[time-nuts] 2 X R-388's W/non-original cases for sale
Hi List, Besides a four sail ad, it's a bit of a bottom feeder story. Several weeks ago, I made a post of 3 R-338's for sale. One was missing the S-meter so I listed it a *parts unit*. I also stated that FedEx shipping based on my experience for the units with cases would be in the $125 range each. The next day I get a long distance call from X who lives in XX, a state far, far away from CA. Who wanted to buy both R-388's with cases. He askes me *Am I near a military base?* No, I reply curiously asking why he asked? Well he was retired militay he vagely implied a had some special shipping araignment available. He then asks *Do I know of a freight shipping place nearby?* I reply that I have no idea, but I curiously ask why? His relpy was that they *could be strapped to a palate for cheap shipping.* Next he asks if * I would hold the radios for 24 hours while he checked shipping prices?* Sure, No Problemo. So the next or so I get an email stating that the cheapest shipping that he could find was $225 and *these were PARTS radios and he coluld get an estate R-388 for IIRC $250.* I took that to mean he felt my prices were too high. Now I don't know how he missed the part whereI had said that the radios came with IREC tube shields and a case, but were complete. Now any radio with *Bathtub* cap need to have them replaced because of high ESR being 60 years old. It has been well reported by Bill Orr and others that the resistor network in the HV that's used to create negative bias chages value resulting in poor performance. So I still have 2 X R-388's for sale that have IREC tube shields, are in non-OEM cases, have bath tub and a electrolytic filter cap that should be repla retired as it is OEM. So the price is still $125 each plus a larger shipping price due to the weight of case. Estimate $100+ (Do an original email please) If one can find a better deal, please but it and inform the list so we all can be envious. Like the guys who got WWII surplus jeeps for $50 in long past times. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 5370B using manual start-stop
List, I'd like to do 1000 second TIC measurements with my 5370B but I don't want to have to perchase A HP 1B prologic or similar controller for the timeing. As long as I'm interested in the TIC difference but not an absolute value is it reasonable to use the manual start/stop switches and a stop watch or similar timer? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 5370 A to B conversion?
List, Is it practical to try and convert a HP 5370A to the B model. (I know that a dedicated TN could do it. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Suggestions on getting 24 MHz?
Esteemed List Members, I have four new Midland glass encased 3.00 MHz HC 6 case style available. Each one was given a S/N and were ordered for Hallicrafters circa. Ovenized they would be excellent although I don't now what oven temp was specified. Best guess is 85 C. I can send world wide. If interested please send and email directly to me at sandeenpa at yahoo dot com (Please do not reply on the list.) Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP DVM for shipping
List, the item has been spoken for. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 3455A 6.5 digit DVM for shipping cost
Esteemed List Members (was Yo Dudes) I have a HP 3455A 6.5 digit DVM that has stopped working. When turned on it fails to complete the self-check routine. The display lights briefly. I will send it to anyone who will pay shipping from 92220, Banning, CA. 17 x 20 x 3.5 inches. Approx 20 pounds. If interested please send email directly to me at sandeenpa at yahoo dot com. (please do not reply on the list. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Use the LT3042 for retrofit?
Yo Dudes, Should one consider retrofitting HP 105's, Austron 1250's or HP 10811 power supplies with the LT3042 for better performance? The price is modest. The HP 10811 suggested PS for the EFC is a 723 circuit that spedc's 6 microvolts ripple IIRC. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 107BR Ski Question
List, In getting documentation together for my HP 107BR I discovered the manuals I was able to aquire were for prefix 333. My unit prefix is 708. Does anyone have that prefix schematics or an errata sheet? Or does the 708 prefix just designate another factory run? TIA Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP Xtal Osc Question
List, When perusing HP xtal oscillators on ebay I noticed some cases were marked HP 10811 and the same appearing unit was marked HP 10811-60111. Are both the same for TN purposes? If so what are the differences? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 117A spoken for
Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 107BR FS
List, I bought the HP 107BR from ebay. It arrived very well packed and is as new on the inside and 9.5/10 on the exterior. It requires a special A/N connector for the AC power. I also bought the Artek CD and D/L rhe manual from the K4OOB site. I discovered that my model is of a later revision than the manuals I found. On ther ealier models there are pots for doing some adjustment of the inner and outer oven. Everything else looks the same as the earlier models. Asking $475 plus shipping from 92220. For the buyer I will upfront the shipping cost (FedEx) and then settle up later. If interested, please generate an ORIGINAL email other wise it will come as the current TN post. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 117A for ship
List, I have a 117 receiver that I never got round-to-it. The tag on the unit sayes one tube is weak. I have at least one extra tube (6CW4 IIRC) and more likely two. It's avaiable for shipping from 92220. If interested please send an ORIGINAL email off list. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 5065A super
List, I've been following the ongoing mod process for the HP 5065A super on the list. Two questions: 1. Are any of these upgrades applicable to the Lucnet and other Rb units? 2. Are there any other Rb units available (that don't cost you your first born child IF they can be found) that could be fine tuned as Corby is doing? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 420B Clip On DC Milliampmeter FS
Hi, I have a HP 420B Clip On DC Milliampmeter with Probe FS as I’mmoving in the spring. Current measured goes from 1 mA FS to 10 Amps FS. I have not used it since I bought it several years ago. The reliable vendor who sold it to me had guaranteedthat it worked. Will guarantee it isoperational. I’ll also include a NOS6DJ8 input tube. The is some delamination on the meter faceplate of the whitebackground . It does not contact themeter. I also have a copy of the service manual. $250 plus shipping from 92220 If interested please send me an ORIGINAL email because ifyou use the hyperlink on the address Yahoophoey will stack it up with otheremails which becomes a PITA to sort out. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 54501A digitizing O’scope FS
Hi, I have a HP 54501A 100MHz digitizing o’scope Two probes (notoriginal) 1ea HP 54501ADigitizing O’scop Front panel Operation Reference 1ea HP 54501ADigitizing O’scope Programming Reference Screen is razor sharp. When first turned on a message shows in small type “cal ram checksumerror. Re-cal instrument”. When thedigital dial is rotated, it disappears. I’m selling this as I will be moving inthe spring. $240 plus shippingfrom 92220. If interested please send me an ORIGINAL email because ifyou use the hyperlink on the address Yahoophoey will stack it up with otheremails which becomes a PITA to sort out. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP Test equipment catalogs FS
Hi, Amongst my rubble I found 4 more HP test equipment catalogs.They are 1982, 1985, 1987, and 1991. $10each plus shipping from 92220 or $50 plus shipping for all four. Yes, $50 for all four as I’ve got to put themin a box. If interested, please send and ORIGINAL E-Mail. If you do a reply to from the list it willget bunched up by Yaphooey an is a mess to separate. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP Test equipment catalogs FS
Hi, Amongst my rubble I found 4 more HP test equipment catalogs.They are 1982, 1985, 1987, and 1991. $10each plus shipping from 92220 or $50 plus shipping for all four. Yes $50 for all four as I’ve got to put themin a box. If interested, please send and ORIGINAL E-Mail. If you do a reply to from the list it willget bunched up by Yaphooey an is a mess to separate. Regards, Perry ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Skilled Math Editor(s) Needed
HI, At the request of a TN member (who wishes to remain anonymous)I started to reproduce: The Quantum Physics of Atomic Frequency Standards Volume 1By Jacques Vanier Division de Physique,Conseil National de Recherches, Ottawa and Claude Audoin Laboratoire de I’Horloge Atomique, CentreNational de la Recherche Scientifique, Universite Paris Sud, Orsay. From aphotocopy he had. I tried to do this as its used price will cost you yourfirst born child. The original copyright was 1989. The copyright has expired and the document isnow in the public domain So I digitally reproduced and translated it into AmericanEnglish in March 2016. Additionalliberty in editing was taken. Many paragraphs contained more than one subjectso using standard writing guidelines they were split up for an easierunderstanding of the concepts being presented. Many formulae had to be transferred images, and are veryclear, as re-typing would have delayed this project to infinity. Lastly, textwas transferred by OCR. Many drawings had to be edited using PhotoShop Elements as the originals were smeared. I spent about 200 hours doing this. Some formula symbols were not accurately reproduced. I don’t have the math ability needed toretype most formulae. No material was added or deleted I can send to all who wish it a DVD with the 800+ Mbytes ofraw data and the partial (5%) I have accomplished. Due to permanent changes in my life I will never be able tospend time on this again. I just don’t want delete the material. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP Spec Analyzer Sold
