Re: New licensing

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Sorry list, that was supposed to go to Dar. 

Bob S


> On Sep 18, 2024, at 10:09 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Well I didn’t want to post this on the main list for reasons that will become 
> obvious. 
> 
> First, any apps you create with Classic will still operate under the old 
> license. I have been assured that if I create and distribute an app the last 
> day of the classic licensing, the distributed apps will continue to function, 
> so no worries there. Up until sometime in 2027 you should still be good. 
> 
> What to do after that is the issue. Certain LC developers have forked the LC 
> build based upon the Open Licensing of Livecode. It functions so far as I can 
> tell just like the commercial version of LC, but of course any changes made 
> to LC prior to the fork will of course not be in the Open xTalk build. 
> 
> For instance LC *finally* incorporated inline custom behaviors for Datagrids, 
> something I take full advantage of. But unfortunately, it did not make it 
> into the fork, and the OXT devs do not appear to think it worth it to 
> replicate the work, even though it is quite simple to do. I will have to do 
> considerable refactoring to make my main project work. 
> 
> So there you are. Don’t tell anyone at LC I said so. There’s no bad blood 
> between LC and the OXT project, they have amicably parted ways, forked their 
> relationship if you will. :-) But obviously promoting a competing project on 
> the list would be at the very least rude. 
> 
> Bob S
> 
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New licensing

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Well I didn’t want to post this on the main list for reasons that will become 
obvious. 

First, any apps you create with Classic will still operate under the old 
license. I have been assured that if I create and distribute an app the last 
day of the classic licensing, the distributed apps will continue to function, 
so no worries there. Up until sometime in 2027 you should still be good. 

What to do after that is the issue. Certain LC developers have forked the LC 
build based upon the Open Licensing of Livecode. It functions so far as I can 
tell just like the commercial version of LC, but of course any changes made to 
LC prior to the fork will of course not be in the Open xTalk build. 

For instance LC *finally* incorporated inline custom behaviors for Datagrids, 
something I take full advantage of. But unfortunately, it did not make it into 
the fork, and the OXT devs do not appear to think it worth it to replicate the 
work, even though it is quite simple to do. I will have to do considerable 
refactoring to make my main project work. 

So there you are. Don’t tell anyone at LC I said so. There’s no bad blood 
between LC and the OXT project, they have amicably parted ways, forked their 
relationship if you will. :-) But obviously promoting a competing project on 
the list would be at the very least rude. 

Bob S

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Re: CharToNum Depricated??

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Thanks Jacqueline. I knew about the binary thing. I just thnik that silent 
conversions are a violation of the of principle of low level file operations. 
The whole point to low level file functions is so that what you write is what 
you get, and what you read is what you wrote.

But it’s water under the bridge now. I’m even thinking about going through all 
my code and ensuring that all reads and writes are binary, and that all line 
endings are CRLF.

Bob S


On Sep 18, 2024, at 1:59 AM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
 wrote:

I should have thought of that. Line endings are always translated to/from 
native unless the file is opened/written in binary, it's been that way since 
MetaCard. It's a feature.
--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | 
jac...@hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software | 
http://www.hyperactivesw.com

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Re: CharToNum Depricated??

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I went through all my code and replaced charToNum and numToChar with 
codepointToNum and numToCodepoint respectively. If it matters to anyone, the 
Quartum PDF, Excel and sqlYoga libraries all were using the depricated 
versions. 

Bob S


> On Sep 17, 2024, at 8:50 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I also read up on the BOM, and for UTF-8 it is optional, and as mentioned not 
> recommended, because UTF-8 always uses the same byte order.
> 
> And anyway, the BOM was never the issue. Apparently Livecode always produces 
> a UTF-8 format file unless instructed to do otherwise.
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
> On Sep 17, 2024, at 4:41 AM, Niggemann, Bernd via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Bob,
> 
> 
> Actually I think what I need to do is figure out what the original file
> encoding is, and use that when I write out the export file.
> 
> I assume that the byte order mark (BOM) is for UTF-8
> 
> To see the BOM for UTF-8 make a button and a field named "fText"
> 
> Use this script for the button
> 
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Re: CharToNum Depricated??

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I also read up on the BOM, and for UTF-8 it is optional, and as mentioned not 
recommended, because UTF-8 always uses the same byte order.

And anyway, the BOM was never the issue. Apparently Livecode always produces a 
UTF-8 format file unless instructed to do otherwise.

Bob S


On Sep 17, 2024, at 4:41 AM, Niggemann, Bernd via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Hi Bob,


Actually I think what I need to do is figure out what the original file
encoding is, and use that when I write out the export file.

I assume that the byte order mark (BOM) is for UTF-8

To see the BOM for UTF-8 make a button and a field named "fText"

Use this script for the button

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Re: CharToNum Depricated??

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Thanks Bernd. But I finally figured out what the issue was. It seems that 
unless the output file is opened binary, any attempt to wrote to a file using 
any of the cr, lf or crlf keywords in LC will result in LC auto-converting them 
to cr, because that is the Macintosh standard. What I had to do is to use 
numToCodepoint() to create a variable containing ascii characters 13 and 10 
(crlf) and then use that variable to end my lines. 

The way I actually figured out what the issue was, is I downloaded Notepad++ 
for Windows which has the capability of showing non-printing characters, and it 
does not transparently cut convert files without informing the user, as 
Microsoft seems to think they have every right to take the liberty to do. 

And without putting too fine a point on it, Livecode seems to take the same 
liberties. If I write lf to a file, I expect the file to contain lf and not cr! 
But at least there is a way around it. 

Bob S


> On Sep 17, 2024, at 4:41 AM, Niggemann, Bernd via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Bob,
> 
> 
> Actually I think what I need to do is figure out what the original file
> encoding is, and use that when I write out the export file.
> 
> I assume that the byte order mark (BOM) is for UTF-8
> 
> To see the BOM for UTF-8 make a button and a field named "fText"
> 
> Use this script for the button
> 
> -
> on mouseUp
>   local tPath, tContent, tBom, tCollect
>   answer file "choose"
>   if it is empty then exit mouseUp
>   put it into tPath
>   if the optionKey is down then
>  put url ("binfile:" & tPath) into tContent
>  delete line 2 to -1 of tContent
>  put textEncode(tContent, "UTF-8") into tContent
>   else
>  put url ("file:" & tPath) into tContent
>  delete line 2 to -1 of tContent
>   end if
>   put tContent into field "fText"
> end mouseUp
> -
> 
> and see if you see the BOM when you hold down the option key when opening the 
> file
> If you do not use the option key there should be no BOM at the beginning of 
> the text and the text is automatically UTF-8 encoded
> Apparently "put url ("file:" & tPath)" is also aware of the encoding of the 
> file since it converts it omits the BOM.
> 
> Kind regards
> Bernd
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Re: CharToNum Depricated??

