Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

Am Di., 26. Nov. 2019 um 13:08 Uhr schrieb Marc Gemis :

> Typically, the websites of the vendors use "Commercial Vehicles"
>
> some examples:
>
> https://www.volkswagen-vans.co.uk/en.html
> https://www.peugeot.co.za/range.html
> http://www.usedvans.mercedes-benz.co.uk/ (window title)



this is the place I have tagged:
http://www.fcaspa.com/

They only sell Volvo trucks (new), but have a wide selection of used
vehicles of many different brands.

Cheers
Martin
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Marc Gemis]

Typically, the websites of the vendors use "Commercial Vehicles"

some examples:

https://www.volkswagen-vans.co.uk/en.html
https://www.peugeot.co.za/range.html
http://www.usedvans.mercedes-benz.co.uk/ (window title)

m.

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

Am Mo., 18. Nov. 2019 um 12:08 Uhr schrieb Philip Barnes <
p...@trigpoint.me.uk>:

> Maybe to reflect driving licence requirements?
> Only those with relatively recent licenses need a special license to drive
> a vehicle between 3.5 and 7.5t.
> Many of us can drive a 7.5t vehicle on a car license.



might be true for Britain or Germany, but definitely is countryspecific.

Cheers
Martin
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Philip Barnes]

Maybe to reflect driving licence requirements?

Only those with relatively recent licenses need a special license to drive a 
vehicle between 3.5 and 7.5t.

Many of us can drive a 7.5t vehicle on a car license.

Phil (trigpoint) 

On Monday, 18 November 2019, Volker Schmidt wrote:
> Wikipedia includes pickups in the "Truck
> " category.
> But HGV  excludes many
> pickups because of the H in HGV ("GCM
>  over 3500kg").
> 
> An aside: in the EU, and hence for the time being also in the UK, HGV is
> superceded by LGV - no idea why, as the criterion is mass over 3500kg)
> 
> On Sun, 17 Nov 2019 at 22:34, Markus  wrote:
> 
> > On Sun, 17 Nov 2019 at 19:23, Marc Gemis  wrote:
> > >
> > > AFAIK, VW does not sell lorries/hgv/trucks. Their commercial vehicles
> > > are pick ups and vans (caddy/transporter/crafter) The largest, has a
> > > GVW of 5t.
> > >
> > > Which tags do we have to use in case the shop only sells those vehicles?
> >
> > It seems we don't have one, but it may make sense to use
> > shop=utility_vehicle or something similar.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Markus
> >
> > ___
> > Tagging mailing list
> > Tagging@openstreetmap.org
> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
> >
>

-- 
Sent from my Sailfish device
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Volker Schmidt]

Wikipedia includes pickups in the "Truck
" category.
But HGV  excludes many
pickups because of the H in HGV ("GCM
 over 3500kg").

An aside: in the EU, and hence for the time being also in the UK, HGV is
superceded by LGV - no idea why, as the criterion is mass over 3500kg)

On Sun, 17 Nov 2019 at 22:34, Markus  wrote:

> On Sun, 17 Nov 2019 at 19:23, Marc Gemis  wrote:
> >
> > AFAIK, VW does not sell lorries/hgv/trucks. Their commercial vehicles
> > are pick ups and vans (caddy/transporter/crafter) The largest, has a
> > GVW of 5t.
> >
> > Which tags do we have to use in case the shop only sells those vehicles?
>
> It seems we don't have one, but it may make sense to use
> shop=utility_vehicle or something similar.
>
> Regards
>
> Markus
>
> ___
> Tagging mailing list
> Tagging@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Markus]

On Sun, 17 Nov 2019 at 19:23, Marc Gemis  wrote:
>
> AFAIK, VW does not sell lorries/hgv/trucks. Their commercial vehicles
> are pick ups and vans (caddy/transporter/crafter) The largest, has a
> GVW of 5t.
>
> Which tags do we have to use in case the shop only sells those vehicles?

It seems we don't have one, but it may make sense to use
shop=utility_vehicle or something similar.

