date:20170307



On Monday, 6 March 2017 22:23:58 UTC+11, PMario wrote:
>
> On Monday, March 6, 2017 at 11:20:58 AM UTC+1, tejjyid wrote:
>>
>> Edge cases
>>
>
> There are 11 js macros in the core and 860 macro \define statements in the 
> UI and templates. ~200 of them are duplicated in the language editions. So 
> macros are all over in the core, and we only had 11 exceptions, that where 
> done in js. The rest it pure wikitext. ... IMO that's impressive. 
>
Well, I agree. That IS impressive. 

>  
>
>> I can see that you might be able to do a lot with the wiki-text macros, 
>> but ... for anything complex they get pretty *unreadable pretty quickly!
>>
>
> Readability is a problem, since whitespace matters.  But many of the 
> core macros could have better readability, without side-effects in the DOM. 
>  
>
>> And it's not like they use a language you might use somewhere else.
>>
>
> They use wikitext. ??
>
Maybe we are slightly at cross purposes on what wkitext is; but $cmd; !!, 
{{{, [[[ (for example) constitute a syntax never used outside TW. I taught 
meyself JS to use TWc & since then I've written an Android app in it, 
amongst other things. That made the pain of the learning curve good value. 

>  
>
>> IMO, more, not less, use should be made of JS macros.
>>
>
> js macros can't be modified by most users. Standard macros can be modified 
> by every user. That's a huge difference.
>

There's possibly a difference here between system macros & user macros. The 
TW pros write a kind of expert JS that is hard to decode without 
experience, that's true. But simple procedural type JS is easy. It takes as 
much effort to learn how to use widgets as it does to learn the fragments 
of JS that are required for most of my macros. In fact, it takes more, 
because the documentation of widgets is not supported by a community as 
large as the JS community. 

>
>  
>
>> I'm just about to rework the lexer/parser you helped me with a few years 
>> ago into TW5 - but it'll stay in JS. I hope you'll be on standby once again 
>> :-)
>>
>
> If you want to implement stuff like this, you clearly have to go with 
> javascript. ... 
>

I recognize that's not part of the argument :-) 

>
> There is a big difference between TWc macros and TW5 macros. They are 
> completely different things. 
>
> TW5 macros are simple text-substutions, with no built-in "refresh" 
> mechanism. TWc macros are more like TW5 widgets now. .. parsing and 
> rendering a domain specific language (DLC) is a complete different topic 
> again, but doable. We have such plugins already. 
>
> eg: 
> railroad-plugin, markdown-plugin, katex-plugin, .. which may give you 
> hints :)
>

I will look into them, for sure. 

>
> have fun!
> mario
>

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[tw] Re: TW5 Red Screen of Death suggestions

Will do.

On Wednesday, 8 March 2017 11:55:16 UTC+11, PMario wrote:
>
> PR: https://github.com/Jermolene/TiddlyWiki5/pull/2799
> +1 vote for it, if you want to push it. 
>
> -m
>

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[tw] Re: TW5 Red Screen of Death suggestions

That was for Thomas, Mario. I know you know :-)

Thanks

On Wednesday, 8 March 2017 11:47:36 UTC+11, PMario wrote:
>
> On Tuesday, March 7, 2017 at 9:28:05 PM UTC+1, tejjyid wrote:
>>
>> You can move the button fairly easily, I found. In boot.js, find this 
>> line:
>>
>>
>> form = dm("form",{children: [heading,prompt,message,button], "class": 
>> "tc-error-form"});
>>
>>  document.body.insertBefore(form,document.body.firstChild); 
>>
>>
> I know.  
>  
>
>> If you want to play with the colours, then "tc-error-form" is the CSS 
>> motivator.
>>
>
> I did change the CSS a bit, so the error-message text gets scroll bars, if 
> needed and the whole box is max 80% high. So it will never be bigger than 
> the browser window. 
> We will see, if Jeremy merges it. 
>
> -m
>
>

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[tw] Re: TW5 Red Screen of Death suggestions

PR: https://github.com/Jermolene/TiddlyWiki5/pull/2799
+1 vote for it, if you want to push it. 

