Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 09:02:37PM -0500, Bill Dailey wrote: Well..if they didn't properly license the technology... They should be disabled. The problem is the fine print...where FTDI also states they won't support any chip they actually made before 2012...so some of those being disabled are possibly true counterfeits, and some are legitimate but insecured FTDI chips. --msa ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
On Fri, 24 Oct 2014 01:45:16 + Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing As a rule of thumb, never let windows update anything that isn't from Microsoft. What I do is if MS says I should update something, I go to that manufacturer and look at the update. MS update has been known to supply the wrong update when it comes to non-MS software. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
I read somewhere that you can pay FTDI and re-enable the devices but further in the article it said they would be permanently disabled in windows. Confusing. On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 10:47 PM, jim s jwsm...@jwsss.com wrote: Petty BS. If they want to disable the competitors, rev the device to have something that they can use to id their devices, and leave the other driver alone. USB supposed to put the widest support in the host end, and the secret sauce in the device. If they have a problem, they will not produce anyone with a dead device wanting to ever do business with them by disabling infringing devices. If they put out a message or such, but still worked with their driver fine. Else I will expect a generic unsigned driver to be out, which can be installed and will again work with all. That isn't desirable for anyone, but if that is what it takes to get going, most will install the unsigned driver, then mark FTDI devices forever off their list. They aren't the only ones with the secret sauce. I've seen several others, and had I known about them planning to do this would have gone with them, and not FTDI. There are only a few things that I have that have incorporated FTDI in, and I'm going to look at dumping that code and device now. Jim On 10/23/2014 8:01 PM, Paul Berger wrote: Unfortunately the issue that FTDI is trying to combat is counterfeiters, and I think you will find that the counterfeit devices will report the same product and vendor id as the genuine ones. The product and vendor ids are how the OS identifies a device and how they decide which device driver should be used. Apparently at least some of these counterfeit devices are not perfect copies or else a device driver would be unable distinguish them from genuine. It is like a number of years ago when cable TV companies where having a lot of trouble with counterfeit cable descramblers, they found a flaw in the code used in them and transmitted what became know as a magic bullet that caused them to fail. Paul. On 2014-10-23 11:30 PM, Chris Albertson wrote: On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 7:05 PM, paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com wrote: Umm I think its profoundly hard to know one way or another what chip you have in a widget. Before you buy it yes, you can't know. But it's trivial to find out after you own it. For example click the Apple logo then choose about this Mac and the data is there. For example it says this random USB thumb drive I have is Product ID: 0x3260 Vendor ID: 0x0aec (Neodio Technologies Corporation) Version: 1.00 Serial Number: 20040602032741578 This same exact information is logged every time the device is inserted to my Linux system too. I assume MS Windows will tell you all the vendor info as well. The vendor IDs are handed out to manufacturers by an outfit at usb.org . So, check your devices. It's not hard to find out about the ones you have. This is pretty insane actually. I buy products that I believe are legit no way to know just as if the cpu in my acer or emachines not legal. Heck I have no idea. Regards Paul WB8TSL On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 10:02 PM, Bill Dailey docdai...@gmail.com wrote: Well..if they didn't properly license the technology... They should be disabled. Sent from my iPad On Oct 23, 2014, at 8:45 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills- fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/ mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/ mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