Thanks for all those that replied. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP Spec Analyzer FS
Hi, I have a HP 8590A that I got from Bob Camp in a trade. In the spring we will be moving so I'm shedding some of my large TN gear. I works OK but it may need to be cal'd if one wants precise mearsurments. $365 plus shipping from 92220 about 30 lbs. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Lady Heather Question
Hi, I received an unexpected lost money just at Christmas time. I had my eye on a GPSDO Symmetricom Inside GPS10MHz 1PPS GPS Disciplined Clock & GPS Ant Display Refurbished $209.99 radioshackus. It has a LCD display the shows some sat data. At his time I'm not planning on running Lady Heather but might want to in the future. My question is can I still run LH from the RS232 port? Or would it be better to buy the OscilloquartzOSA-4530 GPSDO and use LH? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP 105D FS
Apologies to All, Perrier should not post when tired. The HP oscillator is a 100D Low Frequency Standard.. Sorry for the brain fart. Regards, Perrier On Sunday, April 9, 2017 5:18 AM, Bob kb8tq <kb...@n1k.org> wrote: Hi Are you sure you have the model number right? That does not sound like a 105D … The 105B was a 1960’s creature that had a 5 MHz crystal in it already. Bob (who probably has eight typos in the sentence above :) > On Apr 9, 2017, at 2:46 AM, Perry Sandeen via time-nuts <time-nuts@febo.com> > wrote: > > List, > Since I've been babysitting this unit for 20 years or so waiting for > a-round-it to arrive its probably to to pass it on to someone who would > revive it. > It is a 100KHz ovenized crystal with an external reading mercury thermometer. > It has dividers down 100Hz and is equipped with a 2 inch scope for doing > Lissajous comparisons. The input and outputs are the old style dual binder > posts. > It's the usual test equipment width, about 10 inches high, and 18 inches > deep. Weight is about 30 Lbs. > It's in fair cosmetic condition > I have the original HP manual for it. > If one is so inclined, there is interior space for a couple of HP 10811 > oscillators, GPS unit and the associated PS for the modern stuff. IIRC I > have a NOS CRT tube as well. > Or polish up the front panel, place it on a shelf to remember how far we've > come. > Make me an offer. Shipping by FedEx is extra from 92220, Banning CA. > If interested please generate an original email so Yahoo doesn't stack the > replies all in one file. > I'm sure the purchaser can be absolutely certain that they have the only one > in their state, or even country :). > Regards, > Perrier > > > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 105D FS
List, Since I've been babysitting this unit for 20 years or so waiting for a-round-it to arrive its probably to to pass it on to someone who would revive it. It is a 100KHz ovenized crystal with an external reading mercury thermometer. It has dividers down 100Hz and is equipped with a 2 inch scope for doing Lissajous comparisons. The input and outputs are the old style dual binder posts. It's the usual test equipment width, about 10 inches high, and 18 inches deep. Weight is about 30 Lbs. It's in fair cosmetic condition I have the original HP manual for it. If one is so inclined, there is interior space for a couple of HP 10811 oscillators, GPS unit and the associated PS for the modern stuff. IIRC I have a NOS CRT tube as well. Or polish up the front panel, place it on a shelf to remember how far we've come. Make me an offer. Shipping by FedEx is extra from 92220, Banning CA. If interested please generate an original email so Yahoo doesn't stack the replies all in one file. I'm sure the purchaser can be absolutely certain that they have the only one in their state, or even country :). Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 105B FS
The unit has been sold. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 105B FS
List, I'm selling my HP 105B that has been "cooking" for the last 6 months and the meter readings are all in the OK region and has a 5 MHz output which hasn't been calibrated. It has the pre-10811 10 MHz oscillator type and the PS is the of the earlier version where the regulating transistor is mounted separately to the chassis. Asking $250 plush shipping from 92220. I can remove the original Ni-Cad battery for disposal at a approved disposal facility if one wishes. This will reduce the shipping weight 3-5 pounds. If interested, please send me an ORIGINAL email off list so it doesn't get lumped with other TN emails. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Austron 1250A FS
List, I am selling my Austron 1250A. The meter readings are all in the OK range and has a 5 MHz output which I've not calibrated. It's in good cosmetic condition. It comes with the factory manual,extender board, relay rack mounting brackets, spare fuses and a AN connector for attaching an external battery pack. The one problem it may have as I was told when I bought it is that the rear EFC might not work. (I never took the time to find out if it is a problem, I just powered it up. Has been in continuous operation for over 6 months.) Asking $250 plus shipping from 92220. If the buyer wishes, I can remove the Ni-Cad battery pack and dispose of it in an approved recycler and save some money on the shipping. If interested, please send me an ORIGINAL email so it won't get mixed in the TN nuts posts. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] 5 Mhz NBS Frequency Computers for Sale
List, I'm culling my too extensive test equipment inventory. I have two NBS System 358 Frequency Measurement Computers for sale It works like this: You have a 5 MHz "A" input for your standard and a 5 MHz "B" input for the DUT. The computer has a "B" offset output that multiplies the error to 3000 x 10^ -11. The person who acquired them from NBS surplus sale was the late Clyde Still of Colorado Springs CO who ran a local frequency calibration and measuring service on the side as he was a shift transmitter engineer for a local TV station on top of Pikes Peak. I acquired them from a third party. They were originally sold at the NBS excess inventory sale in Ft. Collins, CO as working units, but I haven't had the round-to-it's to use them. The PS has a number of small electrolytic caps that should probably we replaced before using. I have no schematics or data for them. They measure about 12 inches long by 9 1/2 inches wide and 2 1/2 inches thick and weigh about 6 pounds each. Asking $70 each PLUS shipping from 92220 or $120 for both plus shipping. Please contact me off list. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Who has a hm H Maser?
List, The discussion about building a H Maser has been fascinating however it appears that there will be a long time period before the project reaches fruition. My questions for those that have a H Maser are: Where and when did you get it and what was the cost? Exactly what do you have to do to keep it operating? Lastly where would one look to get a GOOD used H Maser and what would it cost (rough guess is fine)? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Low CostTemperature sensor
List, A while back there was much discussion about temperature sensors. One simple inexpensive one to consider would be the ZNI1000Temperature sensor. It's 1K ohms at 0C and it replicates the temperature curve of the Pt 1K ohm sensors. It's about $3 from Digi-Key. FWIW YMMY Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] How to create a super Rb standard
List It looks like their is as infinitely small chance of being able to get 5065. So what can be done with the telco Rb's (mine are analog tuned) to wring the best possible performance from them? Sooper Duper power supplies, Peltier (sp) cooling modules? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] RF cables and connectors
List, I recently bout a couple of USB male to USB male cables from Newegg. About two weeks later I received a catalog from: Brake Manufacturing LLC. They make inter-connecting cables for almost any type of connector with almost any type of co-ax as well as selling almost any RF connector one can imagine. You can different types of connectors on the ends of each cable. Prices for a simple 3 foot cable start around $30. WWW.BRAKEMFG.COM Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Top Posting
List, There is always going to be some top posting however it has been six or seven pages long multiple times lately. I save all these on MS word for reference later. How about shortening these at least a little bit please? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Fluke Voltage Standards.
