Good choice Bert Kehren
Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
Original message From: Gerhard Hoffmann Date:
9/16/18 6:30 PM (GMT-05:00) To: time-nuts@lists.febo.com Subject: Re:
[time-nuts] Programmable clock for BFO usenoise
Am 16.09.2018 um 23:11 schrieb
Am 16.09.2018 um 23:11 schrieb Attila Kinali:
On Sun, 16 Sep 2018 22:08:19 +0200
Gerhard Hoffmann wrote:
I'm also not a fan of using slowish, slew-rate challenged logic as a
replacement
for a low pass. When I want a low pass, I make it from nice,
time-invariant RLC.
Unfortunately, using a
Am 16.09.2018 um 20:00 schrub Mark Goldberg:
For a radio BFO you want something with low phase noise (low jitter). The
SI5351 is not designed for that, and it's jitter spec is 70 ps, which is
pretty noisy. It even has a spread spectrum mode that would be even worse.
They do have other parts
gt;>
> >> 89 Arnold Blvd.
> >>
> >> Howell NJ 07731
> >>
> >> 848-245-9115
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: time-nuts On Behalf Of Richard
> >> (Rick) Karlquist
&
On Sun, 16 Sep 2018 22:08:19 +0200
Gerhard Hoffmann wrote:
> I'm also not a fan of using slowish, slew-rate challenged logic as a
> replacement
> for a low pass. When I want a low pass, I make it from nice,
> time-invariant RLC.
Unfortunately, using a low pass after the divider will not
Just the info I wanted! Thanks, N0UU
> On September 16, 2018 at 8:49 AM Didier Juges wrote:
>
> Not the same part number but probably similar in terms of performance:
>
>
> http://www.ko4bb.com/getsimple/index.php?id=microprocessor-crystal-oscillator-comparison
>
> Bottom line:
Am 15.09.2018 um 17:38 schrieb Richard (Rick) Karlquist:
If you divide by something that is not a power of 2, then it is
important
that each stage produces an output waveform with a 50% duty cycle.
Otherwise
flicker noise which has been up-mixed by a previous stage, will be
down-mixed
into
Hi Chris,
On 09/16/2018 07:22 PM, Chris Waldrup wrote:
> How about using a ProgRock on Hans Summers QRP Labs website? This is a
> programmable crystal replacement.
I have one of those but have not had the time to put it up for a real
test. Also got the GPS module that should fit, as you can
Arnold Blvd.
>>
>> Howell NJ 07731
>>
>> 848-245-9115
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: time-nuts On Behalf Of Richard
>> (Rick) Karlquist
>> Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 7:15 PM
>> To: Discussion of prec
Hi
Coming back to the basics of the design:
If you are playing with a normal radio, a BFO that drifts under a few Hertz is
going to be pretty much un-noticable. Drift is a bit of an elastic term in this
case
since it can cover a bunch of different parameters on an oscillator
(temperature
as
Hi
Most of the traditional rules about phase noise apply out to 10 or 20% of the
“carrier”
frequency. If the carrier is 1Hz, then you are talking about the traditional
definitions holding
out to 0.1 or 0.2 Hz relative to carrier. That’s *deep* in the 1/F noise part
of the divider’s
“noise
That is fascinating. So, the 1PPS line on a GPSDO (a divide by 10Meg in
many cases) is 70 dB worse than the traditional 20log(N) PN scaling?
On Sat, Sep 15, 2018 at 11:40 AM Richard (Rick) Karlquist <
rich...@karlquist.com> wrote:
> Another great posting from Attila that keeps the S/N ratio
> on
Another great posting from Attila that keeps the S/N ratio
on this list high.
On 9/15/2018 3:26 AM, Attila Kinali wrote:
possible logic family for the task. Otherwise the harmonics of the
switching of the FF will down-mix high frequency white noise down
to the signal band (this is the reason
Kinali Date:
9/15/18 8:34 AM (GMT-05:00) To: Discussion of precise time and frequency
measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Programmable
clock for BFO usenoise
Hoi Bert,
On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 11:09:18 + (UTC)
ew via time-nuts wrote:
> What about the application and the trigger circ
Hoi Bert,
On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 11:09:18 + (UTC)
ew via time-nuts wrote:
> What about the application and the trigger circuit
Sorry, I don't understand what you mean.
Attila Kinali
--
The bad part of Zurich is where the degenerates
throw DARK
On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 13:13:40 +0200
Club-Internet Clemgill wrote:
> Very interesting, thanks.
> I found ref (2) by seems that need to pay or be to registered as a researcher
> to get ref (1).
> Is there a easier way to get a copy ?
Yes, use sci-hub: https://sci-hub.tw/10.1109/58.56498
Hi Attila,
Very interesting, thanks.
I found ref (2) by seems that need to pay or be to registered as a researcher
to get ref (1).
Is there a easier way to get a copy ?
Thx,
Gilles.