Hi Licensing a legit USB ID costs money, both up front and ongoing. Writing drivers that keep up with the OS rev’s costs money. Supporting all this stuff with web sites and on the phone costs money. FTDI supports their products much better than the “other guys” you could buy from. That’s why they counterfeit the FTDI parts. If FTDI continues to support “all the old stuff” forever, then the counterfeiters simply dupe the old parts. Free ride / lower price / fewer costs. FTDI does all the support for their products. They have *no* responsibility to support stuff that was stolen from them. How much does the silicon cost on a typical chip - a few cents. How much does all the support stuff cost - a buck or more. The difference is not a small one at all. Bob On Oct 23, 2014, at 11:47 PM, jim s jwsm...@jwsss.com wrote: Petty BS. If they want to disable the competitors, rev the device to have something that they can use to id their devices, and leave the other driver alone. USB supposed to put the widest support in the host end, and the secret sauce in the device. If they have a problem, they will not produce anyone with a dead device wanting to ever do business with them by disabling infringing devices. If they put out a message or such, but still worked with their driver fine. Else I will expect a generic unsigned driver to be out, which can be installed and will again work with all. That isn't desirable for anyone, but if that is what it takes to get going, most will install the unsigned driver, then mark FTDI devices forever off their list. They aren't the only ones with the secret sauce. I've seen several others, and had I known about them planning to do this would have gone with them, and not FTDI. There are only a few things that I have that have incorporated FTDI in, and I'm going to look at dumping that code and device now. Jim On 10/23/2014 8:01 PM, Paul Berger wrote: Unfortunately the issue that FTDI is trying to combat is counterfeiters, and I think you will find that the counterfeit devices will report the same product and vendor id as the genuine ones. The product and vendor ids are how the OS identifies a device and how they decide which device driver should be used. Apparently at least some of these counterfeit devices are not perfect copies or else a device driver would be unable distinguish them from genuine. It is like a number of years ago when cable TV companies where having a lot of trouble with counterfeit cable descramblers, they found a flaw in the code used in them and transmitted what became know as a magic bullet that caused them to fail. Paul. On 2014-10-23 11:30 PM, Chris Albertson wrote: On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 7:05 PM, paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com wrote: Umm I think its profoundly hard to know one way or another what chip you have in a widget. Before you buy it yes, you can't know. But it's trivial to find out after you own it. For example click the Apple logo then choose about this Mac and the data is there. For example it says this random USB thumb drive I have is Product ID: 0x3260 Vendor ID: 0x0aec (Neodio Technologies Corporation) Version: 1.00 Serial Number: 20040602032741578 This same exact information is logged every time the device is inserted to my Linux system too. I assume MS Windows will tell you all the vendor info as well. The vendor IDs are handed out to manufacturers by an outfit at usb.org. So, check your devices. It's not hard to find out about the ones you have. This is pretty insane actually. I buy products that I believe are legit no way to know just as if the cpu in my acer or emachines not legal. Heck I have no idea. Regards Paul WB8TSL On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 10:02 PM, Bill Dailey docdai...@gmail.com wrote: Well..if they didn't properly license the technology... They should be disabled. Sent from my iPad On Oct 23, 2014, at 8:45 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
On 10/23/14, 9:14 PM, John Allen wrote: Hi Rick - I believe it was CompuServe (which AOL later bought.) It didn't really cause any trouble... Regards, John K1AE -Original Message- From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Richard (Rick) Karlquist Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2014 10:31 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately... This dispute reminds me of another one. A long long time ago, .gif was the internet standard for encoding photographs. Far and away the favorite. Then the owner (was it AOL?) decided to enforce their patent by getting snotty with end users. Almost overnight, .gif virtually disappeared off the face of the earth, to be replaced by .jpg, previously an also-ran. The IP holder got their wish We wish people would stop free loading on our IP.. Be careful what you wish for as the saying goes. Let's see if history repeats itself. Rick It wasn't GIF, per se (which was promulgated by CompuServe), but the fact that it is LZW compression, which was patented by Welch and assigned to Unisys in the mid 80s (so the patent has expired by now) Other compression schemes by Lempel and Ziv were also patented (earlier). ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
Jim Lux wrote: ... This dispute reminds me of another one. A long long time ago, .gif was the internet standard for encoding photographs. Far and away the favorite. Then the owner (was it AOL?) decided to enforce their patent by getting snotty with end users. Almost overnight, .gif virtually disappeared off the face of the earth, to be replaced by .jpg, previously an also-ran. The IP holder got their wish We wish people would stop free loading on our IP.. Be careful what you wish for as the saying goes. Let's see if history repeats itself. Rick It wasn't GIF, per se (which was promulgated by CompuServe), but the fact that it is LZW compression, which was patented by Welch and assigned to Unisys in the mid 80s (so the patent has expired by now) Other compression schemes by Lempel