From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
At 23:21 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
There is still a conflict of Code for Mandaean, is it Mand or Mnda?
Mand.
OK This is now corrected on the new HTML pages.
But the new normative plain-text file now contains... Mnda !!!
---
Beside this,
On Thursday, May 20th, 2004 23:56, Philippe Verdy wrote:
I see no real problem if not all the different orthographies are
listed or if they are not used universally. As long as the name is
non ambiguous. What will be important for interchange of data will
not be this name but the Code (or N°,
Philippe Verdy wrote:
Michael Everson wrote:
Philippe Verdy wrote:
There is still a conflict of Code for Mandaean, is it Mand or Mnda?
Mand.
OK This is now corrected on the new HTML pages.
But the new normative plain-text file now contains... Mnda !!!
I updated my own Excel sheet at:
From: Antoine Leca [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Thursday, May 20th, 2004 23:56, Philippe Verdy wrote:
I see no real problem if not all the different orthographies are
listed or if they are not used universally. As long as the name is
non ambiguous. What will be important for interchange of data
Philippe Verdy scripsit:
Please go to Langues'O for this commentary. As I wrote, you will be
probably answered with the historical context.
C'est quoi Langues'O ? Où est-ce ?
Please forgive me for intruding into an internal francophone matter, but
whenever I see Langues'O, my mind insists
At 10:28 +0200 2004-05-21, Philippe Verdy wrote:
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
At 23:21 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
There is still a conflict of Code for Mandaean, is it Mand or Mnda?
Mand.
OK This is now corrected on the new HTML pages.
But the new normative plain-text
on 2004-05-21 07:10 Michael Everson wrote:
I am not very happy about loading the plain-text in browsers. Three of
my browsers load it and *all* the French UTF-8 is displayed in Latin 1.
This *may* be a server issue. Iirc, the server has to be told to mark
the text/plain MIME-type as UTF-8, since
Michael Everson everson at evertype dot com wrote:
The plain text would appear directly in the browser window where it
could be saved as well, without needing any ZIP tool...
Everyone has a zip tool.
I am not very happy about loading the plain-text in browsers. Three
of my browsers load it
-- there is no
need to zip it (unlike, say, Unihan!).
Mark
__
http://www.macchiato.com
- Original Message -
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Unicode List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Fri, 2004 May 21 07:10
Subject: Re: ISO 15924 draft fixes
At 10:28
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf
Of Philippe Verdy
I updated my own Excel sheet at:
Philippe, I really appreciate the content you posted for it's potential
value in guiding the RA in doing a better job with their data.
I hope, however, that you do not plan to leave
At 12:31 +0200 2004-05-21, Philippe Verdy wrote:
- light blue signals the english or French names that have been kept when
removing duplicate rows with alternate names.
Those duplicate rows did not appear in the plain-text data files, so
will not be considered further or tracked on the code
At 08:31 -0700 2004-05-21, Mark Davis wrote:
I am not very happy about loading the plain-text in browsers. Three
of my browsers load it and *all* the French UTF-8 is displayed in
Latin 1.
Michael, you just need to put a BOM at the start of the file. Direct access to
the plain text file, would
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf
Of Michael Everson
As a side note to Michael or the other 6 RA members (Ken, and Rick
notably), I
don't think it's even a good idea to ZIP this reference plain-text
file due to
its very small size (which smaller than each of the
At 07:57 -0700 2004-05-21, Curtis Clark wrote:
on 2004-05-21 07:10 Michael Everson wrote:
I am not very happy about loading the plain-text in browsers. Three
of my browsers load it and *all* the French UTF-8 is displayed in
Latin 1.
This *may* be a server issue. Iirc, the server has to be told
Antoine Leca Antoine10646 at leca dash marti dot org wrote:
So there's nothing wrong if Han'gul is shown to users
Sorry: this is meaningless to me as French reader. And it is a mistake
(missing breve) when it comes about the McCune-Reischauer scheme.
Half-good fallback mechanisms are usually
From: Peter Constable [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf
Of Philippe Verdy
I updated my own Excel sheet at:
Philippe, I really appreciate the content you posted for it's potential
value in guiding the RA in doing a better job with their data.