-m

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[tw] Re: list filter in order of number of field items

2017-03-07 Thread Dave

Okay, how about this (same idea but with tags)

<$list filter="[tags[]!is[system]sort[title]]">

<$transclude tiddler="$:/core/ui/TagTemplate"/>
<$count filter="[all[current]tagging[]]"/>




is there a way to sort by the "count" number given?

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[tw] Re: TW5 Red Screen of Death suggestions

On Tuesday, March 7, 2017 at 9:28:05 PM UTC+1, tejjyid wrote:
>
> You can move the button fairly easily, I found. In boot.js, find this line:
>
>
> form = dm("form",{children: [heading,prompt,message,button], "class": 
> "tc-error-form"});
>
>   document.body.insertBefore(form,document.body.firstChild); 
>
>
I know.  
 

> If you want to play with the colours, then "tc-error-form" is the CSS 
> motivator.
>

I did change the CSS a bit, so the error-message text gets scroll bars, if 
needed and the whole box is max 80% high. So it will never be bigger than 
the browser window. 
We will see, if Jeremy merges it. 

-m

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[tw] Re: Vivaldi Browser - Shameless Publicity

2017-03-07 Thread Duarte Farrajota Ramos

The regular default saving mechanism by download works fine like in every 
other browser of course. Press save and download to a chosen location, or a 
default one automatically with incremental numbers.

I would love to see some sort cooperation between the two projects though, 
to maybe support some form of native saving. That would be heaven on earth.

On Tuesday, 7 March 2017 23:26:10 UTC, Mark S. wrote:
>
> Not at all? Not even with the default saving mechanism, which saves as a 
> download in the background? That would be pretty much a non-starter for 
> just about everyone, I would think.
>
> Thanks,
> Mark
>
> On Tuesday, March 7, 2017 at 10:01:22 AM UTC-8, Dragon Cotterill wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, 7 March 2017 17:51:00 UTC, David Szego wrote:
>>>
>>> Can you save TW files with the "Save" button?
>>>
>>
>> Sadly, no. 
>>
>

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Re: [tw] New Powerpoint-Style presentation-mechanism ready for testing

Hi Jan

I am not completely sure about what and where and why you want to use this. 
Even after I have read a bit in Birthes translation of MetaTabs (which is 
closer to a standard wiki than yours and thus more readable for me) I am 
not familiar with MetaTabs and from where the new macro here is called. So 
I make some wild guesses ;–)

I didn’t find out about the outer list, but I have a working draft for the 
inner: 


Slides in <>:

<$list filter="01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10" variable="number">

<$macrocall $name="slice" tiddler=<> nr=<> />






Hints: $variablename$ can only be used in macros that get the value as an 
input like 

\define showSlides(variablename)
print $variablename$ here
…

And <> can not be used in a simplyfied <>. This is why we have to use <$macrocall syntax here.

Hope, this helps!
Thomas

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[tw] Re: Vivaldi Browser - Shameless Publicity

2017-03-07 Thread 'Mark S.' via TiddlyWiki

Not at all? Not even with the default saving mechanism, which saves as a 
download in the background? That would be pretty much a non-starter for 
just about everyone, I would think.

Thanks,
Mark

On Tuesday, March 7, 2017 at 10:01:22 AM UTC-8, Dragon Cotterill wrote:
>
>
> On Tuesday, 7 March 2017 17:51:00 UTC, David Szego wrote:
>>
>> Can you save TW files with the "Save" button?
>>
>
> Sadly, no. 
>

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[tw] Re: .tid created timestamp

The documentation is here: http://tiddlywiki.com/#Date%20Fields

All the best!
Thomas

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[tw] Re: .tid created timestamp

2017-03-07 Thread 'Mark S.' via TiddlyWiki

I believe the modified and created date fields always use UTC. The simplest 
way of dealing with that is to move to the western edge of Europe. ;-_

So as long as the tablet was internally consistent and the time was set 
accurately, the stamps should be OK. TW5 expects the dates to always 
contain UTC stamps.

The default date-stamp display should display the modified date stamp with 
your local time stamp, wherever you happen to be at the moment. I suppose 
if you cross timezones a lot this may make a tiddler's time stamp appear to 
be jumping around. I suppose you could modify 
$:/language/Tiddler/DateFormat to clarify what timezone it is displaying 
for. 

You could modify the subtitle by editing $:/core/ui/ViewTemplate/subtitle . 
For instance, you could change "modified" to "created" to display the 
creation date, or cut and paste the view widget to display both fields. (Be 
sure to make back-ups before trying this).

Good luck!
Mark

On Tuesday, March 7, 2017 at 12:19:03 PM UTC-8, Captain Packers wrote:
>
> I was at a conference and created some tiddlers in a different time zone. 
> My tablet did not auto switch time zones, I would like to modify the 
> created timestamp in the .tid files to reflect the local creation time, but 
> am not sure of the spec on the value. It looks like it may be 
> MMDDHHMMSSmmm where mmm is fractional milliseconds. Can anyone confirm 
> this?
>
> Also, it would be more helpful to me if the created date was visible in 
> the subtitle in addition to the last modified timestamp. Does anyone know 
> how to pick this up and display it within the tiddler?
>
> Thanks.
>

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[tw] Re: TW5 Red Screen of Death suggestions

You can move the button fairly easily, I found. In boot.js, find this line:


form = dm("form",{children: [heading,prompt,message,button], "class": 
"tc-error-form"});

document.body.insertBefore(form,document.body.firstChild); 


  and move the button higher in the list.

If you want to play with the colours, then "tc-error-form" is the CSS 
motivator.

Cheers

On Tuesday, 7 March 2017 21:02:10 UTC+11, Thomas Elmiger wrote:
>
> Hi folks
>
> I would support what Andrew says. In my experience (I develop in a single 
> page wiki) it is often possible to click the RSOD away – especially when 
> the message is short – and go on working without reload. 
>
> So make it as scary as possible, but give us the possibility to easily get 
> rid of it (button at the top or scrollable hints) so that I don’ have to 
> use the browser zoom to find the button if the message is larger than my 
> screen.
>
> Just my 5 cents.
> Thomas
>

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[tw] .tid created timestamp

2017-03-07 Thread Captain Packers

I was at a conference and created some tiddlers in a different time zone. 
My tablet did not auto switch time zones, I would like to modify the 
created timestamp in the .tid files to reflect the local creation time, but 
am not sure of the spec on the value. It looks like it may be 
MMDDHHMMSSmmm where mmm is fractional milliseconds. Can anyone confirm 
this?

Also, it would be more helpful to me if the created date was visible in the 
subtitle in addition to the last modified timestamp. Does anyone know how 
to pick this up and display it within the tiddler?

Thanks.

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[tw] Help with default tiddler templates.

2017-03-07 Thread Jason Nordin

I'm working with Tiddlermap that shows tags as edges, and I want (1) each
new tiddler created to have a basic toc-selective-expandable (2) for all
the tiddlers who are tagged by said tiddler. So I can easily, automatically
link-list each item's children on every card. Ideally, I can also see its
parents in another list? Or other edges? But that's not as important.

<> works just fine if I just
paste it in, but I want it to be there by default when it is created.
And it doesn't show up without specifying an actual tag because of weird
no-macros-in-macros reasons I don't understand well enough to fix. I want
it to automatically use the tiddler's title without having to enter it;
otherwise it defeats the purpose of not having to edit every single one.
I've got a successful template edit using <$edit-text field="toc"
default="" placeholder="Contents Order" tag="input"/> so I can arbitrarily
order them if I want on the Contents tab I added. But why won't the toc
macro apply to the template?