and Ziv were also patented (earlier). Yep! The thing we need to bear in mind is that Welch, etal, were pretty well compensated by the customers to which they had licensed the LZW algorithms. The free users were paying nothing to LZW, and were causing LZW's licensed customers to wonder why they were paying big bucks for algorithms that were being universally used for free. So, even though GIF (which had nothing to do with LZW, other than infringing the patent) lost its great market share, that happening had no apparent effect on LZW's bottom line. A different company (Microsoft), when faced with a very similar situation (MSBasic on CPM systems), leveraged the publicity and good will provided by the free users, into the leviathan company that is Microsoft today. LZW took the straight hard line and eschewed the fame and glory that came with being the heart of the GIF adhoc standard, and where are they today? Business is a tricky business. -Chuck Harris ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
just look that: http://zeptobars.ru/en/read/FTDI-FT232RL-real-vs-fake-supereal 73 Alex ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
Thanks, that was the final link I hope someone would post. I have many more links, but this is not the right forum for that. Now, everyone - STOP posting FTDI information to time-nuts. We are a precise time frequency list. If you want to discuss FTDI or Windows driver issues please subscribe to the excellent http://www.eevblog.com, or several other electronics, hobby, hacker, Windows, legal, business, USB forums that deal with stuff like this. It's all over the net. It's really quite interesting, at many levels! It hits me too. But it doesn't belong here. So, please keep time-nuts about precision time frequency. Use the rest of the web for non-TF stuff. Thanks, /tvb ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
Well..if they didn't properly license the technology... They should be disabled. Sent from my iPad On Oct 23, 2014, at 8:45 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
Umm I think its profoundly hard to know one way or another what chip you have in a widget. This is pretty insane actually. I buy products that I believe are legit no way to know just as if the cpu in my acer or emachines not legal. Heck I have no idea. Regards Paul WB8TSL On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 10:02 PM, Bill Dailey docdai...@gmail.com wrote: Well..if they didn't properly license the technology... They should be disabled. Sent from my iPad On Oct 23, 2014, at 8:45 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
The solution is for the infringing manufacturer to write their own driver that tests for one of their chips and then gives the chip a valid legal ID of their own. This is what they should have done in the first place. On 10/23/2014 07:05 PM, paul swed wrote: Umm I think its profoundly hard to know one way or another what chip you have in a widget. This is pretty insane actually. I buy products that I believe are legit no way to know just as if the cpu in my acer or emachines not legal. Heck I have no idea. Regards Paul WB8TSL On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 10:02 PM, Bill Dailey docdai...@gmail.com wrote: Well..if they didn't properly license the technology... They should be disabled. Sent from my iPad On Oct 23, 2014, at 8:45 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Chuck Forsberg WA7KGX c...@omen.com www.omen.com Developer of Industrial ZMODEM(Tm) for Embedded Applications Omen Technology Inc The High Reliability Software 10255 NW Old Cornelius Pass Portland OR 97231 503-614-0430 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
Yes it is hard to tell, I believe that is the aim of people in the counterfeiting business, if it was easy to tell they would not get very far. I do however believe that FTDI has the right to protect their intellectual property. I don't believe they are in the business of enabling counterfeiters. Let the counterfeiters provide their own drivers. If you think this is harsh it is no worse than being passed counterfeit money, when that happens no one reimburses you for the phoney money, I know I have been there, but fortunately it was only $10. Paul. On 2014-10-23 11:05 PM, paul swed wrote: Umm I think its profoundly hard to know one way or another what chip you have in a widget. This is pretty insane actually. I buy products that I believe are legit no way to know just as if the cpu in my acer or emachines not legal. Heck I have no idea. Regards Paul WB8TSL On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 10:02 PM, Bill Dailey docdai...