From: Doug Ewell [EMAIL PROTECTED]
In any case, the question of *which* French-based transliteration(s) to
use seems to have been decided already.
Is it true also for N=206, Code=Goth, English_Name=Gothic,
Nom_franais=Gotique, Property_Value_Alias=Gothic ?
My French dictionnaries (Petit
Michael Everson wrote:
At 08:31 -0700 2004-05-21, Mark Davis wrote:
I am not very happy about loading the plain-text in browsers. Three
of my browsers load it and *all* the French UTF-8 is displayed in
Latin 1.
Michael, you just need to put a BOM at the start of the file. Direct
access to
the
At 21:38 +0200 2004-05-21, Philippe Verdy wrote:
Michael said that he will ignore all differences found in the previous HTML
files, considering only the text file as the source and adding the missing
elements.
Yes, I did.
Since then, there has been no clear justification for the removal of
At 22:04 +0200 2004-05-21, Philippe Verdy wrote:
I have no référence in my French dictionnaries for Gotique, but LOTS of
references to écriture gothique ou caractères gothiques (including on the
web and in calligraphy/typography books). I think it's a typo here... So this
should be
Philippe Verdy verdy underscore p at wanadoo dot fr wrote:
In any case, the question of *which* French-based transliteration(s)
to use seems to have been decided already.
Is it true also for N=206, Code=Goth, English_Name=Gothic,
Nom_franais=Gotique, Property_Value_Alias=Gothic ?
I have no
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
At 22:04 +0200 2004-05-21, Philippe Verdy wrote:
I have no référence in my French dictionnaries for Gotique, but LOTS of
references to écriture gothique ou caractères gothiques (including on the
web and in calligraphy/typography books). I think it's a
From: "Michael Everson" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
At 03:28 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote: It was in the
previous list (see the online HTML table 2). What does that refer
to?
See http://www.unicode.org/iso15924/iso15924-codes.html
(sorry it was Table 1):
Sylo
316
Syloti
[Mailed _and_ posted to the list; UTF-8]
On Wednesday, May 19th, 2004 10:40 PM, Michael Everson wrote:
I would appreciate it if interested persons could look this over and
inform me if they find any further discrepancies between the two
which are worth troubling about. Then we will proceed to
At 11:16 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
From: Michael Everson mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED]
At 03:28 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
It was in the previous list (see the online HTML table 2).
What does that refer to?
See
At 11:52 +0200 2004-05-20, Antoine Leca wrote:
[Mailed _and_ posted to the list; UTF-8]
On Wednesday, May 19th, 2004 10:40 PM, Michael Everson wrote:
I would appreciate it if interested persons could look this over and
inform me if they find any further discrepancies between the two
which are
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
At 11:16 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
From: Michael Everson mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED]
At 03:28 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
It was in the previous list (see the online HTML table 2).
What does that refer to?
At 13:00 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
(I wonder why this file is zipped, given its small size,
If uncompressed, downloading it opens it in the browser rather than
downloading it.
and the fact that the text file is coded in Unix-style end-of-line format,
I used Mac OS X TextEdit.
not
- Original Message -
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 10:40 PM
Subject: ISO 15924 draft fixes
The Registrar wishes to thank everyone who has taken an interest in
the ISO 15924 data pages, and regrets the imperfections which
At 13:37 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
I added Coptic unilaterally.
I can't see Coptic for now in your source zip file.
It isn't in that file.
There are other duplicate lines for name aliases that should be listed in
changes:
I'm not going to list those changes. There is no code or
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
It can't be Unicode's UTC alone, as there are
already codes for bibliographic references that
are not (and will never) be encoded separately
in Unicode,so I suppose that there are librarian
or publishers members with which you have to
discuss,
At 14:44 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
It can't be Unicode's UTC alone, as there are
already codes for bibliographic references that
are not (and will never) be encoded separately
in Unicode,so I suppose that there are librarian
or publishers
Antoine Leca a crit :
The French name for Hang looks strange. It happened to be hangul (hangul,
hangeul) (after quite a bit of discussion.)