List, Fair Radio which has been in the surplus electronics business almost forever has two models of Fluke standards for sale. They have a sterling reputation. FLUKE-332A $100 Voltage Standard - Used Reparable FLUKE-332B $125 Voltage Standard - Used Reparable IIRC, this means they will work but are not calibrated. If interested one can email them for exactly what Used Repairable means. FWIW Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] China Oscillator Alternative
List, After all the problems that Bob Camp has noted with surplus OCXO's from China, perhaps buying the new Lucent units on Ebay may save bad words and/or unhappy actions. LUCENT/SYMMETRICOMKS-24361 L101, Z3812A, RFTG-U REF-0 UNIT -CASE OF 2 EACH $80 So for about $50 each delivered one has two brand new units that are already in a chassis so with just a simple lap top computer PS one is on the air. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Calibrating a HP 5370B Oscillator
Hi, Wrote:I am the proverbial man with too many clocks and I don'tknow what time it is. To correct this situation I have decided to calibrateeverything. I have a HP 5370B, a HP6370A, and a HP 5328A all with the TCXO option. Hi Peter, You can't really calibrate the 5370B oscillator. I tried. All that you can do is adjust the mechanical adjustment as the EFC pin is grounded on the edge connector. I thought about making the EFC pin available but it required cutting some of the bottom sheet metal. Then one would have to cut the trace on the MB and add a highly regulated PS for the EFC with an adjustment control. Also the PS for the oscillator is primitive and would need to be upgraded. IMNSHO, the reason they left out doing this is the variations of airflow rate, airflow temperature and vibration from the cooling fan. In the 5370A they used a less expensive oscillator. I think that in the B model HP just wanted better stability to achieve the better pico-second resolution rating. An interesting experiment would be to run the B, take the 10 MHz output and compare it to a GPSDO or Rb standard and see how many variances that would occur. IMNSHO, I drive the B with an its 10811 externally powered in a better enclosure. I cant comment on the other gear. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Gentlemen: Synchronize Your Watches!
List Time may be relative, but physicists are a stickler for accuracy. While many of us may give a few minutes’ grace to the timepieces in our homes, one group of scientists has successfully synchronized a pair of optical clocks to within a million billionths of a second. By measuring time to such a fine point of accuracy, physicists could ultimately change the length of a second. Scientists have managed to synchronize two optical clocks 12 km apart to within a quintillionth of a second. By measuring time to such a fine point of accuracy, physicists could ultimately change our longstanding units for how time is measured World's most accurate clocks are synchronised to a quadrillionth of a second - and it could change how we define time SUPER ACCURACTE CLOCKS Physicists in the US fired a laser beam between two buildings more than seven miles (12 km) apart. At either end they used optical clocks to detect regular laser pulses every five nanoseconds – five billionths of a second – just like ticking of a clock. The two clocks send the pulses to each other, with the arrival time measured at each clock. The measurements were so fine that they even took the swaying of the buildings and air turbulence into account, to account for tiny changes which could affect the arrival times of the pulses. Once the tiny differences were taken into account, the clocks could be synchronized to within a quadrillionth of a second. In order to make such precise measurements, a team led by physicists at the US National Institutes of Standards and Technology (NIST) in Colorado fired a laser beam from one building to another, more than seven miles (12 km) away. At either end they used optical clocks, which work in a similar way to microwave clocks, using atoms or ions which oscillate about 100,000 times higher than microwave frequencies, in the optical, or visible, part of the electromagnetic spectrum. Using a specialized laser tool called a frequency comb, they were able to detect regular laser pulses every five nanoseconds – five billionths of a second – just like ticking of a clock.The two clocks send the pulses to each other, with the arrival time measured at each clock.The team’s measurements were so minute that they even took the swaying of the buildings and air turbulence into account, to account for tiny changes which could affect the arrival times of the pulses. Accounting for these differences meant they could be subtracted from any difference in arrival times to synchronize the two to within a quadrillionth of a second. Once we measure the difference of the clock times, we can speed up or slow down the clock at site B so that it agrees with the clock at site A to within femtoseconds,’ explained Laura Sinclair, a physicist at the NIST. Writing in the journal Applied Physical Letters, the team reports the how they were able to maintain such a fine degree of accuracy in spite of such large distances.More accurately keeping would enable financial networks to use more precise time stamps, so handle even more transactions in shorter amounts of time. It would also allow GPS and other satellite-based navigation systems to provide even more precise location information ‘The 12 km of turbulent air results in massive distortions of the laser beams, yet the two clocks agree in time to 20 digits,’ said Sinclair. The physicist added: ‘How far, in distance, can we really go? ‘If we want to someday redefine the second so that it’s based on an optical standard instead of a microwave standard, we’ll need to be able to link up the world’s best clocks and then distribute that time information.’ Earlier this year, researchers in Germany devised the method to measure precisely how long a second is with far more accuracy. It could mean the definition for what a second actually is will change by an incomprehensibly tiny amount - just a fraction of a quadrilltionth of a second. The change will see the amount of error in estimating the length of a second reducing from 0.25 quadrilliionths of a second - that is 0.25 with 15 zeros in front of it - by a factor of ten.Reducing the amount of uncertainty in how long a second is means physicists will be able to make much more accurate estimates of how long events take. In context, it means such clocks would only have lost about 100 seconds since the universe began, 14 billion years ago. Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3834518/World-s-accurate-clocks-synchronised-quadrillionth-second-change-define-time.html#ixzz4MtN7WvBJ Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Concrete basement moisture proofing
Hi, I have rehabed three houses that I have owned that have cement basements. All three were in Colorado. Bare concrete will weep moisture. The solution is to paint (actually spread) a product made by UGL. It is $125 for a five gallon bucket. It is a latex based product that seals the surface. Any exterior concrete wall will suck out heat in the winter and needs to be insulated. In the two housed with full basements I used 2 x 4 studs on 16 inch centers and filled the space with IIRC R 13 fiberglass insulation. That was all that was practical at the time but still cold was conducted to the interior in the winter. The third house we had in the mountains outside of Westcliffe, Co and had a 4 foot stem wall. About the upper third part of the shorter back wall was open to the elements. I bought 4 x 8 foot panels of 2 inch foam that was covered on one side with aluminum foil at Home Depot. They were about $25 a sheet. I covered the stem wall on all sides with two layers of insulation as well as the rim joists. Since we were at 9,000 ft moisture was not a problem. Even though it was well below zero F much of the winter, the electronic thermometer probe on the floor which I monitored all winter stayed a 54F. Now the fact that we had a 450 gallon water cistern in the crawl space probably helped to some extent as the crawl space was 30 x 40 ft. If I was building a temperature controlled room with an exterior concrete wall I'd seal it with UGL and put a 4 inch layer of foam to stop exterior heat variations. When I had a work shop in TN, I stapled aluminium screening material from Home Depot to RF proof my exterior walls. If one chooses this method, an electric staple gun or better yet, an air driven staple gun makes it a relatively reasonable project. Remember if one goes the old refrigerator route that some states (CO, CA) for example have extremely strict requirements for the old refrigerant to be removed and tagged by licensed personal (or else...). Just FFT. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] measuring noise of power supplies (was: For those that insist on using switching power supplies)
List, Two Points 1. Switching regulator power supplies are here to stay and will replace most transformer types as the are cheaper, smaller, and more energy efficient. They have improved to the point of being used in medical equipment for patient monitoring equipment that picks up milli-volt signals from the patient electrodes. 2. It is very simple to use a cheap all band AM-FM shortwave receiver with an isolation cap to the antenna. Cheap, quick, and efficient. BTDTGTTS. What one is interested in usually is that there is interference, not its exact level or wave form. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 105B Battery the saga continues
Hi, The battery problem becomes more convoluted every day. Due to family medical issues I have not been able to do any testing/repairing. The 105B charger is set up for nicads using some selected un-alterable charging rate so to use an internal lead acid setup requires a different ps. My unit prefixed 2128A has a pc board non-adjustable ps that requires a different extender board to trouble shoot with the power on than the other boards require. Mine partially works as I have oven power but a current limited other voltages so I have to either buy the special extender board or rebuild the ps. Since I'm never going to use NiCads rebuilding the ps is a very viable option. My other unit has the older style ps with a heat-sinked pass transistor mounted to the chassis. At present it in in the equipment rack and cooking nicely. A number of battery back-up proposals have been shared, many are case specific. In my situation here in So CA are rare occasional fractions of a second drop outs. I purchase a refurbished APC Pro 1500 for $100 delivered from ebay. IF I get aroundtoit, the least expensive option for me is a 12 car battery and a buck-boost converter from china for $8 and use a trickle charger [Harbor Freight] to keep it topped off. I'd use a Shottky barrier diode for isolation from the ac ps and not use a relay to switch over. Where the nicad pack was located one can put in 33,000 uF of Nichicon 105C caps for $20 for a buffer hold over. The oscillator draw is listed at 18W. If I have a power outage for several days my 105B will be the least of my problems. I've cobbled together a 105B manual for the 2128A prefix only using the errata sheet and some ski's from a list member who I apologize to for forgetting his name for attribution. It is 75 Mbytes in MS word and I have to re-install my PDF creator so I can get it to a size that will fit my attachment limit. Although not complete it is a pretty good start. The wiring method is the weirdest I've seen any time in my electronics career. The underside of all the pc board edge connectors are covered with a non-removable aluminium plate, so one has to probe through the top. It is the hardest piece of HP equipment that I've had to work on in 25 years of working on HP equipment. The divider boards can easily replaced by TTL logic and a 10 MHz output jack can be added. Great oscillator but horrid implementation. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 3010Axxxxx oscillator
Hi, In the two HP 105B's I recently acquired both had the 10 Mhz 3010A series oscillator which appears to be pin for pin compatible with the HP 10811 series but it has a resistor value listed on the outer case. Trying to research it, the HP 105A/B supplement vaguely said to take a look at the HP 10811 ski. I'm still in the dark about it, so several questions. How good is it compared to the HP 10811? Is it worth the effort as some point to change the outer oven to WarrenS's circuit? There is some mention of using a LM723 regulator circuit. Is it worthwhile to re-work the PS to one with better regulation? And lastly, Rick K might know the answer to this: Why didn't HP bring out the 10 MHz as a "new feature" and call it the HP 105A/B Mod II or something? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 5060-0049 extender board
List, WTB for HP 105. please contact off list if you have one for sale. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Late model HP 105B update
List, I Goofed. The 2848A late model info is on is on Dider's site as a HP 105B "Supplement". The HP *Supplement* instructions are: butcher a perfectly good earlier model service manual add info here and delete info there, pencil in changes making the original manual a piece of garbage. They were also too damn cheap to make any new schematics. So you have to use the old schematics (from your butchered manual) and interpolate. The unit is a gread idea and seems to run well. I'd rather have this later version as one can easily swap out 10811 pin compatible oscillators for testing ad refining. For perspective, when introduce in 1979, the price of two and 1/2 units could buy you a modest 2 or 3 bedroom house. Later I'll try and make a combined ski for the group. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] CS Jr. Clarification
Hi, Thanks to all who replied and made the lite in my brain go on. Probably a great niche product but not for me. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Late Model HP 105B shematic
Hi, Thanks for all the suggestions for the ski but I still have drawn a blank. However I was able to get a large amount of similar data of of Dider's web site. And thanks Charles for your phase noise postings. More for me to learn. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Cs jr.