> Le 15 sept. 2018 à 12:26, Attila Kinali a écrit :
>
> On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 21:42:05 +
> Bryan _
What about the application and the trigger circuit
In a message dated 9/15/2018 6:27:50 AM Eastern Standard Time, att...@kinali.ch
writes:
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 21:42:05 +
Bryan _ wrote:
> I would be interested in hearing more of the more suitable classes of
> logic chips. I have a 20Mhz
Good points, Ulrich Rohde
Sent from my iPhone
> On Sep 15, 2018, at 6:26 AM, Attila Kinali wrote:
>
> On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 21:42:05 +
> Bryan _ wrote:
>
>> I would be interested in hearing more of the more suitable classes of
>> logic chips. I have a 20Mhz rubidium that I wanted to
On Fri, 14 Sep 2018 21:42:05 +
Bryan _ wrote:
> I would be interested in hearing more of the more suitable classes of
> logic chips. I have a 20Mhz rubidium that I wanted to divide down to 10Mhz
Any logic family works, as long as it is fast enough to handle your
input frequency. Due to the
Depending on the cost of those mems devices, a microcontroller can be so
trivial that you can just consider it as a smart eprom. Like Tom's PICDIV
dividers, which act more like perfect-for-pupose division chip than a micro.
On Sat, Sep 15, 2018 at 4:31 AM, Forrest Christian (List Account) <
Somebody send me the URL to that board thank you
On Fri, Sep 14, 2018, 9:21 PM wrote:
> Got a whole bunch of answers all with useful info. I think I will go
> with Hans' 4 output board to see if the project works at all and go from
> there. Off on a three week tour of Italy to Malta and
Got a whole bunch of answers all with useful info. I think I will go with
Hans' 4 output board to see if the project works at all and go from there. Off
on a three week tour of Italy to Malta and should have the parts when I get
back. This is one of those weird design things so maybe the
Would a mems oscillator such as a dsc6183 possibly work for you? I'm
uncertain if the characteristics of a mems oscillator is compatible with
your application.
For odd frequencies I often head toward a mems oscillator since many can be
programmed to any reasonable frequency. For example one
requency measurement
> ; ed breya
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Programmable clock for BFO usenoise
>
>
>
> >
>
> > Finally, of course, you can use DDS. This is nearly an ideal case for
>
>
>
> The trouble with a
of precise time and frequency measurement
; ed breya
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Programmable clock for BFO usenoise
>
> Finally, of course, you can use DDS. This is nearly an ideal case for
The trouble with a DDS is that you need a microcontroller with software just
to baby sit the
Rick said:
"The trouble with a DDS is that you need a microcontroller with software
just to baby sit the thing."
Yes, I know what you mean. I wouldn't want to go through all that. I'm
picturing more like the small, cheap DDS boards that show up on ebay.
Maybe the right stuff could be found
Finally, of course, you can use DDS. This is nearly an ideal case for
The trouble with a DDS is that you need a microcontroller with
software just to baby sit the thing.
Rick N6RK
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time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com
To
Those programmable oscillators look interesting. I went to Cardinal the
website to learn more, but they're pretty sparse on details. It looks
like they make all sorts of crystals, OC, TC, and VT XO modules, etc,
and these programmable ones, which are apparently PLL-based oscillators
locked to
; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Programmable clock for BFO usenoise
Frequency dividers can be pretty low noise, if you choose the right class
of logic. I remember that
at one time in the distant past, LSTTL was considered king. Unfortunately
I've been
As a suggestion I collaborate with a Canadian ham some 5 years ago using a
DDS as a BFO for the HP 3586. Those details were shared on time-nuts if
they are still in the archives.That worked really well. I recall he was a
VE3??? The 3586 had 2 crystals for the BFO while the entire rest of the
The AC series is really quite good on phase noise; I used it in
the 5071A at 80 MHz.
Rick N6RK
On 9/14/2018 12:55 PM, Dana Whitlow wrote:
Frequency dividers can be pretty low noise, if you choose the right class
of logic. I remember that
at one time in the distant past, LSTTL was considered
I encountered these oscillators on a circuit I inherited
from another engineer. The spectrum of these is quite
dirty and they should only be considered as digital clock
oscillators. An additional annoyance is that they are
not marked with the frequency they are programmed to,
so if you have USB
Frequency dividers can be pretty low noise, if you choose the right class
of logic. I remember that
at one time in the distant past, LSTTL was considered king. Unfortunately
I've been out of touch
with frequency dividers long enough to be ignorant of what works well today.
i'd suggest trying
I'd look for the appropriate crystals. If it will help, I have a 250.00 kHz one
you can have.
Wes N7WS
On 9/14/2018 9:14 AM, lstosk...@cox.net wrote:
Off topic for this list, but you guys are experts in oscillator noise!
Playing with some mechanical filters. Need USB and LSB crystals for
paulsw...@gmail.com said:
> I looked at those types of units. I thought they were factory programmed. I
> may be wrong but was not of the opinion they were single unit buys.
I think the business model is distributor programmed. The distributor stocks
a small set of internal xtal frequencies
Not sure it would be the noise divided by 4. Not a useful answer.
I looked at those types of units. I thought they were factory programmed.
I may be wrong but was not of the opinion they were single unit buys.
Regards
WB8TSL
On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 12:14 PM, wrote:
> Off topic for this list,
Off topic for this list, but you guys are experts in oscillator noise!
Playing with some mechanical filters. Need USB and LSB crystals for the BFO.
No one seems to make crystals anymore, especially in the 253 KHz range!
Looking at the DigiKey Cardinal programmable oscillators. Cheap and
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