The name in ISO/CEI 10646 (F) is hangl from a Corean dictionary
and a Corean grammar published by the Inalco (Langues O'). Another
suggested form in
To terminate with this discussion, I have put online the corrected tables.
http://www.rodage.org/pub/iso15924-sheets.html
(this is a Excel workbook in HTML format with frames but without Excel
interactivity, that references other URLs in a subfolder; it can be navigated
by the tabs at the bottom)
At 06:51 -0700 2004-05-20, Patrick Andries wrote:
Antoine Leca a écrit :
The French name for Hang looks strange. It happened to be hangul (hangul,
hangeul) (after quite a bit of discussion.)
The name in ISO/CEI 10646 (F) is « hangûl »
from a Corean dictionary and a Corean grammar
published by
For now I suggest an immediate warning in the ISO15924 web pages,
explicitly stating that these published tables were in beta, and
contain incoherences, which are being corrected.
No. This is purely cosmetic. Let us move on.
I find this cavalier attitude a bit disconcerting. Errors in the
At 08:10 -0700 2004-05-20, Peter Constable wrote:
For now I suggest an immediate warning in the ISO15924 web pages,
explicitly stating that these published tables were in beta, and
contain incoherences, which are being corrected.
No. This is purely cosmetic. Let us move on.
I find this
Peter, Philippe,
I hope this satisfies you. http://www.unicode.org/iso15924/codelists.html
It is enough work finding and fixing and figuring out whatever it is
that a perl script is and how to make it work. It may seem obvious to
you, but it is not obvious to me.
--
Michael Everson * * Everson
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf
Of Michael Everson
Taking time to put up an immediate warning isn't a
good use of my time.
I didn't ask for an immediate warning. I will note, though, that
incorporating bad data into a product may not be a good use of time for
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf
Of Michael Everson
I hope this satisfies you.
http://www.unicode.org/iso15924/codelists.html
If they are consistent and reliable, I'm satisfied with them. I hope you
will be preparing a page for corrigenda / errata.
It's not a big
.
It is not a feature.
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Peter Constable
Sent: 2004520 8:10
To: Unicode List
Subject: RE: ISO 15924 draft fixes
For now I suggest an immediate warning in the ISO15924 web pages,
explicitly stating
At 09:49 -0700 2004-05-20, Peter Constable wrote:
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf
Of Michael Everson
I hope this satisfies you.
http://www.unicode.org/iso15924/codelists.html
If they are consistent and reliable, I'm satisfied with them. I hope you
will be preparing
At 10:00 -0700 2004-05-20, Addison Phillips [wM] wrote:
I concur with Peter. If there are multiple
documents now, then I'd like to see a single
normative document...
It will be the plain-text version, and for the
purposes of fixing the current regrettable mess
I'm taking it as read that the
Antoine Leca a écrit :
The French name for Hang looks strange. It happened to be hangul
(hangul, hangeul) (after quite a bit of discussion.)
Sorry guys. For reasons known to itself, my mailer refused to post in UTF-8
this morning. I meant hangul(hangul, hangeul).
According to a native
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf
Of Michael Everson
Also, it appears you have not fixed a serious error in the
plain-text file: it is not well-structured. Some rows have 6
columns, and some have 7.
That might be fixed in the newest one.
It is not fixed in the
At 12:07 -0700 2004-05-20, Peter Constable wrote:
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf
Of Michael Everson
Also, it appears you have not fixed a serious error in the
plain-text file: it is not well-structured. Some rows have 6
columns, and some have 7.
That might be
]
Subject: RE: ISO 15924 draft fixes
At 10:00 -0700 2004-05-20, Addison Phillips [wM] wrote:
I concur with Peter. If there are multiple
documents now, then I'd like to see a single
normative document...
It will be the plain-text version, and for the
purposes of fixing the current
I could use a little help rendering this into French, lest I
embarrass myself
The Property Value Alias is defined as part of the Unicode Standard
and is provided informatively in the tables here to show how entries
in the ISO 15924 code table relate to script names defined in
Unicode.
--
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf
Of Addison Phillips [wM]
I don't care about the order, so long as it is stable over time.
Personally I find the
latter form more logical (with the identifier, i.e. the code, first).