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Actually I think what I need to do is figure out what the original file 
encoding is, and use that when I write out the export file. 

Bob S


> On Sep 16, 2024, at 2:06 PM, Bob Sneidar  wrote:
> 
> OK so I determined that the native export file from the Toshiba Address Book 
> Export is putting some non-display (probably unicode) characters at the 
> beginning of the file. They don’t appear in any text editor but they are 
> there because when I do a char by char comparison, the very first char in the 
> Toshiba Export file is a question mark. 
> 
> Is there any way to ignore that exterraneous data when reading the file? 
> 
> Bob S
> 

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Re: CharToNum Depricated??

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

OK so I determined that the native export file from the Toshiba Address Book 
Export is putting some non-display (probably unicode) characters at the 
beginning of the file. They don’t appear in any text editor but they are there 
because when I do a char by char comparison, the very first char in the Toshiba 
Export file is a question mark. 

Is there any way to ignore that exterraneous data when reading the file? 

Bob S

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Re: CharToNum Depricated??

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I think you nailed it Bernd. That scans with all that I am seeing in 
troubleshooting. 

Bob S


> On Sep 15, 2024, at 11:50 AM, Niggemann, Bernd via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Bob,
> 
> charToNum has been deprecated, I think since LC 7.0
> 
> It is replaced by nativeCharToNum() and byteToNum
> 
> (As of LC 10.0.0 charToNum maps to nativeCharToNum, see release notes)
> 
> This covers the ASCII range.
> 
> For unicode you use codepointToNum()
> 
> I suspect that the small difference you see in file size is a Byte Order 
> Mark, BOM at the beginning of the Konica Minolta address book.
> 
> You could try to use "open file" to import the Konica Minolta address book.
> 
> open file tFilePath for read
> read from file tFilePath until EOF
> put it into tData
> close file tFilePath
> 
> The dictionary states
> 
> From 7.0, it's possible to specify an encoding for the file being
> opened. By doing so, you can straight read or write to a file without
> having to call textEncode or textDecode; the encoding supported by
> open file are the same as these text encoding functions. If no encoding
> is provided, then open file tries to read a Byte Order Mark (BOM) exists
> at the beginning of the file. In success, the encoding is adapted and the
> BOM is ignored.
> 
> 
> If my assumption that there is a BOM is correct then after opening and 
> reading from the file should give you the same length of the data since the 
> BOM is not part of the data.
> I guess that is also the reason why SublimeText sees both files as identical. 
> It probably also ignores the BOM.
> 
> I am just guessing and I am not an expert for these matters but maybe this 
> gives you an idea to try.
> 
> Kind regard
> Bernd
> 
> 
> Bob wrote
> 
> Also, if charToNum is deprecated, what do I use to compare t he ascii values 
> of
> two characters??
> 
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Re: CharToNum Depricated??

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Also, if charToNum is deprecated, what do I use to compare t he ascii values of 
two characters??

Bob S


> On Sep 13, 2024, at 3:44 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I am having an issue where I am trying to compare the data of two files I 
> read from disk character by character. To the naked eye, both files are 
> identical. If I open each file in Sublime Text and do a fileDiff, it declares 
> they are identical. But when I look at the actual file size, one is slightly 
> larger than the other. Also, when I compare the ascii values of each 
> character, right off the bat with the first character, charToNum reports that 
> in one file the first character is “F” which is correct. But for the second 
> file, it is “?” which is NOT CORRECT!!!
> 
> Now one file I generated by converting a Konica Minolta address book to a 
> Toshiba address book. I won’t go into the gory details, but remember both 
> files I am comparing look identical and SublimeText thinks they are 
> identical. 
> 
> My suspicion is that the source file, the Konica Minolta address book is 
> unicode. What I did. to try and get around this is I used textDecode(it, 
> “ASCII”) on the data read from the disk, but I am still getting the same 
> results. 
> 
> My goal is to read the data as ascii data with NO UNICODE  and then export it 
> with NO UNICODE. 
> 
> Bob S
> 
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CharToNum Depricated??

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I am having an issue where I am trying to compare the data of two files I read 
from disk character by character. To the naked eye, both files are identical. 
If I open each file in Sublime Text and do a fileDiff, it declares they are 
identical. But when I look at the actual file size, one is slightly larger than 
the other. Also, when I compare the ascii values of each character, right off 
the bat with the first character, charToNum reports that in one file the first 
character is “F” which is correct. But for the second file, it is “?” which is 
NOT CORRECT!!!

Now one file I generated by converting a Konica Minolta address book to a 
Toshiba address book. I won’t go into the gory details, but remember both files 
I am comparing look identical and SublimeText thinks they are identical. 

My suspicion is that the source file, the Konica Minolta address book is 
unicode. What I did. to try and get around this is I used textDecode(it, 
“ASCII”) on the data read from the disk, but I am still getting the same 
results. 

My goal is to read the data as ascii data with NO UNICODE  and then export it 
with NO UNICODE. 

Bob S

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Re: testing the list

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Okay. ;-)

> On Sep 5, 2024, at 1:50 AM, Heather Laine via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> please ignore
> 
> Heather Laine
> Customer Services Manager
> LiveCode Ltd
> www.livecode.com


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Re: Strange...

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

put "777,50,1424,1" into tCoords
put item 1 of tCoords > -32768 AND \
item 2 of tCoords > -32768 AND \
item 3 of tCoords < 32767 AND \
item 4 of tCoords < 32767 AND \
"936,474" is within tCoords --> true

put "777,50,1424,10" into tCoords
put item 1 of tCoords > -32768 AND \
item 2 of tCoords > -32768 AND \
item 3 of tCoords < 32767 AND \
item 4 of tCoords < 32767 AND \
"936,474" is within tCoords --> false

Bob S


> On Aug 28, 2024, at 11:48 AM, jbv via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Le 2024-08-28 13:52, Klaus major-k via use-livecode a écrit :
>> should suffice for a simple addressbook app. :-)
> 
> yep, but not for processing any kind of raw data...
> 
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Re: Strange...

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Easy enough to test. 

put ("936,474" is within "777,50,1424,32767”) —> true
put ("936,474" is within "777,50,1424,32768”) —> false

Bob S


> On Aug 28, 2024, at 5:17 AM, Brian Milby via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Looks like ~32k is the max value allowed for a coordinate value.
> 
> Brian Milby
> br...@milby7.com
> 
>> On Aug 28, 2024, at 4:22 AM, jbv via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> ("936,474" is within "777,50,1424,1") -> true
>> 
>> ("936,474" is within "777,50,1424,10") -> false
>> 
>> LC 9.6.9 on Mac OSX 10.15
>> 
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Re: Error creating Android Standalone

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Every entity is trying to solve their own subset of problems. The real question 
is, why has the industry seemingly abandoned the concept of, “backwards 
compatible”? It seems nowadays that we are all expected; no required to upgrade 
to the latest greatest, irrespective of the catch 22’s like yours that will 
inevitably result.

