Martin Koppenhoefer writes:
I do agree that they might likely have copyright on the routes, and
that we maybe can't reproduce their routes in our db, but I do
question that we can't map their signposts. Reasoning: the routes
are nothing physically existing, they are, similar to a novel,
Am 07.04.2015 um 16:51 schrieb Martin Koppenhoefer:
...
is this something the OSMF lawyers have had a look into? Is the issue
really copyright or is this about trademark (regarding the names
GR PR etc.)? Currently it seems we are accepting what the Fédération
Francaise de la Randonnée
2015-04-08 9:05 GMT+02:00 Simon Poole si...@poole.ch:
The wiki already explains: they hold a trademark for GR which makes
using the official names of the routes essentially impossible in and
for material they hold protection for and further they seem to claim
copyright on the routes
Am 08.04.2015 um 15:23 schrieb Russ Nelson:
Simon Poole writes:
The wiki already explains: they hold a trademark for GR which makes
using the official names of the routes essentially impossible in and
Perhaps French trademark law is different than US trademark law, but
in the US, you
Simon Poole writes:
The wiki already explains: they hold a trademark for GR which makes
using the official names of the routes essentially impossible in and
Perhaps French trademark law is different than US trademark law, but
in the US, you can *always* use a trademark truthfully. Thus, you
Under French law, would it be a violation of that copyright if someone recorded
a GPX trace while walking along the signposted route, then mapped that route in
OSM using the GPX trace and not using the GR name or shield? Do any of these
routes have non-copyrighted local names?
On April 4,
2015-04-04 16:46 GMT+02:00 Simon Poole si...@poole.ch:
Sorry for the late answer, been on the road for two days and now are on a
rather flaky network connection. See
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Walking_Routes#France for a very short
synopsis of the GR issue.
is this something the
Minh Nguyen writes:
On 2015-04-03 22:25, Russ Nelson wrote:
Greg Morgan writes:
* In my case, TIGER isn't all the that bad.
In some NY counties, TIGER is very good. In other places it is like
Stevie Wonder was in charge of quality control. What I've heard is
that the maps
Eleanor,
I want to clarify some things:
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 1:06 AM, Eleanor Tutt eleanor.t...@gmail.com wrote:
Paul - If perception of mapping in the US isn't aligning with reality, we
probably *do* need to do a better job as a chapter board of telling the full
story.
I believe that the
On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 11:19 AM, Martijn van Exel mart...@openstreetmap.us
wrote:
It would be nice if we could have SotM US this June be a venue to dispel
some of the assumptions that seem to exist abroad about the U.S
OpenStreetMap community. Reducing the U.S. community to a bunch of couch
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 2:55 AM, Serge Wroclawski emac...@gmail.com wrote:
The events are characterized as Edit-a-thons and they were designed
to be run indoors. They were essentially a response from some members
of the community who felt that Mapping Parties were not for them. The
advantage
I actually think it's fine Frederik has opinions about how we should do
things around here in the US and shares them. I just don't want to be
called a couch potato in the course of it ;-)
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 8:57 AM, Kate Chapman k...@maploser.com wrote:
On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 7:18 PM,
On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 8:53 PM, Paul Norman penor...@mac.com wrote:
In the current board term I counted 15 blog posts. The breakdown of these
is
7 conference
3 indoor computer-based events
2 non-OSM geo-related projects
2 chapter administrative
1 HOT
Last year, it is similar, except the
Also! There's still time to join the upcoming #mapathon by organizing an
event in your community
https://twitter.com/OpenStreetMapUS/status/584378522245922816
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 11:33 AM, Serge Wroclawski emac...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 11:09 AM, Eleanor Tutt
Am 04.04.2015 um 14:57 schrieb Kate Chapman:
...
Small reality check (not saying that this is anybodies fault, just how
it is):
- the US community shapes how the project is perceived by the media globally
- US based companies control the majority of funds spent on OSM
development and have a
Am 03.04.2015 um 02:41 schrieb stevea:
Facts about the world
Simon Poole writes:
Up to now OSM has drawn the line in such a way that stuff that is
signposted and is observable on the ground is fair game (with some
exceptions, I believe the GR issue is still unsolved).
Yes, all of that is
Hi, Serge.
As a member of the chapter board, I feel a bit erased? misrepresented? by
your email. It hurt, especially because I think you and I share some common
ground about why we map and that it is important to feel a connection to a
place.
At any rate, while you are more qualified to speak to
Many areas of the western US are sparsely populated. Not only are there few
mappers per square mile, there are simply very few people per square mile.
I map were I visit. But in more than a few cases I may only visit and area
once. This could lead to the same issue you worry about for imports:
On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 7:18 PM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote:
Hi,
On 04/03/2015 02:41 AM, stevea wrote:
It seems to me that in the USA, what people think about OSM is one of
these two:
(a) A project for hackers and couch potatoes who trawl their county web
pages and other
Thanks so much, Serge - seriously. Your apology means a lot to me.
