Re: [talk-au] cities changed to towns
On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 20:58:26 -0500, Richard Weait wrote: On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 5:17 PM, Chris Barham wrote: some Australian places have changed from cities to towns on; changeset was: http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/changeset/14217241 [1] I've emailed to the editor to ask the source for the change as I believe some are now incorrect. Did the account reply to you in a satisfactory manner? I don't see a correspondent in this thread that I relate to that username porjo. Have the edits in question been reverted? I did receive a response from the user. He was unaware of the Australian wiki guidance page, or the designated cities. He states his criteria was purely population size as he believed a city to require population of ~100k or more. No reversion has been done for the changeset; as a result I have manually re-tagged the Queensland cities, and intend to revisit should we reach a tagging consensus that would require further amendment. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] cities changed to towns
On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 11:16 PM, Nick Hocking nick.hock...@gmail.comwrote: Richard wrote Take a shot at creating rendering rules that fit your use case! :-) I'm with John on this one - especially for the case of Australia. Maybe we need a special renderer for Australia. Just recently I managed to get some new mappers interested in mapping in rural NSW. They have started on the Wyndham area (which was just about completely unmapped, and they are having the same problem as John. I,E when they want to see Wyndham and it's neighbouurs (Candelo and Cathcart) at the same time on a map, OpenStreetMap shows almost nothing since they are too far apart. We really need a smart renderer that determines (for each tile in each zoom level) what are the most significant objects/ways in that tile/zoom and makes sure that they are rendered (even if they happen to be hundred mile long dirt tracks). Also if the major places in the tile are only localities,hamlets or villages then they should be rendered. That way we would not be tempted to elevate a village to a town just to make the map usable. Largely, I think that removing the temptation to elevate a village to a town is an education problem, not a rendering problem. Don't tag for the renderer is part of it and look at this awesome transit map is another part. Back to creating a specialty rendering that is smarter about sparse areas. I don't think that the smart sparse renderer is impossible. In fact, a new feature was discussed on the mapnik list this week, transformation plugins, that may be helpful. Transformation plugins allow you to analyze and transform the data before rendering, so that might just be the place to decide which place= to render at which size / logo / prominence. So if it interests you, have a go at it. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] cities changed to towns
Richard wrote So if it interests you, have a go at it. It does interest me and I will have a go at it (eventually). However I have a few more pressing issues (OSMwise). We urgently need to complete the street name reclamation of Australia. To this end I will be mapping Hay and Narrandra in the next two weeks and fixing up Mildura and Renmark. I'll also knock out a few of the suburbs in Adelaide that have lost their street names. Also (and this could be done by an armchair mapper,local or overseas) we need to get all the house addresses for Australia into OSM. I'm also spending a lot of time fixing crazy TIGER roads in th US (I'm having a huge battle with some really crazy stuff near Lake Arrowhead). Once all the crazy TIGER roads are fixed and all the US house addresses are added then and only then will (I believe) Nokia start to use OpenStreetMaps in their mapping app. Then all the others (Apple, Google etc) will have to follow suit. Once all this has happened then I intend to spend a lot of time writing software for the mobile platform to do stuff that I find interesting. Nick ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] cities changed to towns
I think it might be a mistake to suggest that we don't get to have a say in how (eg) the main osm map is rendered just because we can personally render our own. Firstly, setting up to do that rendering is not trivial, nor is reconfiguring it for a different view. But mainly because we contribute to the map to make it useful for other people. Now, i don't see anyone sponsoring the necessary server and bandwidth capabilities (maybe i am wrong?) here in Oz. So i think we should assume that the 'other people' we want to help will be looking at osm.org or at an app that has been written by someone guided by what they see at osm.org. I agree that putting incorrect data into osm just because that makes it look right is evil. But we do have an obligation to make sure 'our' data is presented so its useful. In this case, if that means redefining terms like city, that's what we need do. We have a similar problem with connecting roads and even how frequently the name appears on a long road. Sigh... Incidentally, the documentation on how to set up a local rendering system is not great, i might do a bit of updating. And, importantly, there does not seem to be any user guide for osm.xml, quite a lot goes on in there ! Should we be documenting our views in the Australian page of the wiki ? David . Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 11:16 PM, Nick Hocking nick.hock...@gmail.comwrote: Richard wrote Take a shot at creating rendering rules that fit your use case! :-) I'm with John on this one - especially for the case of Australia. Maybe we need a special renderer for Australia. Just recently I managed to get some new mappers interested in mapping in rural NSW. They have started on the Wyndham area (which was just about completely unmapped, and they are having the same problem as John. I,E when they want to see Wyndham and it's neighbouurs (Candelo and Cathcart) at the same time on a map, OpenStreetMap shows almost nothing since they are too far apart. We really need a smart renderer that determines (for each tile in each zoom level) what are the most significant objects/ways in that tile/zoom and makes sure that they are rendered (even if they happen to be hundred mile long dirt tracks). Also if the major places in the tile are only localities,hamlets or villages then they should be rendered. That way we would not be tempted to elevate a village to a town just to make the map usable. Largely, I think that removing the temptation to elevate a village to a town is an education problem, not a rendering problem. Don't tag for the renderer is part of it and look at this awesome transit map is another part. Back to creating a specialty rendering that is smarter about sparse areas. I don't think that the smart sparse renderer is impossible. In fact, a new feature was discussed on the mapnik list this week, transformation plugins, that may be helpful. Transformation plugins allow you to analyze and transform the data before rendering, so that might just be the place to decide which place= to render at which size / logo / prominence. So if it interests you, have a go at it. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