That being said, I wonder that there is no a command to tell terminal or 
Livecode which version of the engine you want to work with.

Bob S


On Aug 26, 2024, at 5:32 AM, Klaus major-k via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Why is this all so damn difficult and complicated? :-/


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Re: Bowing Out

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

+42

> On Aug 23, 2024, at 4:10 AM, Graham Samuel via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Just a quick note to say that after many years of using LiveCode (including 
> its predecessors) and doing some modest development - some of which was 
> successfully sold to real users - I’ve decided that for me time’s up. This is 
> because of seniority (as someone recently put it - I’m old!) and the feeling 
> that at my time of life I can’t productively invest time or money in learning 
> about Create and the whole direction of the LC technology. I’ve had fun over 
> the years, and have benefitted hugely from the generosity and expertise of 
> those on this list and of course from the direct support of the whole Kevin 
> circus. I’ll miss it all.
> 
> For what it's worth, I have seen the Create demo and tried to understand the 
> underlying model of app that is being aimed at. If I were still trying to 
> contribute, I would be asking about how Create can help with apps that depend 
> on user interaction with animations, and apps that are driven by external 
> triggers like changing GPS coordinates, and most of all, about how far Create 
> will assist with deployment, particularly on iOS - an issue that can dwarf 
> the actual development effort of an app in terms of time and resources. If 
> Create can take the user all the way from internal beta test to publication, 
> that would be an achievement worth celebrating.
> 
> Anyway, it’s a great product that deserves success - so good luck to all 
> involved.
> 
> I’ll lurk for a little longer, but really its goodbye and thanks for all the 
> fish.
> 
> Graham
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Re: Polygrid or polylist as datagrid form replacement?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I believe he is talking about form style datagrids. Form style has row 
templates that can be coded dynamically. To my knowledge, table style only have 
column templates. 

Bob S


> On Aug 16, 2024, at 3:02 AM, Mark Smith via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Terry, I can’t answer your question but I am curious if you have any code 
> you use to dynamically resize the row height in a datagrid. I am very 
> interested in doing this.
> 
> Thanks
> Mark
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Aug 16, 2024, at 7:35 AM, Terry Judd via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I’ve been using datagrid form objects for a number of years and am 
>> investigating the viability of replacing them with polygrids or polylist 
>> widgets but on first look it seems that both have fixed/uniform row heights, 
>> whereas datagrid form rows can dynamically resize their height according to 
>> their content - ie individual rows can have different heights.
>> 
>> Is that right, or am I missing something?
>> 
>> Terry
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Re: Polygrid or polylist as datagrid form replacement?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

There are a great many things you can do with a datagrid that you cannot do 
with a polygrid. From what I have been able to gather, the main advantage to 
using a polygrid is that they perform better than a datagrid. But their list of 
properties that you can get and set are what I would call minimal compared to a 
datagrid. Also, I do not think that polygrids can be used like a form style 
datagrid. 

Bob S


> On Aug 15, 2024, at 11:34 PM, Terry Judd via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I’ve been using datagrid form objects for a number of years and am 
> investigating the viability of replacing them with polygrids or polylist 
> widgets but on first look it seems that both have fixed/uniform row heights, 
> whereas datagrid form rows can dynamically resize their height according to 
> their content - ie individual rows can have different heights.
> 
> Is that right, or am I missing something?
> 
> Terry
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Re: Issues with (64bit?) Windows MySQL driver

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I had an issue with my mySQL server some time ago that revolved around making 
multiple connections in a short period of time. I would hit the connection 
limit of the SQL server and it would stop accepting connections. My issue was 
that I didn’t realize at the time that I needed to disconnect after every 
session, because the SQL server will keep a connection alive for a period of 
time specified in the server settings. If you are already connected and you 
create a new connection it will create a new thread.

If you have MySQLWorkbench (or some other server manager) you should be able to 
see the current connections. The MySQLWorkbench will have it’s own connections 
but if you see a lot of other connections that you can’t account for, then you 
need to ensure that you are disconnecting after every session.

Bob S


On Aug 16, 2024, at 1:14 AM, Mark Waddingham via use-livecode 
 wrote:

On 2024-08-16 08:32, Ben Rubinstein via use-livecode wrote:
I have a tool (a LiveCode standalone) running on Windows, which every night 
drops and recreates a database on a remote MySQL server, (about 350MB, 50 
tables). Running for many years.
About a year ago, we started to see a problem where sometimes the nightly build 
would fail, part-way through the process. The routine involves creating and 
populating tables, then creating indexes. Depending when the problem hits, the 
initial error is either
Connection was killed
or
Lost connection to MySQL server during query
All subsequent calls to revdb_execute get the error
MySQL server has gone away
I tried splitting the build into sections, so that the code opens the 
connection to a database builds some of the tables, then closes the connection, 
and opens a new connection to add more tables. There was no evidence that this 
made the issue occur less frequently; and once it hit, subsequent attempts to 
open a connection would get the error
Can't connect to MySQL server on '' (0)
When this was happening maybe a couple of times per month (on average) it 
didn't matter too much (the system is designed to be resilient, if the data 
wasn't refreshed one day, it would be the next). I thought it might be network 
glitches.
Recently IT tightened security on the machine where the tool runs; and since 
then we get this problem nine times of out ten. They say the only change made 
was to remove the admin privileges of the user account, and have now reversed 
that change; however, this problem has remained since. Another problem that 
arrived at the same time, reported here as "a windows weirdness", seems (per 
Paul Dupuis and Mark Waddingham) to be related to UNC paths, and possibly to 
security policies.
Does anyone have a suggestion for how conditions could affect this? Is there 
any way to get more detailed information out of the rev database driver about 
what's happening?

The dbmysql is just a thin wrapper around the mysqlclient library which is 
basically just implementing a protocol over a socket.

The fact that you get 'Can't connect to MySQL on ''' after it happens 
sounds very much like there's some sort of blocking going on at the system 
level. (A bit like most servers have 'portsentry' or similar on it which blocks 
requests which look dodgy) - given the 'tigtening of security' this is quite 
possible...

I think there are some low-level network tools on windows you could use to look 
at what's happening with sockets/ports (e.g. 
https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/downloads/tcpview).

I was going to suggest tweaking the timeouts/auto-reconnect parameters on your 
revOpenDatabase call - but I'm not sure its a timeout due to the 'Can't 
connect' error happening subsequently.

Warmest Regards

Mark.

