3. srsly?! | Re: I’m running for OSMF board and I’ve set up
office hours for questions (Rory McCann)
Good afternoon everybody,
I pay attention only occasionally to the talk-list, but this message
resonated in Geochicas and made me (us) feel attacked, from the tone and
expressions chosen
Hi,
it occurs to me that I should have provided more context to this message.
I wrote:
On 12/3/20 00:44, Frederik Ramm wrote:
> People have thought the same about Donald Trump - yeah, this
> whole grab-them-by-the-pussy talk is just showmanship and once elected
> he'll be more presidential. But
Since you asked, I am a company employee myself and I fully support Michal in
following his company's official position. We are not talking about a matter
that would warrant whistleblowing, we disagree on an interpretation of a
license term we all agree is not very specific. All interpretations
Danke, dass Du dich hier noch mal ganz eindeutig für jegliche
Verantwortungs-Position in OpenStreetMap disqualifizierst.
Zum Verständnis: Zunächst fällt Michal zum Thema Attribution nichts anderes
ein, als mechanisch-roboterhaft die Formulierungen anderer nachzuplappern. Die
Frage nach der
On Wed, 2 Dec 2020 at 21:50, Michal Migurski wrote:
> I am speaking here as an individual and not on behalf of Facebook
I'd have no problem with Facebook, or any other commercial
organisation, putting up a candidate for a seat on the board; but I am
having trouble seeing how the above statement
On Dec 3, 2020, at 6:12 PM, Michal Migurski wrote:
> For those using or defending rape metaphors, shame on you.
I take offense (and will not be shamed) at Mike's gross mischaracterization
(after I took GREAT pains to be painstaking) of my reiteration of Frederik's
analogy of offensive-to-women
Hi Robert, Christoph, and Mateusz, thanks again for continuing to engage in
this thread!
I’m going to post just once more since I think we’re reaching the limits of how
much I can say on behalf of my employer here. I’m participating as a way to
make myself available for questions and feedback
Mikel:
I’m disappointed to see you characterize Frederik’s characterization of
behavior as “garbage;” to do so is a red herring (intentional distraction).
While I don’t want to put words in Frederik's mouth (indeed, I said I fully
understand why he used such colorful language — to vividly
Dec 3, 2020, 11:07 by dieterdre...@gmail.com:
> Am Do., 3. Dez. 2020 um 10:49 Uhr schrieb Mateusz Konieczny via talk <>
> talk@openstreetmap.org> >:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> Dec 3, 2020, 00:44 by >> frede...@remote.org>> :
>>
>>> People have thought the same about Donald Trump - yeah, this
>>> whole
>>>
> Robert Whittaker (OSM lists) hat am
> 03.12.2020 12:27 geschrieben:
>
> [...] It means that the
> attribution method you use must be reasonably calculated to ensure
> that *every* person viewing will be aware that content has come from
> OpenStreetMap. Nowhere does the clause allow you to
Thanks Mateusz, I agree. Points can easily be made without such garbage.
Unfortunately Frederik has a habit of using rhetoric that evokes violence
against women. I’m not saying that he or anyone here personally holds biased
views about women. But the effect is the same, it degrades our entire
On Wed, 2 Dec 2020 at 21:56, Michal Migurski wrote:
> First, the text of the ODbL is explicit about “reasonably calculated”
> awareness. FB believes its maps comply with this. The ODbL does not require
> that “every” person see the attribution. It requires that “any” person can.
I believe that
Am Do., 3. Dez. 2020 um 10:49 Uhr schrieb Mateusz Konieczny via talk <
talk@openstreetmap.org>:
>
>
>
> Dec 3, 2020, 00:44 by frede...@remote.org:
>
> People have thought the same about Donald Trump - yeah, this
> whole
>
> I think that form of this is very unfortunate and references
> to Trump
Dec 3, 2020, 00:44 by frede...@remote.org:
> People have thought the same about Donald Trump - yeah, this
> whole
>
I think that form of this is very unfortunate and references
to Trump and genitalia could be dropped without losing anything.
This really have not added anything useful and this
While I have travelled widely, I call California home (and have for several
decades) so I unapologetically have a parochial perspective from the USA.
Clifford, I deeply respect you, Frederik and many others in OSM: it is a
global project about all of Earth (and its humanity, among other
Frederik,
I've had it with four years of listening to Trump. Not only don't I want to
hear it on OSM but it's completely inappropriate for a mailing list. Can
you please respond in a constructive manner.
Thanks,
Clifford
On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 3:45 PM Frederik Ramm wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On 12/2/20
Dec 3, 2020, 00:44 by frede...@remote.org:
> Hi,
>
> On 12/2/20 23:09, Mateusz Konieczny via talk wrote:
>
>> FB’s attribution to OSM is available to any viewer in a place that
>> is commonly associated with attribution.