Happy mapping!
Eleanor
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 10:33 AM, Serge Wroclawski emac...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 11:09 AM, Eleanor Tutt eleanor.t...@gmail.com
wrote:
Hi, Serge.
As a member of the chapter board,
Hi all,
I have been reading most of the exchange about the different approaches.
My take on it is that the entire discussion is missing something that is in
my view much more important than the quality of the data at the moment of
important:
I am much more worried about imports for a completely
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 11:09 AM, Eleanor Tutt eleanor.t...@gmail.com wrote:
Hi, Serge.
As a member of the chapter board, I feel a bit erased? misrepresented? by
your email. It hurt, especially because I think you and I share some common
ground about why we map and that it is important to feel
Hi Frederik,
On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 3:36 AM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote:
Hi,
On 04/04/2015 07:20 PM, Simon Poole wrote:
I just don't want to be called a couch potato in the course of it ;-)
Seriously, I believe Frederik was more referring to how OSM is viewed by
third
On 4/3/2015 5:32 PM, Eleanor Tutt wrote:
I'm interested in hearing more about how and why people contribute to
the map.
It's just a hobby for me, a way to get out and learn some obscure
facts about a place. Most contributions come from a GPS survey or
local observation. Although I
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 2:21 PM, Darrell Fuhriman darr...@garnix.org wrote:
TIGER is much older than reasonably portable GPS units.
According to [1] pre-TIGER paper map sources were below the quality of the
1:100,000 DLG data outside of urban areas. Many of the crazy spaghetti data
areas we see
I feel the OSM project is missing a major opportunity to find mappers, by
focusing on finding mappers.
Instead find enthusiasts for . It
could be RV toilets, street art,
abandoned railways (ahem), free book stands, fairy houses, whatever.
OSM is far behind
On 2015-04-03 22:25, Russ Nelson wrote:
Greg Morgan writes:
* In my case, TIGER isn't all the that bad.
In some NY counties, TIGER is very good. In other places it is like
Stevie Wonder was in charge of quality control. What I've heard is
that the maps they were digitizing off were of MUCH
exceptions, I believe the GR issue is still unsolved).
Yes, all of that is fair game. Though I don't know what the GR
issue is, and ask you to please clarify.
Sorry for the late answer, been on the road for two days and now are
on a rather flaky network connection. See
Am 04.04.2015 um 18:40 schrieb stevea:
Re: [Talk-us] Facts about the world
I respectfully and strenuously disagree. We still (and likely will)
continue to have some predictable and manageable problems with import
of data from third party sources, but we have procedures in place to
make
Am 04.04.2015 um 17:03 schrieb Alex Barth:
I just don't want to be called a couch potato in the course of it ;-)
Couch carrot? :-P
Seriously, I believe Frederik was more referring to how OSM is viewed by
third parties and the impression outsiders could get from the image we
tend to market. And
On 4/3/2015 10:06 PM, Eleanor Tutt wrote:
Paul - If perception of mapping in the US isn't aligning with reality,
we probably *do* need to do a better job as a chapter board of telling
the full story. I see what you mean about the blog posts, though I do
think your interpretation is a bit
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 10:04 AM, Minh Nguyen m...@nguyen.cincinnati.oh.us
wrote:
On 2015-04-03 22:25, Russ Nelson wrote:
Greg Morgan writes:
* In my case, TIGER isn't all the that bad.
In some NY counties, TIGER is very good. In other places it is like
Stevie Wonder was in charge of
OSM started out with the do-it-yourself, clean room approach of
on-the-ground surveying. It offers the strongest guarantee of legal
compliance and appropriateness for OSM -- no legal analysis
required. All of us certainly hold such efforts in the highest
esteem, but I do see an argument for
Hi,
On 04/04/2015 07:20 PM, Simon Poole wrote:
I just don't want to be called a couch potato in the course of it ;-)
Seriously, I believe Frederik was more referring to how OSM is viewed by
third parties
Indeed. I don't have much exposure to US Americans outside of OSM but in
the few
On Apr 4, 2015, at 1:36 PM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote:
Indeed. I don't have much exposure to US Americans outside of OSM but in
the few interactions like that I had, if people did have any conception
about OSM it usually fell into one of the two categories I mentioned -
On 4/4/2015 1:04 PM, Minh Nguyen wrote:
I wonder if it was even about the resolution in some counties. It's as
if the data was traced off a cartogram, or maybe reconstructed from a
table of intersections.
Or recorded with a GPS back in the days when the signal was scrambled,
that is with the
On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 6:14 AM, Volker Schmidt vosc...@gmail.com wrote:
I am much more worried about imports for a completely different reason,
and that is data maintenance
If the external data were not imported, but kept in a separate
external-data layer, the situation could be
On 2015-04-02 17:41, stevea wrote:
Simon Poole writes:
Up to now OSM has drawn the line in such a way that stuff that is
signposted and is observable on the ground is fair game (with some
exceptions, I believe the GR issue is still unsolved).
