Re: replies and cutlines

[ken green]

Mary Bull wrote:

k>>  ... Thankfully this list has picked one method (it's bottom,
k>> right?)

> No, it is "interlined." In a short reply, with only one relevant
> section quoted and the comment below, it looks like "bottom posting."
> But the method is more like conversation than it is like replying to a
> letter.

Umm.. sorry about that.  I was being a smart-ass, trying to be clever,
and failing miserably. My "it's bottom, right?" comment was purely in
jest, as this list uses what I would definitely call bottom posting.

I understand the concept of interlined or interspersed quoting and
commenting, but for me (at least in my cloudy gray mind), that's what I
call bottom posting. It is quite a rare occasion for me to see someone
refer to multiple points and put their response all the way at the
bottom only (and not after each section) that way top-posters might.

When I think of "bottom posting" I think of it as posting replies
beneath (at the bottom of) relevant comments.  What you did in your
response, and what I'm about to do now




> I think so, too. It's not about the individual subscriber's personal
> preference. It's about the entire community, and especially about the
> decisions of the moderators for the good of the community.

That, and being a little thick-skinned.  I saw some posts recently that
mentioned moderators being rude in their public reminders of list
protocol.  I wanted to chime in on the thread, but most of the people in
that discussion said it better than I could anyway.  The only real point
I wanted to make then - and it applies here too - is that being a little
less sensitive seems to work really well with mailing lists.

For me, that means just doing what the group wants.  I don't have the
time or energy to wage a battle about how I think top-posting makes
sense (that's just an example and not a reflection of what I actually
believe).

I think we're saying the same thing basically.  I'm just being
long-winded and more confusing about it...  ;)



> There will always be new subscribers who need reminding and old ones,
> also, from time to time. But, as you noted, Ken, being consistent in
> format is a virtue here. :)

The fact that the mods use templates for the reminders is brilliant.  It
removes the emotional aspect, so if one is having a bad day, just
stubbed his toe, or broke up with girlfriend/boyfriend - they don't have
to fire off a self-righteous bomb to blow off some steam.  (anyone who
has participated on more than 1 or 2 lists/groups knows exactly what I'm
talking about).

-- 
 Ken Green
 Using The Bat! v1.62r on Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195 Service Pack 4



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: replies and cutlines

[Mary Bull]

Hello Ken!

On Friday, October 10, 2003, 10:02 PM, you wrote:

MDP>> Usually a top post (what you are describing) does *not* use
MDP>> quote prefixing and instead quotes the entire original message
MDP>> below the signature in a format like this:



k>  ... Thankfully this list has picked one method (it's bottom,
k> right?)

No, it is "interlined." In a short reply, with only one relevant
section quoted and the comment below, it looks like "bottom posting."
But the method is more like conversation than it is like replying to a
letter.

When you get time, re-read the "Welcome" message.

k> ... and sticks with it. ... That this list is 'strict' about its chosen
k> method is a good thing, IMO.

I think so, too. It's not about the individual subscriber's personal
preference. It's about the entire community, and especially about the
decisions of the moderators for the good of the community.

I have friends, and one relative in particular, who want to correspond
as if in a series of snail-mail letters, with the entire current
series appended below, in a succession of top posts. I do this with
them. It was the only way I knew, until I joined TBUDL. Like everyone
who encounters TBUDL's way for the first time, I wanted to talk about
it and argue about it. But I cooperated.

Now, after almost a year, list protocol or not, it's my preferred way
for e-mail correspondence. But as I said above, the list protocol is
not about individual members' personal philosophies or ways of
handling things or preferences.



k> ... And I have TB Quick templates that can switch between top and
k> bottom with a few keystrokes.

I put my template in the AB address entry for my sister and those
friends who use top posting--mostly people still with Outlook or
Outlook Express, and a few (hold your nose) with Incredimail. :)

I'm writing a little less concisely here than the ideal of the
"Welcome" message, but the list is slow tonight. And I think, also,
that my reply to you makes for an illustration of "interlined"
posting. (I hope I'm using the right term, Marck, Leif, Allie.)

There will always be new subscribers who need reminding and old ones,
also, from time to time. But, as you noted, Ken, being consistent in
format is a virtue here. :)

-- 
Best regards,
Mary

The Bat! 2.00.6 on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 1



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

TB! Backup Sets

[Joseph N.]

I generally backup all the files of all the folders (except trash) of
all my accounts in my userprofile documents directory. My backed up
files go off site. From time to time I also make a TB! backup file for
my slave disk when I've made a significant change in the
configuration. Am I correct in thinking that there's no reason to
include the TB! backup file as part of the off-site backup set,
because it does not add anything beyond the separate files that are
already included in the backup set?

-- 
JN



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Canadian The Bat! discussion list

[Constantin Tanurkov]

Hello Allen,

Allen> What  is  the particular focus of this list?  You said it's available to
Allen> people from all over . . . as are the other lists -- and the other lists
Allen> [this one included] are available to Canadians.

Most of the Canadian users already know that there is a new department
in Toronto which helps for the support and distribution of The Bat! in
Canada. The focus is to get this local community together and to share
some ideas and news connected to Canadian.

Allen> I'm not necessarily criticizing this new list, I am simply curious as to
Allen> why I might want to add yet another TB list to my daily reading . . .

It's a though question because the list exists just for a few hours.

For now, you can just take it as an enthusiastic idea to join people.
And to be honest, I still don't have a clue what exactly that is going
to be. What is sure now, is that I would like it to be a little bit
more than a discussion about The Bat! features, because TBUDL is the
best one for that. It would be great for people who uses The Bat! here
to get know each other and see what's going on in the neighborhood -
may be a colleague is secretly using The Bat! too :-) And for other
folks to check if Canadian are doing well :-)

-- 
 All Best,
 Constantinmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Using The Bat! v2.00.6 on Windows XP  5.1 Build  2600 

"Compromise makes a good umbrella but a poor roof; it is a temporary
expedient." - James Russel Lowell, American editor (1819-1891)



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: replies and cutlines

[Chris]

On Friday, October 10, 2003 at 11:02:01 PM, ken green wrote in the
message "replies and cutlines"
:

> I can see good reasons for both top and bottom posting.  Really.  And I
> love to argue.  Thankfully this list has picked one method (it's bottom,
> right?) and sticks with it.  I'm much more in favor of consistency than
> I am with top or bottom.  That this list is 'strict' about its chosen
> method is a good thing, IMO.

Yes. I agree. Consistency makes everything much easier to understand.

-- 
Chris
Quoting when replying to this message is good for your karma.

In a Restaurant window: "Don't stand there and be hungry, come on in
and get fed up."



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: replies and cutlines

[ken green]

Marck D Pearlstone wrote:
> Usually a top post (what you are describing) does
> *not* use quote prefixing and instead quotes the entire original
> message below the signature in a format like this:


Hmmm...  I disagree slightly.  I would say that people who use Outlook
generally top post in the format you describe because that is the
default behavior of Outlook.

Using a prefix character (>, :, etc.) for quoted text is pretty common
from what I have seen (including just about every web-based mail client
I have played around with).  And that is independent of top (or bottom)
posting.

In fact, I use a reply template for business mail that mimics the
Outlook-style headers quote, but I also use the '>' symbol in front of
those headers and the quoted text.

I sense that the top-posting vs. bottom-posting has the potential of
religious fervor, but I'm not convinced it even matters that much. I end
up using whatever method I think will get my message across best.

I don't care what anyone says about bottom posting being "right" - I
experience top-posting a whole lot more in my business and personal
e-mail alike.  And while I'm very aware that frequency and/or popularity
does not make something right or better, I do know that my ultimate goal
is to have people understand the message I am sending them.

I gave up the fight for ASCII e-mail a long time ago, even though I'll
go to my grave holding onto the idea that HTML does NOT belong in
e-mail.  I know I'm right about this :) but cannot ignore the simple
fact that HTML and rich text mail is more and more common.  And no
matter how hard or how long I preach of its evils, if I am to continue
using e-mail, I will likely see more and more HTML mail.

The Bat - thankfully - provides a beautiful interface for not dealing
with HTML e-mail, so this particular issue is moot for me now anyway.

I can see good reasons for both top and bottom posting.  Really.  And I
love to argue.  Thankfully this list has picked one method (it's bottom,
right?) and sticks with it.  I'm much more in favor of consistency than
I am with top or bottom.  That this list is 'strict' about its chosen
method is a good thing, IMO.

I belong to a motorcycle list where half the people top post and the
other half bottom post.  I just shrug my shoulders and reply using
whatever method the author used.  And I have TB Quick templates that can
switch between top and bottom with a few keystrokes.

-- 
 Ken Green
 Using The Bat! v1.62r on Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195 Service Pack 4



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Canadian The Bat! discussion list

[Allen]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

10/10/2003, 8:46 PM: Constantin said in "Canadian The Bat! discussion list"

CT> Hello guys,

CT> It's  my  pleasure  to  announce  that  there  is  now  new The Bat!
CT> discussion list started in Canada.