I agree with Addison here: the most important
From: Peter Constable [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf
Of Michael Everson
I hope this satisfies you.
http://www.unicode.org/iso15924/codelists.html
If they are consistent and reliable, I'm satisfied with them. I hope you
will be preparing a
At 13:49 -0700 2004-05-20, Peter Constable wrote:
I agree with Addison here: the most important thing is stability, but it
makes sense that the first and second columns be the symbolic code and
the numeric code, especially if this is *the* plain-text version and
normative reference.
That's going
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Is the format order satisfactory? English_Name;Code;Nº;Nom_français;PVA;Date
Or would it be preferable to have it in the
format of Table 1
(Code;Nº;English_Name;Nom_français;PVA;Date)
I vote for the order of table 1; the Code is the most important one,
At 23:21 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
Micheal has just changed the online version (but with the wrong dates...that's
irritating).
Patience... Unchanged codes will retain 2004-05-01 as the starting
date. Changed codes have (as of the current BETA draft which is
uploaded for testing
From: Antoine Leca [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Antoine Leca a crit :
The French name for Hang looks strange. It happened to be hangul
(hangul, hangeul) (after quite a bit of discussion.)
Sorry guys. For reasons known to itself, my mailer refused to post in UTF-8
this morning. I meant
Peter Constable wrote:
Michael Everson wrote:
Also, it appears you have not fixed a serious error in the
plain-text file: it is not well-structured. Some rows have 6
columns, and some have 7.
That might be fixed in the newest one.
It is not fixed in the file that's on the site now.
From: Philippe Verdy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
No the structure is correct, however the text file was prepared by
copy/pasting
HTML text inserted in empty cells, namely the nbsp; character
reference (that
contains a syntaxic semicolon conflicting with the CSV separator).
IMO, the structure
At 00:05 +0200 2004-05-21, Philippe Verdy wrote:
This (below) is my own plain text version (still using the field and row order
of table 3 by english name, instead of the order of table 1 by code)... Some
entries are commented out with %.
The RA has no intention whatsoever of making use of this
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I could use a little help rendering this into French, lest I
embarrass myself
The Property Value Alias is defined as part of the Unicode Standard
and is provided informatively in the tables here to show how entries
in the ISO 15924 code table
From: Peter Constable [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Philippe Verdy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
No the structure is correct, however the text file was prepared by
copy/pasting
HTML text inserted in empty cells, namely the nbsp; character
reference (that
contains a syntaxic semicolon conflicting
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
At 00:05 +0200 2004-05-21, Philippe Verdy wrote:
This (below) is my own plain text version (still using the field and row
order
of table 3 by english name, instead of the order of table 1 by code)... Some
entries are commented out with %.
The RA has
I see some differences
- For Georgian, your new file contains only:
Georgian (Mkhedruli);Geor;240;géorgien (mkhédrouli);Georgian;2004-05-18
But the previous version also contained in one of the online tables:
Georgian (Asomtavruli);Geoa;242;géorgien (assomtavrouli);Georgian;2004-01-05
-
I note also that the list of change (the HTML file in your archive) does not
include the change of orthograph in English names for consonnants with dots
below (such as malalayam). As this ISO-15924 standard should make the English
and French names unambiguous, their orthograph is important.
-
At 01:08 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
I see some differences
- For Georgian, your new file contains only:
Georgian (Mkhedruli);Geor;240;géorgien (mkhédrouli);Georgian;2004-05-18
But the previous version also contained in one of the online tables:
Georgian
At 01:26 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
I note also that the list of change (the HTML file in your archive) does not
include the change of orthograph in English names for consonnants with dots
below (such as malalayam). As this ISO-15924 standard should make the English
and French names
From: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
- Where is this line?:
Syloti Nagri;Sylo;316;sylotî nâgrî;;2004-09-01
A new script? Oh, it's in the old file and not in
the new one? It, Coptic, and Phags-pa need to be
in the list (they are all under ballot).
It was in the previous list (see the
At 03:28 +0200 2004-05-20, Philippe Verdy wrote:
It was in the previous list (see the online HTML table 2).
What does that refer to?
Who decides for the addition of scripts in ISO-15924?
The ISO 15924 RA-JAC.
I thought there was a separate technical commity
and that you were just the bookkeeper
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