List, Several years ago we were enthralled by the NIST designed Cs that still needed cal once in a while. It was listed for sale IIRC for $1400 or so. Since then it has seemed to have fallen off of the radar screen. Does anyone have any follow-up info? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Schematic needed
Hi, I bought a HP 105B that is a later version. All the manuals I've searched for end up being for the original version. My S/N prefix is 2848Ao or 0. Plse reply off list if you have even just a ski. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 105B oscillator
List, I purchased a HP 105B oscillator on ebay and it arrived today. Previous to getting it I D/L the manual and brief;y perused it. So when I popped open the top cover to see the internal parts, what to my wondering eyes appeared Not the A1 module shown in the manual but a 10811 lookalike. The only information on the oscillator is S/N 3010A59493 and R11215k. So what do I have? The next question that comes to mind is the plug in base the same electrical configuration of the 10811? (Being a TN You can see where this is going.) Leaving out the divide issue for the moment, this would seem to be an ideal test bed for my 10811 oscillators as the 3 in my 5370B's have no EFC adjustment installed and I have another 10811 spare. I have enough 5370B's and 5335's in which I could put all my 10811's in to *incubate* for months before attempting to tune them. Also are there upgrades that are practical to add to the present PS for greater stability. I am going to replace the original screw cap capacitor with a new Nichicon 105C cap. Thoughts? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Using lasers for data transmission
Hi, Several (many?) years ago National Geographic magazine show a picture taken here in southern California of the state government sending red laser signals between different mountain tops to keep track what was going on near fault lines. There were no technical details on what was taking place. So it can be done. At a hamfest a few years ago I bought both a red and green 35 mW laser pen for about $15 each. They do shine a long, long way. Whether these are powerful enough, or can be properly modulated for what is needed, I have no idea. On line I saw at least one China site that had much larger outputs available. The prices were modest. FWIW. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 5335 Manual
The manual has been sold. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 5335A Manual FS
List, I have a HP 5335A counter factory manual VGC. $20 PLUS postage from 92220. Please reply off list if interested. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP Catalogs
List, I have 5 HP Test and Measurements catalogs which I will send for postage from 92220. The years are 1982, 1985 (2), 1987, and 1991. These are heavy suckers (bound books. I estimate postage to be $10 per book. Please reply off list if interested. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Oscope Tutorial
List, Usedoscilloscopes have gotten to the price where us experimenters can affordexcellent ones at reasonable prices (my Tek 200 MHz dual bandwidth was<$200). I wastrained how to use them in the military but many haven't that experience. Insorting out my papers I found a HP Bench Briefs titled Basic Techniques ofWaveform Measurement Using an Oscilloscope published in 1980. It is anexcellent article which I have reproduced. Anywanting a copy contact me off list at sandeenpa yat whahoey.commie after iststranslation. Also would someone post this to the K04BB website? I couldn’t figure out to do it when I went there. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP Reliability
Hi, It is rather depressing to me to hear RK and others remark about the unreliability of HP test equipment. There is one area where they had outstanding equipment. I was involved with repairing HP medical equipment for 25 years and it was awesome stuff. This was the same info I got from other BMET's at many different hospitals. The TCO was low as the equipment ran and ran, a lot of it 24/7. I'm talking about a 10 year period. Usually our equipment was only replaced by newer technology systems. Too bad it didn't apply to test equipment as well. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Cheap GPS OCXO's
Hi, One comment posted a while back warned that if the Morion OCXO's reached the limit of their EFC range the could not manually re-tuned as others are. That said, the newer ones posted seem to be using Trimble OCXO's. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP5370B & HP5345B Front-End IC Redesign Effort
Hi, Wrote: Since the front end chips are mixed signal ASIC’s, it will take more than a bit of time to replace them directly. Re-doing the entire front panel board is the most likely way to “fix”the problem. The question is - why do that at all? Just do a PC instrument that does the same thing as the counter with way less effort….. Well, I have two reasons not to. First I have about $1800 invested in my 3 5370’s including the new CPU boards and blowing that off is not in my budget. I’ll kludge the living daylights out of my units before blowing off my investment. Second, I haven’t the slightest clue on how to do a PC instrument and I have to many other projects to finish to learn something new. Also there was much discussion about A and B cooling in the past and it seems the only things some did to their units was the addition of fan(s) on the cooling fins. I had an external fan on a B I was running and the thing still was too hot. IMNSHO, I believe the front end chip failure is aggravated by the high interior heat level. I’m committed to a number of other projects so it will be a while before I can work on mine. I’ll either rip the whole PS out and put it on another chassis, try better 3 terminal regulators instead of the installed pass transistors, install switching regulator PS’s in place of the original PS, cut holes in the top lid and install 10 or 12 computer fans. Or a combination of the afore mentioned. I don’t give a rat’s behind how it will look. I’m only interested in it working properly. I’ve spent 50 years in the electronics industry and I will find a way to skin this cat. I’ve done this to other equipment before. And when done I’ll tell the list how I did it. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP Type II feet.
List, I'd like to buy up to 60 HP type II feet. I don't need the metal bail but it would be OK to have also. Please reply off list with amount and price. I also have some TN HP test equipment that could be used in a trade/cash deal. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] UBLOX LEA-5T Programming?
Hi, I have six of the older style (anodized solid aluminum case) Lucent crystal oscillators that I’d like to turn into simple 10 MHZ output GPSDO’s. I have some salvaged HP cases so I can have a linear PS and all other stuff in one package. I’ve found two different choices of GPS relatively low cost units on Ebay. One is a LUCENT M12+ GPS Timing Receiver W/100 Hz output for $19.99 Item 171886538138. The other is a UBLOX LEA-5T GPS module dev board 1PPS /USB/RS232/ntp ser with two 1 PPS outputs for $49.90. Item 251785217093. IIRC, one output of a Ublox can be set to a 10 MHz. Can this model be set to have a 10 MHz output and is it easily done from a PC? I have no coding ability. For more money I’d get a simpler phase detector circuit, which is all I’m looking for. For less money I’d have to build more circuitry. A factor I don’t know is if the ublox is that much better/newer to justify the price difference. I already have packed away two Oncore units with either a 1 KHz or 10 KHz output. Suggestions welcomed. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP5065A C-field current voltage mod
Hi, Wrote:No, the temperature is not stable, not even close. Wrote:Given that the TL431 is quite good at measuring temperature, that makes itunsuitable in this case. Wrote:There is a LOT more to making a good temperature-controlled >environmentthan hacking together a DIY oven. Thatmay be fine for stability of tenths of a percent (10e-3), but when stability of >10e-13is at issue it doesn't pay to start with 50ppm parts and put them in a >DIYoven. You need to start with low-tempcoparts. Waita second good people! We have a bit of confusion about what I wrote. Anamplification of what I wrote: TheTL 431 is listed as a low noise shunt regulator. It doesn’t measure temperature at all. Theonly noise spec I could find is about 7 uV. A LM723 data sheet specified 2.5 uV noise. The REF 012A specifies 5 uVnoise. The first two are around 50 cents from Mouser. The REF102A is about 10X more. I’mnot sure the original reference diode had that low noise but that’s a guess onmy part. Thetemperature circuit I referenced uses a 220 ohm load resistor in series withthe positive output of the regulator and Vcc. The temperature is regulated by a resistor from Vcc to the programminglead. Then there is a thermistor going from the programming lead to ground. Usingthe formula given in the data sheet. One can then calculate the desired voltageratio and then with a series control pot set the temp to the desired value. Thisis a simple circuit and with 1% 100ppm vishey metal film resistors it would begood for .1 degree stability. That should suffice for Paul’s application Charlesis correct that if one is getting into the TN class of .01 or .001 degreestability a far more elaborate circuit is required. Goingback to my original post, this was only a suggestion for an inexpensivesolution for the problem. Since I don’t have a 5065A, I can’t prove or disproveif it would give the desired results. WhenI get them set up, my demon to solve is how to get my 5370B’s to be cool andquiet. There has to be a better solution to the PS heat. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Subject: Subject: Re: HP5065A C-field current voltage mod
Hi, Wrote: A possible solution mightbe to use two of the TL431 programmable shut regulators. [Snip] Wrote: That would be worse thanwhat is in my 5065 now. OK, but why? The temperature would be stable so the resistorsand reference diode wouldn’t drift. Is the TL 431 not sufficientlyquiet? What about newer reference’s IC’s such as REF 102? I don’t want to re-invent thewheel, just learn what is better. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Subject: Re: HP5065A C-field current is temperature sensitive
Hi, A possible solution might be touse two of the TL431 programmable shut regulators. One to replace the zener diodeand the second to form a simple oven using a thermistor and pot to set thetemp. See: http://www.techlib.com/electronics/ovenckts.htmand TL431 data sheet for details. Then one can use 1% 50 ppm metalfilm resistors, far, far less expensive than <5 ppm units. Put the whole package in part ofa 1/2 inch reformed copper water pipe. Using just two pots bothtemperature and output voltage can be quite precisely adjusted. Cheap. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Chinese GPSDO 10 MHz error
Hi, On the EEVBLOG (http://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php) They mention that the 2014-11-06version GPSDO that was “most extensively tested, so far (by ke5x and others). (Has a) known bug, outputfrequency is not exactly 10mhz (9,999,999.999,800 Hz). This translates to ~2hzerror at 100ghz.” A question is if this bug isjust for this particular model or all other versions suspect? I realize that in and of itsself it is very small error, but errors tend to multiply or cause incorrectconclusions to testing. Another question is will the LHdisplay unit they offer work with other Trimble units such as are offered byRDR? That said, these models seem tobe a very nice turn-key systems. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] New +/- 1 sec in 100 days mech clock
List, http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3045499/Longitude-clock-stuns-experts-keeping-accurate-second-100-days-300-years-designed.html Personally I’m blown away howsomeone can homer brew a mechanical clock like this. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Thank you note
List, I want to thank all the memberswho have answered my questions, many being you really don’t want to do this andhere’s why as well as the current group that generally posts to the list. I really don’t want to learn by trying thingsthat have failed for others proving again to myself that they won’t work, I’ve learned much from the listby reading what other people have tried with varying degrees of success or havefailed at so I don’t make the same mistake. Many subjects are way over myhead and for those I just delete as I’ll never be interested in it or it farexceeds my skill level. I want to especially acknowledgetwo members in particular. Jim Lux: for his fascinating longand highly readable posts for a layman like myself on the JPL workings. Secondly, Bob Camp for both hislist and off list emails patiently *schooling * me so I continue to grow in TNknowledge. This is a great group and I concedethat I have made some less than prudent comments on several occasions for whichI apologize for. An extreme differencein opinion still calls for polite response of disagreement. I was appropriatelytaken, privately, to the wood shed. That issue aside, I could neverhave gotten such a fascinating education in timekeeping and its almost infinitevariations without this group. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Distribution Amps
List, There has been a large exchangeof ideas for various home-brew or other video box alternatives which all wouldseem to work OK. For me it was simpler to buy asurplus HP 5087A for best offer which turned out to be $300 delivered. Besides having 12 outputs, youhave a choice of 3 inputs. It alsoaccepts IIRC 1, 5, and 10 MHz input signals. I probably will never use all ofits capabilities but for my needs it was the best choice. Also if your pacemaker isn’t intop-notch order, you may not want to look at the prices of its newerreplacement. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] 5 to 10 MHz doublers
List, There has been a lot ofinformation on the list for 5 MHz frequency doublers. As it is easier for me to buythan make, would using something like a Mini-Circuits surplus DBM’s be anacceptable way to go? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] 10811 Alternatives
List, It appears from Bob Camp’sexperience (and others) that the Chicoms Morion oscillators are to be avoided. My question is: Could Bob Camp,Rick K. and other gurus with experience come up with a list of the Ebay 10 MHzsurplus oscillators that would be worth buying as well as what would be a fairprice? Also some good vendor names would be nice as well. I realize that surplus listvaries quite a bit and it still a bit of a crap shoot, but perhaps the odds arebetter from certain venders, makes, and models. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 5370A to B conversion
List, I won a 5370A from ebay. Though it seems to be missing the A channel level knob, the unit was shown powered up with the correct 0.0 on the display, although the unit was sold as non-working for parts or repair. But the price was right with a best offer accepted. So assuming (gulp) that the unit works after fixing the A channel problem. is it practical or desirable to convert this to a B unit? I have one of the new processor boards with the BBone option that I can use in the unit. Advice requested. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] LM 723 Ckt Wanted.
