Re: [Talk-GB] "secret" site

[Mark Goodge]

On 28/06/2020 15:12, Dave Love wrote:

On Sun, 2020-06-28 at 13:37 +0100, Mark Goodge wrote:


On 28/06/2020 12:18, Dave Love wrote:

On Sun, 2020-06-28 at 09:33 +0100, Robert Skedgell wrote:

Is it mapped or does it appear to be redacted on NLS's out-of-
copyright
OS maps?


Yes, for NLS and current OS displayed by MAGIC.


Is that yes, it's mapped, or yes, it's redacted?


Sorry, it's mapped.  I don't recall ever seeing anything redacted on an
OS map, but I don't remember when and what navigation we used on a
North York Moors walk.


In that case, the next question is, is it visible, either from a ground 
survey or from the overhead imagery?


If the answer is yes, then map it. You can then use your local knowledge 
to name it.


Stuff isn't generally redacted on OS maps these days, although it was, 
once. There's an interesting disconnect on the New Popular Edition here, 
where one sheet was produced while Lakenheath Airbase was still redacted 
but the neighbouring sheet was produced after it ceased to be:


http://www.npemap.org.uk/tiles/map.html#191,94,2

You can see it on the 1:10,560 maps of 1949-1969 on NLS as well:

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=14=52.41301=0.56200=193=3

Although the 7th Series had the road diversion and gave a name for the 
airfield, it didn't map any of the features and gave the (misleading) 
impression that a track still crossed it:


https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=13=52.41613=0.54170=11=3

Mark

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Re: [Talk-GB] Server crash or dns spoofing?

[ael]

On Sun, Jun 28, 2020 at 09:12:20PM +0200, Mateusz Konieczny via Talk-GB wrote:
> >> Apparently it was a temporary outrage,
> >> see https://github.com/openstreetmap/operations/issues/431

Thanks for all the replies. Indeed everything seems to be working again.

I am surprised that reverse dns doesn't work.

ael


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Re: [Talk-GB] Server crash or dns spoofing?

[Mateusz Konieczny via Talk-GB]

That is an unrelated failure that caused tile of
the default map style to stop updating
(other servers relying on the same toolchain also
were likely to be affected)


Jun 28, 2020, 21:08 by danstowell+...@gmail.com:

> I won't presume that everyone on talk-gb wants the gory technical
> details, but it seems they gave a brief summary on twitter:
> https://twitter.com/OSM_Tech/status/1277001284705570821
>
> Best
> Dan
>
>
> Op zo 28 jun. 2020 om 19:39 schreef Mateusz Konieczny via Talk-GB
> :
>
>>
>> Apparently it was a temporary outrage,
>> see https://github.com/openstreetmap/operations/issues/431
>> (without useful details except that whatever is broken become fixed)
>>
>> Jun 28, 2020, 20:30 by witwa...@disroot.org:
>>
>> Is www.openstreetmap.org down?
>>
>> I am getting an error "We're sorry, but something went wrong".
>>
>> My dns is giving
>> www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.11
>> www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.13
>> www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.12
>> www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:b
>> www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:c
>> www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:d
>>
>> but reverse lookup is a bit suspicious:
>> $ host 130.117.76.11
>> Host 11.76.117.130.in-addr.arpa. not found: 3(NXDOMAIN)
>>
>> Am I the only one seeing this: do I need to investigate further?
>>
>> ael
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Server crash or dns spoofing?

[Dan S]

I won't presume that everyone on talk-gb wants the gory technical
details, but it seems they gave a brief summary on twitter:
https://twitter.com/OSM_Tech/status/1277001284705570821

Best
Dan


Op zo 28 jun. 2020 om 19:39 schreef Mateusz Konieczny via Talk-GB
:
>
> Apparently it was a temporary outrage,
> see https://github.com/openstreetmap/operations/issues/431
> (without useful details except that whatever is broken become fixed)
>
> Jun 28, 2020, 20:30 by witwa...@disroot.org:
>
> Is www.openstreetmap.org down?
>
> I am getting an error "We're sorry, but something went wrong".
>
> My dns is giving
> www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.11
> www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.13
> www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.12
> www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:b
> www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:c
> www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:d
>
> but reverse lookup is a bit suspicious:
> $ host 130.117.76.11
> Host 11.76.117.130.in-addr.arpa. not found: 3(NXDOMAIN)
>
> Am I the only one seeing this: do I need to investigate further?
>
> ael
>
>
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] JOSM Plugin for the FHRS API

[Kai Michael Poppe - OSM]

Good evening,

with (most) issues fixed, I've upgraded the plugin to v 0.1.5 and also
published it in the JOSM wiki so that you can download it via your
plugin dialog within JOSM.