--
Mark Waddingham ~ m...@livecode.com ~ 
http://www.livecode.com/
LiveCode: Build Amazing Things

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Re: Live LiveCode Create demo - Application Payments portal

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

From what I was able to watch live, it looks amazing. I especially like how 
much coding the widgets can alleviate (bug free BTW) and I can always go back 
and look at and modify the code if need be. 

When the time comes to migrate I will definitely take a look at this. 

Bob S


> On Aug 14, 2024, at 10:12 AM, Heather Laine via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Folks, it did take us all day owing to the number of questions but we now 
> have a page up, with the recording and (I hope!) all your questions answered 
> in text as well.
> 
> https://future.livecode.com/live-demo-your-questions-answered/
> 
> Best Regards,
> 
> Heather
> 
> Heather Laine
> Customer Services Manager
> LiveCode Ltd
> www.livecode.com
> 
> 
> 
>> On 13 Aug 2024, at 18:11, Stephen Barncard via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi gang,
>> I missed the webinar. I have been working on the other side of the clock.
>> Is it possible to see a recording?
>> 
>> sqb
>> --
>> Stephen Barncard - Sebastopol Ca. USA -
>> mixstream.org
>> 
>> 
>> On Tue, Aug 13, 2024 at 4:21 AM Curry Kenworthy via use-livecode <
>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> I also cannot attend a Zoom meeting now -
>>> 
>>> My watch-later absentee request:
>>> 
>>> Please demo the Application Payments portal interface/process to:
>>> 
>>> - 'upload your monthly sales figures' including
>>> - 'the monthly reports from the app store/s you are shipping through.'
>>> 
>>> Best wishes,
>>> 
>>> Curry Kenworthy
>>> 
>>> Radically Innovative Christian LiveCode Development
>>> "PASSION for Elegant, Efficient Code!"
>>> https://livecodeconsulting.com/
>>> 
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Re: revSpeak/speechSpeakutterance?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Thanks. As usual, I didn’t read the manual. It works, but I can’t get or change 
the voices. Not sure if I can get more voices. I tried, “I’m sorry Dave, I’m 
afraid I can’t let you do that.” but it sounded like Hal had most of his 
modules removed already. ;-)

I will poke around on the internet.

Bob S


On Aug 12, 2024, at 10:04 AM, panagiotis merakos via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Hello Bob,

The speechSpeakUtterance should work. The library is *implemented *in LCB,
but its handlers (such as "speechSpeakUtterance") should be called from LCS
(LiveCode Script)

Make sure you initialize the library first by calling
speechInitializeLibrary.
See the dictionary for more details.

Kind regards,
Panos
--




On Mon, 12 Aug 2024 at 19:01, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com<mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>> wrote:

OIC it only works in Livecode Builder. NVM.

Bob S


On Aug 12, 2024, at 8:42 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

revSpeak works, speechSpeakUtterance does not.

Bob S


On Aug 12, 2024, at 6:36 AM, panagiotis merakos via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com<mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com><mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>>
wrote:

Hello Klaus,

It is not the same library:

- The "revSpeak" one is the old speech library, implemented in the engine
level, available for Windows and macOS

- The "speechSpeakUtterance" is the new speech library, implemented in LCB,
available for macOS, Android, iOS

Also, each one of them has a slightly different feature set - see the
dictionary for more details.

Kind regards,
Panos

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Re: revSpeak/speechSpeakutterance?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

OIC it only works in Livecode Builder. NVM.

Bob S


On Aug 12, 2024, at 8:42 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
 wrote:

revSpeak works, speechSpeakUtterance does not.

Bob S


On Aug 12, 2024, at 6:36 AM, panagiotis merakos via use-livecode 
mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>> wrote:

Hello Klaus,

It is not the same library:

- The "revSpeak" one is the old speech library, implemented in the engine
level, available for Windows and macOS

- The "speechSpeakUtterance" is the new speech library, implemented in LCB,
available for macOS, Android, iOS

Also, each one of them has a slightly different feature set - see the
dictionary for more details.

Kind regards,
Panos

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Re: revSpeak/speechSpeakutterance?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

revSpeak works, speechSpeakUtterance does not. 

Bob S


> On Aug 12, 2024, at 6:36 AM, panagiotis merakos via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello Klaus,
> 
> It is not the same library:
> 
> - The "revSpeak" one is the old speech library, implemented in the engine
> level, available for Windows and macOS
> 
> - The "speechSpeakUtterance" is the new speech library, implemented in LCB,
> available for macOS, Android, iOS
> 
> Also, each one of them has a slightly different feature set - see the
> dictionary for more details.
> 
> Kind regards,
> Panos
> --
> 
> On Sun, 11 Aug 2024 at 14:44, Klaus major-k via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> 
>> Hi friends,
>> 
>> I am currently exploring the revspeak stuff, but the dictionary
>> does in fact irritate me a lot?
>> 
>> Entry for revSpeak:
>> Type: command
>> Syntax: revSpeak phraseToSpeak
>> Associations: Speech library
>> Summary: Speaks text through the computer's speakers.Introduced2.0
>> OS: mac, windows
>> 
>> Entry for speechSpeakUtterance:
>> Type: handler
>> Syntax: speechSpeakUtterance(pString)
>> Associations: Speech Library
>> Summary: Synthesize text to speech
>> OS: mac, ios, android
>> 
>> Note the OS differences (while obviously using the SAME library)!?
>> 
>> Is this an error in the dictionary or does the "speechspeak..." stuff
>> really not work on Windows? Thanks for any insight!
>> 
>> 
>> Best
>> 
>> Klaus
>> --
>> Klaus Major
>> https://www.major-k.de
>> https://www.major-k.de/bass
>> kl...@major-k.de
>> 
>> 
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Re: Icon id conflicts?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I agree with Jacque I always use the full path to the image file, and I always 
put the image on the same card as the button, unless the image is used in 
multiple buttons, then I put the image on the first card of the stack the 
button is in. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 10, 2024, at 10:04, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Did you try using the full path to the image when setting the icon by name in 
> the message box?

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Re: Annual price

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Understood, but LC and Kevin have made it crystal clear that these are the 
options available, they are willing to make some rare exceptions if they are 
contacted directly and NOT on this list, and finally that no more criticisms 
will be tolerated on this list. 

Bob S


> On Aug 9, 2024, at 9:53 AM, jbv via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Le 2024-08-09 12:24, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode a écrit :
>> Jeeze can we just please stop with the criticisms??
>> Bob S
> 
> Apart from criticism, it could be a nice option, especially for hobbyists,
> to be able to pay a Classic license monthly, just like LC hosting, or other
> development software line Max MSP : https://cycling74.com/shop/max.
> 
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Re: Annual price

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Jeeze can we just please stop with the criticisms??