>>
>> Barely visible icon that must be clicked is not a standard place
On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 2:56 PM Michal Migurski wrote:
> In some specific cases there may be a conflict of interest where I’d
> recuse myself, but in general it’s much more likely that FB and other
> companies’ need for a high-quality, free, global map with a healthy org
> behind it is *strongly
Hi,
On 12/2/20 23:09, Mateusz Konieczny via talk wrote:
> FB’s attribution to OSM is available to any viewer in a place that
> is commonly associated with attribution.
>
> Barely visible icon that must be clicked is not a standard place for
> attribution.
Agree with Mateusz, and I'm
Michal Migurski:
Hi Robert, Martin, Alexandre, Jochen, Richard, Tom:
Thanks for your followups in this conversation! I am speaking here as an individual
and not on behalf of Facebook,
great.
...
First, the text of the ODbL is explicit about “reasonably calculated” awareness. FB
believes
> First, the text of the ODbL is explicit about “reasonably calculated”
> awareness. FB believes its maps comply with this. The ODbL does not require
> that “every” person see the attribution. It requires that “any” person can.
> FB’s attribution to OSM is available to any viewer in a place
Hi Michal,,
> Successful attribution guidelines published by the OSMF will make it much
> easier to decide how to interpret the ODbL.
The problem is, I expect the current draft will not get support from the
community so for me its back to my original question.
Given the community
Dec 2, 2020, 22:50 by m...@teczno.com:
> The ODbL does not require that “every” person see the attribution. It
> requires that “any” person can.
>
Untrue.
"notice associated withthe Produced Work reasonably calculated to make any
Person that
uses,views, accesses, interacts with, or is
Hi Robert, Martin, Alexandre, Jochen, Richard, Tom:
Thanks for your followups in this conversation! I am speaking here as an
individual and not on behalf of Facebook, so I’m going to focus on the areas
relevant to board candidacy.
First, the text of the ODbL is explicit about “reasonably
I would like to ask a question related to #1.
Let's make a thought exercise. OSM provides geographical data, right? By
definition, a map is a visualization of geographical and other types of
data. In this case, a tile server is nothing more than the visual
representation of the geographical data.
On 02/12/2020 09:27, Richard Fairhurst wrote:
Michal Migurski wrote:
> FB’s attribution approach in keeping with best practices
seen from other commercial users of display maps.
In the spirit of Twitter footnoting one of Donald Trump's "I won the
election" tweets, this is your respectful
Am Mi., 2. Dez. 2020 um 09:51 Uhr schrieb Robert Whittaker (OSM lists) <
robert.whittaker+...@gmail.com>:
> On Wed, 2 Dec 2020 at 03:41, Michal Migurski wrote:
>
> > Facebook is in compliance with the ODbL license which requires that
> attribution be “reasonably calculated to make any Person
On Tue, Dec 01, 2020 at 07:36:24PM -0800, Michal Migurski wrote:
> Facebook is in compliance with the ODbL license which requires that
> attribution be “reasonably calculated to make any Person that uses, views,
> accesses, interacts with, or is otherwise exposed to the Produced Work aware”
>
Michal Migurski wrote:
> FB’s attribution approach in keeping with best practices
> seen from other commercial users of display maps.
In the spirit of Twitter footnoting one of Donald Trump's "I won the election"
tweets, this is your respectful reminder that Google, Bing, Here, Tencent,
On Wed, 2 Dec 2020 at 03:41, Michal Migurski wrote:
> Facebook is in compliance with the ODbL license which requires that
> attribution be “reasonably calculated to make any Person that uses, views,
> accesses, interacts with, or is otherwise exposed to the Produced Work aware”
> of OSM’s
Hi Michal,
I have a second question on #1
Given the community concern about the lack of ‘community required attribution’
by Facebook (and other major corporations) do you think it would be beneficial
for Facebook to take a corporate lead in updating attribution to that accepted
by the
Great questions, thanks Mateusz!
I’ll start with #2 because the answer is very straightforward: I would recuse
myself from cases where there is a conflict of interest between the
OpenStreetMap Foundation and my employer or other organizations whose boards I
serve on (currently PlanScore,
(1)
In 2019 you answered
"we’re moving toward a consolidated approach to maps at Facebook. Thus, you
will soon
see us take a more uniform approach to the way we handle attribution across all
map
surfaces across the company"
to question[1] about illegal OSM data use (without proper attribution)
Absolutely!
michal migurski- contact info and pgp key:
sf/cahttp://mike.teczno.com/contact.html
> On Nov 30, 2020, at 11:53 AM, Mateusz Konieczny via talk
> wrote:
>
> Is it also OK to ask questions also in public
Is it also OK to ask questions also in public via mailing list?
Nov 30, 2020, 20:00 by m...@teczno.com:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I’m excited to be running for the OSMF board this year! In 2021, OSM’s
> community has two opportunities to grow stronger together: we should make the
> OSM organization
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