I hope you find it as useful as others have already reported :-)

Thanks to everyone who has tested and helped me move the most glaring
mistakes out of the way!

Have a great evening!

Kai

On 26.06.2020 23:33, Kai Michael Poppe - OSM wrote:
> Hi everyone,
> 
> Version 0.1.3 is now available for download from
> https://github.com/kmpoppe/fhrsPlugin
> 
> Thank you all for being so active in helping with the development of
> this small part of the OSM bubble!
> 
> Good n8!
> 
> Kai
> 
> On 26.06.2020 17:48, Tony OSM wrote:
>> Hi Kai
>>
>> Was thinking that automatically selecting the first array element which
>> will be highlighted in the display will solve it.
>>
>> My belt and braces is to catch that exception and display a suitable
>> error message ( should never occur)
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On 26/06/2020 16:35, Kai Michael Poppe - OSM wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Tony, Hi Dave,
>>>
>>> yep, that's the same Issue
>>> (https://github.com/kmpoppe/fhrsPlugin/issues/2) - current, you HAVE
>>> to select an entry, even if there is only one. I have covered for that
>>> now in code, but I'm thinking it might be easier, if there is just one
>>> entry, to automatically go for that one without the user having to
>>> select it.
>>>
>>> Kai
>>>
>>> On 26.06.2020 17:14, Tony OSM wrote:

 Hi

 I get that also. In my case its caused by not selecting an entry in
 the table presented after the initial Search entry. I've reported
 this issue & Kai is aware.

 Tony

 On 26/06/2020 15:54, Dave F via Talk-GB wrote:
> I'm getting this after selecting the Search Entry option:
>
> https://snipboard.io/7J6Eb0.jpg
>
> Latest JOSM version
>
> Any ideas?
>
> On 26/06/2020 10:45, o...@poppe.dev wrote:
>> Hey Tony,
>>
>> as I'm from the other side of the Channel, I doubt that there's
>> someone from the UK community that knows me well enough to reassure
>> you about my person (I could always ask people from the German
>> Telegram group to tell you I'm not a lunatic *g*)
>>
>> You could always take a look at the GitHub repository (
>> https://github.com/kmpoppe/fhrsPlugin) and check what's going on in
>> the code - which heavily relies on the JOSM core source.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Kai
>>
>>> Hi Kai
>>>
>>> I'd like to help as its a good idea - however I don't know you,
>> so could
>>> you get some community people who are well known to vouch for
>> you, its
>>> just that I don't want strange software on my machine.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>> Tony Shield
>>>
>>> TonyS999
>>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Server crash or dns spoofing?

[Mateusz Konieczny via Talk-GB]

Apparently it was a temporary outrage,
see https://github.com/openstreetmap/operations/issues/431
(without useful details except that whatever is broken become fixed)

Jun 28, 2020, 20:30 by witwa...@disroot.org:

> Is www.openstreetmap.org down?
>
> I am getting an error "We're sorry, but something went wrong".
>
> My dns is giving
> www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.11
> www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.13
> www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.12
> www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:b
> www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:c
> www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:d
>
> but reverse lookup is a bit suspicious:
> $ host 130.117.76.11
> Host 11.76.117.130.in-addr.arpa. not found: 3(NXDOMAIN)
>
> Am I the only one seeing this: do I need to investigate further?
>
> ael
>
>
>
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[Talk-GB] Server crash or dns spoofing?

[ael]

Is www.openstreetmap.org down?

I am getting an error "We're sorry, but something went wrong".