Bob S


> On Aug 9, 2024, at 8:56 AM, Sean Cole via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> As Create is billed annually, why does this page,
> https://future.livecode.com/buy/, only show the monthly price? Why not show
> the annual price at all? It is a common marketing practice that only comes
> across as underhanded and untrustworthy.
> 
> Sean
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Re: Best way to convert color values

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Yet another gem for my Validations library. I should probably separate out the 
conversion stuff as a conversions library. 

Bob S


> On Aug 7, 2024, at 11:14 AM, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Paul Dupuis wrote:
> 
>> I can always write a routine to convert RGB to Hex and Hex to RGB, but
>> I am wondering if there is some clever trick in Livecode to do this.
>> 
>> For example: answer color -- returns RGB, but the htmlText of a line
>> wants  
> 
> 
> If the target of the htmlText is a LiveCode field, I don't know of a method 
> built into the LC engine, but it's easy enough to script:
> 
> function RGBtoHex pColor
>   repeat for each item tVal in pColor
>  get baseConvert(tVal, 10, 16)
>  if len(it) < 2 then put 0 before it
>  put it after tHex
>   end repeat
>   return "#"& tHex
> end RGBtoHex
> 
> 
> If the target of the htmlText is a browser widget, the browser engine's 
> built-in "rgb" CSS function can do this:
> 
> 
>   Hello 
> 
> 
> --
> Richard Gaskin
> FourthWorld.com
> 
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Re: iOS App Crashing On Close

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I would dearly love to know how to symbolicate a crash log!!!

Bob S


On Aug 8, 2024, at 2:14 AM, panagiotis merakos via use-livecode 
 wrote:

In any case, I think the best way to get this resolved is to send us the
crash log to see if we can symbolicate it

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Re: Cell colorization in a table in Livecode...

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Bob S


On Aug 7, 2024, at 11:17 AM, Bob Sneidar  wrote:



On Aug 7, 2024, at 10:47 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Now, our current problem is that there does not appear to be any tricks to 
having variable cell background colors in a Polygrid. Row colors: yes Alternate 
Row colors: Yes, Highlight color: Yes, possibly even highlighting different 
cell via the pgHilitedData property: maybe (haven't tested yet, but they'd all 
be 1 color).

I am not really familiar with the PolyList widget (vs PolyGrid). Has anyone 
figured out how to do a spreadsheet-like table in either the PolyGrid or 
PolyList with individual cell background coloring?

If not, I'll stick with the Datagrid and add a check for the columns x widths 
exceeding the 32K px threshold and just warn the researcher we can't handler 
that much data (which dings our product vs competition!)


Right. That has been the problem with widgets that are meant to replace native 
controls all along. They do not work the way the native controls work, and they 
don’t have the extensive property list that the native control had. Take the 
Custom Property Editor itself. It is actually uses a Tree List widget, which is 
fine except that there is this anooying need to click something you just edited 
again after it was already selected. The old Property Editor did not do that.

The Segmented Control was meant to replace the Tab Panel, but try setting the 
widths of the tabs using a comma separated list of integers and you will have 
issues.  I had to create buttons that I place over each tab “segment” and put 
it all in a group because the widget does not handle mouseUps. In fact, I do 
not think any widgets handle mouseUps! I could be mistaken.

Als while they look great, (the old Tab Panel lokked like warmed over dog cr*p 
on Windows) their options for modification via script are usually less than the 
native object they were meant to produce.

Bob S


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Re: Cell colorization in a table in Livecode...

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

On Aug 7, 2024, at 10:47 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Now, our current problem is that there does not appear to be any tricks to 
having variable cell background colors in a Polygrid. Row colors: yes Alternate 
Row colors: Yes, Highlight color: Yes, possibly even highlighting different 
cell via the pgHilitedData property: maybe (haven't tested yet, but they'd all 
be 1 color).

I am not really familiar with the PolyList widget (vs PolyGrid). Has anyone 
figured out how to do a spreadsheet-like table in either the PolyGrid or 
PolyList with individual cell background coloring?

If not, I'll stick with the Datagrid and add a check for the columns x widths 
exceeding the 32K px threshold and just warn the researcher we can't handler 
that much data (which dings our product vs competition!)


Right. That has been the problem with widgets that are meant to replace native 
controls all along. They do not work the way the native controls work, and they 
don’t have the extensive property list that the native control had. Take the 
Custom Property Editor itself. It is actually uses a Tree List widget, which is 
fine except that there is this anooying need to click something you just edited 
again after it was already selected. The old Property Editor did not do that.

The Segmented Control was meant to replace the Tab Panel, but try setting the 
widths of the tabs using a comma separated list of integers and you will have 
issues.  I had to create buttons that I place over each tab “segment” and put 
it all in a group because the widget does not handle mouseUps. In fact, I do 
not think any widgets handle mouseUps! I could be mistaken.

Als while they look great, (the old Tab Panel lokked like warmed over dog cr*p 
on Windows) their options for modification via script are usually less than the 
native object they were meant to produce.

Bob S

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Re: Best way to convert color values

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Also 
https://dev.to/hichem-mg/comprehensive-guide-converting-rgb-color-to-hex-code-2fcb

Google is your friend. :-)

Bob S


On Aug 7, 2024, at 9:04 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
 wrote:

You have RGB colors (0-255,0-255,0-255), Hex colors (#00 - #FF) and 
named colors ("blue") in Livecode

Any built in way (via some trick) to convert between color value formats?

I can always write a routine to convert RGB to Hex and Hex to RGB, but I am 
wondering if there is some clever trick in Livecode to do this.

For example: answer color -- returns RGB, but the htmlText of a line wants  

Thanks in advance,

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Re: Best way to convert color values

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I found a private function in the Quartam PDF Library. I don’t want to post it 
here because I don’t know the licensing. I believe it was a purchased product. 
If you have it you can probably find it. Otherwise it shouldn’t be too 
difficult to do the math. 

Bob S


> On Aug 7, 2024, at 9:04 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> You have RGB colors (0-255,0-255,0-255), Hex colors (#00 - #FF) and 
> named colors ("blue") in Livecode
> 
> Any built in way (via some trick) to convert between color value formats?
> 
> I can always write a routine to convert RGB to Hex and Hex to RGB, but I am 
> wondering if there is some clever trick in Livecode to do this.
> 
> For example: answer color -- returns RGB, but the htmlText of a line wants  bgcolor="#NN"> 
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> 
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Re: Making controls less subtle

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

With the Widgets, probably not. They are supposed to comply with the interface 
standards of your OS, so if running Windows, try using a high contrast window 
setting, but you won’t like it. 