Yes, all of that is fair game. Though I don't
TIGER is much older than reasonably portable GPS units. It was originally
developed for the 1990 Census, which means work began much earlier than that.
In 1990, handheld GPS units were not even available to the military.
Much of the original data was traced from paper maps (which is also true
So I think the issue of long term data maintenance is a separate issue from
that of imports though imported data may spotlight the issue more.
Agreed. Data maintenance is a much duller task than adding new data, and that’s
going to be an issue anywhere and has nothing to do with the origin of
Not sure it is necessary to suggest all nonhackers and non humanitarians on
this list are couch potatoes to further the argument.
Osm is a place where imports happen, we have rules to stick to, we want to
have educated discussions about those rules.
I am tired of import bashing as an
Hello!
While I think that (vetted, high quality) imports and armchair mapping have
the ability to improve OSM, especially for things like building footprints
that are hard to survey on the ground without traipsing across private
property, I certainly hope that people do not view the US as
On 04/03/2015 02:41 AM, stevea wrote:
Erring on the side of high ground safety might be
a good place to plant an initial flag, but if it's location is wrong and
we need to move it to a more accurate place, we must do so.
And Frederik Ramm replied:
Frankly - no. OSM does not depend on the
On 4/3/2015 8:18 AM, Frederik Ramm wrote:
Hi,
I'm really sad that time and time again we have to fight about whether
or not a specific source is permitted to be used in OSM, when we could
just collect the facts ourselves and therefore be completely free of any
legal implications (and also
Darrell,
On 04/03/2015 08:39 PM, Darrell Fuhriman wrote:
Ignore the haters, we’re doing fine.
I don't know if that thing about haters is just a generic figure of
speech but if you should indeed believe that I have expressed hate about
anything, then you are mistaken (and I would feel a bit
On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 12:11 PM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote:
Darrell,
On 04/03/2015 08:39 PM, Darrell Fuhriman wrote:
Ignore the haters, we’re doing fine.
I don't know if that thing about haters is just a generic figure of
speech but if you should indeed believe that I have
Eleanor,
I don't see a reason not to be public with my reply to you.
I organize mapping parties during the warmer months (have one next
week) and during the colder months, organize indoor mapping events.
The indoor events tend to get less participants than the outdoor ones,
which is surprising.
Greg Morgan writes:
* In my case, TIGER isn't all the that bad.
In some NY counties, TIGER is very good. In other places it is like
Stevie Wonder was in charge of quality control. What I've heard is
that the maps they were digitizing off were of MUCH lower resolution
than we have available now.
Frederik Ramm writes:
isn't us who must move our flag to make it (even) easier to swamp us
with (often low quality) third-party data.
You're blowing smoke in a no-smoking zone, Frederik. Looking at BNSF's
system map (or calling up BNSF's public affairs office) to see what
they call their
Hi everyone,
Second warning. Please cool it down. We're all in this project together,
and if we can't keep our conversations on the mailing list civil then we
should step away from the e-mail client and go map.
-Ian
___
Talk-us mailing list
On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 2:32 PM, Eleanor Tutt eleanor.t...@gmail.com wrote:
Side note relevant to this conversation: I would love to hear from mappers
in the US who are collecting data on the ground - either by themselves or
by organizing mapathons and building community. I can think of quite
Serge - Thanks for the detailed response! I think I do recall seeing your
blog post in the past, but I reread it now and your concerns - especially
who decides what gets shown on the map - very much resonate with me.
Paul - If perception of mapping in the US isn't aligning with reality, we
On 4/3/2015 11:19 AM, Martijn van Exel wrote:
Perhaps we, as the U.S. chapter, play a role in creating or sustaining
these false assumptions?
Yes. To substantiate this, I looked at communications from the US chapter
I looked through the current board term and the previous board term.
In the
My god, this is arrogant.
Crap like this is the #1 reason I’m not an OSMF member.
If this is what counts as the “OSM community” – I want no part of it.
d.
On Apr 3, 2015, at 17:53, Paul Norman penor...@mac.com wrote:
On 4/3/2015 11:19 AM, Martijn van Exel wrote:
Perhaps we, as the U.S.
On Apr 3, 2015, at 5:18 AM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote:
. . .
It seems to me that in the USA, what people think about OSM is one of
these two:
(a) A project for hackers and couch potatoes who trawl their county web
pages and other sources to look for stuff they could upload
Simon Poole writes:
Up to now OSM has drawn the line in such a way that stuff that is
signposted and is observable on the ground is fair game (with some
exceptions, I believe the GR issue is still unsolved).
Yes, all of that is fair game. Though I don't know what the GR
issue is, and ask you
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