Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-04-20 Thread Greg Troxel
Martijn van Exel m...@rtijn.org writes: On Wed, Mar 25, 2015 at 3:00 AM, Minh Nguyen m...@nguyen.cincinnati.oh.us wrote: If you're lucky, you can find an Ohio city limit's legal definition in county commissioners' minutes when an annexation is proposed. The most authoritative data

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-28 Thread Russ Nelson
Serge Wroclawski writes: It's entirely possible that the names the locals use for that river differ from the government dataset, in which case, OSM would prefer you use the local name as the primary name, and not the official one. This is the USGS standard for naming in their topo maps.

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-25 Thread Martijn van Exel
On Wed, Mar 25, 2015 at 3:00 AM, Minh Nguyen m...@nguyen.cincinnati.oh.us wrote: On 2015-03-24 13:57, Martijn van Exel wrote: I have long been on the fence about boundaries in OSM, and while I don't feel as strongly about it any longer, it still feels wrong to make this sweeping exception to

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-25 Thread Bryce Nesbitt
On Wed, Mar 25, 2015 at 2:00 AM, Minh Nguyen m...@nguyen.cincinnati.oh.us wrote: I've taken quite a few imported municipal boundaries, lined them up with road easements or hedges between farms _when that is obviously the intent_, and deleted extra nodes. These borders become far more accurate

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-24 Thread Kevin Kenny
On 03/23/2015 12:29 PM, Bryce Nesbitt wrote: The nice thing about mapping a neighborhood name as a point feature is: a) It helps people locate the neighborhood b) it completely sidesteps the question of the exact, possibly fuzzy, boundaries. For 10% of the hassle you map 90% of the benefit.

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-24 Thread Jack Burke
I would politely disagree that TIGER is an authoritative source for two reasons: 1) The extensive TIGER cleanup that is still being done years after the last import, and 2) While helpful at compiling data, the federal government is not authoritative for any boundaries within a state (and once

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-24 Thread Richard Welty
On 3/24/15 6:01 PM, Jack Burke wrote: I would politely disagree that TIGER is an authoritative source for two reasons: 1) The extensive TIGER cleanup that is still being done years after the last import, and well, if that data were removed and sourced externally, the problems with TIGER

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-24 Thread Clifford Snow
On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 7:46 AM, Kevin Kenny kken...@nycap.rr.com wrote: Or follow the obvious rule: Let the local mappers decide. Use point features for indeterminate things. In areas where neighborhoods have borders that are identifiable on the ground, map the borders. Some neighborhoods

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-24 Thread Martijn van Exel
I have long been on the fence about boundaries in OSM, and while I don't feel as strongly about it any longer, it still feels wrong to make this sweeping exception to one of the fundamental conventions of OSM mapping: verifiability. For many types of land use, anyone would be able to verify

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-23 Thread Frederik Ramm
Greg, 3. It is my belief and experience that the ground observable rule is something that only applies to Europe or older metropolitan areas. I think there's a misunderstanding here. Of course even in European metropolitan areas there will *not* be a sign bearing the name of every stream that

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-23 Thread Richard Fairhurst
Greg Morgan wrote: 2. To quote Richard Fairhurst, Seriously, OSM in the [England] s still way beyond broken. You can open it at any random location and the map is just __fictional__. Here are two random examples bing;OS StreetView [2] shape is approximate. Needs proper survey as mostly

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-23 Thread Serge Wroclawski
On Mon, Mar 23, 2015 at 2:30 AM, Greg Morgan dr.kludge...@gmail.com wrote: 1. Every time this boundary debate or accuracy debate comes up, I image that I am supposed to have $20,000 of GPS equipment[1]; post process the data so that it is accurate; before I dare put the data in OSM. I agree

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-23 Thread Serge Wroclawski
I agree 100% with Bryce. - Serge On Mon, Mar 23, 2015 at 12:29 PM, Bryce Nesbitt bry...@obviously.com wrote: The nice thing about mapping a neighborhood name as a point feature is: a) It helps people locate the neighborhood b) it completely sidesteps the question of the exact, possibly

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-23 Thread Greg Morgan
On Sun, Mar 22, 2015 at 2:04 PM, Minh Nguyen m...@nguyen.cincinnati.oh.us wrote: tl;dr: I'm against a blanket rule when it comes to administrative boundaries. They're really nuanced, and so should we. On 2015-03-22 04:32, Serge Wroclawski wrote: Imagine if Bob and Alice conflict on where a

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-23 Thread Bryce Nesbitt
The nice thing about mapping a neighborhood name as a point feature is: a) It helps people locate the neighborhood b) it completely sidesteps the question of the exact, possibly fuzzy, boundaries. For 10% of the hassle you map 90% of the benefit. ___

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-23 Thread Clifford Snow
On Mon, Mar 23, 2015 at 10:29 AM, Bryce Nesbitt bry...@obviously.com wrote: The nice thing about mapping a neighborhood name as a point feature is: a) It helps people locate the neighborhood b) it completely sidesteps the question of the exact, possibly fuzzy, boundaries. For 10% of the

Re: [Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-23 Thread Bryce Nesbitt
On Mon, Mar 23, 2015 at 10:39 AM, Clifford Snow cliff...@snowandsnow.us wrote: Except when it reports you are in a different neighborhood than you actually are. A point feature does not imply a radius. A governmental defined neighborhood boundary is totally mappable at the right admin level,

[Talk-us] Boundaries and verifiability (was Re: Retagging hamlets in the US)

2015-03-22 Thread Minh Nguyen
tl;dr: I'm against a blanket rule when it comes to administrative boundaries. They're really nuanced, and so should we. On 2015-03-22 04:32, Serge Wroclawski wrote: Imagine if Bob and Alice conflict on where a neighborhood boundary is inside OSM. The issue escalates to an edit war and the DWG