My dns is giving
www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.11
www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.13
www.openstreetmap.org has address 130.117.76.12
www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:b
www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:c
www.openstreetmap.org has IPv6 address 2001:978:2:2c::172:d

but reverse lookup is a bit suspicious:
$ host 130.117.76.11
Host 11.76.117.130.in-addr.arpa. not found: 3(NXDOMAIN)

Am I the only one seeing this: do I need to investigate further?

ael



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Re: [Talk-GB] "secret" site

[Andy Townsend]

On 28/06/2020 00:47, David Woolley wrote:


On the other hand, there used to be part of the North Yorkshire moors 
that had "undefined" written over it on OS maps.)


Interestingly (assuming you're talking about the radar installation at 
RAF Fylingdales), at least as of my 2006 copy of OS's OL6 map, the OS 
was still lacking some of the detail - the military area is missing yet 
clearly signposted onsite, and the bridleway that runs north of the site 
is mostly signposted on the ground but mostly missing from the OS map 
(in OSM https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/7600885032 and 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/813719250 
). 
There are still some "odd" signposts around such as 
https://map.atownsend.org.uk/tmp/fylingdales/IMG_20200531_163604.jpg , 
but at least no-one's pretending that there's "nothing there" - it's 
fairly obvious in the landscape: 
https://map.atownsend.org.uk/tmp/fylingdales/IMG_20200531_183407.jpg .


Best Regards,

Andy




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Re: [Talk-GB] "secret" site

[Dave Love]

On Sun, 2020-06-28 at 13:37 +0100, Mark Goodge wrote:
> 
> On 28/06/2020 12:18, Dave Love wrote:
> > On Sun, 2020-06-28 at 09:33 +0100, Robert Skedgell wrote:
> > > Is it mapped or does it appear to be redacted on NLS's out-of-
> > > copyright
> > > OS maps?
> > 
> > Yes, for NLS and current OS displayed by MAGIC.
> 
> Is that yes, it's mapped, or yes, it's redacted?

Sorry, it's mapped.  I don't recall ever seeing anything redacted on an
OS map, but I don't remember when and what navigation we used on a
North York Moors walk.

I could have said that the reservoir in question will supply many
employees of the (well-mapped!) remaining GCHQ site.  I appreciate the
significance of critical infrastructure, but the threat model isn't
like German cyclists in the '30s, and a casual attacker will poison the
obvious open one that's now used for food defence.  I don't see a real
issue mapping it, but thought it was worth opinions.


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[Talk-GB] weeklyOSM #518 2020-06-16-2020-06-22

[weeklyteam]

The weekly round-up of OSM news, issue # 518,
is now available online in English, giving as always a summary of a lot of 
things happening in the openstreetmap world:

 https://www.weeklyosm.eu/en/archives/13326/

Enjoy! 

Did you know that you can also submit messages for the weeklyOSM? Just log in 
to https://osmbc.openstreetmap.de/login with your OSM account. Read more about 
how to write a post here: 
http://www.weeklyosm.eu/this-news-should-be-in-weeklyosm 

weeklyOSM? 
who: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WeeklyOSM#Available_Languages 
where?: 
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/weeklyosm-is-currently-produced-in_56718#2/8.6/108.3
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Re: [Talk-GB] "secret" site

[Andy Mabbett]

On Sun, 28 Jun 2020 at 00:47, David Woolley  wrote:


> there used to be part of the North Yorkshire moors
> that had "undefined" written over it on OS maps.

Unlike Sovet military maps, that had all the details...

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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Re: [Talk-GB] "secret" site

[Mark Goodge]

On 28/06/2020 12:18, Dave Love wrote:

On Sun, 2020-06-28 at 09:33 +0100, Robert Skedgell wrote:

Is it mapped or does it appear to be redacted on NLS's out-of-
copyright
OS maps?


Yes, for NLS and current OS displayed by MAGIC.


Is that yes, it's mapped, or yes, it's redacted?

Mark

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Re: [Talk-GB] "secret" site

[Dave Love]

On Sun, 2020-06-28 at 09:33 +0100, Robert Skedgell wrote:
> Is it mapped or does it appear to be redacted on NLS's out-of-
> copyright
> OS maps?