Bob S

> On Aug 6, 2024, at 11:20 AM, David Epstein via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> On my Mac, some LiveCode (10.0rc1) controls seem to me much too subtle, light 
> gray where I would like there to be a distinct black line.  The  “slider” 
> control looks to me as if it is disabled (although if I actually disable it, 
> it gets even dimmer).  And the circle of the radio button, the rounded 
> rectangle of a check box button, and the edges of an option button have this 
> same light gray color.
> 
> Is there some way to change this?  
> 
> David Epstein
> 
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Re: By popular demand - Extend access to LC Classic IDEs BEYOND 2027!

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Yup. +100

> On Aug 2, 2024, at 10:45 AM, Heather Laine via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I don't know what you think we are trying to hide.
> 
> Do you want to discuss your annual takings on this list? Or the number and 
> needs of your clients? I don't think its relevant to the readers here nor any 
> of their business. We've explained the new licensing, exhaustively. We've 
> said we want to help existing customers. We've said there is a program to 
> help you migrate, on a case by case basis. 
> 
> If you want to take us up on that, please do. If not, well  that is your 
> decision. 
> 
> Please take this off list. This thread is not helpful and its time for it to 
> stop.
> 
> Best Regards,
> 
> Heather
> List mom. On the Use LiveCode list.
> 
> 
> Heather Laine
> Customer Services Manager
> LiveCode Ltd
> www.livecode.com
> 
> 
> 
>> On 2 Aug 2024, at 18:34, Mike Kerner via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> sunlight is the greatest disinfectant.
>> these are conversations that should be held in the open.
>> 
>> On Fri, Aug 2, 2024 at 1:10 PM Heather Laine via use-livecode <
>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> I understand busy. Sometimes we are so busy chopping down trees we cannot
>>> see the wood.
>>> 
>>> You have a specific situation. The people on this list cannot help you
>>> resolve it. Talking about it on this list and indeed reading the long
>>> conversations on this list is using up your precious time. Maybe taking
>>> half an hour to talk about it direct with us would resolve it and
>>> potentially save you... I have no idea how long rewriting your apps.
>>> 
>>> But its entirely up to you.
>>> 
>>> Best Regards,
>>> 
>>> Heather
>>> 
>>> Heather Laine
>>> Customer Services Manager
>>> LiveCode Ltd
>>> www.livecode.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 2 Aug 2024, at 17:21, Mike Kerner via use-livecode <
>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> heather, as i told you, at the time, i am busy running multiple
>>> companies.
>>>> i don't have time for pitches.
>>>> i asked for you to send me the information so that i could review it,
>>> ahead
>>>> of a call. that request was declined.
>>>> if the pricing remains untenable, we will be rewriting apps and exiting.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Fri, Aug 2, 2024 at 12:01 PM Roger Guay via use-livecode <
>>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> If this is the conclusion that you come to, then I failed to make my
>>> case.
>>>>> Sorry!
>>>>> 
>>>>> I thank Kevin for keeping this amazing tool going for so many years and
>>>>> want him to succeed in the future.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Roger
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Aug 2, 2024, at 8:17 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode <
>>>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com <mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> You cannot mean that you want him to go bankrupt so that you can
>>>>> maintain your hobby!
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Aug 2, 2024, at 8:17 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode <
>>>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Kevin has clearly made the point that it has become financially
>>>>> untenable to continue with the classic licensing model. You cannot mean
>>>>> that you want him to go bankrupt so that you can maintain your hobby!
>>> You
>>>>> are asking him for what he cannot give. It only remains then for all of
>>> us
>>>>> to decide what we can and cannot accept.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Bob S
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Aug 2, 2024, at 7:59 AM, Roger Guay via use-livecode <
>>>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I too am in the "Clasic Is For Me Crowd”
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> - Been here since Metacard
>>>>>> - Use LC strictly as a hobby
>>>>>> - LC is extremely important to me as a hobby
>>>>>> - Have created hundreds of tools, utilities, simulations, fun thin

Re: Livecode Future

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

+1

On Aug 2, 2024, at 9:50 AM, Kevin Stallibrass via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Retiree’s comments:
I started with runtime revolution v1 when it was included on a PC Pro magazine 
all those years ago and immediately built my first program which was a neat 
utility (in 4 languages) which was used by my company. No fee, plenty cudos.

Continued using Runrev over the years to build tools for myself. Cudos from 
family and friends

Got a commercial licence when I created my only ‘big’ app which worked on PC’s, 
Macs, Android, & iOS, all talking to a Livecode server. Even included  an iOS 
push notification server running on Rpi which was featured in the last RevUp 
newsletter.
Plenty cudos from company, no payment but avoided a redundancy round and got a 
free holiday for me and my wife in a swanky villa in the Med.

Favorite app was for iPad ( talking to server) which really helped our sales 
force - and phoned home when they used it.
Super cudos avoiding the next round of redundancies.

When that company finally folded, I reverted back to the community licence and 
built a few things for myself and family.

Long, boring story I know but the point i’d like to make is that Runrev enabled 
me to start coding. They supported me through commercial licence and community 
freebee’s

I’m retired but still grateful for what the Runrev team has enabled me to do. 
Thanks for your support Kevin and I sincerely hope you get through this change 
and continue to help people as stupid as myself succeed.



Regards
Kevin Stallibrass
Sent from my iPhone

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Re: By popular demand - Extend access to LC Classic IDEs BEYOND 2027!

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Kevin has clearly made the point that it has become financially untenable to 
continue with the classic licensing model. You cannot mean that you want him to 
go bankrupt so that you can maintain your hobby! You are asking him for what he 
cannot give. It only remains then for all of us to decide what we can and 
cannot accept.

Bob S


On Aug 2, 2024, at 7:59 AM, Roger Guay via use-livecode 
 wrote:

I too am in the "Clasic Is For Me Crowd”

- Been here since Metacard
- Use LC strictly as a hobby
- LC is extremely important to me as a hobby
- Have created hundreds of tools, utilities, simulations, fun things just for 
shear enjoyment and mental exercise
- Have frequent internet problems that interfere with cloud computing
- Have participated in every fundraising campagne
- Frequently contributed to Example Stacks including Alien Civilization 
Detection simulation

I beg you, Kevin, don’t take this away from us

Roger

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Re: Proposed update to datagrid library

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Not nearly as sexy, but it does what I need it to. 

getProp dgNextIndex [tIndex]
   put the dgIndexes of me into tIndexes
   put itemOffset(tIndex, tIndexes) into tItem
   
   if tItem = the the number of items of tIndexes then
  put item tItem of tIndexes into tIndex
   else 
  put item tItem +1 of tIndexes into tIndex
   end if
   
   return tIndex
end dgNextIndex

getProp dgPrevIndex [tIndex]
   put the dgIndexes of me into tIndexes
   put itemOffset(tIndex, tIndexes) into tItem
   
   if tItem = 1 then
  put item tItem of tIndexes into tIndex
   else 
  put item tItem -1 of tIndexes into tIndex
   end if
   
   return tIndex
end dgPrevIndex


> On Jul 31, 2024, at 12:20 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> My Datagrid skills are not great, but i thought the thedgIndexes 
> ofgroup"DataGrid" The Dictionary says "Returns the internal list of indexes 
> in the order in which they appear in the data grid"
> You also have the dgIndexOfLine[pLine] to get the index of the line (hilited 
> line or next line or whatever). Then find the index returned by dgIndexOfLine 
> in the dgIndexes, which will return a line number in the list of indexes and 
> then add 1 to that to the the line in the dgIndexes of the next index.
> 
> 


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Re: Proposed update to datagrid library

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hmmm… I will look into that. Another way is to record the current index(s), set 
the dgData of the grid to it’s own data (resets the lines to the visible order) 
then restore the hilited index(s), get the hilted line, THEN get the next line. 
That seems too convoluted so I will look into using indexes. 