Regards

Markus

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Max]

Interesting. I've watched a fair amount of British media coverage about 
the horrific human trafficking a couple of weeks back and noticed the 
repeated use of lorry. In this Sky News segment they say vehicle 
(comprising of tractor and container) and lorry, but they aren't saying 
truck once.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yo_SpJPJSs4


On 17.11.19 00:37, Philip Barnes wrote:

Lorry has largely fallen out of use, truck is the more used word in British 
English nowadays.

Phil (trigpoint)

On Saturday, 16 November 2019, Max wrote:

Given that OSM language is British it probably should be "lorry" not
"truck".


On 16.11.19 18:21, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:

I have found a shop that sells Volvo and Volkswagen commercial vehicles
(large trucks). Looking in the wiki, it suggested the tag shop=car
should/could also be used for this, but I find it puzzling. How would
someone looking at the map understand, that this shop=car,
brand=Volkswagen;Volvo is only selling trucks? Wouldn't it make more
sense to tag these with a different tag. e.g. shop=truck?

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:shop%3Dcar

Cheers,
Martin

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging




___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging






___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

sent from a phone

>> On 17. Nov 2019, at 19:23, Marc Gemis  wrote:
> AFAIK, VW does not sell lorries/hgv/trucks. Their commercial vehicles
> are pick ups and vans (caddy/transporter/crafter) The largest, has a
> GVW of 5t.


you may be right, actually brand=volkswagen commercial vehicles;volvo was what 
was already tagged, and after researching them on their webpage it seems this 
should be Krone;Volvo because no mention of Volkswagen (they are also 
officially authorized to repair a series of components from different brands, 
like tachometers and similar, for which I haven’t tagged any, and they’re 
offering a lot of used vehicles from varying brands as well).

Cheers Martin 
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Mateusz Konieczny]

17 Nov 2019, 12:03 by dieterdre...@gmail.com:

>
>
> sent from a phone
>
>> On 16. Nov 2019, at 23:26, Mateusz Konieczny  wrote:
>>
>> I would use something like
>> shop=car car=truck
>>
>
>
> I had considered this, but shop=car says it is for automobiles, and trucks 
> aren’t automobiles
>
Thanks, I was unaware about this.___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Max]

VW Group has controlling stakes in MAN and Scania, maybe that's what he 
meant?


On 17.11.19 19:21, Marc Gemis wrote:

AFAIK, VW does not sell lorries/hgv/trucks. Their commercial vehicles
are pick ups and vans (caddy/transporter/crafter) The largest, has a
GVW of 5t.

Which tags do we have to use in case the shop only sells those vehicles?

regards

m.

On Sun, Nov 17, 2019 at 12:11 PM Martin Koppenhoefer
 wrote:


I have now changed this back to shop=truck, seems the most convincing of all 
options, and the most frequently used specific tag

Cheers Martin
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging


___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging




___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Marc Gemis]

AFAIK, VW does not sell lorries/hgv/trucks. Their commercial vehicles
are pick ups and vans (caddy/transporter/crafter) The largest, has a
GVW of 5t.

Which tags do we have to use in case the shop only sells those vehicles?

regards

m.

On Sun, Nov 17, 2019 at 12:11 PM Martin Koppenhoefer
 wrote:
>
> I have now changed this back to shop=truck, seems the most convincing of all 
> options, and the most frequently used specific tag
>
> Cheers Martin
> ___
> Tagging mailing list
> Tagging@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

I have now changed this back to shop=truck, seems the most convincing of all 
options, and the most frequently used specific tag

Cheers Martin 
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

sent from a phone

> On 16. Nov 2019, at 23:26, Mateusz Konieczny  wrote:
> 
> I would use something like
> shop=car car=truck


I had considered this, but shop=car says it is for automobiles, and trucks 
aren’t automobiles 


> 
> Similarly I recently used 
> shop=furniture furniture=office
> to tag shop selling office furniture.


different case because office furniture is furniture 


Cheers Martin 
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Philip Barnes]

Lorry has largely fallen out of use, truck is the more used word in British 
English nowadays.

