[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[TonyM]

Great,

Thanks again, I consider this resolved. I'll just have to fiddle a bit more 
> haha :)
>
>>
>> I  knew the answer was there and grateful for Mario to point out the more 
versatile use of the class field. 

I am still searching for a method to use css specificity to help target 
single tiddlers elements.

Regards
Tony

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[PMario]

On Friday, December 13, 2019 at 2:41:28 PM UTC+1, Hubert wrote:
...

>
> Thanks again, I consider this resolved. I'll just have to fiddle a bit 
> more haha :)
>

Cool!

-m

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[Hubert]

>
> Would YOU be in it? :-)
>
> Your voice is nice. You might look as good? 
>

Thanks TT but I'll give it a pass ;)

-Hubert

On Friday, 13 December 2019 13:39:56 UTC, TiddlyTweeter wrote:
>
> PMario wrote:
>>
>> If the description doesn't work for you, I can record a short video. Just 
>> let my know!
>>
>
> Would YOU be in it? :-)
>
> Your voice is nice. You might look as good?  
>

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[Hubert]

Thank you Mario, you've been very helpful. I've never used performance 
instrumentation before but I'll have it ago. Thanks for the instructions.

I'm aware of the improvements in 5.1.20. Also, it's not like the 
performance I have is poor, not at all. It's just that I want to optimise 
it as well as I can so as to be aware that any remaining bottlenecks are 
not design/syntax/filter related but hardware related. I've read that 
several posters on this forum were experiencing delays if using tags in 
their filters which were removed once tags were removed from the filters. 
This is primarily what triggered my interest in removing tags altogether.

I will do these tests first.

Also, following your suggestion to use multiple values in the class field 
(i.e. treating it as a list field) I was able to match both classes 
(values) with my CSS, which is promising. I'll give it a go and see what 
happens.

Thanks again, I consider this resolved. I'll just have to fiddle a bit more 
haha :)

-Hubert


On Friday, 13 December 2019 13:31:41 UTC, PMario wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> If your filters are not there, you need to open the tiddlers that contain 
> them.
> And run the $tw.perf.log(); again
>
> -m
>

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[TiddlyTweeter]

PMario wrote:
>
> If the description doesn't work for you, I can record a short video. Just 
> let my know!
>

Would YOU be in it? :-)

Your voice is nice. You might look as good?  

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[PMario]

Hi,

If your filters are not there, you need to open the tiddlers that contain 
them.
And run the $tw.perf.log(); again

-m

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[PMario]

Hi, 

If the description doesn't work for you, I can record a short video. Just 
let my know!

-m

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[PMario]

On Friday, December 13, 2019 at 11:59:06 AM UTC+1, Hubert wrote:
..

> Everything works perfectly and I've had all of this working well for 
> months. I'm very happy with this design. BUT, as I've said above, I want to 
> get rid of tags altogether (for performance reasons). 
>

hmmm, 

That shouldn't happen anymore. See: 
https://tiddlywiki.com/#Release%205.1.20  Performance Improvements 1st 
paragraph. 

 - Added  pluggable 
> index modules to accelerate the field Operator 
>  and the tag Operator 
>  (in tests on a wiki with 60K 
> tiddlers, startup time is reduced by 25% with these optimisations, and 
> refresh time is reduced by a factor of three.)
>

 - Enable $:/ControlPanel : Settings : Performance Instrumentation 
 - Save and Reload your TW
 - F12 : Console tab shows: performance: Execute $tw.perf.log(); to see 
filter execution timings
 - enter the text: $tw.perf.log();
 - hit enter button

TW should show a table with all filters and there execution time now. So 
you can see, if there are are really slow filters. 

Jeremy uses TWs with 60k Tiddlers

-mario

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[PMario]

On Friday, December 13, 2019 at 2:05:23 PM UTC+1, Hubert wrote:

But the class field (being a field) can only have one value. Since I need 
> two values, what I'm missing is another (custom) field that will match the 
> power of class. Or, ideally, the ability to add more custom fields at 
> system level that will match the functionality of a class field.
>

you can have class like: 

class: aaa bbb ccc

The div will look like this: 


  ^^^
 
I'm not sure if that helps. 

-m

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[Hubert]

Hi Mario,

Exactly. What you've described is my current implementation.

But the class field (being a field) can only have one value. Since I need 
two values, what I'm missing is another (custom) field that will match the 
power of class. Or, ideally, the ability to add more custom fields at 
system level that will match the functionality of a class field.

I know I could probably use a custom filter or some regex to match a list 
of classes within the class field but it's probably overkill.

More details in my convoluted post above :)

Many thanks,
Hubert

On Friday, 13 December 2019 12:34:20 UTC, PMario wrote:
>
> On Friday, December 13, 2019 at 11:59:06 AM UTC+1, Hubert wrote:
>
> What I forgot to say is that the functionality I'm looking for is one that 
>> would match the power of the "class" field, in that it would be able to 
>> style the* entire tiddler*, not just its body.
>>
>
> If you add a class field eg: class: test you can do it:
>  
>
>> Like using the class field, we could, say, remove a tiddler's title by 
>> using .tc-titlebar h2 { display: none; } etc.
>>
>
> like this:  .test .tc-titlebar h2 {display: none}
>
> class is applied at the same level as the data-tags elements
>
> -m
>

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[PMario]

On Friday, December 13, 2019 at 11:59:06 AM UTC+1, Hubert wrote:

What I forgot to say is that the functionality I'm looking for is one that 
> would match the power of the "class" field, in that it would be able to 
> style the* entire tiddler*, not just its body.
>

If you add a class field eg: class: test you can do it:
 

> Like using the class field, we could, say, remove a tiddler's title by 
> using .tc-titlebar h2 { display: none; } etc.
>

like this:  .test .tc-titlebar h2 {display: none}

class is applied at the same level as the data-tags elements

-m

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[Hubert]

Tony & Mario, thank you very much for taking the time to help.

I've just realised that I've omitted one important piece of info in my 
original post which would probably save you time trying to assist me. I'm 
sorry for that. What I forgot to say is that the functionality I'm looking 
for is one that would match the power of the "class" field, in that it 
would be able to style the* entire tiddler*, not just its body. Like using 
the class field, we could, say, remove a tiddler's title by using 
.tc-titlebar h2 { display: none; } etc.

Just an example. My actionable tiddlers (tasks and such) are tagged "item". 
I use the below custom view template (tagged $:/tags/ViewTemplate) to 
display them. This view template is itself conditional: the contents of a 
tiddler tagged "item" will be displayed if the tiddler is not "locked" 
(having a class "locked" will *conditionally *remove tiddler body and 
buttons such as "More", "Edit this tiddler" etc. from view). The locked 
tiddler view template is itself also conditional (based on other logic that 
enables me to mass lock locked tiddlers using a toggle that modifies a 
global variable, something not really relevant to this topic), which means 
that even if an "item" tiddler also has the class "locked" it will not 
necessarily be hidden from view as locked, because this depends on the 
current status of the global locking mechanism (toggle position).

My view template for tiddlers tagged "item", at its most basic level, looks 
like this:

<$list filter="[is[current]tag[item]]">
<$list filter="[is[current]class[locked]]">

{{_template_tiddler-locked}}


<$list filter="[is[current]!class[locked]]">

-- all the styling/macros for the not locked tiddler tagged "item" go here




So, list filters determine what view template is applied to this tiddler. 
In short, it's a view template transcluded in another view template.

In addition to that, I target all tiddlers tagged "item" through CSS 
defined in my own $:/tags/Stylesheet tiddler to remove their titles like 
here:

[data-tags*="item"] .tc-titlebar h2 { display: none; }) 

...because I've redesigned the way everything, titles included, look like 
in "items" by using the above view template.

Everything works perfectly and I've had all of this working well for 
months. I'm very happy with this design. BUT, as I've said above, I want to 
get rid of tags altogether (for performance reasons). So, it would seem 
trivial to simply replace the tag "item" and replace it with a field, say a 
field called "data_type" with the value "item". Once this is done, this 
would be my new view template:

<$list filter="[is[current]has[data_type]data_type[item]]">
<$list filter="[is[current]class[locked]]">

{{_template_tiddler-locked}}


<$list filter="[is[current]!class[locked]]">

-- all the styling/macros for the not locked tiddler go here




But now I'm losing all the styling (specifically, the removal of tiddler 
buttons) because this: [data-tags*="item"] no longer works, understandably, 
because the tiddler is no longer tagged, I've replaced the tag with a field!

*This is the very root of what I'm trying to accomplish -- to give this 
"data_type" field the same powers as the "class" field was given, so as to 
be able to manipulate styling of the entire tiddler, not just its body.*

This will be only relevant in the edge cases where a tiddler is "double 
styled", in addition to this styling being conditional. This is why I had 
to rely on [data-tags*="item"] and on the "class" field as both of these* 
target the whole tiddler* (including system buttons, the title etc.) 
Styling from within a view template only targets tiddler body and this is 
not enough for my use case.

I need to apologise for the sprawl, I'm aware it may all seem convoluted. 
English is not my first language and I occasionally struggle to concisely 
express what I'm trying to do. I'm also aware that there might be a quick 
fix to this problem, though I haven't found it yet. I think it can be 
accomplished by creating some clever CSS cascading or by modifying the core 
view template (something I'm reluctant to do).

Thank you again for your time and all the help so far, it's very much 
appreciated. It's amazing that TW has such a thriving community.

Best regards,
Hubert

On Friday, 13 December 2019 05:30:35 UTC, TonyM wrote:
>
> Post Script
>
> Using selectors and Understanding specificity  
> is quite involved. One 
> thing I know is you can wrap something in a div with a specific ID and 
> include that ID in your CSS so it only applies to something inside that ID.
>
> In a recent post I shared a solution for creating anchors inside a 
> Tiddler, copy below. The trick was we used the qualify macro to make the ID 
> unique to that tiddler, and in that case within the tiddler, you could do 
> something similar. But I now have an idea how to make this automatic.
>
> Eg in TOC
>
> > >Link to My Heading
>
> 

[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[TonyM]

Post Script

Using selectors and Understanding specificity  
is quite involved. One 
thing I know is you can wrap something in a div with a specific ID and 
include that ID in your CSS so it only applies to something inside that ID.

In a recent post I shared a solution for creating anchors inside a Tiddler, 
copy below. The trick was we used the qualify macro to make the ID unique 
to that tiddler, and in that case within the tiddler, you could do 
something similar. But I now have an idea how to make this automatic.

Eg in TOC

> >Link to My Heading

In Text

> > My Heading

Also the following works to help users nest headings

> >Link to My Heading 1.1 

Later in tiddler
> > My Heading h1.1

Notes:
   
   - There is not current tiddler in the sidebar so this may not work 
   there, but a hardcoded number could be used
   - As ID's can be defined in CSS perhaps we can use the new wikitext in 
   CSS features to automatically generate ID's that qualify them automatically.
   - I am confident there is more to be discovered.


Regards
Tony


On Friday, December 13, 2019 at 4:17:45 PM UTC+11, TonyM wrote:
>
> Hubert,
>
> Perhaps, I expected you to read between the lines a little more. As in 
> marios pointer to "dynamically create a CSS 
> "
>  
> see how the filter is used?, it is possible to have the filter use fields 
> to decide when to make some css active.
>
> For example in a tiddler tagged $:/tags/ViewTemplate
> <$list filter=[all[current]has[fieldname]]">
> 
> css here
> 
> 
> The CSS Will be silently "displayed" on any tiddler with a field 
> "filename" that has a value.
>
> Be careful because this css will be valid on the whole page, that is where 
> ensuring the CSS selectors target only elements in the current tiddler, you 
> can use classes and styles in your css and in the tiddler ensure that you 
> label things with the specific class.
>
> Also in a tiddler tagged $:/tags/ViewTemplate
> <$list filter=[all[current]has:field[fieldname]]">
> 
> css here
> 
> 
> Will be silently "displayed" on any tiddler with a field "filename" that 
> exists with a value or not.
>
> Or other filters like
> [all[current]!has:field[fieldname]]
> On tiddler that do not have the field "fieldname"
>
> I am no expert in CSS but I think you may be able to see what I am saying. 
> Please ask more Questions.
>
> Regards
> Tony
>
> On Thursday, December 12, 2019 at 8:26:21 PM UTC+11, Hubert wrote:
>>
>> Tony,
>>
>> I appreciate your efforts to assist me. But what you've described or 
>> referenced is exactly what I've been doing and what I've already had 
>> implemented in my own wiki for a long time.
>>
>> As you can see in my original post and also in its title, I'm trying to 
>> go beyond all of that. I'm trying to apply custom data styles by 
>> *specifically 
>> targeting fields* -- also fields other than the designated "class" field 
>> alone.
>>
>> Anyway, thanks again for your time and efforts to provide assistance.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Hubert
>>
>> On Thursday, 12 December 2019 01:02:33 UTC, TonyM wrote:
>>>
>>> Hubert,
>>>
>>> I am no expert in this but see 
>>> https://tiddlywiki.com/#Custom%20data-styles this defines the attribute 
>>> tags that comes with TiddlyWiki, it includes the ability to apply it to 
>>> tiddler titles as well as using tags. I believe another approach is for you 
>>> to use the attribute definitions below 
>>> More Possibilities in 
>>> https://tiddlywiki.com/#Custom%20styles%20by%20data-tags 
>>> 
>>>
>>> That is you can use this css method to address elements with your custom 
>>> attributes and apply css to those elements. This can stop the css bleeding 
>>> because it only applies to elements with those attributes.
>>>
>>> With an unbleading set of css you can then use a list widget/reveal with 
>>> a filter in the view template that contains a 
>>> css
>>> Section, if and only if any desired field condition exists.
>>>
>>> I hope this leads you to an answer. Hopefully a CSS expert will see this.
>>>
>>> tony
>>>
>>> On Thursday, December 12, 2019 at 1:19:11 AM UTC+11, Hubert wrote:

 Thanks for responding Tony.

 I believe filters can be used in css data-tags. Not done it myself
>

 I would like to avoid tags as reference points for 

[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[TonyM]

Hubert,

Perhaps, I expected you to read between the lines a little more. As in 
marios pointer to "dynamically create a CSS 
"
 
see how the filter is used?, it is possible to have the filter use fields 
to decide when to make some css active.

For example in a tiddler tagged $:/tags/ViewTemplate
<$list filter=[all[current]has[fieldname]]">

css here


The CSS Will be silently "displayed" on any tiddler with a field "filename" 
that has a value.

Be careful because this css will be valid on the whole page, that is where 
ensuring the CSS selectors target only elements in the current tiddler, you 
can use classes and styles in your css and in the tiddler ensure that you 
label things with the specific class.

Also in a tiddler tagged $:/tags/ViewTemplate
<$list filter=[all[current]has:field[fieldname]]">

css here


Will be silently "displayed" on any tiddler with a field "filename" that 
exists with a value or not.

Or other filters like
[all[current]!has:field[fieldname]]
On tiddler that do not have the field "fieldname"

I am no expert in CSS but I think you may be able to see what I am saying. 
Please ask more Questions.

Regards
Tony

On Thursday, December 12, 2019 at 8:26:21 PM UTC+11, Hubert wrote:
>
> Tony,
>
> I appreciate your efforts to assist me. But what you've described or 
> referenced is exactly what I've been doing and what I've already had 
> implemented in my own wiki for a long time.
>
> As you can see in my original post and also in its title, I'm trying to go 
> beyond all of that. I'm trying to apply custom data styles by *specifically 
> targeting fields* -- also fields other than the designated "class" field 
> alone.
>
> Anyway, thanks again for your time and efforts to provide assistance.
>
> Regards,
> Hubert
>
> On Thursday, 12 December 2019 01:02:33 UTC, TonyM wrote:
>>
>> Hubert,
>>
>> I am no expert in this but see 
>> https://tiddlywiki.com/#Custom%20data-styles this defines the attribute 
>> tags that comes with TiddlyWiki, it includes the ability to apply it to 
>> tiddler titles as well as using tags. I believe another approach is for you 
>> to use the attribute definitions below 
>> More Possibilities in 
>> https://tiddlywiki.com/#Custom%20styles%20by%20data-tags 
>> 
>>
>> That is you can use this css method to address elements with your custom 
>> attributes and apply css to those elements. This can stop the css bleeding 
>> because it only applies to elements with those attributes.
>>
>> With an unbleading set of css you can then use a list widget/reveal with 
>> a filter in the view template that contains a 
>> css
>> Section, if and only if any desired field condition exists.
>>
>> I hope this leads you to an answer. Hopefully a CSS expert will see this.
>>
>> tony
>>
>> On Thursday, December 12, 2019 at 1:19:11 AM UTC+11, Hubert wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks for responding Tony.
>>>
>>> I believe filters can be used in css data-tags. Not done it myself

>>>
>>> I would like to avoid tags as reference points for styling. I'm doing 
>>> that currently and, if possible, I would like to "deprecate" this. Same for 
>>> filters. Whenever possible, I've replaced them with the  widget.
>>>
>>> There is the class field and you can conditionaly display css between 
 

[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[PMario]

On Thursday, December 12, 2019 at 12:18:50 PM UTC+1, PMario wrote:
...

> Other possibilities can be found in the Style FAQ. Especially "dynamically 
> create a CSS 
> ".
>  
> ... But this method can have a negative performance impact, if done wrong. 
> ... It should be "a last resort" if other possibilities don't work, because 
> it can lead to 1 CSS rule per tiddler if done wrong. 
>

Don't understand me wrong. You can do really crazy stuff with this 
mechanism. So it's definitely worth some experiments. 

-mario

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[PMario]

Hi Hubert, 

Starting with 5.1.16 we have the possibility to use a "class" field 
 to define 
special behaviour. 

Other possibilities can be found in the Style FAQ. Especially "dynamically 
create a CSS 
".
 
... But this method can have a negative performance impact, if done wrong. 
... It should be "a last resort" if other possibilities don't work, because 
it can lead to 1 CSS rule per tiddler if done wrong. 

have fun!
mario

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[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[Hubert]

Tony,

I appreciate your efforts to assist me. But what you've described or 
referenced is exactly what I've been doing and what I've already had 
implemented in my own wiki for a long time.

As you can see in my original post and also in its title, I'm trying to go 
beyond all of that. I'm trying to apply custom data styles by *specifically 
targeting fields* -- also fields other than the designated "class" field 
alone.

Anyway, thanks again for your time and efforts to provide assistance.

Regards,
Hubert

On Thursday, 12 December 2019 01:02:33 UTC, TonyM wrote:
>
> Hubert,
>
> I am no expert in this but see 
> https://tiddlywiki.com/#Custom%20data-styles this defines the attribute 
> tags that comes with TiddlyWiki, it includes the ability to apply it to 
> tiddler titles as well as using tags. I believe another approach is for you 
> to use the attribute definitions below 
> More Possibilities in 
> https://tiddlywiki.com/#Custom%20styles%20by%20data-tags 
> 
>
> That is you can use this css method to address elements with your custom 
> attributes and apply css to those elements. This can stop the css bleeding 
> because it only applies to elements with those attributes.
>
> With an unbleading set of css you can then use a list widget/reveal with a 
> filter in the view template that contains a 
> css
> Section, if and only if any desired field condition exists.
>
> I hope this leads you to an answer. Hopefully a CSS expert will see this.
>
> tony
>
> On Thursday, December 12, 2019 at 1:19:11 AM UTC+11, Hubert wrote:
>>
>> Thanks for responding Tony.
>>
>> I believe filters can be used in css data-tags. Not done it myself
>>>
>>
>> I would like to avoid tags as reference points for styling. I'm doing 
>> that currently and, if possible, I would like to "deprecate" this. Same for 
>> filters. Whenever possible, I've replaced them with the  widget.
>>
>> There is the class field and you can conditionaly display css between 
>>> 

[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[TonyM]

Hubert,

I am no expert in this but see https://tiddlywiki.com/#Custom%20data-styles 
this defines the attribute tags that comes with TiddlyWiki, it includes the 
ability to apply it to tiddler titles as well as using tags. I believe 
another approach is for you to use the attribute definitions below 
More Possibilities in 
https://tiddlywiki.com/#Custom%20styles%20by%20data-tags

That is you can use this css method to address elements with your custom 
attributes and apply css to those elements. This can stop the css bleeding 
because it only applies to elements with those attributes.

With an unbleading set of css you can then use a list widget/reveal with a 
filter in the view template that contains a 
css
Section, if and only if any desired field condition exists.

I hope this leads you to an answer. Hopefully a CSS expert will see this.

tony

On Thursday, December 12, 2019 at 1:19:11 AM UTC+11, Hubert wrote:
>
> Thanks for responding Tony.
>
> I believe filters can be used in css data-tags. Not done it myself
>>
>
> I would like to avoid tags as reference points for styling. I'm doing that 
> currently and, if possible, I would like to "deprecate" this. Same for 
> filters. Whenever possible, I've replaced them with the  widget.
>
> There is the class field and you can conditionaly display css between 
>> 

[tw5] Re: Custom data styles: targeting fields

[Hubert]

Thanks for responding Tony.

I believe filters can be used in css data-tags. Not done it myself
>

I would like to avoid tags as reference points for styling. I'm doing that 
currently and, if possible, I would like to "deprecate" this. Same for 
filters. Whenever possible, I've replaced them with the  widget.

There is the class field and you can conditionaly display css between 
>