Bob S


> On Jul 31, 2024, at 12:20 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> My Datagrid skills are not great, but i thought the thedgIndexes 
> ofgroup"DataGrid" The Dictionary says "Returns the internal list of indexes 
> in the order in which they appear in the data grid"
> You also have the dgIndexOfLine[pLine] to get the index of the line (hilited 
> line or next line or whatever). Then find the index returned by dgIndexOfLine 
> in the dgIndexes, which will return a line number in the list of indexes and 
> then add 1 to that to the the line in the dgIndexes of the next index.
> 
> 
> On 7/31/2024 2:29 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode wrote:
>>  never mind. I just realized that if the datagrid gets re-sorted, 
>> there IS NO WAY to determine the next visible line in a datagrid. Kinda 
>> sucks.
>> 
>> Bob S
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 31, 2024, at 11:01 AM, Bob Sneidar via 
>>> use-livecode  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi all.
>>> 
>>> Has anyone tried to determine the index of the next line of a datagrid? 
>>> It’s not as straightforward as you might think. When data is first loaded 
>>> into a datagrid, the dgIndexes are only going to be in numeric order if the 
>>> sort order of the datagrid is the same as the data you are loading. 
>>> Otherwise, the indexes will be all mixed up, but the dgLines of the 
>>> datagrid will ALWAYS be in the order of the visible rows.
>>> 
>>> Sure you can just add one to the current dgHilitedLine, but what if you 
>>> want to know the index of the next line just before deleting the current 
>>> one? You cannot delete the line first because then the line numbers change, 
>>> and there won’t be another line hilited until your code sets it.
>>> 
>>> And while there is a dgIndexOfLine property built in, there is no 
>>> dgLineOfIndex! Not only that, but there is a dgIndexes property, but there 
>>> is no dgLines property! How odd is that?? The goal is to determine the 
>>> index of the next visible line where the line numbers are no longer 
>>> sequential.
>>> 
>>> So I wrote some very simple virtual properties that ought to be a part of 
>>> the datagrid library. You can put these in the script of a datagrid itself, 
>>> or if you are brave enough to use the inline behaviors feature of datagrids 
>>> as I do, you can put them in your own datagrid custom library. But really 
>>> they belong in the built-in datagrid library itself. They are:
>>> 
>>> getProp dgNextIndexOfLine [tLine]
>>>   put tLine +1 into tNewLine
>>> 
>>>   if tNewLine > the dgNumberOfLines of me then
>>>  put the dgIndexOfLine [tLine] of me into tIndex
>>>   else
>>>  put the dgIndexOfLine [tNewLine] of me into tIndex
>>>   end if
>>> 
>>>   return tIndex
>>> end dgNextIndexOfLine
>>> 
>>> getProp dgPrevIndexOfLine [tLine]
>>>   put tLine -1 into tNewLine
>>> 
>>>   if tNewLine <1 then
>>>  put the dgIndexOfLine [tLine] of me into tIndex
>>>   else
>>>  put the dgIndexOfLine [tNewLine] of me into tIndex
>>>   end if
>>> 
>>>   return tIndex
>>> end dgPrevIndexOfLine
>>> 
>>> You are welcome. :-)
>>> 
>>> Bob S
>>> 
>>> ___
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>>> subscription preferences:
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Re: Proposed update to datagrid library

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

 never mind. I just realized that if the datagrid gets re-sorted, there 
IS NO WAY to determine the next visible line in a datagrid. Kinda sucks. 

Bob S


> On Jul 31, 2024, at 11:01 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all. 
> 
> Has anyone tried to determine the index of the next line of a datagrid? It’s 
> not as straightforward as you might think. When data is first loaded into a 
> datagrid, the dgIndexes are only going to be in numeric order if the sort 
> order of the datagrid is the same as the data you are loading. Otherwise, the 
> indexes will be all mixed up, but the dgLines of the datagrid will ALWAYS be 
> in the order of the visible rows. 
> 
> Sure you can just add one to the current dgHilitedLine, but what if you want 
> to know the index of the next line just before deleting the current one? You 
> cannot delete the line first because then the line numbers change, and there 
> won’t be another line hilited until your code sets it. 
> 
> And while there is a dgIndexOfLine property built in, there is no 
> dgLineOfIndex! Not only that, but there is a dgIndexes property, but there is 
> no dgLines property! How odd is that?? The goal is to determine the index of 
> the next visible line where the line numbers are no longer sequential. 
> 
> So I wrote some very simple virtual properties that ought to be a part of the 
> datagrid library. You can put these in the script of a datagrid itself, or if 
> you are brave enough to use the inline behaviors feature of datagrids as I 
> do, you can put them in your own datagrid custom library. But really they 
> belong in the built-in datagrid library itself. They are: 
> 
> getProp dgNextIndexOfLine [tLine]
>   put tLine +1 into tNewLine
> 
>   if tNewLine > the dgNumberOfLines of me then
>  put the dgIndexOfLine [tLine] of me into tIndex
>   else 
>  put the dgIndexOfLine [tNewLine] of me into tIndex
>   end if
> 
>   return tIndex
> end dgNextIndexOfLine
> 
> getProp dgPrevIndexOfLine [tLine]
>   put tLine -1 into tNewLine
> 
>   if tNewLine <1 then
>  put the dgIndexOfLine [tLine] of me into tIndex
>   else 
>  put the dgIndexOfLine [tNewLine] of me into tIndex
>   end if
> 
>   return tIndex
> end dgPrevIndexOfLine
> 
> You are welcome. :-)
> 
> Bob S
> 
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Re: Proposed update to datagrid library

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Correction, dgLines is not a property of a datagrid. The dgHilitedLines is, but 
are only sequential when the data is first loaded. If resorted by clicking a 
column header, the dgHilitedLines will no longer be sequential.

Bob S


On Jul 31, 2024, at 11:01 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Otherwise, the indexes will be all mixed up, but the dgLines of the datagrid 
will ALWAYS be in the order of the visible rows.