Phil (trigpoint) 

On Saturday, 16 November 2019, Max wrote:
> Given that OSM language is British it probably should be "lorry" not 
> "truck".
> 
> 
> On 16.11.19 18:21, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> > I have found a shop that sells Volvo and Volkswagen commercial vehicles 
> > (large trucks). Looking in the wiki, it suggested the tag shop=car 
> > should/could also be used for this, but I find it puzzling. How would 
> > someone looking at the map understand, that this shop=car, 
> > brand=Volkswagen;Volvo is only selling trucks? Wouldn't it make more 
> > sense to tag these with a different tag. e.g. shop=truck?
> > 
> > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:shop%3Dcar
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > Martin
> > 
> > ___
> > Tagging mailing list
> > Tagging@openstreetmap.org
> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
> > 
> 
> 
> ___
> Tagging mailing list
> Tagging@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>

-- 
Sent from my Sailfish device
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Max]

Given that OSM language is British it probably should be "lorry" not 
"truck".



On 16.11.19 18:21, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
I have found a shop that sells Volvo and Volkswagen commercial vehicles 
(large trucks). Looking in the wiki, it suggested the tag shop=car 
should/could also be used for this, but I find it puzzling. How would 
someone looking at the map understand, that this shop=car, 
brand=Volkswagen;Volvo is only selling trucks? Wouldn't it make more 
sense to tag these with a different tag. e.g. shop=truck?


https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:shop%3Dcar

Cheers,
Martin

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging




___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Paul Allen]

On Sat, 16 Nov 2019 at 22:26, Mateusz Konieczny 
wrote:

> I would use something like
> shop=car car=truck
>

This is not good English.  A truck is not a type of car.  Both are kinds of
motor vehicle.  I
doubt you'd find anyone with English as a first language over the age of 4
who would consider
a truck to be a type of car.

-- 
Paul
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Mateusz Konieczny]

I would use something like
shop=car car=truck

Similarly I recently used 
shop=furniture furniture=office
to tag shop selling office furniture.

This way both detail is provided 
and someone interested just in general
info may use reasonably sized list of shop values.

I would not consider shop=truck or
shop=office_furniture to be a good design,
I strongly prefer cascading tags
allowing both tagging details and using
data without caring about all details.
16 Nov 2019, 18:21 by dieterdre...@gmail.com:

> I have found a shop that sells Volvo and Volkswagen commercial vehicles 
> (large trucks). Looking in the wiki, it suggested the tag shop=car 
> should/could also be used for this, but I find it puzzling. How would someone 
> looking at the map understand, that this shop=car, brand=Volkswagen;Volvo is 
> only selling trucks? Wouldn't it make more sense to tag these with a 
> different tag. e.g. shop=truck?
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:shop%3Dcar
>
> Cheers,
> Martin
>___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

sent from a phone

> On 16. Nov 2019, at 20:19, Jmapb  wrote:
> 
> Hi Martin, we have shop=hgv documented for this. It's rarely used but I say 
> go for it!
> 
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Hgv#shop.3Dhgv
> 


I had used shop=truck which is also rarely used and undocumented, but it has 54 
uses vs. 13 for hgv, and it isn’t an abbreviation (although hgv as a term is 
well introduced in the OpenStreetMap context). Opinions?

Cheers Martin ___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Jmapb]

On 11/16/2019 12:21 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:


I have found a shop that sells Volvo and Volkswagen commercial
vehicles (large trucks). Looking in the wiki, it suggested the tag
shop=car should/could also be used for this, but I find it puzzling.
How would someone looking at the map understand, that this shop=car,
brand=Volkswagen;Volvo is only selling trucks? Wouldn't it make more
sense to tag these with a different tag. e.g. shop=truck?

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:shop%3Dcar

Cheers,
Martin


Hi Martin, we have shop=hgv documented for this. It's rarely used but I
say go for it!

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Hgv#shop.3Dhgv

Jason





___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

[Tagging] shop selling trucks

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

I have found a shop that sells Volvo and Volkswagen commercial vehicles
(large trucks). Looking in the wiki, it suggested the tag shop=car
should/could also be used for this, but I find it puzzling. How would
someone looking at the map understand, that this shop=car,
brand=Volkswagen;Volvo is only selling trucks? Wouldn't it make more sense
to tag these with a different tag. e.g. shop=truck?

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:shop%3Dcar

Cheers,
Martin
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging