Re: [Diversity-talk] First Meeting of Diversity and Inclusion Special Committee

[Ferdinand]

The main question with the time is the planned length of this session.
If it is one hour most Europeans won't be able to join in.
If the session is planned to run for a longer time it would allow all to
talk but not allow everyone to talk to each other.
As such I'd like to know if there is a planned/expected duration

Philip Barnes  schrieb am Do., 6. Feb. 2020, 22:31:

> On Thu, 2020-02-06 at 21:17 +, Mikel Maron wrote:
>
> Heather -- I chose a time next week that would be near waking hours for
> maximum number of timezones. We can have more than one initial meeting.
> Want to get this moving. Suggest another time to me and we can schedule
> another.
>
>
> Would a weekend be a better day?
>
> Whilst it is waking hours in Europet is also working hours.
>
> Phil (trigpoint)
> ___
> Diversity-talk mailing list
> Code of Conduct:
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Diversity/MailingList/CodeOfConduct
> Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org
>
___
Diversity-talk mailing list
Code of Conduct: 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Diversity/MailingList/CodeOfConduct
Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org

Re: [talk-au] SSSI National Bushfire Recovery Map-a-thon - Sunday 9th Feb

[Andrew Harvey]

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 18:25, Andrew Harvey  wrote:

> I finally managed to get in touch with one of the organisers, and raised
> the licensing/waiver issue. They've said they asked Planet Labs for the
> waiver, I've also independently reached out to the Planet Labs disasters
> contact with background on why OSM asks for the waiver and the waiver
> asking them if they can complete it if they would like OSM to be able to
> use their disaster imagery. Given the mapathon is on Sunday it's a
> nervous wait to see if they'll respond in time.
>

Thanks to many people behind the scenes we obtained the necessary CC waiver
from Planet Labs. I've updated
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_data_catalogue with the
details. I'll update the Contributors page on Sunday when I see some edits
come through.
___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [talk-au] FW: [HOT] damage as a tag - not docu,

[Graeme Fitzpatrick]

On Fri, 7 Feb 2020 at 08:32, Phil Wyatt  wrote:

> Hi Folks,
>
>
>
> There was a proposal back in 2016 (well after the first use of the damage
> tag) and it seems to have stalled, maybe because tagging damage has been
> found to be less effective than hoped
>
>
>
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/HOT_Damage_Tagging_Proposal
>
>
>
>
> https://americanredcross.github.io/OSM-Assessment/docs/OSM%20Damage%20Assessment%20Interim%20Report.pdf
>
>
>
> maybe the discussion needs to be moved to the tagging list, if its deemed
> a worthy addition?
>

Yes, I would think so

Thanks

Graeme
___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [talk-au] SSSI National Bushfire Recovery Map-a-thon - Sunday 9th Feb

[Graeme Fitzpatrick]

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 23:37, Andrew Harvey  wrote:

>
> Yes it will go out of date quickly but so does landuse=construction. If
> anything by flagging it as damaged, ruined, razed it attributes this
> feature as needed to be checked again soon.
>

Yep, as I said on the other thread, they all need a fixme= added, as well
as "damaged"

Thanks

Graeme
___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [talk-au] SSSI National Bushfire Recovery Map-a-thon - Sunday 9th Feb

[Graeme Fitzpatrick]

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 19:42, Ewen Hill  wrote:

>
> I would like to see something a bit smarter than this. Something that can
> assist people on the ground now would be highly beneficial. A "Hell yes, we
> are open" web-site that *small *businesses can advertise would be great.
> A whole lot of other things could be done well before adding a temporary
> updates. These towns are going to really struggle in winter and people
> drift off.
>

Completely OT to mapping, but saw this article a few weeks ago
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-13/community-campaigns-helping-bushfire-towns-bounce-back/11859990

& this is the site they mentioned
https://www.roadtripforgood.org.au/locale/roadtrip-for-good

There are already other similar sites appearing as well, so good on 'em! :-)

  Thanks

Graeme
___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [OSM-talk] it's not a fake, but "it's complicated

[Mario Frasca]

oops, Aaron, I'm afraid I was not clear in at least one of my 
statements.  so sorry.


On 06/02/2020 15:42, Aaron Young wrote:

but also checks with the local community, if there is any,
what special agreements rule in the local community.  for Panamá, I
would like to have such activities listed in a dedicated page in the
*wiki*.


This is doable and we try, without making an excuse, it is hard to 
determine who to coordinate with in “each” community.  This may be 
because mappers are active, not active, want to be communicative and 
others don’t.  I would also be hesitant to agree to “special 
agreements” which might take away from the idea of open, free data for 
all to utilize.  Utilizing the main OSM wiki for editing standards is 
preferred, with limited country specific editing guidelines.  This 
creates a more global map for all.


when I speak of special agreements, I refer to the contents, not to the 
licenses.  like what do we do in a case like … (here comes the 
description of the case).  osm is IMO very north-centric: not only does 
it speak British English all over the place, in the terms to use, but 
also in the concepts it implements.  take "village green".  I've been 
using in Panama because there's a lot of places with open space not 
belonging to anybody in particular. but go to the description in the 
wiki, and you get the impression that OSM is made for-and-by the blind 
British retired high rank military.


anyhow.

"special agreements" on how to use tags and values, that's what I 
meant.  possibly with pictures.  think of Highway Tag Africa.


also, again thinking of Panama, most places get at least 4000mm rain 
yearly, some ~6000mm, Pacific weather pattern is different from 
Caribbean, the so called Cordillera Central is a transition zone with 
the worst of the two sides, and then there's Herrera-Los Santos with 
possibly 1500mm/year.  any road with 'surface:ground' absolutely needs 
an indication of the period when it can be expected to be usable.  
'ford:yes' also need that.  'incline' can be of great help.


that's just what me as a newcomer to the place can think of.  I'm not 
sure where to find this information other than coming here and observing 
yourself.



[…] Example from South Africa (we started this after Panama): 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/South_Africa#Kaart_Groundwork_.26_Mapping


interesting, not enough people here in Panama for so much work, but 
interesting.  chapeau!


ciao,

M


___
talk mailing list
talk@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [talk-au] FW: [HOT] damage as a tag - not docu,

[Phil Wyatt]

Hi Folks,

 

There was a proposal back in 2016 (well after the first use of the damage tag) 
and it seems to have stalled, maybe because tagging damage has been found to be 
less effective than hoped

 

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Bgirardot/HOT_Damage_Tagging_Proposal

 

https://americanredcross.github.io/OSM-Assessment/docs/OSM%20Damage%20Assessment%20Interim%20Report.pdf

 

maybe the discussion needs to be moved to the tagging list, if its deemed a 
worthy addition?

 

Cheers - Phil

 

From: Graeme Fitzpatrick  
Sent: Friday, 7 February 2020 9:22 AM
To: Phil Wyatt 
Cc: OSM-Au 
Subject: Re: [talk-au] FW: [HOT] damage as a tag - not docu,

 

 

 

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 20:27, Phil Wyatt mailto:p...@wyatt-family.com> > wrote:


From: Russell Deffner mailto:russell.deff...@hotosm.org> > 
Sent: Thursday, 6 February 2020 9:04 PM
To: Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com  >
Cc: h...@openstreetmap.org  
Subject: Re: [HOT] damage as a tag - not docu,

Just a quick note; HOT does not formally do damage tagging, mainly because no 
tagging schema exists. In the past, members of HOT tried various tagging but 
results for remote damage assessment were poor.

I personally would be glad to see a community driven tagging schema developed 
but if not we (HOT) will need to document what we come up with for usage in 
disaster response and recovery.

One glaring issue has been that typically the tags persist much longer than the 
damage.

=Russ

> On Feb 6, 2020, at 12:49 PM, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com 
>  > wrote:
> 
> Hi.
> 
> It looks like HOT is using the tag 'damage' for something. It is not 
> documented as to what it means. Further is this information kept current or 
> just added and forgotten? In at least one case the tag goes back to 2011.

 

So it looks like that damage= key we were discussing needs to be documented, & 
I suppose go through the full RFC & so on basis for arguments :-(

 

However, I'd also suggest that whenever (without fail!), something is tagged as 
damaged=, it also has to have a fixme= added, so that it's (hopefully!) one day 
corrected.

 

The big problem there, of course, is when things are marked as damaged by 
remote HOT mappers, who is actually on site in that area to correct the map as 
buildings are either repaired or demolished, & when is aerial imagery of these 
areas likely to be updated?  

 

Thanks

 

Graeme

___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [talk-au] FW: [HOT] damage as a tag - not docu,

[Graeme Fitzpatrick]

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 20:27, Phil Wyatt  wrote:

>
> From: Russell Deffner 
> Sent: Thursday, 6 February 2020 9:04 PM
> To: Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com>
> Cc: h...@openstreetmap.org
> Subject: Re: [HOT] damage as a tag - not docu,
>
> Just a quick note; HOT does not formally do damage tagging, mainly because
> no tagging schema exists. In the past, members of HOT tried various tagging
> but results for remote damage assessment were poor.
>
> I personally would be glad to see a community driven tagging schema
> developed but if not we (HOT) will need to document what we come up with
> for usage in disaster response and recovery.
>
> One glaring issue has been that typically the tags persist much longer
> than the damage.
>
> =Russ
>
> > On Feb 6, 2020, at 12:49 PM, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Hi.
> >
> > It looks like HOT is using the tag 'damage' for something. It is not
> documented as to what it means. Further is this information kept current or
> just added and forgotten? In at least one case the tag goes back to 2011.
>

So it looks like that damage= key we were discussing needs to be
documented, & I suppose go through the full RFC & so on basis for arguments
:-(

However, I'd also suggest that whenever (without fail!), something is
tagged as damaged=, it also has to have a fixme= added, so that it's
(hopefully!) one day corrected.

The big problem there, of course, is when things are marked as damaged by
remote HOT mappers, who is actually on site in that area to correct the map
as buildings are either repaired or demolished, & when is aerial imagery of
these areas likely to be updated?

Thanks

Graeme
___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [Diversity-talk] First Meeting of Diversity and Inclusion Special Committee

[Philip Barnes]

On Thu, 2020-02-06 at 21:17 +, Mikel Maron wrote:
> Heather -- I chose a time next week that would be near waking hours
> for maximum number of timezones. We can have more than one initial
> meeting. Want to get this moving. Suggest another time to me and we
> can schedule another.

Would a weekend be a better day? 

Whilst it is waking hours in Europet is also working hours.

Phil (trigpoint)
___
Diversity-talk mailing list
Code of Conduct: 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Diversity/MailingList/CodeOfConduct
Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org

Re: [Talk-it] Accesso paese a pagamento

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

sent from a phone

> Il giorno 6 feb 2020, alle ore 20:13, Andreas Lattmann 
>  ha scritto:
> 
> Le voci sono tante, si parla anche di transennare gli accessi al paese


starei attento, da lì manca poco e qualcuno ci mette la copertura e lo chiama 
manicomio ;-)


Ciao Martin 
___
Talk-it mailing list
Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

Re: [OSM-talk] Old maps from Royal Collection UK

[Andy Mabbett]

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 20:30, Colin Smale  wrote:
>
> On 2020-02-06 21:10, Andy Mabbett wrote:
>
> George III's collection of military maps

> Remarkably, though, they are claiming copyright over these maps.

> As I read it, they are claiming copyright in the images on the
> website, which is probably fair enough. I cannot see where they
> claim copyright in the maps themselves. But they do have
> ownership on their side; can they be forced to make the original
> maps available for someone else to photograph/scan?

Those images are flat reproductions of entire maps, not artistic
renditions; for example:

   
https://militarymaps.rct.uk/other-17th-century-conflicts/siege-of-vercelli-1617-lassedio-di-vercelli

The UK Intellectual Property Office guidance says:

   According to the Court of Justice of the European Union which has effect
   in UK law, copyright can only subsist in subject matter that is
original in the
   sense that it is the author’s own ‘intellectual creation’. Given
this criteria, it
   seems unlikely that what is merely a retouched, digitised image of an older
   work can be considered as ‘original’. This is because there will generally
   be minimal scope for a creator to exercise free and creative choices if their
   aim is simply to make a faithful reproduction of an existing work.

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

___
talk mailing list
talk@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [Diversity-talk] First Meeting of Diversity and Inclusion Special Committee

[Mikel Maron]

Heather -- I chose a time next week that would be near waking hours for maximum 
number of timezones. We can have more than one initial meeting. Want to get 
this moving. Suggest another time to me and we can schedule another.-Mikel

* Mikel Maron * +14152835207 @mikel s:mikelmaron 

On Thursday, February 6, 2020, 04:06:43 PM EST, Heather Leson 
 wrote:  
 
 Hi how did you choose this time? I really want to attend as someone who had 
been engaged in this topic. 
Reason for response: i am in a work event during this time.

Thanks in advance and am glad to see actions
Heather 
On Thu, 6 Feb 2020, 19:42 Mikel Maron,  wrote:

 Last month, the OSMF adopted this Diversity Statement [1] and appointed a 
committee [2] to compile research and undertake new research on our diversity, 
identify root causes that contribute to any shortfalls, and make 
recommendations to help resolve issues and improve. 
If you're interested to take part, join an upcoming initial meeting of the 
committee. We're holding a first meeting on Wednesday February 12 at 1400 UTC 
[3] on Mumble [4] (in the public OSMF Board of Directors room). Please join if 
you'd like to contribute. If you're unavailable at that time, let us know other 
times that might work, and we can schedule another kickoff meeting in addition.
[1] https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Diversity_Statement[2] 
https://hackmd.io/ZG8x44H4Skq0CPkcrMTB6A?view[3] Timezone converter: 
https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=DISC+Meeting=20200212T14=1440[4]
 How to use Mumble: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mumble
-Mikel

___
Diversity-talk mailing list
Code of Conduct: 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Diversity/MailingList/CodeOfConduct
Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org

___
Diversity-talk mailing list
Code of Conduct: 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Diversity/MailingList/CodeOfConduct
Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org
  ___
Diversity-talk mailing list
Code of Conduct: 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Diversity/MailingList/CodeOfConduct
Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org

Re: [Diversity-talk] First Meeting of Diversity and Inclusion Special Committee

[Heather Leson]

Hi how did you choose this time? I really want to attend as someone who had
been engaged in this topic.

Reason for response: i am in a work event during this time.


Thanks in advance and am glad to see actions

Heather

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020, 19:42 Mikel Maron,  wrote:

> Last month, the OSMF adopted this Diversity Statement [1] and appointed a
> committee [2] to compile research and undertake new research on our
> diversity, identify root causes that contribute to any shortfalls, and make
> recommendations to help resolve issues and improve.
>
> If you're interested to take part, join an upcoming initial meeting of the
> committee. We're holding a first meeting on Wednesday February 12 at 1400
> UTC [3] on Mumble [4] (in the public OSMF Board of Directors room). Please
> join if you'd like to contribute. If you're unavailable at that time, let
> us know other times that might work, and we can schedule another kickoff
> meeting in addition.
>
> [1] https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Diversity_Statement
> [2] https://hackmd.io/ZG8x44H4Skq0CPkcrMTB6A?view
> [3] Timezone converter:
> https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=DISC+Meeting=20200212T14=1440
> [4] How to use Mumble: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mumble
>
> -Mikel
>
>
> ___
> Diversity-talk mailing list
> Code of Conduct:
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Diversity/MailingList/CodeOfConduct
> Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org
>
___
Diversity-talk mailing list
Code of Conduct: 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Diversity/MailingList/CodeOfConduct
Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org

Re: [Talk-it] Accesso paese a pagamento

[Andreas Lattmann]

Quello che è certa è la data, per il resto si susseguono voci e basta.
Vorrei evitare che chi passa in bicicletta o a piedi e si ferma alla fontanella 
gli bussino sulla spalla per chiedere l'obolo. 
Vedremo se riesco a recuperare l'ordinanza...
Grazie a tutti.

Il 6 febbraio 2020 21:25:27 CET, Ivo Reano  ha scritto:
>Per rispondere alla domanda iniziale.
>Il fee=yes sarà su un'area definita dal comune con sua delibera. O
>sul/sui
>punti dove si paga se la delibera fosse meno deprimente...
>
>OT: Aspetto di leggere la delibera per organizzare un raid pedonale.
>
>Il giorno gio 6 feb 2020 alle ore 21:18 Ivo Reano 
>ha
>scritto:
>
>> Cercando di rimanere nello spirito OSM.
>>
>> Da quello che è stato riportato non si sa assolutamente quale sia la
>> delimitazione del divieto.
>> Su Openstreetmap dobbiamo segnalare quello che esiste (o che almeno
>> legalmente, esiste).
>> Per poter mappare il divieto ci dovremo andare di persona, leggere le
>> informazioni scritte su cartelli informativi, registrare le
>informazioni
>> fornite dai rapresentanti dell'ordinanza, avere in mano l'ordinanza
>> comunale...
>> Allora si potrebbe prendere in considerazione di chiede su OSM quali
>> cavolo di tag usare.
>> Non prima.
>> Bhe. Almeno non prima di mettere un divieto di transito su un intero
>> comune.
>>
>> Non è un intero comune?
>>
>> Allora di cosa discutiamo?
>> Se un'area richiede il pagamento per l'accesso si usa:
>> fell=yes
>> A guardare la mappa. dovranno solo mettere due transenne sulla strada
>di
>> accesso ed "indirizzare" le auto al gabelliere.
>> Ma riguarda l'acceso auto/bus/mobilistico o anche chi vi arriva a
>piedi?
>> Voglio dire... Per capire che tag usare bisogna sapere cosa è vietato
>>
>>
>>
>> Il giorno gio 6 feb 2020 alle ore 21:05 Ivo Reano
> ha
>> scritto:
>>
>>> Non so la discussione sia in topic o meno...
>>> Ma non credo si possa (legalmente) chiedere il pagamento per passare
>su
>>> un sentiero.
>>> Poi, se nel centro del paese per accedere alla trattoria devo
>pagare,
>>> torno indietro...
>>> E vi garantisco che per difendere la mia libertà, posso fare anche i
>200
>>> km per tornare, a piedi, a casa mia.
>>>
>>>
>>> Il giorno gio 6 feb 2020 alle ore 20:13 Andreas Lattmann <
>>> andrea.lattm...@ga-2.it> ha scritto:
>>>
 Non è tanto "per l'entusiasmo di trovare un nuovo tag", ma trovare
>il
 tag ideale.

 >controllare se tutti i sentieri hanno i gabellieri, con le carte
>in
 >regola...

 
 Le voci sono tante, si parla anche di transennare gli accessi al
>paese
 ed avere un unica biglietteria nella piazzetta. (Una gran
>confusione)

 Il borgo è Corenno Plinio (LC)

 https://osm.org/go/0CnC_O9B--?m=



>https://giornaledilecco.it/attualita/corenno-plinio-a-pagamento-lanciata-la-petizione-per-dire-no/

 >Lo posso sapere in modo da poterlo, se possibile, visitare e
>valutare,

 Mi raccomando prima del 22 Marzo,  se nò ti tocca l'obolo di 5€ 


 --
 樂

 ___
 Talk-it mailing list
 Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
 https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

>>>

--
樂

___
Talk-it mailing list
Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

Re: [OSM-talk] it's not a fake, but "it's complicated

[Aaron Young]

h the local community, if there is any, 
> what special agreements rule in the local community.  for Panamá, I 
> would like to have such activities listed in a dedicated page in the 
> *wiki*.  if you could describe them in Spanish, it would be much better, 
> but if you're putting an English language page in the wiki, I'm sure 
> there are enough non-Kaart people who would help translate that.
> 
> in fact, editing the local activities page in the wiki would be 
> sufficient to *alert the local community*, or at least anyone watching 
> that page.
> 
> On 05/02/2020 23:50, Aaron Young wrote:
>> maintain the data to make sure it is as good as it can be, which is what 
>> initiated this conversation
> 
> good news Kaart collecting experience and building on it.  may I suggest 
> you also help local communities make their rules more explicit.  to make 
> a concrete example, again for Panamá, did not agree on (did not discuss) 
> *how to categorize highways*, nor do we know where to collect 'ref' values.
> 
> we also hardly have any factual information about rural bus routes.  why 
> is this relevant?  a road on which you have a regular service, however 
> crummy, can hardly qualify as "unclassified", but would be promoted to 
> "tertiary" at the least.  could serve as reference.  also, knowing what 
> kind of car runs the service would help with the "smoothness" tag.  
> collecting this information needs to happen locally, and I don't manage 
> to picture the difficulties and the costs associated to doing this.
> 
> [[as a complete *side thread*, a concrete example: I recently tracked a 
> "chiva" only doing a short round trip from Santa Fé, travelling through 
> El Pantano, which cost me $4.  I uploaded the trace as private, that was 
> a mistake. https://www.openstreetmap.org/trace/3198854/data, one of the 
> GPS lost power on the way back, I should upload the data from the other 
> device.  with some extra cheap GPS devices (I own 5, not all equally 
> good), and some official-looking piece of paper from an organization, 
> one could spend half a day distributing phones running OSMTracker to bus 
> drivers and collecting them when they're back.  and moving to the next 
> "piquera" for a different round. rural routes here may come back after 
> more than 5 hours, and I know of routes where a one-way ticket costs $8.  ]]
> 
> I am considering how to describe the above, but did not yet create the 
> relevant wiki page/paragraph.  since Kaart is helping reclassify roads 
> (in Panamá), it would be nice if we had some agreements on how to do 
> that.  and given we did not have it yet, in Panamá, it would be nice if 
> you publicly offered your thoughts for discussion, so we can reach an 
> agreement we can describe and follow.
> 
> for *old edits*, I would consider very helpful if someone within Kaart 
> would receive notifications on changesets produced under the Kaart 
> flag.  see BlueSombra, and all other Kaart abandoned accounts, with all 
> the comments still waiting for a reply.
> 
> a point which I'm afraid has been missed: the reply I received by Vigo 
> gave me the impression "past is past, and we don't look back (but you 
> may tide up our mess)".  I understand that you're not focusing on 
> mapping businesses any more, and I realize it's too much work for 
> anybody, to look up the mess and clean it up, but there must be other 
> ways to *profile yourself as responsible for the data you added*, even 
> if it was while you were early in your learning process.
> 
> ciao,
> 
> Mario
> 
> -- next part --
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: 
> <http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20200206/adeec835/attachment-0001.htm>
> 
> --
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2020 14:59:31 +0100
> From: Imre Samu 
> To: Martin Koppenhoefer 
> Cc: osm 
> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Crimea situation - on the ground
> Message-ID:
>   
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
>> but also reaffirms that it supports the on-the-ground-rule
> 
> I suggest to extend our manifesto [1] with the word "emphatic"
> ( adding after the list:  Truthful, Legal, Verifiable, Relevant,
> +Emphatic )
> 
> With adding the "empathy"  to the "on the ground rule"  ->  it is adding
> the extra layer of the meaning.
> 
> Without "empathy" - we can map* "nesting locations of vulnerable species"*
> - because of the cold logic of the "*on the ground rule"*
> With "empathy" we can fix the side effects of cold logic, and we can make

Re: [OSM-talk] Old maps from Royal Collection UK

[Colin Smale]

On 2020-02-06 21:10, Andy Mabbett wrote:

> The UK's Royal Collection [1 [1]] have placed online [2 [2]] George III's
> collection of military maps which, they say:
> 
> comprises some 3,000 maps, views and prints
> ranging from the disposition of Charles V's armies
> at Vienna in 1532 to the Battle of Waterloo (1815).
> 
> I'm sure these will be of interest to many OSM mappers.
> 
> Remarkably, though, they are claiming copyright over these maps.

As I read it, they are claiming copyright in the images on the website,
which is probably fair enough. I cannot see where they claim copyright
in the maps themselves. But they do have ownership on their side; can
they be forced to make the original maps available for someone else to
photograph/scan? 
  

Links:
--
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Collection
[2] https://militarymaps.rct.uk/___
talk mailing list
talk@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [Talk-it] Accesso paese a pagamento

[Ivo Reano]

Per rispondere alla domanda iniziale.
Il fee=yes sarà su un'area definita dal comune con sua delibera. O sul/sui
punti dove si paga se la delibera fosse meno deprimente...

OT: Aspetto di leggere la delibera per organizzare un raid pedonale.

Il giorno gio 6 feb 2020 alle ore 21:18 Ivo Reano  ha
scritto:

> Cercando di rimanere nello spirito OSM.
>
> Da quello che è stato riportato non si sa assolutamente quale sia la
> delimitazione del divieto.
> Su Openstreetmap dobbiamo segnalare quello che esiste (o che almeno
> legalmente, esiste).
> Per poter mappare il divieto ci dovremo andare di persona, leggere le
> informazioni scritte su cartelli informativi, registrare le informazioni
> fornite dai rapresentanti dell'ordinanza, avere in mano l'ordinanza
> comunale...
> Allora si potrebbe prendere in considerazione di chiede su OSM quali
> cavolo di tag usare.
> Non prima.
> Bhe. Almeno non prima di mettere un divieto di transito su un intero
> comune.
>
> Non è un intero comune?
>
> Allora di cosa discutiamo?
> Se un'area richiede il pagamento per l'accesso si usa:
> fell=yes
> A guardare la mappa. dovranno solo mettere due transenne sulla strada di
> accesso ed "indirizzare" le auto al gabelliere.
> Ma riguarda l'acceso auto/bus/mobilistico o anche chi vi arriva a piedi?
> Voglio dire... Per capire che tag usare bisogna sapere cosa è vietato
>
>
>
> Il giorno gio 6 feb 2020 alle ore 21:05 Ivo Reano  ha
> scritto:
>
>> Non so la discussione sia in topic o meno...
>> Ma non credo si possa (legalmente) chiedere il pagamento per passare su
>> un sentiero.
>> Poi, se nel centro del paese per accedere alla trattoria devo pagare,
>> torno indietro...
>> E vi garantisco che per difendere la mia libertà, posso fare anche i 200
>> km per tornare, a piedi, a casa mia.
>>
>>
>> Il giorno gio 6 feb 2020 alle ore 20:13 Andreas Lattmann <
>> andrea.lattm...@ga-2.it> ha scritto:
>>
>>> Non è tanto "per l'entusiasmo di trovare un nuovo tag", ma trovare il
>>> tag ideale.
>>>
>>> >controllare se tutti i sentieri hanno i gabellieri, con le carte in
>>> >regola...
>>>
>>> 
>>> Le voci sono tante, si parla anche di transennare gli accessi al paese
>>> ed avere un unica biglietteria nella piazzetta. (Una gran confusione)
>>>
>>> Il borgo è Corenno Plinio (LC)
>>>
>>> https://osm.org/go/0CnC_O9B--?m=
>>>
>>>
>>> https://giornaledilecco.it/attualita/corenno-plinio-a-pagamento-lanciata-la-petizione-per-dire-no/
>>>
>>> >Lo posso sapere in modo da poterlo, se possibile, visitare e valutare,
>>>
>>> Mi raccomando prima del 22 Marzo,  se nò ti tocca l'obolo di 5€ 
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> 樂
>>>
>>> ___
>>> Talk-it mailing list
>>> Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
>>>
>>
___
Talk-it mailing list
Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

Re: [Talk-it] Accesso paese a pagamento

[Ivo Reano]

Cercando di rimanere nello spirito OSM.

Da quello che è stato riportato non si sa assolutamente quale sia la
delimitazione del divieto.
Su Openstreetmap dobbiamo segnalare quello che esiste (o che almeno
legalmente, esiste).
Per poter mappare il divieto ci dovremo andare di persona, leggere le
informazioni scritte su cartelli informativi, registrare le informazioni
fornite dai rapresentanti dell'ordinanza, avere in mano l'ordinanza
comunale...
Allora si potrebbe prendere in considerazione di chiede su OSM quali cavolo
di tag usare.
Non prima.
Bhe. Almeno non prima di mettere un divieto di transito su un intero comune.

Non è un intero comune?

Allora di cosa discutiamo?
Se un'area richiede il pagamento per l'accesso si usa:
fell=yes
A guardare la mappa. dovranno solo mettere due transenne sulla strada di
accesso ed "indirizzare" le auto al gabelliere.
Ma riguarda l'acceso auto/bus/mobilistico o anche chi vi arriva a piedi?
Voglio dire... Per capire che tag usare bisogna sapere cosa è vietato



Il giorno gio 6 feb 2020 alle ore 21:05 Ivo Reano  ha
scritto:

> Non so la discussione sia in topic o meno...
> Ma non credo si possa (legalmente) chiedere il pagamento per passare su un
> sentiero.
> Poi, se nel centro del paese per accedere alla trattoria devo pagare,
> torno indietro...
> E vi garantisco che per difendere la mia libertà, posso fare anche i 200
> km per tornare, a piedi, a casa mia.
>
>
> Il giorno gio 6 feb 2020 alle ore 20:13 Andreas Lattmann <
> andrea.lattm...@ga-2.it> ha scritto:
>
>> Non è tanto "per l'entusiasmo di trovare un nuovo tag", ma trovare il tag
>> ideale.
>>
>> >controllare se tutti i sentieri hanno i gabellieri, con le carte in
>> >regola...
>>
>> 
>> Le voci sono tante, si parla anche di transennare gli accessi al paese ed
>> avere un unica biglietteria nella piazzetta. (Una gran confusione)
>>
>> Il borgo è Corenno Plinio (LC)
>>
>> https://osm.org/go/0CnC_O9B--?m=
>>
>>
>> https://giornaledilecco.it/attualita/corenno-plinio-a-pagamento-lanciata-la-petizione-per-dire-no/
>>
>> >Lo posso sapere in modo da poterlo, se possibile, visitare e valutare,
>>
>> Mi raccomando prima del 22 Marzo,  se nò ti tocca l'obolo di 5€ 
>>
>>
>> --
>> 樂
>>
>> ___
>> Talk-it mailing list
>> Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
>>
>
___
Talk-it mailing list
Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

[OSM-talk] Old maps from Royal Collection UK

[Andy Mabbett]

The UK's Royal Collection [1] have placed online [2] George III's
collection of military maps which, they say:

   comprises some 3,000 maps, views and prints
   ranging from the disposition of Charles V's armies
   at Vienna in 1532 to the Battle of Waterloo (1815).

I'm sure these will be of interest to many OSM mappers.

Remarkably, though, they are claiming copyright over these maps.


[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Collection

[2] https://militarymaps.rct.uk/

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

___
talk mailing list
talk@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [Talk-it] Accesso paese a pagamento

[Ivo Reano]

Non so la discussione sia in topic o meno...
Ma non credo si possa (legalmente) chiedere il pagamento per passare su un
sentiero.
Poi, se nel centro del paese per accedere alla trattoria devo pagare, torno
indietro...
E vi garantisco che per difendere la mia libertà, posso fare anche i 200 km
per tornare, a piedi, a casa mia.


Il giorno gio 6 feb 2020 alle ore 20:13 Andreas Lattmann <
andrea.lattm...@ga-2.it> ha scritto:

> Non è tanto "per l'entusiasmo di trovare un nuovo tag", ma trovare il tag
> ideale.
>
> >controllare se tutti i sentieri hanno i gabellieri, con le carte in
> >regola...
>
> 
> Le voci sono tante, si parla anche di transennare gli accessi al paese ed
> avere un unica biglietteria nella piazzetta. (Una gran confusione)
>
> Il borgo è Corenno Plinio (LC)
>
> https://osm.org/go/0CnC_O9B--?m=
>
>
> https://giornaledilecco.it/attualita/corenno-plinio-a-pagamento-lanciata-la-petizione-per-dire-no/
>
> >Lo posso sapere in modo da poterlo, se possibile, visitare e valutare,
>
> Mi raccomando prima del 22 Marzo,  se nò ti tocca l'obolo di 5€ 
>
>
> --
> 樂
>
> ___
> Talk-it mailing list
> Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
>
___
Talk-it mailing list
Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

Re: [Talk-it] Accesso paese a pagamento

[Andreas Lattmann]

Non è tanto "per l'entusiasmo di trovare un nuovo tag", ma trovare il tag 
ideale. 

>controllare se tutti i sentieri hanno i gabellieri, con le carte in
>regola...

 
Le voci sono tante, si parla anche di transennare gli accessi al paese ed avere 
un unica biglietteria nella piazzetta. (Una gran confusione)

Il borgo è Corenno Plinio (LC)

https://osm.org/go/0CnC_O9B--?m=

https://giornaledilecco.it/attualita/corenno-plinio-a-pagamento-lanciata-la-petizione-per-dire-no/

>Lo posso sapere in modo da poterlo, se possibile, visitare e valutare,

Mi raccomando prima del 22 Marzo,  se nò ti tocca l'obolo di 5€ 


--
樂

___
Talk-it mailing list
Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

Re: [Talk-it] Province italiane - coordinazione

[Damjan Gerl]

Martin Koppenhoefer je 6.2.2020 ob 13:09 napisal:
Visto che qui non ci sono più stati commenti, ho aggiunto 
suppressed:admin_level=6, già presente alla Provincia di Trieste, 
anche alle ex-Province di Gorizia e Udine.


Ciao
Martin


Grazie Martin. Ho messo lo stesso tag anche alla Provincia di Portenone 
ed ho uniformato un po' i tag di tutte e 4 le ex provincie FVG.


Damjan

___
Talk-it mailing list
Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

[Diversity-talk] First Meeting of Diversity and Inclusion Special Committee

[Mikel Maron]

 Last month, the OSMF adopted this Diversity Statement [1] and appointed a 
committee [2] to compile research and undertake new research on our diversity, 
identify root causes that contribute to any shortfalls, and make 
recommendations to help resolve issues and improve. 
If you're interested to take part, join an upcoming initial meeting of the 
committee. We're holding a first meeting on Wednesday February 12 at 1400 UTC 
[3] on Mumble [4] (in the public OSMF Board of Directors room). Please join if 
you'd like to contribute. If you're unavailable at that time, let us know other 
times that might work, and we can schedule another kickoff meeting in addition.
[1] https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Diversity_Statement[2] 
https://hackmd.io/ZG8x44H4Skq0CPkcrMTB6A?view[3] Timezone converter: 
https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=DISC+Meeting=20200212T14=1440[4]
 How to use Mumble: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mumble
-Mikel

___
Diversity-talk mailing list
Code of Conduct: 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Diversity/MailingList/CodeOfConduct
Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org

Re: [Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Rob Nickerson]

>do we cover British Overseas Territories such as Gibraltar and the
Falkland Islands?

Not as OSM UK CIC. We ended up settling on the British Islands:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Islands

Thank you,
*Rob*
___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

Re: [Talk-it] Accesso paese a pagamento

[Ivo Reano]

Capisco l'entusiasmo per una nuova fonte di tag.
Ma. Mi è sfuggito il nome di questo comune.
Lo posso sapere in modo da poterlo, se possibile, visitare e valutare,
controllare se tutti i sentieri hanno i gabellieri, con le carte in
regola...

*Jrachi firmò*
___
Talk-it mailing list
Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] [OT] Interrogation base FINESS

[deuzeffe]

Le 06/02/2020 à 00:15, deuzeffe a écrit :

'soir,

J’essaie d'interroger la base FINESS 
(http://finess.sante.gouv.fr/fininter/jsp/index.jsp ) et y récupérer des 
ref. kivonbien mais la console (FF, Debian ou windows, ou Chromium) me 
renvoie une avalanche d'erreurs "js" C'est moi ou bien ?


Merci pour vos tests !


Merci à tous ceux, ici ou en privé, qui m'ont répondu "cmçm" (en substance).

C'est plus bizarre que je le pensais.

Test avec une machine :
- sur réseau IP/Rénater -> cmçm ;
- sur réseau IP/free : a pas marche.

Désolée pour le bruit.
--
deuzeffe, qui a le chic pour tomber sur des bugs ALC (pléonasme)

___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Proposition de mise à jour : la population des communes

[deuzeffe]

Le 06/02/2020 à 15:04, Vincent de Château-Thierry a écrit :


Il semble que quelqu'un conteste tes mises à jour ou plutôt ne
les as pas comprises. C'est sur :

https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=68546


Merci Alain pour le pointeur. Comme dit par Marc on a reçu en
parallèle un message de Clinton par un autre canal. Toutes nos
réponses convergent donc il devrait pouvoir synthétiser. Je vois qu'à
l'instant il a remercié Marc ici.

Il y a même un breton qui a répondu sur le forum.
--
deuzeffe - je n'ai pas le nom

___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

Re: [Talk-it] Accesso paese a pagamento

[Andreas Lattmann]

Scusate, non so come, ma non ho ricevuto le risposte tramite mail ma le ho 
viste su Nabble.
Il problema è un po' più articolato: il sindaco ha deciso che per accedere al 
paese bisogna pagare il biglietto perché considerato "paese turistico". Il 
"pedaggio" non interesserà solo le strade, ma anche sentieri, via lago... La 
decisione del sindaco ha creato molte polemiche ed ha sollevato un polverone. 
Adesso non si sa se verrà interessato anche un importante sentiero medievale 
che passa nel territorio del paese (nel medioevo si pagava il dazio per passare 
nel territorio comunale, da cui probabilmente il sindaco ha preso ispirazione). 
Quindi per far capire a chi si avvicina al paese con la barca, non potrà 
attraccare se non paga il biglietto ho creato un area, perché ci sono anche 
sentieri che arrivano in paese e li appostati si presume che ci saranno i 
bigliettai.
Spero di essermi spiegato bene...

--
樂

___
Talk-it mailing list
Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

Re: [Talk-GB] Still too many universities in Cambridge

[Phillip Barnett]

And here is the email from the guy who did the original mapping, the last time 
this came up, including his reasoning for the amenity Tag rather than building 
tag https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2015-May/017457.html

Sent from my iPhone

> On 6 Feb 2020, at 15:49, Brian Prangle  wrote:
> 
> 
> "OSM is not beholden to data consumers. 
> They take the data 'as is'. That includes any amendments
> 
> My planned amendment can always be reversed if there is a valid reason.  
> Upsetting CU isn't one"
> 
>  Not a great way to build a community when the data user in question put in a 
> lot of resource in order to create the OSM data in the firstplace
> 
> 
>> On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 14:35, Dave F via Talk-GB  
>> wrote:
>> Hi Jerry
>> 
>> On 06/02/2020 10:19, SK53 wrote:
>> > Funnily enough this long-standing issue came up at our pub meeting last
>> > month. Although my reaction has always been to let sleeping dogs lie, this
>> > was clearly not the consensus.
>> 
>> It's detrimental to the quality of the OSM database. it requires sorting 
>> out.
>> 
>> > I've sent a message to University of Cambridge Information Services who run
>> > the map.cam.ac.uk site which consumes the OSM data
>> 
>> Is this their sole use? There was a hint in a university blog there were 
>> other sites
>> 
>> > , to warn them that a
>> > change is impending. It's probably worth holding off for a week or so to
>> > allow them to assess any impact on their map.
>> 
>> I was going to give it a week from my post to allow other OSM 
>> contributors to have their say. I don't want this to fizzle out as has 
>> happened on previous occasions. OSM is not beholden to data consumers. 
>> They take the data 'as is'. That includes any amendments.
>> 
>> My planned amendment can always be reversed if there is a valid reason.  
>> Upsetting CU isn't one.
>> 
>> >   Incidentally, knowing a
>> > specific contact point would help as university IT departments can be big
>> > beasts these days. It does show that having a good contact point is always
>> > a good idea for directed edits when data is in use.
>> 
>> It depends how the institution is set up, but I've found bursar/estates 
>> departments are the more interested in the map's appearance. IT 
>> departments focus more on 0 & 1s.
>> 
>> > As others have said there is a lot of inconsistency: particular with former
>> > houses taken into University or College ownership which sometimes get
>> > building=house/semi and other times building=university. There are other
>> > college buildings of this type which are not hit by amenity=university at
>> > all.
>> 
>> These are to assess what would bel eft after I make my planned amendment.
>> Note these are not all CU (ie Anglia Ruskin)
>> 
>> Buildings=yes, without amenity but have 'university' in the operator tag:
>> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/QsU
>> 
>> Buildings that aren't '=yes', without amenity but have 'university' in 
>> the operator tag:
>> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/QsT
>> 
>> Non building, amenity=university, Has 'University of Cambridge' in the 
>> operator tag
>> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/Qt3
>> 
>> Non building, amenity=university, operator is not 'University of Cambridge'
>> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/Qt1
>> 
>> Non building, amenity=university, No operator tag
>> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/Qt4
>> 
>> > Other general points I noticed relating to  inconsistency/issues (largely
>> > arising because Cambridge got mapped earlier than many places or it just
>> > has a lot of things which are otherwise rare):
>> >
>> > - Theological Colleges are loosely associated with the university, and
>> > are equally loosely amenity=university in their own right. I don't 
>> > know if
>> > we have a regular way of tagging non-degree awarding religious training
>> > centres. These are something of an Oxbridge speciality. I see the 
>> > London
>> > Institute of Theology is tagged
>> >  as a college. Years ago I
>> > mapped Coleg Trefecca as a conference centre, but used old_ tags to
>> > indicate it's historical role as a college training people for the
>> > ministry. Fortunately some of the odder places
>> >  of former
>> > times have similarly changed their roles.
>> > - Sports facilities (especially isolated playing fields and boathouses)
>> > are just tagged with a ref and operator. Pavilions are often tagged
>> > building=university, as is the sports centre.
>> > - Cambridge colleges are independent corporations in their own right, 
>> > so
>> > probably should have separate amenity=university relations (although 
>> > the
>> > world is unlikely to end if not).
>> 
>> They maybe financially independent, but still stand under the umbrella 
>> of CU. Why can't they have separate college or faculty relations?
>> 
>> >   They mostly form discrete campuses.
>> > 

Re: [Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Jez Nicholson]

Indeed.

I will be plundering the excellent repository from Derry Hamilton for the
Docker setup soon (unless someone beats me to it).

I'd like to make the dataset all of the areas covered by OSMUK...do we
cover British Overseas Territories such as Gibraltar and the Falkland
Islands?

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020, 15:32 Brian Prangle,  wrote:

> Looks like you've got yourself a show and tell session at the OSMUK AGM
> Jez!
>
> On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 12:31, Jez Nicholson 
> wrote:
>
>> I come from a database background, and when a question isn't easily
>> answered with Taginfo or Overpass Turbo I jump to my trusty local postgres
>> database of UK data. I have a script that downloads the British Isles from
>> Geofabrik, loads it with osm2pgsql, adds some useful indexes, and then
>> removes Eire. Thereafter I can run SQL queries across the whole database to
>> get 'UK-wide' results.
>>
>> I think that this would be useful for people on hackdays and the like and
>> would be a good service for OSMUK to provide, so have just added a new
>> github repository https://github.com/osm-uk/osmuk2pgsql
>>
>> Friendly-worded Issues are welcome, as are code contributions. I'd like
>> to put it on a Docker environment so that it works quickly-and-easily on
>> Windows, Linux, Mac, whatever.
>>
>> Comments? Thoughts?
>>
>> Regards,
>>  Jez
>> ___
>> Talk-GB mailing list
>> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>>
>
___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

Re: [Talk-is] Hvernig á að merkja bílastæði við götu í OSM?

[Páll Hilmarsson]

Heil og sæl.

 

Ég ætla ekki, a.m.k. á þessu stigi, að viðra skoðanir á því hvernig bílastæði 
eru merkt, en vil hinsvegar benda á kortaþjón Reykjavíkurborgar þar sem 
bílastæði í borgarlandinu eru merkt:

http://reykjavik.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=607425377d0c48dba195a1f58fa4426f

 

Bestu kveðjur,

 

Páll Hilmarsson

 

From: Arni Davidsson  
Sent: fimmtudagur, 6. febrúar 2020 13:42
To: OpenStreetMap in Iceland 
Subject: [Talk-is] Hvernig á að merkja bílastæði við götu í OSM?

 

Sæl

 

Ég er að velta fyrir mér merkingum á bílastæðum í OSM.

Bílastæði við götu sem eru með gjaldskyldu hafa verið merkt að því er virðist 
með 'Tag:amenity=parking' og teiknaður flötur sem sýnir afmörkun bílastæðisins. 
Samsvarandi bílastæði án gjaldskyldu virðast þó sjaldan eða aldrei merkt.

 

Er rétt að merkja bílastæði samsíða götu með þessum hætti? Eru þau kannski 
merkt svona til að getað sett inn upplýsingar um gjaldskyldu, fjölda stæða 
o.s.frv.

 

Er réttara að merkja þau á einhver hátt sem hluta götunnar og er hægt að merkja 
þau þannig?

 

Þess má geta að ég hef sérstakan áhuga á fjölda bílastæðanna og að geta dregið 
út þær upplýsingar sem eru settar inn um bílastæði úr OSM og unnið með þær 
síðar og tekið saman yfirlit yfir fjölda og gerð stæða.

 

kveðja

Árni Davíðsson


 

-- 

Árni Davíðsson
arni...@gmail.com  

___
Talk-is mailing list
Talk-is@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-is

Re: [Talk-GB] Still too many universities in Cambridge

[Brian Prangle]

"OSM is not beholden to data consumers.
They take the data 'as is'. That includes any amendments

My planned amendment can always be reversed if there is a valid reason.
Upsetting CU isn't one"

 Not a great way to build a community when the data user in question put in
a lot of resource in order to create the OSM data in the firstplac
e


On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 14:35, Dave F via Talk-GB 
wrote:

> Hi Jerry
>
> On 06/02/2020 10:19, SK53 wrote:
> > Funnily enough this long-standing issue came up at our pub meeting last
> > month. Although my reaction has always been to let sleeping dogs lie,
> this
> > was clearly not the consensus.
>
> It's detrimental to the quality of the OSM database. it requires sorting
> out.
>
> > I've sent a message to University of Cambridge Information Services who
> run
> > the map.cam.ac.uk site which consumes the OSM data
>
> Is this their sole use? There was a hint in a university blog there were
> other sites
>
> > , to warn them that a
> > change is impending. It's probably worth holding off for a week or so to
> > allow them to assess any impact on their map.
>
> I was going to give it a week from my post to allow other OSM
> contributors to have their say. I don't want this to fizzle out as has
> happened on previous occasions. OSM is not beholden to data consumers.
> They take the data 'as is'. That includes any amendments.
>
> My planned amendment can always be reversed if there is a valid reason.
> Upsetting CU isn't one.
>
> >   Incidentally, knowing a
> > specific contact point would help as university IT departments can be big
> > beasts these days. It does show that having a good contact point is
> always
> > a good idea for directed edits when data is in use.
>
> It depends how the institution is set up, but I've found bursar/estates
> departments are the more interested in the map's appearance. IT
> departments focus more on 0 & 1s.
>
> > As others have said there is a lot of inconsistency: particular with
> former
> > houses taken into University or College ownership which sometimes get
> > building=house/semi and other times building=university. There are other
> > college buildings of this type which are not hit by amenity=university at
> > all.
>
> These are to assess what would bel eft after I make my planned amendment.
> Note these are not all CU (ie Anglia Ruskin)
>
> Buildings=yes, without amenity but have 'university' in the operator tag:
> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/QsU
>
> Buildings that aren't '=yes', without amenity but have 'university' in
> the operator tag:
> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/QsT
>
> Non building, amenity=university, Has 'University of Cambridge' in the
> operator tag
> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/Qt3
>
> Non building, amenity=university, operator is not 'University of Cambridge'
> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/Qt1
>
> Non building, amenity=university, No operator tag
> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/Qt4
>
> > Other general points I noticed relating to  inconsistency/issues (largely
> > arising because Cambridge got mapped earlier than many places or it just
> > has a lot of things which are otherwise rare):
> >
> > - Theological Colleges are loosely associated with the university,
> and
> > are equally loosely amenity=university in their own right. I don't
> know if
> > we have a regular way of tagging non-degree awarding religious
> training
> > centres. These are something of an Oxbridge speciality. I see the
> London
> > Institute of Theology is tagged
> >  as a college. Years
> ago I
> > mapped Coleg Trefecca as a conference centre, but used old_ tags to
> > indicate it's historical role as a college training people for the
> > ministry. Fortunately some of the odder places
> >  of former
> > times have similarly changed their roles.
> > - Sports facilities (especially isolated playing fields and
> boathouses)
> > are just tagged with a ref and operator. Pavilions are often tagged
> > building=university, as is the sports centre.
> > - Cambridge colleges are independent corporations in their own
> right, so
> > probably should have separate amenity=university relations (although
> the
> > world is unlikely to end if not).
>
> They maybe financially independent, but still stand under the umbrella
> of CU. Why can't they have separate college or faculty relations?
>
> >   They mostly form discrete campuses.
> > Isolated parts are named separately so just replacing these with a
> relation
> > doesn't work. North Court, Emma is one such example. There are
> similarly
> > very well known parts of the university with their own widely used
> names:
> > Downing Site, New Museums, West Cambridge etc. This is true of most
> > universities now that many are 

Re: [Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Brian Prangle]

Looks like you've got yourself a show and tell session at the OSMUK AGM
Jez!

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 12:31, Jez Nicholson  wrote:

> I come from a database background, and when a question isn't easily
> answered with Taginfo or Overpass Turbo I jump to my trusty local postgres
> database of UK data. I have a script that downloads the British Isles from
> Geofabrik, loads it with osm2pgsql, adds some useful indexes, and then
> removes Eire. Thereafter I can run SQL queries across the whole database to
> get 'UK-wide' results.
>
> I think that this would be useful for people on hackdays and the like and
> would be a good service for OSMUK to provide, so have just added a new
> github repository https://github.com/osm-uk/osmuk2pgsql
>
> Friendly-worded Issues are welcome, as are code contributions. I'd like to
> put it on a Docker environment so that it works quickly-and-easily on
> Windows, Linux, Mac, whatever.
>
> Comments? Thoughts?
>
> Regards,
>  Jez
> ___
> Talk-GB mailing list
> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>
___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

Re: [Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Adam Hoyle]

Hey Jez,

Awesome! I’ve used Docker a few times, so am fairly confident in it, so happy 
to help unless someone else gets there first.

Best,

Adam
On 6 Feb 2020, 12:31 +, Jez Nicholson , wrote:
> I come from a database background, and when a question isn't easily answered 
> with Taginfo or Overpass Turbo I jump to my trusty local postgres database of 
> UK data. I have a script that downloads the British Isles from Geofabrik, 
> loads it with osm2pgsql, adds some useful indexes, and then removes Eire. 
> Thereafter I can run SQL queries across the whole database to get 'UK-wide' 
> results.
>
> I think that this would be useful for people on hackdays and the like and 
> would be a good service for OSMUK to provide, so have just added a new github 
> repository https://github.com/osm-uk/osmuk2pgsql
>
> Friendly-worded Issues are welcome, as are code contributions. I'd like to 
> put it on a Docker environment so that it works quickly-and-easily on 
> Windows, Linux, Mac, whatever.
>
> Comments? Thoughts?
>
> Regards,
>              Jez
> ___
> Talk-GB mailing list
> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

[Talk-TW] 恩瑋機場？

[u30 om1]

松山機場旁 https://i.imgur.com/8URhKyh.png
___
Talk-TW mailing list
Talk-TW@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-tw

[OSM-talk-fr] Termes de licence pour rendre une imagerie compatible avec la création de données dans OSM ?

[severin.menard via Talk-fr]

Bonjour à tou-te-s,

Vivant hors de France dans une ville où le cadastre n'est pas libre et où la 
mairie dispose d'une imagerie aérienne de 10 cm de résolution avec correction 
des dévers de bâtiments, je me dis que c'est quand même un peu dommage de ne 
pas pouvoir l'utiliser dans OSM. Cette imagerie est déjà accessible via WMS, 
mais sans statut légal clair qui autorise la création de données dérivées.
Il y a évidemment des exemples existants qui consistent à intégrer une mention 
spécifique pour la création de données OSM dans les conditions d'utilisation 
déjà existantes (exemple de Bing cf. 
https://blog.openstreetmap.org/2010/11/30/microsoft-imagery-details/)), ou de 
passer une convention comme celle de l'IGN français avec l'asso OSM France 
(http://www.openstreetmap.fr/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/2016.05.20_OSM-FR_IGN_Ortho.pdf).
Mais ces deux approches me semblent plus adaptées aux contextes respectifs 
d'une transnationale et d'une institution nationale qu'avec une simple 
collectivité locale qui ne dispose pas de conditions d'utilisation existantes, 
ni n'a habitude de passer des conventions avec des organisations 
internationales. Existerait-il des licences génériques qui seraient adaptées 
avec un flux WMS pour un usage de création de données dans OSM ?

Séverin___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

Re: [Talk-GB] Still too many universities in Cambridge

[Dave F via Talk-GB]

Hi Jerry

On 06/02/2020 10:19, SK53 wrote:

Funnily enough this long-standing issue came up at our pub meeting last
month. Although my reaction has always been to let sleeping dogs lie, this
was clearly not the consensus.


It's detrimental to the quality of the OSM database. it requires sorting 
out.



I've sent a message to University of Cambridge Information Services who run
the map.cam.ac.uk site which consumes the OSM data


Is this their sole use? There was a hint in a university blog there were 
other sites



, to warn them that a
change is impending. It's probably worth holding off for a week or so to
allow them to assess any impact on their map.


I was going to give it a week from my post to allow other OSM 
contributors to have their say. I don't want this to fizzle out as has 
happened on previous occasions. OSM is not beholden to data consumers. 
They take the data 'as is'. That includes any amendments.


My planned amendment can always be reversed if there is a valid reason.  
Upsetting CU isn't one.



  Incidentally, knowing a
specific contact point would help as university IT departments can be big
beasts these days. It does show that having a good contact point is always
a good idea for directed edits when data is in use.


It depends how the institution is set up, but I've found bursar/estates 
departments are the more interested in the map's appearance. IT 
departments focus more on 0 & 1s.



As others have said there is a lot of inconsistency: particular with former
houses taken into University or College ownership which sometimes get
building=house/semi and other times building=university. There are other
college buildings of this type which are not hit by amenity=university at
all.


These are to assess what would bel eft after I make my planned amendment.
Note these are not all CU (ie Anglia Ruskin)

Buildings=yes, without amenity but have 'university' in the operator tag:
https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/QsU

Buildings that aren't '=yes', without amenity but have 'university' in 
the operator tag:

https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/QsT

Non building, amenity=university, Has 'University of Cambridge' in the 
operator tag

https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/Qt3

Non building, amenity=university, operator is not 'University of Cambridge'
https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/Qt1

Non building, amenity=university, No operator tag
https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/Qt4


Other general points I noticed relating to  inconsistency/issues (largely
arising because Cambridge got mapped earlier than many places or it just
has a lot of things which are otherwise rare):

- Theological Colleges are loosely associated with the university, and
are equally loosely amenity=university in their own right. I don't know if
we have a regular way of tagging non-degree awarding religious training
centres. These are something of an Oxbridge speciality. I see the London
Institute of Theology is tagged
 as a college. Years ago I
mapped Coleg Trefecca as a conference centre, but used old_ tags to
indicate it's historical role as a college training people for the
ministry. Fortunately some of the odder places
 of former
times have similarly changed their roles.
- Sports facilities (especially isolated playing fields and boathouses)
are just tagged with a ref and operator. Pavilions are often tagged
building=university, as is the sports centre.
- Cambridge colleges are independent corporations in their own right, so
probably should have separate amenity=university relations (although the
world is unlikely to end if not).


They maybe financially independent, but still stand under the umbrella 
of CU. Why can't they have separate college or faculty relations?



  They mostly form discrete campuses.
Isolated parts are named separately so just replacing these with a relation
doesn't work. North Court, Emma is one such example. There are similarly
very well known parts of the university with their own widely used names:
Downing Site, New Museums, West Cambridge etc. This is true of most
universities now that many are multi-campus. I don't think we have a good
approach to these: roles in relations, campus_name … are all possibilities.
(This also applies to schools now that one academy can take over another).
- There's plenty of (non-public accessible) student accommodation which
is not mapped as such. I presume this is intentional. Examples the Trinity
staircase above the bike shop on Jesus Lane, most of Lower Park St (Jesus),
and Portugal Place,
-  Multiple buildings mapped as one
. There are probably
others, but this one I know. The larger part of the building is the
former Cambridgeshire
County Hall

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Proposition de mise à jour : la population des communes

[Vincent de Château-Thierry]

Bonjour,

> De: "marc marc" 
> 
> Le 06.02.20 à 14:22, Alain Rpnpif via Talk-fr a écrit :
> > Le 05/02/2020 à 07:20, Vincent de Château-Thierry a écrit :
> >> Bonjour,
> > 
> > 
> > Bonjour Vincent,
> > 
> > Il semble que quelqu'un conteste tes mises à jour ou plutôt ne les
> > as
> > pas comprises. C'est sur :
> > 
> > https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=68546

Merci Alain pour le pointeur. Comme dit par Marc on a reçu en parallèle un 
message de Clinton par un autre canal. Toutes nos réponses convergent donc il 
devrait pouvoir synthétiser. Je vois qu'à l'instant il a remercié Marc ici.
 
> la personne a écrit à talk-fr-owner en anglais.
> on lui a répondu et expliqué, en attente de savoir pq c'était un
> message
> privé (erreur ou volontaire)
> mais on pourra copier/coller la réponse sur le forum histoire que le
> prochain qui se pose la question retrouve l'info
> (vive les éditions de masse documentée... au moins les gens
> retrouvent
> l'info)

Clairement je n'y ai pas pensé, c'est une erreur. Je voyais l'aspect "mise à 
jour de l'information" mais pas son côté massif car justement je voulais que la 
tâche soit distribuée entre nous et dans le temps. Je ne voyais pas plus 
l'aspect des impacts d'un changement de modèle, même si on a en France de 
bonnes raisons de le faire (la population INSEE est celle de la commune en 
entier, donc sur la relation, et non pas uniquement celle d'une zone urbaine 
interne à la commune, donc sur un node).
Autant d'enseignements pour une prochaine fois.

vincent

___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

Re: [OSM-talk] Crimea situation - on the ground

[Imre Samu]

> but also reaffirms that it supports the on-the-ground-rule

I suggest to extend our manifesto [1] with the word "emphatic"
( adding after the list:  Truthful, Legal, Verifiable, Relevant,
+Emphatic )

With adding the "empathy"  to the "on the ground rule"  ->  it is adding
the extra layer of the meaning.

Without "empathy" - we can map* "nesting locations of vulnerable species"*
- because of the cold logic of the "*on the ground rule"*
With "empathy" we can fix the side effects of cold logic, and we can make
an "intelligent" decision  [2]

With "empathy"  - it is easy to solve the diversity problems.[4]
Without "empathy" - just with cold logic -  it is impossible.

With "empathy" - this sentence has a deeper meaning:
*"OpenStreetMap values community cohesion over data perfection." [1] *

and this is important for every organisation/community:

*"Empathy deserves its buzzy status, and leaders are wise to desire it for
their businesses. But to succeed in making it part of their organization’s
DNA, they must pay close attention to how cultures build and change —
organically, collectively, and often from the bottom up."  [3]*


And in the "Crimea situation"  the empathy add an extra complexity ..
What is the real meaning of the "Our community is based on mutual respect,
tolerance ..." [4]  in this case?


[1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/How_We_Map
[2] Eugenia Cheng: "The Art of Logic: How to Make Sense in a World that
Doesn't"
https://youtu.be/YHZKX0H6cUE?t=2217
[3] https://hbr.org/2019/05/making-empathy-central-to-your-company-culture
[4] proposed "Diversity Statement" *"Our community is based on mutual
respect, tolerance ..."*  ~ empathy
https://gist.github.com/grischard/53e4e9defebe7912f3aab9c0d2d1b55a

Best,
 Imre


Martin Koppenhoefer  ezt írta (időpont: 2020. febr.
6., Cs, 12:42):

> As most of you will know, the DWG on 14 Nov 2018 had reconsidered its
> original statement on Crimea from 5 June 2014, and decided to acknowledge
> that on the ground, Russia was controlling the territory and that the
> situation seemed fairly stable. On 10 December 2018, the OSMF board decided
> to return to the 2014 resolution. In its reasoning, board refers to the
> community as a whole ("The previous situation with the exception in place
> was obviously much more acceptable to the OSM community as a whole"), but
> also reaffirms that it supports the on-the-ground-rule: "
>
> We recognize that a lot of work has gone into the current Disputed Area
> Policy, and both DWG and LWG have assured us that the "on the ground
> rule" generally works well to avoid and settle conflicts. We, therefore, do
> not want to weaken that policy."
>
> My belief is that the reason for the on-the-ground rule to exist, is
> actually solving problems like the one in Crimea, and that we are weakening
> our position as "neutral", global community, if we make any exceptions to
> the rule. While I fully support the 2014 DWG resolution for the situation
> of 2014 (indeed potentially unclear if it would be stable), I also agree
> that in 2018 DWG couldn't decide differently than how they did.
>
> I therefore ask the current OSMF Board to reconsider the 2018 board
> decision and put the updated DWG statement from Nov 2018 into effect. This
> is not a question whether you believe, Crimea should belong to Ukraine or
> Russia, it is a principal question of creating together a truely impartial
> and indipendent map and adhering to our own standards.
>
> Like the former OSMF board, the DWG and LWG, I do not want to weaken that
> policy.
>
> Cheers
> Martin
>
>
>
> _
>
> https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Working_Group_Minutes/DWG_2018-11-14_Crimea
>
> https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Working_Group_Minutes/DWG_2014-06-05_Special_Crimea
>
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/osmf-talk/2019-February/005972.html
> ___
> talk mailing list
> talk@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>
___
talk mailing list
talk@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Étiquette de population pour les nœuds en France villes / villages / villages

[Clinton Mercieca]

 Bonjour/hello Marc,

in english : Thanks for the clarification.

en français : Merci pour la clarification.

Regards
Clinton


On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 14:42, marc marc  wrote:

> Bonjour/hello Clinton,
>
> Le 06.02.20 à 14:26, Clinton Mercieca a écrit :
> > Is there any particular reason for this
>
> in english : info was wrong (the population from INSEE are for the
> municipality, not for cities/towns/villages) and outdated (the source
> update its data)
> en français : L'information était erronée (la population de l'INSEE est
> pour la commune, pas pour les villes/villes/villages) et périmées (la
> source a mis à jour ses données)
>
> > A fellow user on the Help forum suggested that this may be related to
> > the post below:
> >
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-fr/2020-January/096261.html
>
> in english : yes it's related but in fact updating population for
> municipality may have been done in a separated changeset than deleting
> wrong population tag for cities/towns/villages.
> en français : oui c'est lié mais a mise à jour de la population pour la
> commune peut être fait dans un ensemble de changements séparés que la
> suppression du tag population= erroné des villes/villes/villages.
>
> > Should the population tags at Node level still be retained
>
> in english : why not, but with witch source ?
> the previous data was put on the wrong object.
> keep wrond value only to have a value is a bad idea.
> en français : pourquoi pas, mais avec quelle source ?
> les données précédentes ont été placées sur le mauvais objet.
> garder une valeur fictive uniquement pour avoir une valeur est une
> mauvaise idée.
>
> Regards,
> Marc
> ___
> Talk-fr mailing list
> Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr
>
___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

Re: [Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Dan S]

Op do 6 feb. 2020 om 13:06 schreef Frederik Ramm :
>
> Hi,
>
> On 06.02.20 13:29, Jez Nicholson wrote:
> > I come from a database background, and when a question isn't easily
> > answered with Taginfo or Overpass Turbo I jump to my trusty local
> > postgres database of UK data. I have a script that downloads the British
> > Isles from Geofabrik, loads it with osm2pgsql, adds some useful indexes,
> > and then removes Eire. Thereafter I can run SQL queries across the whole
> > database to get 'UK-wide' result
> I would recommend using --hstore-all instead of just --hstore because
> this gives you *all* tags in the "tags" column and therefore makes some
> analyses easier (cf. some of the examples below).
>
> It is certainly a good approach to answer complicated questions, and
> also an excellent training ground for people to hone their SQL skills.
> Some scribbles from a recent training:
>
> "what are the most frequently used key on a polygon":
>
> select count(*) as c, (each(tags)).key as k from planet_osm_polygon
> group by k order by c desc limit 10;
>
> or "what are the most frequently used key-value combos":
>
> select count(*) as c, each(tags) as k from planet_osm_polygon group by k
> order by c desc;
>
> or "which are the longest hiking routes":
>
> select osm_id, st_length(way::geography) as l, tags from planet_osm_line
> where tags->'route' = 'hiking' order by l desc;
>
> Having said that, for the easier questions there's also the per-region
> taginfo on Geofabrik (it's a bit beta still but good enough) - it
> doesn't actually feature the UK as an area but you can do
> England/Scotland/Wales separately:
>
> http://taginfo.geofabrik.de/europe/great-britain/england/

Also there seems to be GB:
http://taginfo.geofabrik.de/europe/great-britain/

___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

Re: [OSM-talk] it's not a fake, but "it's complicated"

[Mario Frasca]

Hi Aaron,

thank you for your writing!

On 05/02/2020 23:50, Aaron Young wrote:

in this instance we slipped up and didn’t communicate well enough.  We are 
working to improve that now both in Panama and elsewhere


I had a pleasant chat yesterday with Jorge Aguirre, and he insisted in 
explaining that in 2015 Kaart as an organization was very early in its 
learning process.  I suggested adopting/adapting the *Directed Editing 
Guidelines*, and my personal point of view, which I'm sharing now here, 
is that whoever organizes edits should not only follow the global 
guidelines (I like to think of them as "Brexit on World Trade 
Agreements"), but also checks with the local community, if there is any, 
what special agreements rule in the local community.  for Panamá, I 
would like to have such activities listed in a dedicated page in the 
*wiki*.  if you could describe them in Spanish, it would be much better, 
but if you're putting an English language page in the wiki, I'm sure 
there are enough non-Kaart people who would help translate that.


in fact, editing the local activities page in the wiki would be 
sufficient to *alert the local community*, or at least anyone watching 
that page.


On 05/02/2020 23:50, Aaron Young wrote:

maintain the data to make sure it is as good as it can be, which is what 
initiated this conversation


good news Kaart collecting experience and building on it.  may I suggest 
you also help local communities make their rules more explicit.  to make 
a concrete example, again for Panamá, did not agree on (did not discuss) 
*how to categorize highways*, nor do we know where to collect 'ref' values.


we also hardly have any factual information about rural bus routes.  why 
is this relevant?  a road on which you have a regular service, however 
crummy, can hardly qualify as "unclassified", but would be promoted to 
"tertiary" at the least.  could serve as reference.  also, knowing what 
kind of car runs the service would help with the "smoothness" tag.  
collecting this information needs to happen locally, and I don't manage 
to picture the difficulties and the costs associated to doing this.


[[as a complete *side thread*, a concrete example: I recently tracked a 
"chiva" only doing a short round trip from Santa Fé, travelling through 
El Pantano, which cost me $4.  I uploaded the trace as private, that was 
a mistake. https://www.openstreetmap.org/trace/3198854/data, one of the 
GPS lost power on the way back, I should upload the data from the other 
device.  with some extra cheap GPS devices (I own 5, not all equally 
good), and some official-looking piece of paper from an organization, 
one could spend half a day distributing phones running OSMTracker to bus 
drivers and collecting them when they're back.  and moving to the next 
"piquera" for a different round. rural routes here may come back after 
more than 5 hours, and I know of routes where a one-way ticket costs $8.  ]]


I am considering how to describe the above, but did not yet create the 
relevant wiki page/paragraph.  since Kaart is helping reclassify roads 
(in Panamá), it would be nice if we had some agreements on how to do 
that.  and given we did not have it yet, in Panamá, it would be nice if 
you publicly offered your thoughts for discussion, so we can reach an 
agreement we can describe and follow.


for *old edits*, I would consider very helpful if someone within Kaart 
would receive notifications on changesets produced under the Kaart 
flag.  see BlueSombra, and all other Kaart abandoned accounts, with all 
the comments still waiting for a reply.


a point which I'm afraid has been missed: the reply I received by Vigo 
gave me the impression "past is past, and we don't look back (but you 
may tide up our mess)".  I understand that you're not focusing on 
mapping businesses any more, and I realize it's too much work for 
anybody, to look up the mess and clean it up, but there must be other 
ways to *profile yourself as responsible for the data you added*, even 
if it was while you were early in your learning process.


ciao,

Mario

___
talk mailing list
talk@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

[Talk-is] Hvernig á að merkja bílastæði við götu í OSM?

[Arni Davidsson]

Sæl

Ég er að velta fyrir mér merkingum á bílastæðum í OSM.
Bílastæði við götu sem eru með gjaldskyldu hafa verið merkt að því er
virðist með 'Tag:amenity=parking' og teiknaður flötur sem sýnir afmörkun
bílastæðisins. Samsvarandi bílastæði án gjaldskyldu virðast þó sjaldan eða
aldrei merkt.

Er rétt að merkja bílastæði samsíða götu með þessum hætti? Eru þau kannski
merkt svona til að getað sett inn upplýsingar um gjaldskyldu, fjölda stæða
o.s.frv.

Er réttara að merkja þau á einhver hátt sem hluta götunnar og er hægt að
merkja þau þannig?

Þess má geta að ég hef sérstakan áhuga á fjölda bílastæðanna og að geta
dregið út þær upplýsingar sem eru settar inn um bílastæði úr OSM og unnið
með þær síðar og tekið saman yfirlit yfir fjölda og gerð stæða.

kveðja
Árni Davíðsson

-- 
Árni Davíðsson
arni...@gmail.com
___
Talk-is mailing list
Talk-is@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-is

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Étiquette de population pour les nœuds en France villes / villages / villages

[marc marc]

Bonjour/hello Clinton,

Le 06.02.20 à 14:26, Clinton Mercieca a écrit :
> Is there any particular reason for this

in english : info was wrong (the population from INSEE are for the
municipality, not for cities/towns/villages) and outdated (the source
update its data)
en français : L'information était erronée (la population de l'INSEE est
pour la commune, pas pour les villes/villes/villages) et périmées (la
source a mis à jour ses données)

> A fellow user on the Help forum suggested that this may be related to
> the post below:
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-fr/2020-January/096261.html

in english : yes it's related but in fact updating population for
municipality may have been done in a separated changeset than deleting
wrong population tag for cities/towns/villages.
en français : oui c'est lié mais a mise à jour de la population pour la
commune peut être fait dans un ensemble de changements séparés que la
suppression du tag population= erroné des villes/villes/villages.

> Should the population tags at Node level still be retained

in english : why not, but with witch source ?
the previous data was put on the wrong object.
keep wrond value only to have a value is a bad idea.
en français : pourquoi pas, mais avec quelle source ?
les données précédentes ont été placées sur le mauvais objet.
garder une valeur fictive uniquement pour avoir une valeur est une
mauvaise idée.

Regards,
Marc
___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

Re: [Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Paul Berry]

When you have the setup guide drafted, I'll have a go at following the
instructions to see if they're correct. I've never set up anything OSM
locally so I can be your fresh pair of eyes on it.

Thanks.

Regards,
*Paul*

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 13:17, Derry Hamilton  wrote:

> Hi Tony,
> I did something similar a while back at
> https://github.com/rasilon/osm_database so that might help you get
> started?
>
> Cheers,
> Derry
>
> On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 13:10, Tony OSM  wrote:
>
>> Absolutely Fabulous!
>>
>> Not done Docker but I'll start learning how to get it on those
>> environments.
>>
>> I'll try to support by QA and writing instructions as to how to get it
>> live.
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> TonyS999
>> On 06/02/2020 12:29, Jez Nicholson wrote:
>>
>> I come from a database background, and when a question isn't easily
>> answered with Taginfo or Overpass Turbo I jump to my trusty local postgres
>> database of UK data. I have a script that downloads the British Isles from
>> Geofabrik, loads it with osm2pgsql, adds some useful indexes, and then
>> removes Eire. Thereafter I can run SQL queries across the whole database to
>> get 'UK-wide' results.
>>
>> I think that this would be useful for people on hackdays and the like and
>> would be a good service for OSMUK to provide, so have just added a new
>> github repository https://github.com/osm-uk/osmuk2pgsql
>>
>> Friendly-worded Issues are welcome, as are code contributions. I'd like
>> to put it on a Docker environment so that it works quickly-and-easily on
>> Windows, Linux, Mac, whatever.
>>
>> Comments? Thoughts?
>>
>> Regards,
>>  Jez
>>
>> ___
>> Talk-GB mailing 
>> listTalk-GB@openstreetmap.orghttps://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>>
>> ___
>> Talk-GB mailing list
>> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>>
> ___
> Talk-GB mailing list
> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>
___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

Re: [talk-au] SSSI National Bushfire Recovery Map-a-thon - Sunday 9th Feb

[Andrew Harvey]

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 20:52, Andrew Davidson  wrote:

> On 6/2/20 8:39 pm, Ewen Hill wrote:
> >The states have sent out a rapid impact assessment teams to all areas
> > now and have followed up with detailed analysis in most. We know what
> > has been damaged, destroyed and what was inhabited, what wasn't and what
> > other assets were damaged. We also know the structure type, bedroom
> > count etc. Any updates on Sunday are not going to help anyone in social
> > services, council, planning, asbestos removal. I honestly don't know
> > what benefit this will be and as Warin correctly stated, updated.
>
> I agree. I was thinking about the utility of trying to map this stuff
> from aerial imagery when the groups that are responding will all ready
> have much better datasets. Australia is not Haiti or Nepal.
>

I checked out the provided imagery from Planet Labs, from what I could tell
the resolution is too low to make out buildings, for large buildings you
might see a 4 white pixels, but not enough to confidently make out that
it's a building let alone if it's destroyed or not.


> This is one of the biggest problems with the damaged=* tag. It needs to
> be updated regularly because we know that it's a temporary state, and
> who is going to do that?
>

Yes it will go out of date quickly but so does landuse=construction. If
anything by flagging it as damaged, ruined, razed it attributes this
feature as needed to be checked again soon. StreetComplete already does
this for landuse=construction, every month or so it will prompt you "Is
this feature still in construction?".
___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [talk-au] SSSI National Bushfire Recovery Map-a-thon - Sunday 9th Feb

[Andrew Harvey]

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 20:39, Ewen Hill  wrote:

> I will be attending Melbourne however I have deep reservations about this
> and that doesn't include the Waiver which is key to the entire project.
>
>   The states have sent out a rapid impact assessment teams to all areas
> now and have followed up with detailed analysis in most. We know what has
> been damaged, destroyed and what was inhabited, what wasn't and what other
> assets were damaged. We also know the structure type, bedroom count etc.
> Any updates on Sunday are not going to help anyone in social services,
> council, planning, asbestos removal. I honestly don't know what benefit
> this will be and as Warin correctly stated, updated.
>

Agreed.


>
> The removal of buildings and rubble including asbestos will take
> significant time. What is there now, may not be there in 6-12 months and
> the map will be out of date.
>

While that's true, I don't see that a reason not to try. In my eyes it's no
different to someone who maps out all the shops in a retail area, which
also will go out of date quickly.


>
> The other thing to remember is to respect those who have lost everything
> don't need to see damaged/destroyed  on their property as they try and
> rebuild it.
>
> I do see benefit in mapping commercial premises and public assets that
> have been affected.
>
> I would like to see something a bit smarter than this. Something that can
> assist people on the ground now would be highly beneficial. A "Hell yes, we
> are open" web-site that *small *businesses can advertise would be great.
> A whole lot of other things could be done well before adding a temporary
> updates. These towns are going to really struggle in winter and people
> drift off.
>

Maybe an effort to get these rural businesses mapped in OSM, with all the
frills that go with that, website, contact phone/email, opening hours.
Being on the map would help bring customers in the door.
___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Jez Nicholson]

Excellent. Not a new idea then.

https://alexurquhart.com/post/set-up-postgis-with-docker/ looks like a
reasonable summary of what Docker is and why.

It being the whole of the UK, the download and create takes a while. I will
be giving the choice of a smaller area, e.g. Greater Manchester.

I'd like to include some sample SQL queries to help people get started.
Help here would be useful.

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020, 13:17 Derry Hamilton,  wrote:

> Hi Tony,
> I did something similar a while back at
> https://github.com/rasilon/osm_database so that might help you get
> started?
>
> Cheers,
> Derry
>
> On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 13:10, Tony OSM  wrote:
>
>> Absolutely Fabulous!
>>
>> Not done Docker but I'll start learning how to get it on those
>> environments.
>>
>> I'll try to support by QA and writing instructions as to how to get it
>> live.
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> TonyS999
>> On 06/02/2020 12:29, Jez Nicholson wrote:
>>
>> I come from a database background, and when a question isn't easily
>> answered with Taginfo or Overpass Turbo I jump to my trusty local postgres
>> database of UK data. I have a script that downloads the British Isles from
>> Geofabrik, loads it with osm2pgsql, adds some useful indexes, and then
>> removes Eire. Thereafter I can run SQL queries across the whole database to
>> get 'UK-wide' results.
>>
>> I think that this would be useful for people on hackdays and the like and
>> would be a good service for OSMUK to provide, so have just added a new
>> github repository https://github.com/osm-uk/osmuk2pgsql
>>
>> Friendly-worded Issues are welcome, as are code contributions. I'd like
>> to put it on a Docker environment so that it works quickly-and-easily on
>> Windows, Linux, Mac, whatever.
>>
>> Comments? Thoughts?
>>
>> Regards,
>>  Jez
>>
>> ___
>> Talk-GB mailing 
>> listTalk-GB@openstreetmap.orghttps://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>>
>> ___
>> Talk-GB mailing list
>> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>>
> ___
> Talk-GB mailing list
> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>
___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Proposition de mise à jour : la population des communes

[marc marc]

Le 06.02.20 à 14:22, Alain Rpnpif via Talk-fr a écrit :
> Le 05/02/2020 à 07:20, Vincent de Château-Thierry a écrit :
>> Bonjour,
> 
> 
> Bonjour Vincent,
> 
> Il semble que quelqu'un conteste tes mises à jour ou plutôt ne les as
> pas comprises. C'est sur :
> 
> https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=68546

la personne a écrit à talk-fr-owner en anglais.
on lui a répondu et expliqué, en attente de savoir pq c'était un message
privé (erreur ou volontaire)
mais on pourra copier/coller la réponse sur le forum histoire que le
prochain qui se pose la question retrouve l'info
(vive les éditions de masse documentée... au moins les gens retrouvent
l'info)
___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

[OSM-talk-fr] Étiquette de population pour les nœuds en France villes / villages / villages

[Clinton Mercieca]

Hi,

I have recently noticed that quite an amount of the population tags in the
cities/towns/villages nodes have been removed in bulk on different change
sets. Is there any particular reason for this, since that tag is widely
used when getting our dataset and can't see any reason for removing data
from OSM.

An example of such changeset is this one
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/79698989 or
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/79636755, even though there are
quite a number of such changesets.

A fellow user on the Help forum suggested that this may be related to the
post below:

https://lists.openstreetmap.org/piperma … 96261.html


Should the population tags at Node level still be retained since this
created an inconsistency between the France data and other countries in the
data set I'm using.

Thanks in advance

Clinton Mercieca

---

Bonjour,

J'ai récemment remarqué qu'une grande partie des balises de population
dans les nœuds des villes / villages / villages ont été supprimées en
masse sur différents ensembles de modifications.
Y a-t-il une raison particulière à cela, car cette balise est
largement utilisée lors de l'obtention de notre ensemble de données et
ne peut voir aucune raison de supprimer des données d'OSM.

Un exemple d'un tel ensemble de modifications est celui-ci
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/79698989

ou
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/79636755

même s'il existe un certain nombre de ces ensembles de modifications.

Un autre utilisateur du forum d'aide a suggéré que cela pouvait être
lié au message ci-dessous:
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-fr/2020-January/096261.html

Les balises de population au niveau du nœud devraient-elles toujours
être conservées, car cela a créé une incohérence entre les données de
la France et d'autres pays dans l'ensemble de données que j'utilise.

Merci d'avance

Clinton Mercieca
___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Proposition de mise à jour : la population des communes

[Alain Rpnpif via Talk-fr]

Le 05/02/2020 à 07:20, Vincent de Château-Thierry a écrit :

Bonjour,



Bonjour Vincent,

Il semble que quelqu'un conteste tes mises à jour ou plutôt ne les as 
pas comprises. C'est sur :


https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=68546

Rpnpif


___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

Re: [Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Derry Hamilton]

Hi Tony,
I did something similar a while back at
https://github.com/rasilon/osm_database so that might help you get started?

