Re: [time-nuts] What size graphs do people like? (How big isyourscreen?)

[David J Taylor]

-Original Message- 
From: Mike S

Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2012 7:24 PM
[]
?? That's a page, which despite its title, contains a .png image, so the
image is viewable in a browser. The eps is here:
http://www.acousticscale.org/wiki/images/a/a0/SHAR_PGW_2009_Staves.eps

Try opening the real eps in your browser.



On both Firefox and MS Internet Explorer, that page expects a 3rd-party 
helper to visualise the EPS content.


David
--
SatSignal Software - Quality software written to your requirements
Web: http://www.satsignal.eu
Email: david-tay...@blueyonder.co.uk 



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Re: [time-nuts] What size graphs do people like? (How big is yourscreen?)

[Chris Albertson]

>
>
>> http://www.acousticscale.org/**wiki/index.php/File:SHAR_PGW_**
>> 2009_Staves.eps
>>
>
> ?? That's a page, which despite its title, contains a .png image, so the
> image is viewable in a browser. The eps is here:
> http://www.acousticscale.org/**wiki/images/a/a0/SHAR_PGW_**2009_Staves.eps
>  


Yes your link is correct.  I cut and pasted the wrong one.   "EPS" is the
style of postscript that is intended to be embedded.


Chris Albertson
Redondo Beach, California
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Re: [time-nuts] What size graphs do people like? (How big is yourscreen?)

[Mike S]

On 8/8/2012 1:41 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:

On Tue, Aug 7, 2012 at 11:57 PM, Hal Murray 

wrote:

ps and pdf, at least the way I see them, are not in the same boat as

SVG.

SVG is an image format that can easily be included in a html page.

ps and

pdf are stand alone.  They assume they control the whole setup and are
targeted at paper.  Think 8.5x11 or A4.

Here is a random counterexample to the above.
http://www.acousticscale.org/wiki/index.php/File:SHAR_PGW_2009_Staves.eps


?? That's a page, which despite its title, contains a .png image, so the 
image is viewable in a browser. The eps is here: 
http://www.acousticscale.org/wiki/images/a/a0/SHAR_PGW_2009_Staves.eps


Try opening the real eps in your browser.


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Re: [time-nuts] What size graphs do people like? (How big is yourscreen?)

[Chris Albertson]

On Tue, Aug 7, 2012 at 11:57 PM, Hal Murray  wrote:

>
>
> ps and pdf, at least the way I see them, are not in the same boat as SVG.
> SVG is an image format that can easily be included in a html page.  ps and
> pdf are stand alone.  They assume they control the whole setup and are
> targeted at paper.  Think 8.5x11 or A4.
>

Here is a random counterexample to the above.
http://www.acousticscale.org/wiki/index.php/File:SHAR_PGW_2009_Staves.eps

That said.  SVG is probably the way to go.  But Postscript (EPS) is more
sophisticated in that PS is an executable script that draws an image.  This
means you can do conditional branching and computation to for example
replace text with grey blocks if scaled below some limit.   SVG is only
descriptive, not executable.   SVG is likely good enough for making a graph.
If you are worried about the size of an SVG file you can use a compressed
link on the web page and cut the amount of data sent to maybe 30%
http://www.websiteoptimization.com/speed/tweak/compress/




Chris Albertson
Redondo Beach, California
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Re: [time-nuts] What size graphs do people like? (How big is yourscreen?)

[Sylvain Munaut]

Hi,

> SVG is uncompressed text.  PNG compresses well, at least for simple cases.

Decently configured web servers will compress SVG on the fly during
transport, wich yields a 9k transfer size.
(and your server is definitely not properly configured for SVG, it
doesn't compress and serves it as text/plain ...)

Cheers,

Sylvain

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Re: [time-nuts] What size graphs do people like? (How big is yourscreen?)

[mike cook]

Le 08/08/2012 11:00, Rex a écrit :

Hal,

I
If you go to: http://validator.w3.org and enter your link into the 
address field 
(http://www.megapathdsl.net/~hmurray/time-nuts/coax/Front-5ns-800x600.svg) 
then click Check, you will get a message that sort of explains the 
situation, except I still don't know how to get the server configured 
for for svg file => 'Content-Type: image/svg+xml'.