@gmail.com wrote: Well..if they didn't properly license the technology... They should be disabled. Sent from my iPad On Oct 23, 2014, at 8:45 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 7:05 PM, paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com wrote: Umm I think its profoundly hard to know one way or another what chip you have in a widget. Before you buy it yes, you can't know. But it's trivial to find out after you own it. For example click the Apple logo then choose about this Mac and the data is there. For example it says this random USB thumb drive I have is Product ID: 0x3260 Vendor ID: 0x0aec (Neodio Technologies Corporation) Version: 1.00 Serial Number: 20040602032741578 This same exact information is logged every time the device is inserted to my Linux system too. I assume MS Windows will tell you all the vendor info as well. The vendor IDs are handed out to manufacturers by an outfit at usb.org. So, check your devices. It's not hard to find out about the ones you have. This is pretty insane actually. I buy products that I believe are legit no way to know just as if the cpu in my acer or emachines not legal. Heck I have no idea. Regards Paul WB8TSL On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 10:02 PM, Bill Dailey docdai...@gmail.com wrote: Well..if they didn't properly license the technology... They should be disabled. Sent from my iPad On Oct 23, 2014, at 8:45 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
This dispute reminds me of another one. A long long time ago, .gif was the internet standard for encoding photographs. Far and away the favorite. Then the owner (was it AOL?) decided to enforce their patent by getting snotty with end users. Almost overnight, .gif virtually disappeared off the face of the earth, to be replaced by .jpg, previously an also-ran. The IP holder got their wish We wish people would stop free loading on our IP.. Be careful what you wish for as the saying goes. Let's see if history repeats itself. Rick Karlquist N6RK On 10/23/2014 6:45 PM, Mark Sims wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
Unfortunately the issue that FTDI is trying to combat is counterfeiters, and I think you will find that the counterfeit devices will report the same product and vendor id as the genuine ones. The product and vendor ids are how the OS identifies a device and how they decide which device driver should be used. Apparently at least some of these counterfeit devices are not perfect copies or else a device driver would be unable distinguish them from genuine. It is like a number of years ago when cable TV companies where having a lot of trouble with counterfeit cable descramblers, they found a flaw in the code used in them and transmitted what became know as a magic bullet that caused them to fail. Paul. On 2014-10-23 11:30 PM, Chris Albertson wrote: On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 7:05 PM, paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com wrote: Umm I think its profoundly hard to know one way or another what chip you have in a widget. Before you buy it yes, you can't know. But it's trivial to find out after you own it. For example click the Apple logo then choose about this Mac and the data is there. For example it says this random USB thumb drive I have is Product ID: 0x3260 Vendor ID: 0x0aec (Neodio Technologies Corporation) Version: 1.00 Serial Number: 20040602032741578 This same exact information is logged every time the device is inserted to my Linux system too. I assume MS Windows will tell you all the vendor info as well. The vendor IDs are handed out to manufacturers by an outfit at usb.org. So, check your devices. It's not hard to find out about the ones you have. This is pretty insane actually. I buy products that I believe are legit no way to know just as if the cpu in my acer or emachines not legal. Heck I have no idea. Regards Paul WB8TSL On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 10:02 PM, Bill Dailey docdai...@gmail.com wrote: Well..if they didn't properly license the technology... They should be disabled. Sent from my iPad On Oct 23, 2014, at 8:45 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
Petty BS. If they want to disable the competitors, rev the device to have something that they can use to id their devices, and leave the other driver alone. USB supposed to put the widest support in the host end, and the secret sauce in the device. If they have a problem, they will not produce anyone with a dead device wanting to ever do business with them by disabling infringing devices. If they put out a message or such, but still worked with their driver fine. Else I will expect a generic unsigned driver to be out, which can be installed and will again work with all. That isn't desirable for anyone, but if that is what it takes to get going, most will install the unsigned driver, then mark FTDI devices forever off their list. They aren't the only ones with the secret sauce. I've seen several others, and had I known about them planning to do this would have gone with them, and not FTDI. There are only a few things that I have that have incorporated FTDI in, and I'm going to look at dumping that code and device now. Jim On 10/23/2014 8:01 PM, Paul Berger wrote: Unfortunately the issue that FTDI is trying to combat is counterfeiters, and I think you will find that the counterfeit devices will report the same product and vendor id as the genuine ones. The product and vendor ids are how the OS identifies a device and how they decide which device driver should be used. Apparently at least some of these counterfeit devices are not perfect copies or else a device driver would be unable distinguish them from genuine. It is like a number of years ago when cable TV companies where having a lot of trouble with counterfeit cable descramblers, they found a flaw in the code used in them and transmitted what became know as a magic bullet that caused them to fail. Paul. On 2014-10-23 11:30 PM, Chris Albertson wrote: On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 7:05 PM, paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com wrote: Umm I think its profoundly hard to know one way or another what chip you have in a widget. Before you buy it yes, you can't know. But it's trivial to find out after you own it. For example click the Apple logo then choose about this Mac and the data is there. For example it says this random USB thumb drive I have is Product ID: 0x3260 Vendor ID: 0x0aec (Neodio Technologies Corporation) Version: 1.00 Serial Number: 20040602032741578 This same exact information is logged every time the device is inserted to my Linux system too. I assume MS Windows will tell you all the vendor info as well. The vendor IDs are handed out to manufacturers by an outfit at usb.org. So, check your devices. It's not hard to find out about the ones you have. This is pretty insane actually. I buy products that I believe are legit no way to know just as if the cpu in my acer or emachines not legal. Heck I have no idea. Regards Paul WB8TSL On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 10:02 PM, Bill Dailey docdai...@gmail.com wrote: Well..if they didn't properly license the technology... They should be disabled. Sent from my iPad On Oct 23, 2014, at 8:45 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
On Oct 23, 2014, at 6:45 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: I’ve been following this matter closely; just yesterday I received a handful of FT232RLs from Mouser. As someone that makes use of serial-to-USB all the time, I’m well aware of their past efforts to prevent counterfeits from working and for the sake of my end users I’m mindful of the problems that will eventually result from spending $1 on a “FTDI” and make sure to spend $4.50 at reputable suppliers. So I understand where FT is coming from, but I think their solution is extreme. The greatest concern I have is people losing faith in automatic updates, disabling them, and intentionally leaving their machines vulnerable. On eBay I’ve sold about fifty Arduino clones. (Twelve hours until the next shipment arrives!) I go out of my way to make sure they use CHP340/341 chipsets for USB; it’s an extra step to install a driver, but I expected FT to disable counterfeits as they have before. Or in other words, I’m not surprised FTDI broke the fakes, I’m just surprised they touched the hardware. In the past they’ve just disabled the counterfeits in software which has the same effect. Plenty of analogies to counterfeit money, Rolexes, and Gucci handbags have appeared, and claims end users shouldn’t be hurt by counterfeit suppliers. But there are prices that are too good to be true. I don’t expect the average consumer to know the price of a 1000 pieces on a reel, but I do think they might want to ask, “Why can I buy this serial adapter for a dollar, when the rest are all five bucks?” And for context, here I advocate for FTDI, easiest to use: https://www.tindie.com/products/ptudor/ultimate-helper-gps-adapter/ And here I advocate the CH340/341. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Arduino-Nano-v3-clone-ATmega328p-Los-Angeles-USA-/231304190208 I did notice a small spike in ISP programmer sales last night, perhaps people affected or avoiding… http://www.ebay.com/itm/USBasp-H6-USB-ISP-5V-AVR-Programmer-for-Arduino-/231348877599 Patrick (KB6GE) smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately...
Hi Rick - I believe it was CompuServe (which AOL later bought.) It didn't really cause any trouble... Regards, John K1AE -Original Message- From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Richard (Rick) Karlquist Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2014 10:31 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] If any of your USB devices have stopped working lately... This dispute reminds me of another one. A long long time ago, .gif was the internet standard for encoding photographs. Far and away the favorite. Then the owner (was it AOL?) decided to enforce their patent by getting snotty with end users. Almost overnight, .gif virtually disappeared off the face of the earth, to be replaced by .jpg, previously an also-ran. The IP holder got their wish We wish people would stop free loading on our IP.. Be careful what you wish for as the saying goes. Let's see if history repeats itself. Rick Karlquist N6RK On 10/23/2014 6:45 PM, Mark Sims wrote: Happened to a friend of mine. All his Arduino stuff died. This could be the reason: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/ftdi-driver-kills-fake-ftdi-ft232 Short story: FTDI released a new version of their USB driver (via Windows automatic updates no less) that bricks other vendor's compatible versions of their interface chip. They also updated their license file to indicate that this may happen... except you never get a chance to decline the new license with automatic driver updates. I can just hear the class action lawyers drooling... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