List, Many, many years ago I think it was in EDN magazine that a circuit was published that used two LM 723 regulators. One was used as a heater circuit and the other as a voltage regulator. I lost my paper copy in moving and found that that particular circuit is behind a paywall. If anyone has this circuit I'd appreciate a copy. TIA Regards, PerriersandeenpaXXyatXXyahoo.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Simple xtal oven for accurate clocks II
List, This TL 431 temperature regulator circuit might be useful. www.techlib.com/electronics/ovenckts.htm Regards, PerriersandeenpaXXyatXXyahoo.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Motorola Lightning Protection Article
List, I have reproduced a Motorola Lightning Protection article from the PPRA newsletter from the early 80's. If anyone wants a copy please send me an ORIGINAL email off list and I'll send you a PDF. I will also post a copy to Didier's web site in a few days. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] WTT New Lucent GPSDO set
List, My two new OEM Lucent sets arrived today. As I suspected from reading the previous posts, they are a total kettle of fish different from the older *yellow finned* series. Because I already have five of the *yellow finned* units I want to keep all my Lucent units the same style. I'm willing to trade on an even basis for the *yellow finned* style. If possible. I'd rather have more of the GPS boxes than the crystal XO boxes, but XO boxes aren't a deal breaker. I do however, want working *yellow finned* GPS boxes for my new style GPS boxes. I'll split the sets if necessary but I'd rather do a pair bases as the new sets can be enabled to *talk* together. My units came in OEM packed factory sealed boxes that Symetricon had made in Korea. If interested, please contact me off line at sandeenpaXatXyahoodotcom Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] 10 MHz Filters
List, I have seen on the net a 10 MHz filter using 10.7 IFtransformers but have no idea how well they would work for isolation with thenew style Lucent boxes. Thoughts? On Ebay venders are offering 10 MHz crystals for almostnothing if you buy 30. My question wouldthese be good for making some type of simple ladder filter? In his article *Modifying Lucent RFG-M-RB Rubidium FrequencyStandard* the author used a 10MHz filter that was taken from an old 10MbitEthernet LAN board. The part number he used was 20F001N and I found them onEbay for low prices. Now I don’t have any access to any old ethernet LAN boardsso I’d have to build from scratch. Does anyone of these methods have an advantage over theothers on the new style Lucent boxes or in the making of a small distributionamplifier with good isolation? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Division Circuit
List, I’ve digitized and edited an article titled* Circuit DividesFrequency by N+1 by Bert Erickson, Fayetteville, NY from EDN 7/11/2002*. Essentially, this circuit is expandable and allows for adivision by any number plus one. Anyone who wants a PDF copy please send me an original emailoff list. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Lucent Unit Differences
List, Wrote [Snip] The chain in the Z3810 / 3811 / 3812 Lucent boxes is *much* different than the setup in the earlier parts. The phase noise and ADEV on the Z3810’s is better than what you got on the earlier versions. That’s good to know. I only have the older style units. It will be interesting see how well the older units can be *tweeked*. [Snip] The 15 MHz buffer appears to be quiet and puts out a lot of power. Power yes, but the waveform is highly distorted. [Snip] Using it for 10 MHz would give you a *lot* of 10 MHz signal to play with. IF the mods are simple it’s an attractive solution. If it involves swapping out 30 parts - That is the idea. Hack (in my case) the 10 MHz from the oscillator into the 15 MHz circuit. There are two i5 MHz filters to be bypassed or replaced. The Modifying The Lucent Rubidium article uses just two resistors to reduce overdriving and a surplus ethernet 10 MHz to reduce spurs. I don’t know how applicable it would be to the newer boxes but putting a load resistor on the output and using a scope should give one a good idea if a mod is needed. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Bypass Capacitor Kit Prices
List, There has been limited response from the list for bypass caps for the HP 3586 and HP 5370. So this is what I was able to come up with: HP 3586 25ea 470uF 50 Volt Panasonic 667-EEU-FR1H471B for $25 This includes taxes, shipping to and my postage costs. HP 5370X 50ea 150uF 50V Panasonic 667-EEU-FR1H151B for $25. This includes taxes, shipping to and my postage costs. I did not include the large (expensive) input filter caps as that will be up to the individuals discretion. However I will send a complete recap list with every order. I’m setting a cutoff date of Nov. 25th for orders. Delivery will probably be mid Dec. I won’t cash your check until I ship you your parts. My address is Perry Sandeen 661 La Costa Banning, CA 92220-5317 Also if one wants one or both of the lists just for reference, please send me an original email and I’ll send you a copy. SandeenpaXXatXXyahoo.com. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Lucent GPSDO comments
Wrote: At some point we will get into hacking the main board to switch from 15 MHz to 10 MHz. One doesn’t have to that if one uses the two IC divide by 1.5 circuit I offered the list. I specifically found it so I didn’t have to hack the innards. Wrote: The great news is the oscillator is 5 Mhz. Don’t bet the rent on that. My early units have 10 MHZ Datum oscillators. Bob’s point about getting the GPSDO’s if all cost the same is a good point. Another point. At least on the older units I have: GPSDO, Rubidium, and Crystal oscillator, the output circuitry after the 15 MHz conversion takes place is the same. So if one hacks the 10 Mhz into the chain, all one has to do is remove or bypass the 15 MHz filter before the output. Even if you don’t have the rubidium unit but have either/or GPDO or Crystal oscillator email me off list for the rubidium schematic as after the logic chips they use the same circuit. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Electrolytic Capacitor Redux
List, Thanks to all for their comments. Wrote: The high grade aluminum electrolytics and the tantalums will look quite different on a network analyzer as you sweep them from 100 KHz up. OK. Since these of just being used for DC PS bypassing on individual boards I think I’ll be OK with the Panasonic electrolytics. Wrote: Take a look at the Aluminum Organic Polymer Electrolytics. Available in 105 °C and 125 °C. They have very low ESRs. In the milliohms. Yowza! Excellent specs but they cost more than tantalums Wrote: bought Vishay/Sprague caps. I looked at what Mouser stocked but they don’t match the capacitance values I need. My goal when it comes to huge uF caps HP uses in their PS’s is to find a kind of common(s) denominator so I can get the +10 prices. So some of my equipment my get a higher capacity and/or voltage than the OEM version. One thing I’m not going to do is use the OEM screw terminal caps because of their price. Instead I’m going to use the snap-in style and mount them using #16 solid copper wire. I checked the HP 3586 PS schematic and the are specing 40 micro-volts ripple before the regulators. Tight! Regards, Perrier SandeenpaXXatXXyahoo.com. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Capacitor Group Buy
List, The common denominator capacitor for the HP 3586 is 470 uF/ 50V. The HP 3586B uses about 18. The capacitor is a Panasonic P/N 667-EEU-FR1H471B The common denominator capacitor for the HP 5370B is 105C / 6,000 Hr. 150 uF / 50V. The 3586 uses about 20. I am willing to sell them for cost (including shipping and taxes from Mouser) plus postage plus 20% in blocks of 25. Your savings will be about 50% of the single unit price. To make this work I’ll need a commitment of 500 minimum The HP 5370B uses about 46. If enough people are interested I am willing to make a group buy in blocks of 100. The capacitor is a Panasonic 105C / 6,000 Hr.P/N 667-EEU-FR1H151B. I am willing to sell them for cost (including shipping and taxes from Mouser) plus postage plus 20% in blocks of 50. Your savings will be about 50% of the single unit price. For this to work I’ll need a commitment of 1,000 minimum. Parts will be cash up front. If you do the math you will see I’m better off working for Mickey D. If interested, PLEASE send me an ORIGINAL email off list. I inform everybody by email if it is a go. Some have not been doing this and it screws up my Yahooey mail and I may miss your order. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Electrolytic Capacitor Question
List, OK everybody, let’s not get our pacemakers wound upG The problem. (Long Intro) I have about 15 pieces or so of older HP test equipment. 3586B, 5370B, 5335A to name a few. Because of their age of 20+ years a few have failed and need repair. I have decided to go on a wholesale electrolytic capacitor replacement on all of them. (Mouser will be able to declare an extra dividend) For all the *standard* types I’ve chosen mostly Panasonic 105C 10,000 hour caps. So far, so good. Now I come to the issue of the wet-slug tantalums that were used. At the time of manufacture, these were the best and most expensive low voltage electrolytics available. The question is: can one replace the tantalums with the high grade (105C) Panasonic or Nichicon capacitors with an equal or higher capacitance value? Even using the *tear drop* new replacements one is looking at very heavy $$$. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] DIP Is Dead R.I.P
List, Wrote: The days of DIP parts are drawing to a close. I was shocked, absolutely shocked, really, when I looked at the latest Mouser catalog about the lack of PDIP I.C.’s. That said, we are faced with a dilemma. In all my HP test equipment I probably have 500 or more PDip IC’s, so what to do to keep the equipment running properly? My first two thoughts are to re-cap all the power supplies and attempt to have greater cooling, especially in the notoriously hot 5370B units. For them I've given thought to using external switching regulator supplies or removing the heat sink and making it a separate module or external dropping resistors. Another choice maybe is to replace some of the original 74 series with LPS or similar later types to reduce internal instrument heat. It may be time to get a number of *running spares* from reputable Ebay sellers. Perhaps all of the above in different proportions. I have far, far too much money in HP test equipment just to sit and watch my units fail one by one. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 3586B Info
List, I've assembled three PDF documents for the HP 3586B. An electrolytic capacitor replacement list, a 15 KHz IF pick-off doc and the Beethoven audio test. You get three for the price of one: FREE. If interested, please send me a new email off line. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Lucent Rubidium Schematics
List, I have just finished digitizing and repaginating *Modifying Lucent RFG-M-RB Rubidium Frequency Standard* by Ivan Makarov. (m...@makarov.ca Copyright © 2011 VE3IVM). He has made many modifications to solve a number of problems that have been mentioned on the list lately. If anyone wants a PDF copy PLEASE generate an original email off list to me only asking for a copy. This is because if you do a *reply to* from list it Yahoo will lump them all together and I might miss a request. I will also include two additional circuits. One is a divide by 1.5 and the other is a divide by 3. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] GPS W/10KHz
List, Wrote: You're looking for the older Rockwell/Conexant/Navman Jupiter-T ones. Some default in Motorola binary compatibility mode, with only 8 channels visible. Due to scarcity they are getting way too pricey... You might be better off with the newer uBlox NEO/LEA-6T, with configurable output(s). Hi, Actually, I was just looking them up in response to the list request. Personally, I have several Oncore boards I bought years ago. When I use them up and then might give the Ublocs a try. TVB hit the nail on the head for my situation. I know as much about micro-processors as a cat knows about swimming. 10 KHz loop filters are easier to learn and tame than the 1PPS. I want to make it to use it. Nothing is more depressing than building something complex and it doesn’t work and you can’t figure out how to make it work. Many comments made to the list about solving TN problems assumes that one can write code and load it into a device. Many of us can’t and then to learn it the results aren’t worth it. And microprocessor solutions don’t always work out exactly. An example: Bertrand Zauhar, VE2ZAZ designed a DDS replacement oscillator replacement for the HP 3586 SLV. It was to replace the non-phase-locked IF oscillator frequencies (13,775Hz to 17,475Hz). It is an awesome effort. But herein lies the problem. Depending which model one owned, and which production run it came from, you chose one of five different code files. After you load the code the 3585 still has errors of .1 to .2 Hz and change. So what does a poor slob like me do when I have five 3585’s and they have several different frequencies for the IF oscillator? My solution was to spend $250 at a hamfest for a good working HP 3336. I then disable the HP 3586 IF oscillator; plug in the 3326, set my frequency and Wallah. I’m ready to go W/O an offset error. If I go to another 3586 with a different IF oscillator, I just change the dial and I’m back in business again. Now, before someone flames me, please read this twice: Burt’s solution is great for someone who 1.) Knows how to AND likes programming microprocessors and 2.) The DDS error is OK for their purpose. For me, my more expensive solution was 1.) One I could do it with my limitations and 2.) It had the accuracy I desired. As TVB stated: we have to work with the limitations we have. When I make my GPSDO, I will go for the simplest technology I can find to meet my needs. And I want to make it as simple and reliable as an AK-47 Fortunately I have a good supply of HP 10811 and Lucent Xtal oscillators and a couple of Lucent Rubidium’s for test subjects. I have some old HP 1U cases for building complete standalone GPSDO units. All I need now is for us to sell our house to be able to move to our condo in CA and fire up ye olde soldering iron. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] GPS W/10KHz
List, Wrote: where is a good source of GPS receiver modules I need one which has 10kHz output to phase lock a quartz oscillator. Fluke.1 Motorola ONCORE M12+T timing gps receiver 1pps 100hz eBay item number:290656401551 Also RDR There is another china seller that has them(10KHz) with leads for $90 but is almost impossible to find. Last time I searched it took me a hour. But he has a wide assortment. I forgot to bookmark his site. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] EFC divider resistors
All, The REF 102 from TI is a +10 reference with a TC of 2.5PPM/max. Using two 1% 50 PPM metal film Xcion resistors on can make a +5 V regulator that is far superior to a 7805. Cost is about $7 from mouser. If one needs to have an adjustable resistor in a circuit perhaps one of the digital pots that are available will suffice. A question: would thermal cycling oscillators or reference boards be useful before starting a stability run? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Small DPM clocks
List, What I am looking for is a way to display Local Time (MST) and Zulu (GMT) time in a small (6 X 8 or similar) package. There must be two displays and both lock up to NBS. Has anyone seen such a thing? Hi Martin, If you look on Ebay and type in LED automobile clocks, there is a large selection of DPM units that might meet your needs. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Jammer Redux
List, Tonight on the news they reported that an EMS helicopter had to make an emergency landing as the pilot or co-pilot was blinded in one eye by a green laser. As of the report time his one eye was still blind. Now that the proverbial feces has hit the old fashioned rotater cooling mechanism there will be severe repercussions for those morons doing it. (Life W/O parole sounds like a good first time offender sentence to me.) From the video it appeared to be a high wattage green laser that was used was far more powerful than what the Egyptian students used to signal joy by lighting up the supporting military helicopters over Tahir square. Will owner permits be coming in the future? Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Speaking of 5370s
List, I have four 5370b units. Two of the three lost the frequency input channel while I was using it for long term frequency monitoring. The fourth unit I bought for “parts or not working” had the same frequency input problem. Do we see a trend here? Verifying that the input switch(s) are bad can be monitored on TP 2 and TP 4 on the A3 board on the schematic I have but they are marked TP 2 and TP 3 on the rear view photo of the A3 board on the same sheet Page 8-85. I don’t know how easy or difficult they are to access. Unless one can verify the continuity from the input BNC at those test points it may be a bit premature to blame the switches. Also on the A3 board are a number of TA electrolytic caps. If one has to open up there 5370 for repair it would be very wise to replace all caps with new Panasonic, Nichicon or similar brands better grade of electrolytic caps. While the TA caps may still work, being 25 to 30 years old they are not nearly the quality of the new modern electrolytics and at some point they are going to fail. Fortunately both input circuits are identical so it is easier to signal trace. Unfortunately for me this has to be theoretical as my entire lot of test equipment is packed for moving and I may not be able to prove or disprove my hypothesis for months to come. However I’m still of the opinion that every piece of HP test equipment that is over 15 years old should have all its electrolytics replaced with the newer versions now available. Besides the three defective 5370’s I have eight other pieces of failed HP test equipment (several I purchased as non-working) all which will keep me very busy recapping for a month or so when I get to our condo. Mouser will probably be able to declare an extra dividend. However, as I’m 72, when I’m finished there is a very high probability that I will never have to repair them again in my lifetime. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Lady Heather W/O a PC: Alternative
List, Wrote The point is that this only makes it cheaper. It is still a PC running Windows in some other room. Not exactly. You missed what I was trying to say about programming: which was I can’t do it and don’t want to learn how to do it. It’s just not my cup of tea. It is a cheap method for some of us to have a dedicated LH monitor. I think what is wanted is a way to have the Thunderbolt on-line so the status shows up wherever you like. That may the goal, I don’t know. Also those old PC notebooks burn more power than you think. Not nearly as much as an older desktop PC but I bet more than $100 per year in power. (The old desktop might burn $300 per year) Two points. If we can afford to two or more HP 5370b’s and all the other devices we use for our hobby an additional laptop won’t add much more to the electric bill. Using the power just comes with the territory. If we can’t afford it then we need a different hobby. Another problem is that people might like to also run NTP server using their Thunderbolt and the Windows OS that LH uses is a very poor choice for NTP, so you'd need a second computer. Best to put both on a little ARM powered board. That well might be the best technical solution. But if one can’t program, we have to find alternatives. The $25 notebook only helps with cost. It doesn't change the functionality. I disagree. It gives people with no programing skills a cheap dedicated LH monitor. Also many of us don’t run NPT servers so to us it is a non-issue. Lots of solutions are case specific. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Spec Analyzer Redux
List, Wow! Thanks for all the good advice shared on and off list. I guess that I didn’t make clear is that I really don’t need anything below 100 KHz. I bought my 3585a for its upper range to 40 MHz for use with HF receivers. One great idea suggested that I never thought of is to get a scope cart. That may turn out to be the easiest solution. Your advice brings a few more questions and also I’ll share what I found out during my hours of ebay browsing. First, I didn’t want to purchase anything not from North America because of shipping issues. I never looked the Rigor as it was out of my budget range. [It does seem nice. Is it China’s answer to HP and Tek?] The ATTEN series, while inexpensive, didn’t seem to have the sensitivity of the better known brands plus being from China. Tine $1000 range is a bit iffy for analyzers. When one jumps to the $1500 range there seems to be a plethora of choices. Someone suggested a HP 8568a and no matter how good it is it looks like I’m going from one large mass to another. The Agilent L1500A seems very nice but probably above my price point. What seems to be the best fit at the moment are a couple Tektronix units. Decisions, Decisions. All the advice given will help me decide on making another purchase. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 117 from ebay
List, I bought one of them for several reasons besides that I really wanted it. 1. There is plenty of real estate to install Paul’s demod circuit. 2. It is large enough so the nuvistors can be replaced with dual gate mosfets (I have lots of them). Also sometimes replacement nuvistors can be obtained on ebay for a reasonable amount. 3. If needed, I believe most of the divider circuits can be relatively easily replaced with IC’s. However the first thing I will do before firing it up (figuratively or literally) is to replace all the electrolytic caps. I’m not interested in buying the antenna as there are numerous vlf antenna circuits with preamps for 60 KHz on the net. One suggestion I found interesting was the idea of filling your tubing with wet sand then using a truck tire to bend the loop. Where to borrow a truck tire? It didn’t say. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Spectrum Analyzer Suggestions
List, I just purchased a HP 3585 spec analyzer on E bay for a reasonable price. I wanted this instead of the 181 series as the range was more to what I’d be using and it was of a newer vintage. The 3585a goes from 10 Hz to 40 MHz which is a most useful range for my purposes. so far, so good. The problem is I didn’t know the beast weighed a svelte 88 pounds! Double Hernia time! What I’d appreciate advice for a used spec analyzer in the $1,000 range that is at least much lighter. A smaller size would also be a benefit. I probably would never use it above 100 MHz. A slightly smaller screen would be OK. Suggestions appreciated. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Posting Rules
Charles wrote: Please keep your political comments to yourself and off the list (however humorous you might think they are). This is simply not the place for them. Charles, On the two lists we both subscribe to, you always seem to have something to say about almost every post. Often it falls into the category of Mother says: now don’t forget to do ___. (You can fill in the blank space.) I see you doing this in a very condescending manner. On the R-390 list, I’ve forgotten more about the R-390A receiver than you will ever know. I was trained on them, serviced them in the military, developed parts kits for them, wrote the Y2KR3 manual and have had a number of published technical articles about them. At least on the R 390A radio you have done nothing that I’m aware of and I follow information on it very carefully. You don’t own or administer this list. All members have the right to make civil posts of their opinion whether others agree with them on not. My mother died many years ago and I don’t need you to be her replacement. You have the same privilege of all of us to post or delete. Kind Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] How dangerous if a Rb lamp broken?