What  is  the particular focus of this list?  You said it's available to
people from all over . . . as are the other lists -- and the other lists
[this one included] are available to Canadians.

I'm not necessarily criticizing this new list, I am simply curious as to
why I might want to add yet another TB list to my daily reading . . .

- --
Peace, be well
J Allen R Day  http://jarday.com

The Bat! 2.00.22, BayesIt! 0.4gm | Windows XP Service Pack 1 build 2600
Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much. -Oscar Wilde

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0bhYdJI9u0EvFQ4owCvUZDZa
=kYlo
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Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Canadian The Bat! discussion list

[Constantin Tanurkov]

Hello guys,

It's my pleasure to announce that there is now new The Bat! discussion list
started in Canada. Those of you who live there might find in useful,
and though it is created with purpose to join forces of Canadian The
Bat! users community, all users over the world are welcome! :-)

For more details visit http://www.ritlabs.ca/list.html

My name is Constantin (you can use Kostya as well), and I hope we will
have good and useful time together.

-- 
All the best,
 Constantin  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

  "He whose face gives no light shall never become a star." - William
  Blake, English poet and artist (1757-1827)



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Chancing signature with qtemplate and %ISSIGNATURE

[Robin Anson]

On Sat 11 October 2003, 5:08:27 +1000, Edgar wrote:
> More bad news. I've installed a version on a different computer (TB!
> was never installed there, so it should not pickup any faults) and
> imported my mail folders.
> Then tried the macro's that Robin Anson send.
> 
> ,- [ New Message ]
> | TBUDL members
> | 
> | %cursor
> | 
> | -- 
> | Regards
> | Robin
> | 
> | %Qinclude="TBUDLsig"
> | %Account="Personal"
> `-
> 
> ,- [ TBUDLsig ]
> | Robin Anson
> | Using The Bat! v%THEBATVERSION on %WINDOWSPLATFORMNAME %-
> | %WINDOWSMAJORVERSION.%WINDOWSMINORVERSION Build %-
> | %WINDOWSBUILDNUMBER
> | %WINDOWSCSDVERSION
> | %ISSIGNATURE
> `-
> 
> They do not work. The TBUDLsig will not replace the:
> Regards
> Robin

Make sure that there is a space after the "--" in the new message template.
That is very important otherwise TB won't see that as the beginning of the
signature.


-- 
Robin Anson
Using The Bat! v2.00.6 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600
Service Pack 1



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

The Bat! Media review

[Robyn Winter]

Hi listers

Noticed the following article in "The Age" a daily newspaper here in Melbourne,
Australia. The Bat! is getting some well deserved, favourable media attention.

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2003/10/08/1065292647734.html


-- 
Regards
Robyn 


This e-mail message and accompanying data may contain information that is
confidential and subject to privilege. If you are not the intended recipient,
you are notified that any use, dissemination, distribution or copying of this
message or data is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please
notify us immediately and delete all material pertaining to this e-mail.



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
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Re: Woody's EMAIL Essentials?

[Marck D Pearlstone]

Hi Rich,

@10-Oct-2003, 13:56 -0400 (18:56 UK time) rich gregory [RG] in
mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said to Bill:

RG> Hey Batters...  Is there an archive where we can upload these
RG> tools for each other?  I'd love to help everybody as much as I
RG> am helped but would not welcome so much individual email replies
RG> to some number of users who could benefit.

http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/Library.html

-- 
Cheers -- .\\arck D Pearlstone -- List moderator
TB! v2.00.22 on Windows XP 5.1.2600 Service Pack 1


pgp0.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Reply would not quote

[Dave Gorman]

Hi Mary,

On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 15:18:11 -0500

Mary Bull wrote:

> D> Maybe a faulty address book template?
> 
> Exactly. You are brilliant. Thanks a bunch! All fixed now. :)

That's certainly a stretch! Just a lucky guess... But I'm glad it's
working OK now :)

-- 
Dave




Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Reply would not quote

[Mary Bull]

Hello Dave!

On Friday, October 10, 2003, 1:36 PM, you wrote:

MB>> Last night when I clicked Reply to answer a private message, the body
MB>> of the message was not quoted. There was only a blank field for the
MB>> body of the message, plus my sig.

D> Is this happening for all replies? or just replies to this address?

Only replies to this single message at this address. Or at least,
that's what I thought. Went to the folder--all replies, old mail that
I had replied to previously with no quoting problem, gave me a blank
message body.

So, I went to the address book, and sure enough, you are right. When I
took out the Account address defaults, to keep them out of the
folders, I missed putting the regex that says to quote, into the Reply
template, at this address.

D> Maybe a faulty address book template?

Exactly. You are brilliant. Thanks a bunch! All fixed now. :)

-- 
Best regards,
Mary

The Bat! 2.00.6 on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 1



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Chancing signature with qtemplate and %ISSIGNATURE

[Edgar]

Hello Roelof,

On Friday, October 10, 2003, 12:07:38 AM, you wrote:

> In that case the only thing I can think of is that maybe something
> gone amiss with your TB. Try to install it again, maybe that'll help.

I've also uninstalled the new installation on the other PC and tried
it without importing my messages.

Also then it will not replace the signature.


-- 
Cheers,
 Edgar

Communicating with TB! v2.00.6, Windows XP 5.1.2600 Service Pack 1

How many cares one loses when one decides not to be something but to
be someone. - Coco Chanel

  
 
  



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Chancing signature with qtemplate and %ISSIGNATURE

[Edgar]

Hello Roelof,

On Friday, October 10, 2003, 12:07:38 AM, you wrote:

E>> No solution, but an additional problem.

> In that case the only thing I can think of is that maybe something
> gone amiss with your TB. Try to install it again, maybe that'll help.

More bad news. I've installed a version on a different computer (TB!
was never installed there, so it should not pickup any faults) and
imported my mail folders.
Then tried the macro's that Robin Anson send.

,- [ New Message ]
| TBUDL members
| 
| %cursor
| 
| -- 
| Regards
| Robin
| 
| %Qinclude="TBUDLsig"
| %Account="Personal"
`-

,- [ TBUDLsig ]
| Robin Anson
| Using The Bat! v%THEBATVERSION on %WINDOWSPLATFORMNAME %-
| %WINDOWSMAJORVERSION.%WINDOWSMINORVERSION Build %-
| %WINDOWSBUILDNUMBER
| %WINDOWSCSDVERSION
| %ISSIGNATURE
`-

They do not work. The TBUDLsig will not replace the:
Regards
Robin

Is it in my mail folders? :

-- 
Cheers,
 Edgar

Communicating with TB! v2.00.6, Windows XP 5.1.2600 Service Pack 1

If you work on your mind with your mind, how can you avoid immense
confusion? - Seng-Ts'an

  
 
  



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: the folder template vs address book template lecture

[Urban]

Friday, October 10, 2003, Vishal wrote:

> I was actually looking for Marck's post on the subject, not the
> template locations themselves.

Do you mean any of these?

Date: Sat, 14 Jun 2003
Subject: Re: Folder template and to address


Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2003
Subject: Re: RitLabs The Bat password


-- 
Urban

Instrumentalist is a many-purposed word for many player-types.


Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Reply would not quote

[Dave Gorman]

Hi Mary,

On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 13:09:16 -0500

Mary Bull wrote:

> Last night when I clicked Reply to answer a private message, the body
> of the message was not quoted. There was only a blank field for the
> body of the message, plus my sig.

Is this happening for all replies? or just replies to this address?
Maybe a faulty address book template?

-- 
Dave




Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: MenuNavigator Button

[Michael L. Cusac]

Steve & Mary King wrote in
:

> Hey, that's handy!  More software should have that feature.

Oh, yes, it is /very/ handy.  TB!'s menu item locations are mostly
counterintuitive to me, so I used it all the time.  I only have my
keybindings memorized for a few oft-repeated tasks, so now I spend too
much time hunting through the pull-downs.  Thanks to all who replied;
I guess I will install a 1.6x beta, since I am not willing to try 2.x
just yet.

Btw, thanks to all who have replied to recent questions of mine.  I
didn't want to clutter the list with 'thank-yous', but I really do
appreciate how helpful you all are.

-- 
Mike

TB! v1.62r
Hamster Classic v1.3.23.4
Windows XP 5.1.2600 Service Pack 1



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Reply would not quote

[Mary Bull]

Hello Everyone!

Last night when I clicked Reply to answer a private message, the body
of the message was not quoted. There was only a blank field for the
body of the message, plus my sig.

I tried again, using the menu. Same result. Even selective
highlighting will not move any quotes into the Edit Mail Message
window.

Ended up "copying-and-pasting" and just labeling changes of speaker,
as in a script, for the in-line conversation I wanted to have with
this correspondent. It was a drag. Actually, for the first paragraph I
manually put in the angle-brackets, but soon concluded that was too
tedious and would anyway take me all night.

This is the first and only message in which I have seen this behavior.
I tried again this morning with the same message and same result--no
quoted words in the body of the Reply, in the Edit Mail Message
window.

Has anyone else seen anything like this in TB! v. 2.00.6?

--
Best regards,
Mary 

The Bat 2.00.6 on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 1






Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Woody's EMAIL Essentials?

[rich gregory]

Bill wrote:>>>  I use an external to clean subject lines on incoming mail.

Hello Bill, Still looking for a way to clean up text in your email folders?  I now 
have a great filter/batch file combo working thanks to Robin Anson and Roelof Otten!

Hey Batters...  Is there an archive where we can upload these tools for each other?  
I'd love to help everybody as much as I am helped but would not welcome so much 
individual email replies to some number of users who could benefit.

Thx

Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Filter/BAT file interaction

[rich gregory]

RO> I'm using this batch file and nothing got frozen:
RO> c:\windows\command\edit c:\edit.txt
RO> "c:\Program Files\The Bat!\thebat.exe" /importu=roelof;F=Inbox;X;R;IN=c:\edit.txt
RO> I exported the message (as unix mailbox) to the
RO> file c:\edit.txt, the account I was using is called roelof.
RO> When I used different combinations of quotation marks
RO> than I do now, I got very mixing results.
RO> BTW You didn't check 'Wait for completion' at the run external command
RO> stuff, did you?

IT WORKS NOW!!  I can edit my messages again!!!  Hooray!

Yes, the "wait.." box was checked.  I do not know why it works that way for Robin and 
not for me but now...  who cares!

My BAT file differs slightly from both yours and Robins as since I wrongly suspected 
it and not the filter as the culprit I started working there to ensure it was correct.

My .TXT file association works as I want it so I do not call the editor as you do but 
only call the TXT file created by the UNIX export.

I also was interested to make sure the quotes and long file names were not at fault.  
My .BAT file is:

start /max /wait c:\temp\edit.txt
"c:\progra~1\thebat~1\thebat.exe" 
/importu=[ACCOUNTNAME];f="Inbox";X;R;IN=c:\temp\edit.txt

Thanks so much all.  This program may yet be completely everything I need it to be!  
;->
-- 



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: MenuNavigator Button

[Matt Thoene]

On Friday, October 10, 2003 @ 8:46:27 AM [-0700], Thomas Fernandez wrote:

>> it saves you manually running your mouth through all the menus trying to
>  ^
 
> Have you checked out Voice Recognition software? If so, you wouldn't
> need to run your mouth by hand.

Hah! Oh man, I'm drinking your standard american Starbucks venti white
mocha and almost had it come through my nose after reading this...

I know...OT...

-- 
Matt



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: MenuNavigator Button

[Thomas Fernandez]

Hello Allen,

On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 09:27:04 -0400 GMT (10/10/2003, 20:27 +0700 GMT),
Allen wrote:

> it saves you manually running your mouth through all the menus trying to
     ^
 
Have you checked out Voice Recognition software? If so, you wouldn't
need to run your mouth by hand.

scnr

-- 

Cheers,
Thomas.

Moderator der deutschen The Bat! Beginner Liste.

I got into the gene pool while the lifeguard wasn't watching.

Message reply created with The Bat! 2.00.22
under Chinese Windows 98 4.10 Build  A 
using a Pentium P4 1.7 GHz, 128MB RAM




Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: replies and cutlines

[Leif Gregory]

Hello John,

Friday, October 10, 2003, 8:51:59 AM, you wrote:
JLC> Can someone point me to the RFC that describes the posting rules
JLC> people are talking about?

I'm not sure you're mixing your request. The TB list rules are very
specific concerning top-posting, which is at:

http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/subtbudl.txt

You also received this when you subscribed in the welcome message.

However, if you're looking for an actual RFC, then 1855 is the one
concerning netiquette. It's at:

http://www.dtcc.edu/cs/rfc1855.html


JLC> If someone can point me to the RFC that say's that top posting is
JLC> wrong then I may attempt to change my writing style:)

It's not quite so much black and white. Wrong or Right. It's what
the majority of people consider to be acceptable. Like writing
(actual letters) to a friend would be different from a letter you'd
write to a business. You could write to a business (maybe a cover
letter for a job application) like you would write one to a friend,
but I doubt that you'd be high on the list for an interview at that
point.



-- 
Leif (TB list moderator and fellow end user).

Using The Bat! 2.00.22 under Windows 2000 5.0
Build 2195 Service Pack 3 on a Pentium 4 2GHz with 512MB



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: replies and cutlines

[John L Crain]

Hello Ken,


Been a little busy so haven't managed to follow the thread..shame on
me

Can someone point me to the RFC that describes the posting rules
people are talking about?

If someone can point me to the RFC that say's that top posting is
wrong then I may attempt to change my writing style:)


JC



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: MenuNavigator Button

[Steve & Mary King]

 Allen, Friday, October 10, 2003, 6:27:04 AM, you wrote:==

> The  menu  navigator  makes  it  easy  to  find menu items if you have a
> general  idea of what they are but aren't quite sure /where/ they are --
> it saves you manually running your mouth through all the menus trying to
> find message/flags/flagged -- instead, you just open the menu navigator,
> type flag and watch the search results appear.  Flick on the word in the
> results as appropriate and it will open the menu to that item for you or
> even execute it [press execute].

Hey, that's handy!  More software should have that feature.

Steve . . .



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: replies and cutlines

[MAU]

Hello ken,

> I know that TB's discarding of everything below a cutline is a great
> feature. But what happens if I *don't* want that behavior to occur?


Don't use the %Quotes macro then in your reply template. For example,
for top posting correspondence, which will include _all_ previous
messages, this is the template I use:


%Cursor

-- 
Best regards,
 Miguel A. Urech

- Original Message -
   From: %OFromName <%OFromAddr>
   Date: %ODateEn %OTimeLongEn
Subject: %OFULLSUBJ

%TEXT


HTH

-- 
Best regards,

Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain)
Using The Bat! v2.00.6
Winamp OFF:



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: replies and cutlines

[Marck D Pearlstone]

Hi Ken,

@10-Oct-2003, 09:03 -0500 (15:03 UK time) ken green [K] in
mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said to TBUDL:

K> Aside from a full-on crusade to get the rest of the world to
K> follow posting and cutline rules, is there a better way to do
K> what I am describing?

Yes. A custom template for that recipient that uses a real "top
post" format. Usually a top post (what you are describing) does
*not* use quote prefixing and instead quotes the entire original
message below the signature in a format like this:

- Original message -
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
date: (whenever)
Subject: blah

blah blah blah blah
blah blah blah blah
blah blah blah blah
blah blah blah blah
- End message -

This is how you should do it. Also, you should *not* use a cut mark
in such circumstances.

You would achieve this format with a template like this:

,--/ TopPost template \--
Dear %TOFNAME,

%Cursor

%QINCLUDE="MySig"%-
- Original message -
From: %ofromaddr
date: %odate
Subject: %osubj

%text
- End message -
`-\ End template /-

-- 
Cheers -- .\\arck D Pearlstone -- List moderator
TB! v2.00.22 on Windows XP 5.1.2600 Service Pack 1


pgp0.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
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replies and cutlines

[ken green]

I know that TB's discarding of everything below a cutline is a great
feature.  But what happens if I *don't* want that behavior to occur?

I haven't figured out a way to include a message with more than one
response.  For example:

I am following up on a software request to a developer.  I am selecting
the last message I sent, using Reply All and deleting my own address
from From.  I want to quote my last reply as well as the developer's
message that I had replied to.

But there doesn't seem to be an easy way to do that with TB. I've tried
regular Reply and selective Reply (F4) but both methods remove the
developer's message as it falls below the cutline in my signature. (yes,
they are using top-posting and not removing signature/cutlines... shame
on them..  yadda yadda..)

Even if someone else is doing it "wrong" this behavior seems a bit
count-intuitive to highlight a block of text, press F4, and only have
half of what I've highlighted show up in the reply.  It's like The Bat
is enforcing its own belief about cutlines no matter what I do!

Forwarding the message does not work, as the format and quoting isn't
what I want for a reply.  My current work-around is to reply (which only
gets the topmost post), then go back and forward the message, copying
the second message down (developer's message) and pasting it below what
the Reply grabbed.

Aside from a full-on crusade to get the rest of the world to follow
posting and cutline rules, is there a better way to do what I am
describing?

-- 
 Ken Green
 Using The Bat! v1.62r on Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195 Service Pack 4



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: MenuNavigator Button

[Allen]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

10/10/2003, 8:34 AM: Steve said in "MenuNavigator Button"

SMK> Exactly  what  does the Menu Navigator do? I've pressed that little
SMK> question  mark button and popped up the Menu Navigator window a few
SMK> times, but couldn't get it to do anything? (Inquiring minds and all
SMK> that.)

The  menu  navigator  makes  it  easy  to  find menu items if you have a
general  idea of what they are but aren't quite sure /where/ they are --
it saves you manually running your mouth through all the menus trying to
find message/flags/flagged -- instead, you just open the menu navigator,
type flag and watch the search results appear.  Flick on the word in the
results as appropriate and it will open the menu to that item for you or
even execute it [press execute].

- --
Peace, be well
J Allen R Day  http://jarday.com

The Bat! 2.00.22, BayesIt! 0.4gm | Windows XP Service Pack 1 build 2600
Anger  as  soon  as  fed  is  dead-'Tis  starving  makes  it fat. -Emily
Dickinson

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Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
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Re: MenuNavigator Button

[Steve & Mary King]

> Thursday, October 9, 2003, Jonathan Angliss wrote:

> The CB is the bar on top of the windows, the one wit
> minimize/maximize/close buttons on it. The MenuNavigator button has a
> little question mark in it.

Exactly what does the Menu Navigator do?  I've pressed that little
question mark button and popped up the Menu Navigator window a few times,
but couldn't get it to do anything?  (Inquiring minds and all that.)

Steve . . .



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Filter/BAT file interaction

[Robin Anson]

On Fri 10 October 2003, 21:22:55 +1000, Roelof Otten wrote:
> Well, if TB waits until the filter is through, I can imagine that TB
> wouldn't do anything else while you're editing the message. And since
> that is Rich's problem

Ah, yes

-- 
Robin Anson
Using The Bat! v2.00.6 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600
Service Pack 1





Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Filter/BAT file interaction

[Roelof Otten]

Hallo Robin,

On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 21:03:31 +1000GMT (10-10-03, 13:03 +0200, where I
live), you wrote:

>> BTW You didn't check 'Wait for completion' at the run external command
>> stuff, did you?

RA> Why not? I have run my filter with it in each state (checked and unchecked)
RA> and can't say I noticed a difference. I have had "Wait for completion"
RA> checked though since I set up the filter and not noticed a problem.

Well, if TB waits until the filter is through, I can imagine that TB
wouldn't do anything else while you're editing the message. And since
that is Rich's problem

-- 
Groetjes, Roelof



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Filter/BAT file interaction

[Robin Anson]

On Fri 10 October 2003, 20:11:11 +1000, Roelof Otten wrote:
> BTW You didn't check 'Wait for completion' at the run external command
> stuff, did you?

Why not? I have run my filter with it in each state (checked and unchecked)
and can't say I noticed a difference. I have had "Wait for completion"
checked though since I set up the filter and not noticed a problem.

-- 
Robin Anson
Using The Bat! v2.00.6 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600
Service Pack 1





Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Filter/BAT file interaction

[Roelof Otten]

Hallo rich,

On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 01:58:44 -0400GMT (10-10-03, 7:58 +0200, where I
live), you wrote:

rg> There is one problem that I am assuming is due to the
rg> differences in our OSes.  I am on Win98se & I think she is using
rg> XP.

Well, I'm using W98 and I used this batch file and nothing got frozen:

c:\windows\command\edit c:\edit.txt
"c:\Program Files\The Bat!\thebat.exe" /importu=roelof;F=Inbox;X;R;IN=c:\edit.txt

Needless to say that I exported the message (as unix mailbox) to the
file c:\edit.txt, the account I was using is called roelof.
I noticed that when I used different combinations of quotation marks
than I do now, I got very mixing results.

With this batch file I've got plenty of time to edit the message
(don't know why I would want that, but...) without TB freezing on me.

BTW You didn't check 'Wait for completion' at the run external command
stuff, did you?

-- 
Groetjes, Roelof



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Filter/BAT file interaction

[Robin Anson]

On Fri 10 October 2003, 18:35:53 +1000, Rich Gregory wrote:
> For the 1st line (that calls the editor) I reworked it into:
>   start /wait c:\temp\edit.txt
> which seems to be even better that what you had and it does the SAME thing as well.  
> (Locks up TB!)

Try this:
Open up a DOS windows and go to wherever the batch file is. Run it as a DOS
command, and you should see the two individual commands being executed.

When I do this, the first line comes up in my DOS window and my text editor
starts up. When I close the text editor, the second line of the batch file
appears in the DOS window and is executed.

What do you see happen?

-- 
Robin Anson
Using The Bat! v2.00.6 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600
Service Pack 1





Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Woody's EMAIL Essentials?

[Julian Beach (Lists)]

On Friday, October 10, 2003, 12:51:09 AM, Gordon Woolf wrote:

> No hope for it here. In the latest issue editor Rose Vines writes:

>> There are no good reasons for putting your reply beneath the original.
>> First, it forces the recipient to scroll to the bottom, a waste of
>> time. Second, if the recipient habitually replies above the original,
>> as most people do, there's a good chance they'll fail to see your
>> reply altogether and simply assume you hit the Send button before you
>> started typing. You'll look dumb, then they'll look dumb. No-one will
>> be happy. Third, your reply won't show up in the preview pane.

Yes, I noticed that one, although to be fair, the overall conclusion
is that your quoting style should match the needs of the recipient,
not not be fixed.  I have a top quoting template for use on work
emails, as people like to preserve a message history at the bottom of
a message, and think that I have forgotten to reply if I bottom quote.
In line quoting is perfect for mailing lists, but confuses many
people!

I will continue to subscribe for a bit, and hopefully manage to get a
mention of The Bat in the e-zine myself!

Julian

-- 
  Using The Bat! v2.00 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1




Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
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Re[3]: Filter/BAT file interaction

[rich gregory]

RA>> Hmm, that is the way batch files are supposed to work. You have to jump
RA>> through some hoops to get things to happen in parallel usually. Are you sure
RA>> that is the problem?

rg> No, not sure...  It was a feeling, an assumption.  Roelof Otten had a suggestion 
that I tried and it did not help...  Same thing...  TB locks up except with edit.com 
(instead of TextIt) I never
rg> even get the chance to edit the exported mssg.  I even tried putting a PAUSE 
statement in the .BAT file...  No help!


For the 1st line (that calls the editor) I reworked it into:
start /wait c:\temp\edit.txt
which seems to be even better that what you had and it does the SAME thing as well.  
(Locks up TB!)








-- 



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Filter/BAT file interaction

[rich gregory]

RA> (Actually, I am a he, not a she)

Sorry about the gender faux pas!  I know only 1 Robin who happens to be female.  Sorry 
again


>> I am sure it would work if the batch file did not run the second line
>> (import) until after the first command was completed (by me saving the
>> edited email message).

RA> Hmm, that is the way batch files are supposed to work. You have to jump
RA> through some hoops to get things to happen in parallel usually. Are you sure
RA> that is the problem?


No, not sure...  It was a feeling, an assumption.  Roelof Otten had a suggestion that 
I tried and it did not help...  Same thing...  TB locks up except with edit.com 
(instead of TextIt) I never even get the chance to edit the exported mssg.  I even 
tried putting a PAUSE statement in the .BAT file...  No help!

-- 



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Hot keys

[MAU]

Hello rich,

> I imagine depending on if I am
>  a) scrolling in the message list for a particular folder OR
>  b) scrolling down the body of a message OR 
>  c) have a message open in a window of it's own OR
>  d) scrolling thru the list of folders
> the required actions PowerPro needs to perform will be different each time.
> 
> How would I program that?

I am not that proficient with PowerPro. Basically, before programming
something in PowerPro, you would have to find a keyboard sequence to do
what you want.

-- 
Best regards,

Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain)
Using The Bat! v2.00.6
Winamp OFF:



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Filter/BAT file interaction

[Roelof Otten]

Hallo rich,

On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 01:58:44 -0400GMT (10-10-03, 7:58 +0200, where I
live), you wrote:

rg> The BAT file consists of 2 lines. One edits an exported message
rg> then the other re-imports it.

rg> I am sure it would work if the batch file did not run the second
rg> line (import) until after the first command was completed (by me
rg> saving the edited email message).

Robin used UEdit as text editor, what do you use?  You'll need
something that is suited for batch files, ie a dos style program not a
a windows style program. You could use:
c:\windows\command\edit.com

rg> The way it is now TB just locks up (solid!) while I edit the email.

That's understandable. You think the second line of your batch file is
started while you're still busy editing. That means that TB tries to
open a file that's already opened and your OS doesn't allow that,
therefore TB can't import the file. In this problematic situation TB
decides to freeze because it's doing something it can't finish. Might
be sloppy programming, it should give you an error message and quit on
the importing action, but if it did that, you'd have to import the
message manually, so maybe this isn't as bad...

-- 
Groetjes, Roelof



Current version is 2.00.6 | "Using TBUDL" information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html