Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-23 Thread MLewis
uBlox M8T & antenna behind two panes of glass skyview is a 170 degree sweep centred 30 degrees east of south I regularly see attenuation with overcast clouds, but only with some overcast clouds. It's not consistent enough to be able to say which types. The attenuation can be as much as 10 dBc,

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-23 Thread Dana Whitlow
As far as I know, my friend's GPS dropout problems have been associated with simple clouds with no rain (at least no rain reaching the surface). Dana On Wed, Oct 23, 2019 at 2:00 PM Tim Shoppa wrote: > I don't think clouds is the direct cause, but of course clouds in the sky > can be

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-23 Thread Tim Shoppa
I don't think clouds is the direct cause, but of course clouds in the sky can be correlated with wet foliage. Especially if the GPS Field Of View has a lot of angle taken up by tree canopy, wet foliage can substantially degrade not just GPS reception but other VHF and UHF signals. I notice this

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-23 Thread Dana Whitlow
Andy, Isn't DirecTV downlinking around 12 GHz? Yet GPS L1 is at only ~1575 MHz. That's a huge difference with regard to scattering losses, and probably a fair amount of difference for water absorption losses as well. I've recommended that my old friend try putting his GPS antenna up in the

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-23 Thread Andy
Having had DirecTV on the roof for a few years, and having experienced regular significant signal loss events during heavy rain and snow (loss of reception was a rather good predictor that "the skies were about to open up" with rain), I can confirm that signal strength deteriorates noticeably

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-22 Thread Fiorenzo Cattaneo
Hi jimlux -- unfortunately my domain expertise is in the digital domain (computer science) and I'm having a hard time in following this paper. I do understand that "space weather", i.e. CMEs (coronal mass ejections) will significantly impact GPS/GLONASS operations when the charged particles reach

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-22 Thread jimlux
On 10/22/19 1:13 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: In message , Fiorenzo Cattaneo writes: Any kind of atmospheric disturbance has a measurable effect on GPS space and time precision, [...] Actually, it's even simpler than that: Any electrical charge in the freshnell-zone between the

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-22 Thread jimlux
On 10/22/19 2:23 AM, Jim Palfreyman wrote: I see no attenuation at 1376 MHz (close to GPS frequency) when observing pulsars with a radio telescope. Even the brightest pulsar (Vela) is so much fainter than a GPS signal which boom in when they happen to pass into the telescope's beam. It

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-22 Thread jimlux
On 10/21/19 10:06 PM, Dana Whitlow wrote: A friend of mine living in SE lower Michigan recently bought a Geppetto GPS clock, and swears that it tends to lose satellite lock on cloudy days but does OK on sunny days. He is admittedly using a very poorly-sited antenna, placed in a window because

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-22 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message , Fiorenzo Cattaneo writes: >Any kind of atmospheric disturbance has a measurable effect on GPS >space and time precision, [...] Actually, it's even simpler than that: Any electrical charge in the freshnell-zone between the two antennas delays the signal. In practice that

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-22 Thread Jim Palfreyman
I see no attenuation at 1376 MHz (close to GPS frequency) when observing pulsars with a radio telescope. Even the brightest pulsar (Vela) is so much fainter than a GPS signal which boom in when they happen to pass into the telescope's beam. It definitely happens at higher frequencies though. Up

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-22 Thread Fiorenzo Cattaneo
Any kind of atmospheric disturbance has a measurable effect on GPS space and time precision, the question is more about how much the impact is. Presuming that the GPS receiver is stationary, the antenna has a clear visibility of the sky, then "ordinary weather" like clouds, moderate rain or snow,

[time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-22 Thread Dana Whitlow
A friend of mine living in SE lower Michigan recently bought a Geppetto GPS clock, and swears that it tends to lose satellite lock on cloudy days but does OK on sunny days. He is admittedly using a very poorly-sited antenna, placed in a window because his house has aluminum siding. He reports