Cheers,
Derry

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 13:10, Tony OSM  wrote:

> Absolutely Fabulous!
>
> Not done Docker but I'll start learning how to get it on those
> environments.
>
> I'll try to support by QA and writing instructions as to how to get it
> live.
>
> Cheers
>
> TonyS999
> On 06/02/2020 12:29, Jez Nicholson wrote:
>
> I come from a database background, and when a question isn't easily
> answered with Taginfo or Overpass Turbo I jump to my trusty local postgres
> database of UK data. I have a script that downloads the British Isles from
> Geofabrik, loads it with osm2pgsql, adds some useful indexes, and then
> removes Eire. Thereafter I can run SQL queries across the whole database to
> get 'UK-wide' results.
>
> I think that this would be useful for people on hackdays and the like and
> would be a good service for OSMUK to provide, so have just added a new
> github repository https://github.com/osm-uk/osmuk2pgsql
>
> Friendly-worded Issues are welcome, as are code contributions. I'd like to
> put it on a Docker environment so that it works quickly-and-easily on
> Windows, Linux, Mac, whatever.
>
> Comments? Thoughts?
>
> Regards,
>  Jez
>
> ___
> Talk-GB mailing 
> listTalk-GB@openstreetmap.orghttps://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>
> ___
> Talk-GB mailing list
> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>
___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

Re: [Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Tony OSM]

Absolutely Fabulous!

Not done Docker but I'll start learning how to get it on those 
environments.


I'll try to support by QA and writing instructions as to how to get it 
live.


Cheers

TonyS999

On 06/02/2020 12:29, Jez Nicholson wrote:
I come from a database background, and when a question isn't easily 
answered with Taginfo or Overpass Turbo I jump to my trusty local 
postgres database of UK data. I have a script that downloads the 
British Isles from Geofabrik, loads it with osm2pgsql, adds some 
useful indexes, and then removes Eire. Thereafter I can run SQL 
queries across the whole database to get 'UK-wide' results.


I think that this would be useful for people on hackdays and the like 
and would be a good service for OSMUK to provide, so have just added a 
new github repository https://github.com/osm-uk/osmuk2pgsql


Friendly-worded Issues are welcome, as are code contributions. I'd 
like to put it on a Docker environment so that it works 
quickly-and-easily on Windows, Linux, Mac, whatever.


Comments? Thoughts?

Regards,
             Jez

___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

Re: [Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Frederik Ramm]

Hi,

On 06.02.20 13:29, Jez Nicholson wrote:
> I come from a database background, and when a question isn't easily
> answered with Taginfo or Overpass Turbo I jump to my trusty local
> postgres database of UK data. I have a script that downloads the British
> Isles from Geofabrik, loads it with osm2pgsql, adds some useful indexes,
> and then removes Eire. Thereafter I can run SQL queries across the whole
> database to get 'UK-wide' result
I would recommend using --hstore-all instead of just --hstore because
this gives you *all* tags in the "tags" column and therefore makes some
analyses easier (cf. some of the examples below).

It is certainly a good approach to answer complicated questions, and
also an excellent training ground for people to hone their SQL skills.
Some scribbles from a recent training:

"what are the most frequently used key on a polygon":

select count(*) as c, (each(tags)).key as k from planet_osm_polygon
group by k order by c desc limit 10;

or "what are the most frequently used key-value combos":

select count(*) as c, each(tags) as k from planet_osm_polygon group by k
order by c desc;

or "which are the longest hiking routes":

select osm_id, st_length(way::geography) as l, tags from planet_osm_line
where tags->'route' = 'hiking' order by l desc;

Having said that, for the easier questions there's also the per-region
taginfo on Geofabrik (it's a bit beta still but good enough) - it
doesn't actually feature the UK as an area but you can do
England/Scotland/Wales separately:

http://taginfo.geofabrik.de/europe/great-britain/england/

Bye
Frederik

-- 
Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"

___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Référencer la production alimentaire locale

[marc marc]

ni plus ni moins que l'ensemble des noeuds d'une frontière administrative :)

Le 06.02.20 à 13:42, Florimond Berthoux a écrit :
> Salut,
> 
> C’est vérifiable sur le terrain ?
> 
> Le mer. 5 févr. 2020 à 19:36, Vincent Bergeot  > a écrit :
> 
> Bonjour,
> 
> pour référencer les lieux de productions alimentaires (les fermes en
> particulier) et pour pouvoir "comparer" avec d'autres listes, j'aimerai
> bien ajouter la ref siret, mais sur quel objet ?
> 
> Quand il y a un lieu de vente le shop=farm semble approprié (à voir si
> il n'y a pas 2 siret différents,à creuser).
> 
> Mais quand il n'y a pas de lieu de vente !
> 
> Sur le farmyard ?
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/FR:Tag:landuse%3Dfarmyard
> 
> place=farm ne semble pas vraiment correspondre
> (https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:place%3Dfarm)
> 
> Une idée, suggestion ? ou plusieurs :)
> 
> Bonne fin de journée
> 
> VincentB
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> Talk-fr mailing list
> Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org 
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Florimond Berthoux
> 
> ___
> Talk-fr mailing list
> Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr
> 

___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Référencer la production alimentaire locale

[Florimond Berthoux]

Salut,

C’est vérifiable sur le terrain ?

Le mer. 5 févr. 2020 à 19:36, Vincent Bergeot  a
écrit :

> Bonjour,
>
> pour référencer les lieux de productions alimentaires (les fermes en
> particulier) et pour pouvoir "comparer" avec d'autres listes, j'aimerai
> bien ajouter la ref siret, mais sur quel objet ?
>
> Quand il y a un lieu de vente le shop=farm semble approprié (à voir si
> il n'y a pas 2 siret différents,à creuser).
>
> Mais quand il n'y a pas de lieu de vente !
>
> Sur le farmyard ?
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/FR:Tag:landuse%3Dfarmyard
>
> place=farm ne semble pas vraiment correspondre
> (https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:place%3Dfarm)
>
> Une idée, suggestion ? ou plusieurs :)
>
> Bonne fin de journée
>
> VincentB
>
>
>
> ___
> Talk-fr mailing list
> Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr
>


-- 
Florimond Berthoux
___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

[Talk-GB] "OSMUK-in-a-box"

[Jez Nicholson]

I come from a database background, and when a question isn't easily
answered with Taginfo or Overpass Turbo I jump to my trusty local postgres
database of UK data. I have a script that downloads the British Isles from
Geofabrik, loads it with osm2pgsql, adds some useful indexes, and then
removes Eire. Thereafter I can run SQL queries across the whole database to
get 'UK-wide' results.

I think that this would be useful for people on hackdays and the like and
would be a good service for OSMUK to provide, so have just added a new
github repository https://github.com/osm-uk/osmuk2pgsql

Friendly-worded Issues are welcome, as are code contributions. I'd like to
put it on a Docker environment so that it works quickly-and-easily on
Windows, Linux, Mac, whatever.

Comments? Thoughts?

Regards,
 Jez
___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb

Re: [Talk-it] Province italiane - coordinazione

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

Visto che qui non ci sono più stati commenti, ho aggiunto
suppressed:admin_level=6, già presente alla Provincia di Trieste, anche
alle ex-Province di Gorizia e Udine.

Ciao
Martin
___
Talk-it mailing list
Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it

Re: [Talk-GB] Still too many universities in Cambridge

[Jez Nicholson]

Nice work Jerry. I've touted Universities as a Quarterly Project as I
believe that a number of them use and contribute to OSM...and those that
don't, should. Maybe it can gain traction for next quarter...OSMUK could be
used as a means to introduce ourselves officially to any university that
doesn't know about OSM, but Cambridge are long-time contributors.

Remember to add information to
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/University_of_Cambridge

Meanwhile, the conversation has also jumped to the Tagging list and it
would be good to keep an eye on them.

Regards,
 Jez

On Thu, Feb 6, 2020 at 10:21 AM SK53  wrote:

> Funnily enough this long-standing issue came up at our pub meeting last
> month. Although my reaction has always been to let sleeping dogs lie, this
> was clearly not the consensus.
>
> I've sent a message to University of Cambridge Information Services who
> run the map.cam.ac.uk site which consumes the OSM data, to warn them that
> a change is impending. It's probably worth holding off for a week or so to
> allow them to assess any impact on their map. Incidentally, knowing a
> specific contact point would help as university IT departments can be big
> beasts these days. It does show that having a good contact point is always
> a good idea for directed edits when data is in use.
>
> As others have said there is a lot of inconsistency: particular with
> former houses taken into University or College ownership which sometimes
> get building=house/semi and other times building=university. There are
> other college buildings of this type which are not hit by
> amenity=university at all.
>
> Other general points I noticed relating to  inconsistency/issues (largely
> arising because Cambridge got mapped earlier than many places or it just
> has a lot of things which are otherwise rare):
>
>- Theological Colleges are loosely associated with the university, and
>are equally loosely amenity=university in their own right. I don't know if
>we have a regular way of tagging non-degree awarding religious training
>centres. These are something of an Oxbridge speciality. I see the London
>Institute of Theology is tagged
> as a college. Years ago
>I mapped Coleg Trefecca as a conference centre, but used old_ tags to
>indicate it's historical role as a college training people for the
>ministry. Fortunately some of the odder places
> of former
>times have similarly changed their roles.
>- Sports facilities (especially isolated playing fields and
>boathouses) are just tagged with a ref and operator. Pavilions are often
>tagged building=university, as is the sports centre.
>- Cambridge colleges are independent corporations in their own right,
>so probably should have separate amenity=university relations (although the
>world is unlikely to end if not). They mostly form discrete campuses.
>Isolated parts are named separately so just replacing these with a relation
>doesn't work. North Court, Emma is one such example. There are similarly
>very well known parts of the university with their own widely used names:
>Downing Site, New Museums, West Cambridge etc. This is true of most
>universities now that many are multi-campus. I don't think we have a good
>approach to these: roles in relations, campus_name … are all possibilities.
>(This also applies to schools now that one academy can take over another).
>- There's plenty of (non-public accessible) student accommodation
>which is not mapped as such. I presume this is intentional. Examples the
>Trinity staircase above the bike shop on Jesus Lane, most of Lower Park St
>(Jesus), and Portugal Place,
>-  Multiple buildings mapped as one
>. There are probably
>others, but this one I know. The larger part of the building is the former 
> Cambridgeshire
>County Hall
>
> ,
>built around 1910 and Grade II listed, the S part is a 17th century
>house
>
> 
>(formerly 'X' staircase), also Grade II. The two buildings form a single
>unit of student accommodation which presumably reflects the mapping.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Jerry
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, 4 Feb 2020 at 15:15, Dave F via Talk-GB 
> wrote:
>
>> On 04/02/2020 14:28, Dan S wrote:
>> > Hi Dave,
>> >
>> > I agree with what you suggest. Can we be a bit precise though about
>> > what you propose? You're proposing to remove amenity=university from
>> > building=university in Cambridge, and make no other tagging changes?
>>
>> That's correct. I'm going to load the 1050 return by this overpass query
>> into JOSM:
>> [bbox:{{bbox}}];
>> 

[OSM-talk] Crimea situation - on the ground

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

As most of you will know, the DWG on 14 Nov 2018 had reconsidered its
original statement on Crimea from 5 June 2014, and decided to acknowledge
that on the ground, Russia was controlling the territory and that the
situation seemed fairly stable. On 10 December 2018, the OSMF board decided
to return to the 2014 resolution. In its reasoning, board refers to the
community as a whole ("The previous situation with the exception in place
was obviously much more acceptable to the OSM community as a whole"), but
also reaffirms that it supports the on-the-ground-rule: "

We recognize that a lot of work has gone into the current Disputed Area
Policy, and both DWG and LWG have assured us that the "on the ground
rule" generally works well to avoid and settle conflicts. We, therefore, do
not want to weaken that policy."

My belief is that the reason for the on-the-ground rule to exist, is
actually solving problems like the one in Crimea, and that we are weakening
our position as "neutral", global community, if we make any exceptions to
the rule. While I fully support the 2014 DWG resolution for the situation
of 2014 (indeed potentially unclear if it would be stable), I also agree
that in 2018 DWG couldn't decide differently than how they did.

I therefore ask the current OSMF Board to reconsider the 2018 board
decision and put the updated DWG statement from Nov 2018 into effect. This
is not a question whether you believe, Crimea should belong to Ukraine or
Russia, it is a principal question of creating together a truely impartial
and indipendent map and adhering to our own standards.

Like the former OSMF board, the DWG and LWG, I do not want to weaken that
policy.

Cheers
Martin



_
https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Working_Group_Minutes/DWG_2018-11-14_Crimea
https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Working_Group_Minutes/DWG_2014-06-05_Special_Crimea
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/osmf-talk/2019-February/005972.html
___
talk mailing list
talk@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [OSM-talk-ie] Ireland within the OSM Community Index

[Andy Townsend]

On 03/02/2020 07:58, Dave Corley wrote:

That's great Andy, thanks for sorting it out

On Mon 3 Feb 2020, 00:12 Andy Townsend,  wrote:


On 30/01/2020 14:33, Donal Hunt wrote:

Sounds goods to me and will reduce duplication.




and that's now live at https://openstreetmap.community/ .