Hui and all, You have absolutely NOTHING to fear. Here is why: If in the USA it was found that it MIGHT possibly hurt something on the endangered species list [Humans might count also in some situations.] The following would happen. 1. A Transportation Security Agency [1.6 Billion bullets and counting] heavily armed and masked SWAT team would appear at Rb owners houses. They know where we are thanks to NSA wire taps and the fact that every piece of mail in the US mail system is photocopied on each side and stored. 2. The rubidiums would be seized. Next: A. The owner would be fined for having an unregistered WMD. B. The owners name would go on a WMD offenders list. Offenders would have to report to the police wherever they live and would be barred from contact of anyone below the age of 18 and could not reside within one mile of a school. 3. The administration branch of our US government would declare that: The War On Dangerous Rb’s Has Been Won and the US citizens are now safer. 4. Bonus’s will be awarded. 5. Congressional oversight committees will ask the TSA what has been done with seized rubidiums. The TSA will not tell congress who authorized the seizer and where the Rubidiums are. Any TSA leaders subpoenaed will take the 5th amendment. Congress will get really, really mad and stop their feet. Nothing more will happen. It will fade away as the administration spokesman will say: “It is old news and really doesn’t matter compared to what I tell you today”. 6. Magically, as no one knows anything, the Rubidiums will end up in a third world country without environmental law to be salvaged and the sold to mainland China. See, it really is simple. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP 5870B Electrolytic Cap List
To all my fellow list heretics who believe in change before failure, I have put together a list of AFAIK, all the electrolytics from the 5370B service manual, their location, and possible Nicicon 105 C rated capacitors for replacement. Not on the list, but what I plan to do when I replace all of the electrolytics, is to add a .01 uF/500 volt disc ceramic in parallel with each. I plan to replace all the tantalums with much higher capacity electrolytics. The plan is not completely set in stone but it’s close. I have 4 units now. My first one had the display go blank. The second one had the B channel die. I just bought two others on ebay for parts/not working. One also has the B channel out but the last and highest priced unit just needed the rear switch set to internal osc and now it works fine. My estimate cost from the Mouser catalog is less than $20 per unit. For me, cheap insurance. If anyone wants a copy of my list contact me off list and I’ll email you a copy. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Dropping mains voltage
List, Another economical way to auto regulate your AC voltage is using servo motor voltage regulators. They are a bit strange but the ones I’ve seen seem to work well, even the cheap ones from China. But do check that they have a fuse. They also have a trimming pot inside if you want to make a small adjustment. BUT IF YOU DO remember that these are auto-transformers and they are not isolated. so use due caution. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP E1938A Oscillator
List, I was looking on Ebay for some HP E1938A oscillators What I found listed were: HP E1938A 10 MHz Quartz Oscillator with EFC on PC board. $100 Fluke.l HP E1938-60201 Ovenized Crystal Oscillator (on a PC board) $100 Tomy Chou HP E1938A Ovenized Crystal Oscillator W/O a PC board for $50 and free shipping from 2010bluebook. My question is thus: What does the PC board do? All I need is a HP EFC oscillator that would be better that my HP 10811-60111’s. Do I need to worry that the E1938A’s without the board maybe of lessor quality than the others? Fluke.l says his units are good but not stellar. The other venders say they have tested the units and guarantee them to be good. If so, would it get better with aging? So what does the collective wisdom/experience of the group think? TIA Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Wanted: HP 117A
List, I'd like to buy or trade for a working HP 117A. I don;t need the HP antenna. Please contact off line if interested. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Dual-bandwidth loop for VCO phase lock
List, In sorting through my mountain of old papers preparing for our moving, I cam across an article that I had saved from Electronics magazines Engineer's notebook in 1975. The article was titled Dual-bandwidth loop speeds phase lock I OCR'd it and re-drew the illustrations and schematic. I would be glad to email a copy to anyone who would like it. The schematic doesn't show values and I don't have the skills needed to determine the values. So if someone can calculate them I would appreciate getting them and I will add them to the schematic. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Answers to regulator choices comments
Wrote: If you are in the US (maybe elsewhere) you can request two free samples. That might work for projects on and two, but what about projects three and onward? Wrote: I suppose that the same philosophy [paralleled regulators] would apply to getting more power with a 7805 farm. It does however with the general output rating of 1 to 1.5 amps for each regulator it wouldn’t be very practical. It’s much cheaper and simpler to use ones in the 3 amp plus range. Wrote: A regulator needs to be specifically designed for parallel operation. If it's not designed that way you will have a very hard time with it. I’ve never heard of any three terminal regulator designed for parallel operation. I believe that all three terminal regulators use a pass transistor. When one uses them in parallel they need a slight resistance added to each pass transistor to prevent current hogging just as one had to do when paralleling power transistors in other high amperage circuits. Wrote: It may be a bit more complicated than that. You need some way to share the load and you also need to make sure things are stable. The TI/National data sheet doesn't show anything about paralleling regulators. The AD data sheet shows 2 ft of #18 wire between each regulator and the load. I'm not enough of an analog guru to reverse engineer that setup and figure out the stability constraints and transfer them to 78xx type devices. I stand corrected about the LM 1084 showing paralleled regulators. However the data sheet says it is pin compatible with the LM 317. So we get to the paralleled regulator circuits by a bit of a circuitous route. If we go to National Semiconductor Linear Brief 51 March 1981 titled “Add Kelvin Sensing and Parallel Capability To 3-Terminal Regulators” it shows how to parallel two or more three terminal LM 338 regulators. The stability problem is solved for us by the Nation Semiconductor engineers. The 2 ft. of #18 wire for each regulator provides the load balancing resistance needed. One could use an ordinary resistor instead if it had the value of 30 mili-ohms. The operation of all 3 terminal regulators are the same. The internal circuitry looks at the relationship between the output voltage and the *ground* terminal. As the data sheets show, if we change that relationship with resistor combinations we can manipulate the output voltage to our needs. For most low voltage applications one can usually find a three terminal regulator that will fit the current needs, My original point was that the LM 1084 [$14] IMNSHO is very expensive for what it does. By paralleling two far cheaper of the LM 338 family one gets a larger ampacity of 10 amps instead of 7.5 amps for $3 to $5 instead depending on one’s scrounging abilities. In the end you pays your money and you make your choices. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