Yes, for NLS and current OS displayed by MAGIC.

> On 28/06/2020 09:27, Tony OSM wrote:
> > I question the meaning of the word 'secret' when used in a
> > newspaper. My
> > observations are that secret means the reporter didn't know about
> > it.
> > 
> > Tony
The reporter was in one of the structures when it was drained.  [The
quality of local news reporting may be higher than much else because
the audience is people who are more likely in a better position to
know/check.]

> > On 28/06/2020 00:47, David Woolley wrote:

> > > How would another mapper verify this?  I normally think that
> > > people
> > > interpret the map only what's on the ground rule too literally,
> > > but in
> > > this case, I'd suggest the moral thing to do is to ignore your
> > > local
> > > knowledge an only map what can be seen, without guessing its
> > > significance.

They could look it up in the HE listing.  (Obviously I traced the
outline from imagery, not the OS data.)  I was actually mapping the
local listed buildings, partly to point the local history society to
OSM rather than Google maps on their web site.

> > > (There are some road signs entitled "secret bunker", e.g. for
> > > Kelvedon
> > > Hatch, but I don't think this is the case here.
> > > 
> > > On the other hand, there used to be part of the North Yorkshire
> > > moors
> > > that had "undefined" written over it on OS maps.)

With good vantage points around the obvious features, as for the
obvious green building that used to be below the area of the
reservoirs...  (For historical amusement, I don't off-hand know what
appeared there on 1970s maps, though I think there's one around
somewhere.  The OS7 and NLS versions may not be recent enough.)


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Re: [Talk-GB] "secret" site

[Robert Skedgell]

Is it mapped or does it appear to be redacted on NLS's out-of-copyright
OS maps?

On 28/06/2020 09:27, Tony OSM wrote:
> I question the meaning of the word 'secret' when used in a newspaper. My
> observations are that secret means the reporter didn't know about it.
> 
> Tony
> 
> On 28/06/2020 00:47, David Woolley wrote:
>> On 27/06/2020 23:37, Dave Love wrote:
>>> I was going to map a covered reservoir round here that I've known from
>>> my youth, but I happened to find an article about it from the local
>>> paper suggesting the location is secret, though it's listed in
>>> Historic England.  (It's not far from a "sensitive government
>>> establishment" that no-one locally knew about before it ceased to be
>>> secret :-/)
>>> Should I not map it, or pretend I didn't see the article?
>>>
>>
>> How would another mapper verify this?  I normally think that people
>> interpret the map only what's on the ground rule too literally, but in
>> this case, I'd suggest the moral thing to do is to ignore your local
>> knowledge an only map what can be seen, without guessing its
>> significance.
>>
>> (There are some road signs entitled "secret bunker", e.g. for Kelvedon
>> Hatch, but I don't think this is the case here.
>>
>> On the other hand, there used to be part of the North Yorkshire moors
>> that had "undefined" written over it on OS maps.)
>>
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Re: [Talk-GB] "secret" site

[Tony OSM]

I question the meaning of the word 'secret' when used in a newspaper. My 
observations are that secret means the reporter didn't know about it.


Tony

On 28/06/2020 00:47, David Woolley wrote:

On 27/06/2020 23:37, Dave Love wrote:

I was going to map a covered reservoir round here that I've known from
my youth, but I happened to find an article about it from the local
paper suggesting the location is secret, though it's listed in
Historic England.  (It's not far from a "sensitive government
establishment" that no-one locally knew about before it ceased to be
secret :-/)
Should I not map it, or pretend I didn't see the article?



How would another mapper verify this?  I normally think that people 
interpret the map only what's on the ground rule too literally, but in 
this case, I'd suggest the moral thing to do is to ignore your local 
knowledge an only map what can be seen, without guessing its 
significance.


(There are some road signs entitled "secret bunker", e.g. for Kelvedon 
Hatch, but I don't think this is the case here.


On the other hand, there used to be part of the North Yorkshire moors 
that had "undefined" written over it on OS maps.)


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