So it seems most browsers are now ready for SVG, but many servers are 
not. Maybe someone else can give us more details on what change might 
be required. In the mean time it looks like I won't be using any SVG 
on my pages either.
I don't use svg either, but the version of apache I have installed 
(2.2.19) does have svg listed in the mime types config  file.

/usr/local/etc/apache22/mime.types
...
# image/prs.pti
image/svg+xml   svg svgz
# image/t38
...
If your server is apache I think that uncommenting the line and 
restarting httpd should be enough. If you have a propriety server you 
may need to update something else.


Firefox accessing my server does display the graph correctly.





-Rex , et la caravane passe.


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Re: [time-nuts] What size graphs do people like? (How big is yourscreen?)

[Pablo Garaizar Sagarminaga]

Hello,

on Wed, 08 Aug 2012 02:00:40 -0700 Rex  wrote:

> So it seems most browsers are now ready for SVG, but many servers are 
> not. Maybe someone else can give us more details on what change might
> be required. In the mean time it looks like I won't be using any SVG
> on my pages either.

I agree that most browsers are now ready for SVG, even when it is
embedded in HTML. So, I'd try to create HTML documents with your SVGs
embedded on them, this way:

http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml11/DTD/xhtml11.dtd";> 

  
SVG file
  
  
http://www.w3.org/2000/svg"; version="1.1">
   

  


Maybe this is a solution for the mime-type mismatch at GoDaddy :-)

-- 
  Pablo Garaizar Sagarminaga
  Universidad de Deusto
  Avda. de las Universidades 24
  48007 Bilbao - Spain

  Phone:   +34-94-4139000 Ext 2512
  Fax:  +34-94-4139101


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Re: [time-nuts] What size graphs do people like? (How big is yourscreen?)

[Rex]

Hal,

I never tried to use SVG before, but after your messages tonight I 
played around with it a bit. I would never have expected it, but I think 
you are right about the issue being a server configuration.


I copied your SVG file and got the same results. On my local hard drive 
it opens as a graph. I copied it to my own web pages and I also saw it 
display as text.


I browsed around and found this SVG picture: 
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/22/Heckert_GNU_white.svg
It displays fine at that link. I copied the svg file to my web 
directories (hosted by GoDaddy) and there the same file displays as text.


I have a debugging tool add-on on FireFox. I displayed a thing called 
'Response Headers' that (I think) come from the server. For the svg link 
on my pages I see one field: 'Content-Type: text/plain'. If I do the 
same response header display on the wikimedia.org link I see 
'Content-Type: image/svg+xml'. So that seems to be what makes it work or 
not work.


If you go to: http://validator.w3.org and enter your link into the 
address field 
(http://www.megapathdsl.net/~hmurray/time-nuts/coax/Front-5ns-800x600.svg) 
then click Check, you will get a message that sort of explains the 
situation, except I still don't know how to get the server configured 
for for svg file => 'Content-Type: image/svg+xml'.


So it seems most browsers are now ready for SVG, but many servers are 
not. Maybe someone else can give us more details on what change might be 
required. In the mean time it looks like I won't be using any SVG on my 
pages either.


-Rex


On 8/7/2012 11:57 PM, Hal Murray wrote:

albertson.ch...@gmail.com said:

So you are saying that SVG can't work because one example of it is broken.
   Also, there are other vector formats, like Postscript and PDF.

No.  I think my ISP's web server has a simple misconfiguration.

It does work for ps and pdf, at least with my copy of Firefox.
   http://www.megapathdsl.net/~hmurray/time-nuts/test/

ps and pdf, at least the way I see them, are not in the same boat as SVG.
SVG is an image format that can easily be included in a html page.  ps and
pdf are stand alone.  They assume they control the whole setup and are
targeted at paper.  Think 8.5x11 or A4.

Yes, if you have a good pdf display program, you can zoom in/out.  But I
haven't seen pdf graphs included inside normal html pages.

Again, my knowledge of this area is not-great.  I could easily have missed
something.






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