific drawing instruction, and I don't think it belongs. The right angle depends on the map designer's intent and a lot of other things. It seems far better for renderers to decide 1) if they want angled text at all -- which is a major design choice and 2) hwo to choose the angle. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] New rag to draw node name with rotate angle
Every tag is for the renderer, otherwise all maps would be black lines & dots. As your link clearly states: /"Don't deliberately enter data *incorrectly* for the renderer" / The tag 'layer' is purely to aid renderings. Cheers DaveF On 09/11/2018 18:04, OSMDoudou wrote: Looks like encouraging “tagging for the renderer”. https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tagging_for_the_renderer ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] New rag to draw node name with rotate angle
On Fri, Nov 9, 2018 at 12:06 PM دار الآثار للنشر والتوزيع-صنعاء Dar Alathar-Yemen wrote: > I suggest new tag to tell map render to draw the node name with a > specified rotate angle not horizontal. We need this for some seas like Red > Sea, and Suez Gulf in Egypt. > I have serious doubts whether encoding the rendering in the map in such a way is a good idea. A renderer that wished to label an area with an angled label could readily determine the angle for itself, by computing the principal axes of the area, and if its eccentricity exceeds a specified value, rotating the label to align with the major axis. An even better rendering could be achieved by computing the morphological skeleton of the area, and placing the label along some smooth curve that approximates the medial axis. There are also algorithms that handle curved label placement in the presence of interfering labels, although they are somewhat less well developed. One such is described in Mathieu BARRAULT, "A methodology for placement and evaluation of area map labels." _Computers, Environment and Urban Systems_ 25 (2001), pp. 33-52. http://geoinformatics.ntua.gr/courses/admcarto/lecture_notes/name_placement/bibliography/barrault_2001.pdf Barrault describes the process of choosing a family of circular arcs that well approximate the general contour of an area feature. Figure 3 of the paper is informative about what criteria his heuristic takes into account for 'goodness' of placement. Figures 10 and 11 show what the algorithm achieves on sample elongated figures and Figures 13-14 show what it can do in the presence of interfering labels. To place this task on the mapper forecloses on the possibility that a renderer can do it better. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] New rag to draw node name with rotate angle
Looks like encouraging “tagging for the renderer”. https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tagging_for_the_renderer___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