What do I use to make this work?

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Re: [tw] TW as dashboard to multiple internal web resources

2017-03-07 Thread Jasper Travers



On Monday, December 15, 2014 at 10:03:43 AM UTC-8, Andreas Hahn wrote:

Yes, I personally use a Dashboard on top of my tiddlywiki. If you want, I 
> can give you the CSS/template, but I am not fully sure that it is what you 
> want. However, it looks like this:
>

I'd love to see this if you've still got it.  I'm trying to create a 
dashboard in TW5 for taking notes, as most of the specific-use TiddlyWiki 
setups out there have much more functionality than I'm looking for, and the 
default empty with added table of contents tab isn't enough for me.

I look forward to your reply!

-- Jasper

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[tw] Re: Vivaldi Browser - Shameless Publicity

2017-03-07 Thread Dragon Cotterill


On Tuesday, 7 March 2017 17:51:00 UTC, David Szego wrote:
>
> Can you save TW files with the "Save" button?
>

Sadly, no. 

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[tw] Re: Vivaldi Browser - Shameless Publicity

2017-03-07 Thread David Szego

Can you save TW files with the "Save" button?

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[tw] Re: TiddlyWiki behind Apache as /zwiki/

2017-03-07 Thread Lost Admin

I'm curious. What is the benefit to running tiddlywiki on node.js on your 
server vs serving it up from Apache and using something like store.php to 
save changes?

On Monday, March 6, 2017 at 8:38:50 AM UTC-5, Eric Stephens wrote:
>
> I am trying to run the server on an existing Node.js box we have other 
> applications running on.
> Can some help me with the Apache magic to get the ajax calls working?
> Or it may be the pathprefix does not work as I hoped.  
> http://tiddlywiki.com/static/ServerCommand.html
>
> Here's my start command:
>
> tiddlywiki mynewwiki --server 8081 $:/core/save/all text/plain text/html 
> "" "" 127.0.0.1 /zwiki 
>
> Here's the httpd.conf:
>
> ProxyPass /zwiki/ http://localhost:8081/zwiki/
> ProxyPassReverse /zwiki/ http://localhost:8081/zwiki/
>
> Here are the errors:
>
>
> 
>
>
>

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[tw] Re: [TW5] Plugin update: Autosave for EditorCounter – Never lose hours of work again

Hi David

Until now I had not been aware of the fact that "Draft of …" tiddlers (that's 
what my fully automatic tool saves) are loaded and executed and thus are able 
to crash TW like normal tiddlers. I’m tempted to suggest to the core team to 
change that … 

Until then: Could you live with a button in the editor view that let's you 
disable autosave while you work on dangerous stuff?

Cheers, Thomas 

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[tw] Re: [TW5] SimpleCheckList plugin (beta !)

2017-03-07 Thread FrD

Hi PMario,

You're right. Will do !

Regards

FrD

Le mardi 7 mars 2017 17:52:51 UTC+1, PMario a écrit :
>
> Hi FrD, 
>
> Nice work! Thx for sharing.
>
> You should include a tiddler with an example checklist. 
> So we can immediately start playing, without the need of "working" first. 
> ... You know ... for the lazy ones :)
>
> -m
>

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[tw] Re: TW5 View Template when displaying in tabs?

2017-03-07 Thread Lost Admin

I've done a bunch of experimenting to try and solve my own problem and I 
have been left very confused.

When I create the template for displaying the tab like this:

!{{<>!!title}}

<$button action="action-sendmessage" message="tm-edit-tiddler" 
param=<> tooltip="Edit this Tab">Edit Tab

I get the button at the bottom and the title of the tiddler, as expected.

When I create the template like this:

{{<>!!text}}

<$button action="action-sendmessage" message="tm-edit-tiddler" 
param=<> tooltip="Edit this Tab">Edit Tab

or this:

{{<>}}

<$button action="action-sendmessage" message="tm-edit-tiddler" 
param=<> tooltip="Edit this Tab">Edit Tab

I don't get the tiddler content, just the button.

I don't understand why the {{ }} works for some fields but not all?

On Monday, March 6, 2017 at 10:47:13 AM UTC-5, Lost Admin wrote:
>
>
>
> On Friday, March 3, 2017 at 2:12:28 PM UTC-5, Mark S. wrote:
>>
>> Looking at the documentation, it appears that you can provide a template 
>> for transcluding the content of the tabs. Then, inside the template, you 
>> can access the current tab as variable currentTab. Perhaps that is useful 
>> for what you want?
>>
>> Good luck,
>> Mark
>>
>> On Friday, March 3, 2017 at 10:16:47 AM UTC-8, Lost Admin wrote:
>>>
>>> Further to my own question ...
>>>
>>> I can create a template to use with vertical tabs that consistes of 
>>> {{!!text}} and the button widget but when I use it with horizontal tabs, it 
>>> doesn't show the tab content it shows the parent tiddler content.
>>>
>>> On Friday, March 3, 2017 at 12:16:52 PM UTC-5, Lost Admin wrote:

 Hi all,

 I find I use tabs regularly for a couple of reason. One of which is 
 quick access to lists I edit regularly. To simplify getting to the actual 
 tiddler, I added a button to the bottom of the tiddler that opens the 
 transcluded tiddler in edit mode.

 <$button actions="action-sendmessage" message="tm-edit-tiddler" 
> param=<> tootlip="Edit this tab">Edit Tab
>

 I figured out that I can create a view template and add a filter to add 
 the above button to the bottom of tiddlers with a specific tag. *Is 
 there a way to filter based on whether the tiddler is being transcluded or 
 not*? It would be nice to only include the button when the tiddler is 
 being displayed in a tab.

>>>
> I tried, but it's not picking up the {{<>!!text}} transclusion 
> even though it does pick up the rest. To demonstrate, I've created this -> 
> http://thelostadmin.tiddlyspot.com/
>  
>

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[tw] Re: [TW5] SimpleCheckList plugin (beta !)

Hi FrD, 

Nice work! Thx for sharing.

You should include a tiddler with an example checklist. 
So we can immediately start playing, without the need of "working" first. 
... You know ... for the lazy ones :)

-m

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[tw] [TW5] SimpleCheckList plugin (beta !)

2017-03-07 Thread FrD

Hi,

Please find at http://simplechecklist.tiddlyspot.com/ an early version for 
a checklist plugin.
Any feedback welcome !

Regards

FrD

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[tw] Re: TW5 Red Screen of Death suggestions

Good arguments ;)
I'll create a PR. 
-m

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[tw] Re: TW5 Red Screen of Death suggestions

Scary is a different question, Mario. Maybe it needs to be scary, maybe 
not. Personally I believe in trusting users to act well with good 
information. However:

"This is embarassing" is not scary. It's annoying. If the problem is as 
serious as you say, then the error message needs to warn people of the true 
problem. "You are standing on the edge of a cliff" might get people's 
attention. (I would still opt for information rather than emotion, though). 
And if the error only ever bubbled up from somewhere deep in TW, and was 
serious enough to threaten data loss, then the message should ask people to 
notify TW support and, presumably, provide the error message, which I guess 
constitutes some kind of trace. But the error message doesn't do that. It's 
not constructive. It's not useful. It's just red.

The purpose of the message and the message itself are not coherent, that's 
the problem.

Now, my issues may be idiosyncratic, I admit. I do my coding in the 
browser. I don't want to be forced into learning yet another tool, 
installing yet another piece of software on my PC, and once again being 
tied to my PC for software development. TW should support some sort of 
meaningful and practical coding experience in the browser. I think the 
product has become too driven by coders and not enough by users. I 
understand most of the issues (roughly) behind the re-architecting, which 
is why I'm putting myself through the pain of upgrading, but reducing the 
portability of the code by making it so unpleasant to develop in the 
browser is a mistake. I don't believe offhand that this is a question of 
architecture; I think this is a question of people who like Node forgetting 
that there are a lot of people who don't need it, know it, or want it. 

For me, I see the RSOD 100 times a day when I'm writing code; that's how 
bad a coder I am. I don't care how bad I am, because I'm good enough to get 
done what I want to do, mainly. The problems I have to post about 99% turn 
out to be TW issues, not JS issues. TW is such a useful tool, despite this 
pain, that I will keep on using it. I'm going to try to start working on 
documentation of it, as a payback. At the end of all that though, the RSOD 
is not well thought through. I take your point that there may be some sort 
of thinking behind it - but it's still not good quality thinking as it 
stands.

Now I have just finished editing bootstrap CSS & JS to alleviate my 
problems. I've changed the error message to something less idiotic, I've 
muted the colours, and I've put the button on top. Much to my surprise, 
that all worked OK, 1st time (taht's a real tribute to the designers, BTW). 
That will reduce my pain. It doesn't deal with the deeper issues, but I 
don't really expect to persuade anybody to do that.

I'm interested to keep discussing it, though, if people want to.

Thanks for your response.

On Tuesday, 7 March 2017 19:11:25 UTC+11, PMario wrote:
>
>
> Hi Andrew,
>
> In normal cases TW fails silently. So if there are wikitext problems, the 
> "offending" text is ignored, or if possible there is some info. eg: 
> messages about list filter problems.
>
> If RSOD pops up, there is a real js problem, which may cause data loss, if 
> you could cancel and go on. So the only way to get rid of that message is, 
> to refresh the browser window. 
>
> So imo if this message would be less scary, we would have much more 
> trouble with users loosing data, because they would click it away and go on 
> with a probably broken system. The next save may cause much bigger problems.
>
> How do you create your code?  Within TW or a node js dev setup?
>
> just some thoughts.
>
> mario
>

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[tw] Re: TW5 Red Screen of Death suggestions

Hi folks

I would support what Andrew says. In my experience (I develop in a single 
page wiki) it is often possible to click the RSOD away – especially when 
the message is short – and go on working without reload. 

So make it as scary as possible, but give us the possibility to easily get 
rid of it (button at the top or scrollable hints) so that I don’ have to 
use the browser zoom to find the button if the message is larger than my 
screen.

Just my 5 cents.
Thomas

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[tw] Re: [TW5] Plugin update: Autosave for EditorCounter – Never lose hours of work again

Hi Danielo

Thanks for the hint!

I just want to mention that autosave is a built-in function into any tw 
> edition using a sync adaptor. This includes NoteSelf!
>

According to http://tiddlywiki.com/#AutoSave the built-in autosave is 
triggered by clicking a save- or delete-button. My EditorCounter autosave 
function is triggered WITHOUT clicking a button in the user interface. This 
way (my way) a "Draft of …" tiddler is saved after the author has typed or 
removed a defines number of characters. 

Maybe I shoud call it *fully automatic save* for better distincion? 

Cheers, Thomas

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[tw] Re: [TW5] Tinka 0.3.0 release

2017-03-07 Thread Ton Gerner

Hi all,
 

> ... Now it is impossible (or at least difficult) to create a theme 
> starting with $:/themes/
>
>  
As an - easy - workaround to create a theme as $:/themes// 
instead of $:/plugins//:

1) Create all payload tiddlers with the correct prefix 
$:/themes///
2) Package the theme/plugin. It creates a theme: $:/plugins//
3) Rename $:/plugins// to $:/themes//
4) Save & reload.

Thereafter you can repackage your theme without problems.

Cheers,

Ton 

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[tw] Re: [TW5] Plugin update: Autosave for EditorCounter – Never lose hours of work again

2017-03-07 Thread Danielo Rodríguez


Dear everyone,

I just want to mention that autosave is a built-in function into any tw 
edition using a sync adaptor. This includes NoteSelf!

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[tw] Re: TW5 Red Screen of Death suggestions