Best Regards,

Andy



___
Talk-ie mailing list
Talk-ie@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ie

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Josm : fenêtre "résoudre les conflits"

[leni]

Je suis allé voir dans les paramètres avancés s'il n'y avait pas un 
paramètre qui pourrait diminuer la largeur des colonnes, mais je n'ai 
trouvé que : conflict.geometry et 
org.openstreetmap.josm.gui.conflict.tags.combinePrimitiveResolverDialog.geometry 
qui semblent avoir des liens avec les dimensions, mais je n'ai pas 
obtenu de résultat.

Y en a-t-il d'autres ?

leni

Le 20/01/2020 à 18:46, leni a écrit :


Bonjour.

Je suis sous windows 10.

Quand j'obtiens la fenêtre pour résoudre les conflits, j'ai les trois 
tables "ma version", "version fusionnée" et "leur version".


Je ne trouve pas quel endroit sélectionner pour diminuer la largeur de 
chaque table ; j'arrive à diminuer la largeur totale, je ne vois plus 
qu'une partie de la fenêtre et je suis obligé de naviguer avec 
l’ascenseur horizontal.


Je trouve pour changer la largeur des colonnes à l'intérieur d'une 
table, mais pas la largeur d'une table, j'ai beau balader ma souris 
partout ...


cordialement

leni


___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr
___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr

[talk-au] FW: [HOT] damage as a tag - not docu,

[Phil Wyatt]

Hi Folks,

This just popped into the HOT mailing list - very topical at the moment and may 
be worth taking to the SSSI event organisers

Cheers - Phil

-Original Message-
From: Russell Deffner  
Sent: Thursday, 6 February 2020 9:04 PM
To: Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com>
Cc: h...@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Re: [HOT] damage as a tag - not docu,

Just a quick note; HOT does not formally do damage tagging, mainly because no 
tagging schema exists. In the past, members of HOT tried various tagging but 
results for remote damage assessment were poor.

I personally would be glad to see a community driven tagging schema developed 
but if not we (HOT) will need to document what we come up with for usage in 
disaster response and recovery.

One glaring issue has been that typically the tags persist much longer than the 
damage.

=Russ

> On Feb 6, 2020, at 12:49 PM, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi.
> 
> It looks like HOT is using the tag 'damage' for something. It is not 
> documented as to what it means. Further is this information kept current or 
> just added and forgotten? In at least one case the tag goes back to 2011.
> 
> 
> When will HOT start to document what tags they are using, and what they are 
> used for on the OSM wiki? This is not good behavior for HOT in OSM.
> 
> 
> ___
> HOT mailing list
> h...@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot

___
HOT mailing list
h...@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot


___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [Talk-GB] Still too many universities in Cambridge

[SK53]

Funnily enough this long-standing issue came up at our pub meeting last
month. Although my reaction has always been to let sleeping dogs lie, this
was clearly not the consensus.

I've sent a message to University of Cambridge Information Services who run
the map.cam.ac.uk site which consumes the OSM data, to warn them that a
change is impending. It's probably worth holding off for a week or so to
allow them to assess any impact on their map. Incidentally, knowing a
specific contact point would help as university IT departments can be big
beasts these days. It does show that having a good contact point is always
a good idea for directed edits when data is in use.

As others have said there is a lot of inconsistency: particular with former
houses taken into University or College ownership which sometimes get
building=house/semi and other times building=university. There are other
college buildings of this type which are not hit by amenity=university at
all.

Other general points I noticed relating to  inconsistency/issues (largely
arising because Cambridge got mapped earlier than many places or it just
has a lot of things which are otherwise rare):

   - Theological Colleges are loosely associated with the university, and
   are equally loosely amenity=university in their own right. I don't know if
   we have a regular way of tagging non-degree awarding religious training
   centres. These are something of an Oxbridge speciality. I see the London
   Institute of Theology is tagged
    as a college. Years ago I
   mapped Coleg Trefecca as a conference centre, but used old_ tags to
   indicate it's historical role as a college training people for the
   ministry. Fortunately some of the odder places
    of former
   times have similarly changed their roles.
   - Sports facilities (especially isolated playing fields and boathouses)
   are just tagged with a ref and operator. Pavilions are often tagged
   building=university, as is the sports centre.
   - Cambridge colleges are independent corporations in their own right, so
   probably should have separate amenity=university relations (although the
   world is unlikely to end if not). They mostly form discrete campuses.
   Isolated parts are named separately so just replacing these with a relation
   doesn't work. North Court, Emma is one such example. There are similarly
   very well known parts of the university with their own widely used names:
   Downing Site, New Museums, West Cambridge etc. This is true of most
   universities now that many are multi-campus. I don't think we have a good
   approach to these: roles in relations, campus_name … are all possibilities.
   (This also applies to schools now that one academy can take over another).
   - There's plenty of (non-public accessible) student accommodation which
   is not mapped as such. I presume this is intentional. Examples the Trinity
   staircase above the bike shop on Jesus Lane, most of Lower Park St (Jesus),
   and Portugal Place,
   -  Multiple buildings mapped as one
   . There are probably
   others, but this one I know. The larger part of the building is the
former Cambridgeshire
   County Hall
   
,
   built around 1910 and Grade II listed, the S part is a 17th century house
   

   (formerly 'X' staircase), also Grade II. The two buildings form a single
   unit of student accommodation which presumably reflects the mapping.

Cheers,

Jerry




On Tue, 4 Feb 2020 at 15:15, Dave F via Talk-GB 
wrote:

> On 04/02/2020 14:28, Dan S wrote:
> > Hi Dave,
> >
> > I agree with what you suggest. Can we be a bit precise though about
> > what you propose? You're proposing to remove amenity=university from
> > building=university in Cambridge, and make no other tagging changes?
>
> That's correct. I'm going to load the 1050 return by this overpass query
> into JOSM:
> [bbox:{{bbox}}];
> nwr[amenity=university][building=university];
> out meta geom;
>
> plus another 7 which are still tagged as building=yes.
>
> > (Ironically, the current tagging makes it hard for me to search to see
> > if there's a "proper" amenity=university in there somewhere, e.g. as a
> > relation or area covering a large swathe of them.)
>
> There isn't, I'm afraid.. it's a right hotchpotch
>
> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/QnH
>
> These are the remaining 117 amenity=university which will need to be
> rectified at a later date..
>
> Cheers
> DaveF
> > Op di 4 feb. 2020 om 14:15 schreef Dave F via Talk-GB
> > :
> >> Hi
> >> There was a discussion 5 years ago. There may have been others.
> >> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2015-May/017455.html
> >>
> >> Many amenity=university 

Re: [talk-au] SSSI National Bushfire Recovery Map-a-thon - Sunday 9th Feb

[Andrew Davidson]

On 6/2/20 8:39 pm, Ewen Hill wrote:
   The states have sent out a rapid impact assessment teams to all areas 
now and have followed up with detailed analysis in most. We know what 
has been damaged, destroyed and what was inhabited, what wasn't and what 
other assets were damaged. We also know the structure type, bedroom 
count etc. Any updates on Sunday are not going to help anyone in social 
services, council, planning, asbestos removal. I honestly don't know 
what benefit this will be and as Warin correctly stated, updated.


I agree. I was thinking about the utility of trying to map this stuff 
from aerial imagery when the groups that are responding will all ready 
have much better datasets. Australia is not Haiti or Nepal.


I can also understand that SSSI wants to do something to help, that's a 
very natural human emotion. I just don't think this is it.


The removal of buildings and rubble including asbestos will take 
significant time. What is there now, may not be there in 6-12 months and 
the map will be out of date.


This is one of the biggest problems with the damaged=* tag. It needs to 
be updated regularly because we know that it's a temporary state, and 
who is going to do that?


___
Talk-au mailing list
Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au

Re: [talk-au] SSSI National Bushfire Recovery Map-a-thon - Sunday 9th Feb

[Ewen Hill]

I will be attending Melbourne however I have deep reservations about this
and that doesn't include the Waiver which is key to the entire project.

  The states have sent out a rapid impact assessment teams to all areas now
and have followed up with detailed analysis in most. We know what has been
damaged, destroyed and what was inhabited, what wasn't and what other
assets were damaged. We also know the structure type, bedroom count etc.
Any updates on Sunday are not going to help anyone in social services,
council, planning, asbestos removal. I honestly don't know what benefit
this will be and as Warin correctly stated, updated.

The removal of buildings and rubble including asbestos will take
significant time. What is there now, may not be there in 6-12 months and
the map will be out of date.

The other thing to remember is to respect those who have lost everything
don't need to see damaged/destroyed  on their property as they try and
rebuild it.

I do see benefit in mapping commercial premises and public assets that have
been affected.

I would like to see something a bit smarter than this. Something that can
assist people on the ground now would be highly beneficial. A "Hell yes, we
are open" web-site that *small *businesses can advertise would be great. A
whole lot of other things could be done well before adding a temporary
updates. These towns are going to really struggle in winter and people
drift off.

Ewen

On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 18:28, Andrew Harvey  wrote:

> I finally managed to get in touch with one of the organisers, and raised
> the licensing/waiver issue. They've said they asked Planet Labs for the
> waiver, I've also independently reached out to the Planet Labs disasters
> contact with background on why OSM asks for the waiver and the waiver
> asking them if they can complete it if they would like OSM to be able to
> use their disaster imagery. Given the mapathon is on Sunday it's a
> nervous wait to see if they'll respond in time.
>
> I've presented the organiser with an alternative of using ARA's imagery
> for Adelaide Hills and Kangaroo Island (though I just went through and
> mapped out most of Kangaroo Island last night, and KI won't be enough to
> sustain a nation wide mapathon). I also mentioned the Maxar imagery, but
> they don't have much post-event imagery published yet, so can't easily be
> used to identify damaged buildings.
>
> The organiser was not fully across exactly how the HOT Tasking Manager
> worked, they thought edits won't go into OSM until after being validated,
> so they thought without the waiver they could just not upload to OSM, but I
> informed them that's not how the HOT Tasking Manager works, all edits are
> saved into OSM even before the Tasking Manager validation step.
>
> They said if they can't get the waiver they "plan to extract the changeset
> out of OSM post mapathons (this Sunday) at which stage we would expect the
> data not to be committed to OSM". That doesn't make any sense to me.
>
> Since I'm now part of the Data Working Group, I briefly discussed it with
> them and if we don't have the waiver or explicit permission to trace their
> imagery in OSM then we will have no choice but to revert edits / or temp
> block accounts. The LWG policy is clear that for the avoidance of doubt we
> need additional waiver / explicit permission when tracing CC BY, CC BY-SA
> or CC BY-NC imagery.
>
> On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 18:00, Sebastian S.  wrote:
>
>> Hi Andrew, are they (the organisers) aware of the licensing
>> issues/requirements?
>>
>> Are they following here? Please engage with the discussion :-)
>>
>> On 6 February 2020 12:37:16 pm AEDT, Andrew Harvey <
>> andrew.harv...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I was corrected by someone off list, looks like they are planning on
>>> mapping within OSM https://tasks.hotosm.org/project/7893. Now I have to
>>> scrabble to validate Planet Labs has provided the necessary permission for
>>> their imagery to be traced into OSM.
>>>
>>> On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 12:12, Andrew Harvey 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I sent an email to the contact email to ask for more information, but
 by the looks of it they aren't uploading anything to OpenStreetMap, they
 are creating their own datasets (which may or may not be released as open
 data, they haven't stated yet). It's unclear how they are planning on
 consuming OpenStreetMap though. I'm still keen to see what they've
 identified as important or useful to map.

 What they've stated is they'll be using Planet Labs imagery
 https://www.planet.com/disaster/fires-in-australia-2019-11-06/.

 1) As far as I'm aware we don't have an imagery tracing waiver from
 Planet Labs, it's worth reaching out to Planet Labs to ask for this waiver
 for use in OpenStreetMap.

 2) Since access to the imagery is restricted "We provide limited access
 to Explorer for up to 30 days to qualified disaster volunteer
 organizations, humanitarian organizations, 

[talk-cz] WeeklyOSM CZ 497

[Tom Ka]

Ahoj, je dostupné vydání 497 týdeníku WeeklyOSM:

https://weeklyosm.eu/cz/archives/12814

* Tagování škol v ČR.
* Další novinky vrstvy X.
* Pitná voda v Evropě.
* Aktivní sopky v OSM.
* Opět diverzita v OSM.
* HOT Summit 2020.
* Omezení planet OSM.
* Mapa koronaviru.
* Objevitelské plavby.
* Mapa hřbetnic.
* Kultura cyklistiky.
* AI pro sběr dat.

Pěkné počtení ...

___
talk-cz mailing list
talk-cz@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-cz
https://openstreetmap.cz/talkcz

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] zone résidentielle dans une zone résidentielle ?

[Jérôme Seigneuret]

Je le fais en mode relation outer pour le polygone englobant et je met les
autres landaise en objet pour les résidences nommées et lotissement. Rien
d'interdit a cela il faut juste ne pas avoir de superposition

Le jeu. 6 févr. 2020 à 07:56, Arnaud Champollion <
arnaud.champoll...@linux-alpes.org> a écrit :

> Le 05/02/2020 à 21:58, osm.sanspourr...@spamgourmet.com a écrit :
>
> Les relations
> boundary 
> place
> place  neighbourhood
> (par exemple)
> 
> type  boundary
> 
>
> me semblent plus adaptées
>
>
> OK, à l'occasion je ferai les corrections nécessaires, car sur Digne les
> Bains il y a un certain nombre de quartiers mappés landuse=residential à
> l'intérieur d'un autre landuse=residential.
>
> Merci à tous, bonne journée.
> ___
> Talk-fr mailing list
> Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr
>
___
Talk-fr mailing list
Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr