Bob,
I'd expect the PID output to change instantly with error. The equation is
roughly:
OUT = previous integrated error + gain * (error + current error/integral
time constant
+ delta error * derivative time constant)
where multiply or divide occurs before addition, as controlled by
Pardon, but I cannot resist:
OUT = previous integrated error + gain * (error + current
error/integral time constant + delta error * derivative time
constant)
Then previous integrated error = new output.
May a formula that contains
- an error
- a current error
- a delta error
- a
May a formula that contains
- an error
- a current error
- a delta error
- a previous integrated error
be considered to contain a lot of errors?
pun intended? ;)
--
Javier HerreroEMAIL:
Hi
Part of my problem is that all I have to go on are the Trimble definitions of
the terms. I'm just playing with the numbers that load into the device, not
doing an external loop.
There's no way to *eliminate* an instantaneous output change when there's an
input change with a simple loop.
Hi Bert,
I can help you in PCAD schema drowing(i.e. as xxx.pdf output too)_have a
litle experiance :-).
(so ca. 20 years, with RF layouting so good 30 years)...
Best Greetings,
Karesz
2010/5/11 ewkeh...@aol.com
The Dual Mixer project is nearing completion.
Let me refresh every ones memory
Thank you Karesz.
I will contact you direct and we can look at what needs to be done. Nothing
Fancy. Bert
In a message dated 5/11/2010 10:59:17 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
szeke...@gmail.com writes:
Hi Bert,
I can help you in PCAD schema drowing(i.e. as xxx.pdf output too)_have a
OK Bert!
Im wayting on your scripts...
K.
2010/5/11 ewkeh...@aol.com
Thank you Karesz.
I will contact you direct and we can look at what needs to be done. Nothing
Fancy. Bert
In a message dated 5/11/2010 10:59:17 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
szeke...@gmail.com writes:
Hi Bert,
I
The ugly header is a 2mm spaced header instead of the 'normal' .1 header
(2.54mm). You will find that you can use a laptop 2.5 drive adaptor connector
will typically have 2mm to 2.54mm headers that can be 'adapted. I suspect
that you can purchase 2 row 2mm headers on that on-line auction
ws
there is no NIH here, please share how you do it for $ 10, I always like to
learn, and I have not been a member that long. Is there a link to a
specific design? Thanks Bert
In a message dated 5/11/2010 1:47:15 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
warrensjmail-...@yahoo.com writes:
For the
As long as one is aware that your method (as implemented by you) doesn't
actually measure Allan variance, it may be useful for comparing the
relative stability some sources for small Tau (unfortunately the range
of Tau for which the method may produce useful results depends on the
phase noise
Hi
I had not realized they had *finally* published that. They've been using
parts of it for at least 10 years now
Bob
-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On
Behalf Of Bruce Griffiths
Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 2010 4:27 PM
To:
Headers that fit the Jupiter are available from Mouser. ( Search for .2mm
header). They ( the headers) are sold separately from the female crimp sockets.
Thank You
Kiss-Electronics
Ms Ashley Hall
183 N 5th Avenue
Cornelius, Oregon
97113
W7DUZ
www.kiss-electronics.com
I'm not too sure about that. The Jupiter series had a 20 pin 2.0mm pitch
connector. These have TU00-D140-xx- part numbers. This thread refers to a
TU00-D130x number. I can't find any reference to this number.
Robert G8RPI.
--- On Tue, 11/5/10, Tom Clifton kc0...@yahoo.com wrote:
From:
Bruce
Before we go around again and discuses what my simple tester can and can not
do and why,
It would be helpful if you would take the time to better understand how it
works and why it works the way I have done it.
You really should try one yourself if you can't see why it works.
You are
Warren
So you now actually integrate/average the frequency over the sampling
interval (Tau) after rejecting the need to do this for months?
Bruce
WarrenS wrote:
Bruce
Before we go around again and discuses what my simple tester can and
can not do and why,
It would be helpful if you would
A, Ulrich, lad, I, Bill Hawkins, kin to Jim Hawkins and the pirates 0f
Treasure Island, do pardon you, though you really should have resisted.
(Understanding pirates is key to understanding today's economy.)
The pardon is easy, because I have at times ridiculed something that I did
not
Hi
Coming back to the original data.
It seems that the TBolt may respond differently to large scale steps than to
small scale inputs. More mystery...
The same conclusion still holds though. Lying about the gain seems to be a
significant part of getting the noise out of the loop. Weather
(My apologies to all, this is a game Bruce and I play every time I bring up
my simple tester.)
Bruce wrote:
So you now actually integrate/average the frequency over the sampling
interval (Tau) after rejecting the need to do this for months?
Yes, I integrate/average just the same as I have
Allow me to apologize to start this again. Bert
In a message dated 5/11/2010 7:25:39 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
warrensjmail-...@yahoo.com writes:
(My apologies to all, this is a game Bruce and I play every time I bring
up
my simple tester.)
Bruce wrote:
So you now actually
You cannot approximate the sinc function frequency response of an ideal
integrator with an arbitrary low pass filter.
Your scheme will tend to misbehave (in that it will produce anomalous
ADEV estimates) when flicker phase noise is significant.
You actually need to use an analog low pass
OK, So, It is not perfect, but its simple and does give answers that are
GOOD enough.
At least you now understand if the integrator works then the tester works.
So that we do not go down hill again after all this progress,
If you would like to send me a data file of say 1000 + samples of any
The results have so far only been shown to be useful when white phase
noise dominates.
When the phase noise is white almost anything can be made to produce a
result that differs from ADEV by at scale factor.
In practice its sometimes difficult to know over what range of Tau that
the phase
My thinking is that anything that provides a close visual match with ADEV
traces from professional-grade instrumentation is OK for the most part,
assuming enough different sources and slopes are observed to make that
close visual match judgment meaningful. At the very least, homebrew DMTD
and PLL
Hi
As long as the idea is comparing the oscillators here in the basement, there
are a lot of things you can do.
As soon as the bragging rights bug cuts in, knowing that the numbers are
correct becomes an issue. With many noise measurement issues the assumption
that better is correct can
Bruce
So why are you saying I need millions of samples?
Is it that this method of integration may give the wrong answer one out a
million times?
And you will not let up until you find that one in a million times that it
may error?
I don't think you're going to find it, but if you want we can
Did anyone else loose GPS lock from about 0600-1200 UTC on the 11th?
My Z3801A went into holdover for the entire period, despite several
satellites being visible. I wonder if this has anything to do with
that malfunctioning WAAS bird that is supposed to be spewing RF
everywhere?
Joe Gray
KA5ZEC
Spreadsheets can be a snare and a delusion if not carefully applied with
full recognition of their limitations.
Unfortunately the divergent nature of flicker phase noise etc doesn't
become evident until one processes a very large number of samples.
1000 samples is never enough as many tests and
As long as the idea is comparing the oscillators here in the
basement, there are a lot of things you can do.
As soon as the bragging rights bug cuts in, knowing that the
numbers are correct becomes an issue. With many noise measurement
issues the assumption that better is correct can serve
I would doubt it. Even though the frequencies are the same, each
satellite and WAAS satellite has a separate PRN code and your receiver
has to lock up on it. The elder Motorola Oncore VP gps receiver thats in
the Z3801A will ignore all WAAS signals.
Joseph Gray wrote:
Did anyone else loose
Hi Joe:
My RAIM failure message has come back today.
I'm starting to log which sats are being used just after the message
shows up to see if I can tell which sat is causing it.
So far it might be SV# 11 or 20.
Have Fun,
Brooke Clarke
http://www.PRC68.com
Joseph Gray wrote:
Did anyone else
Warren
Calculating an integral using a sampled data system when the Nyquist
criterion is met is exactly equivalent to filtering albeit using just
the right coefficients.
Using rectangular approximation to the integral of the underlying
continuous function is also equivalent to a filter albeit
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