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Proposed update to datagrid library

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi all. 

Has anyone tried to determine the index of the next line of a datagrid? It’s 
not as straightforward as you might think. When data is first loaded into a 
datagrid, the dgIndexes are only going to be in numeric order if the sort order 
of the datagrid is the same as the data you are loading. Otherwise, the indexes 
will be all mixed up, but the dgLines of the datagrid will ALWAYS be in the 
order of the visible rows. 

Sure you can just add one to the current dgHilitedLine, but what if you want to 
know the index of the next line just before deleting the current one? You 
cannot delete the line first because then the line numbers change, and there 
won’t be another line hilited until your code sets it. 

And while there is a dgIndexOfLine property built in, there is no 
dgLineOfIndex! Not only that, but there is a dgIndexes property, but there is 
no dgLines property! How odd is that?? The goal is to determine the index of 
the next visible line where the line numbers are no longer sequential. 

So I wrote some very simple virtual properties that ought to be a part of the 
datagrid library. You can put these in the script of a datagrid itself, or if 
you are brave enough to use the inline behaviors feature of datagrids as I do, 
you can put them in your own datagrid custom library. But really they belong in 
the built-in datagrid library itself. They are: 

getProp dgNextIndexOfLine [tLine]
   put tLine +1 into tNewLine
   
   if tNewLine > the dgNumberOfLines of me then
  put the dgIndexOfLine [tLine] of me into tIndex
   else 
  put the dgIndexOfLine [tNewLine] of me into tIndex
   end if
   
   return tIndex
end dgNextIndexOfLine

getProp dgPrevIndexOfLine [tLine]
   put tLine -1 into tNewLine
   
   if tNewLine <1 then
  put the dgIndexOfLine [tLine] of me into tIndex
   else 
  put the dgIndexOfLine [tNewLine] of me into tIndex
   end if
   
   return tIndex
end dgPrevIndexOfLine

You are welcome. :-)

Bob S

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Re: Date and time format question

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Yeah but I think I got the math backwards. -0400 means the GMT is 4 hours AHEAD 
not behind. It should be subtract tOffset from tDateTime. 

Bob S


> On Jul 29, 2024, at 4:11 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Thanks! You math to do the offset is much simpler.
> 
> On 7/29/2024 6:34 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode wrote:
>> Meh never mind overthinking it. Both ways work.
>> 
>> Bob S
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 29, 2024, at 3:30 PM, Bob Sneidar  
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Actually it’s possible in some whacko time zones to get a rounding error by 
>>> dividing first so:
>>> 
>>> …
>>>> put (tOffset *60 *60) /100 into tOffset
>>> …
>>> 
>>> Bob S
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Jul 29, 2024, at 3:14 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Simpler than that:
>>>> 
>>>> on mouseUp
>>>>  put "Mon, 29 Jul 2024 15:49:52 -0400" into tDateTime
>>>>  put word -1 of tDateTime into tOffset
>>>>  -- delete last word of tDateTime
>>>>  convert tDateTime to seconds
>>>>  put (tOffset / 100) *60 *60 into tOffset
>>>>  add tOffset to tDateTime
>>>>  convert tDateTime to  long date and  long time
>>>>  put tDateTime
>>>> end mouseUp
>>>> 
>>>> Bob S
>>>> 
>>>> 

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Re: Date and time format question

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Meh never mind overthinking it. Both ways work. 

Bob S


> On Jul 29, 2024, at 3:30 PM, Bob Sneidar  wrote:
> 
> Actually it’s possible in some whacko time zones to get a rounding error by 
> dividing first so:
> 
> …
>> put (tOffset *60 *60) /100 into tOffset
> …
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
>> On Jul 29, 2024, at 3:14 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Simpler than that: 
>> 
>> on mouseUp
>>  put "Mon, 29 Jul 2024 15:49:52 -0400" into tDateTime
>>  put word -1 of tDateTime into tOffset
>>  -- delete last word of tDateTime
>>  convert tDateTime to seconds
>>  put (tOffset / 100) *60 *60 into tOffset
>>  add tOffset to tDateTime
>>  convert tDateTime to  long date and  long time
>>  put tDateTime
>> end mouseUp
>> 
>> Bob S
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 29, 2024, at 3:02 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> dateItems does not contain the timezone offset, so you would need to get 
>>> the timezone offset from the internet date (the only format I can find that 
>>> has it) and the break the offset into minutes and hours and perform the 
>>> math.
>>> 
>>> I haven't tested this code (yet), but I think the seconds is the way to go.
>>> 
>>> function refiXMLTimestamp
>>> -- Need to return the timestamp (current time) in UTC format, or 
>>> -MM-DDTHH:MM:SSZ where Z is zulu or GMT
>>> local tTimestamp
>>> get the internet date -- Mon, 29 Jul 2024 16:49:52 -0400
>>> -- the day of the week followed by a comma, all other item delimited by a 
>>> space
>>> -- the day of the month
>>> -- the three-letter abbreviation for the month name
>>> -- the four-digit year
>>> -- the time in 24-hour format, including seconds, delimited by colons
>>> -- the four-digit time zone relative to UTC (Greenwich) time
>>> set the itemDel to space
>>> put last item of it into tZoneOffset -- +/-hhmm
>>> set the itemDel to comma
>>> convert it to seconds
>>> -- the year
>>> -- the month number
>>> -- the day of the month
>>> -- the hour in 24-hour time
>>> -- the minute
>>> -- the second
>>> -- the numeric day of the week where Sunday is day 1, Monday is day 2, and 
>>> so forth
>>> putchar -1 to -2 of tZoneOffset into tMinOffset
>>> delete char -1 to -2 of tZoneOffset
>>> put ((tZoneOffset*3600)+(tMinOffset*60)) into tSecOffset
>>> -- adjust time to zulu/gmt
>>> add tSecOffset to it
>>> convert it to dateItems
>>> -- Now convert to -MM-DDTHH:MM:SSZ where Z is zulu of GMT/UTC
>>> put format("%4u",item 1 of it) &"-"& format("%2u",item 2 of it) &"-"& 
>>> format("%2u",item 3 of it)   into tTimestamp -- the date in new 
>>> format
>>> put "T"& format(%2u",item 4 of it) &":"& format("%2u",item 5 of it) &":"& 
>>> format("%2u",item 6 of it) &"Z" after tTimestamp -- the time in new format
>>> return tTimestamp
>>> end refiXMLTimestamp
>>> 
>>> On 7/29/2024 5:37 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode wrote:
>>>> Convert it to dateitems, then back again.
>>>> 
>>>> Bob S
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Jul 29, 2024, at 2:09 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Follow up question/request:
>>>>> 
>>>>> put the internet date into tTimestamp -- stores something like Mon, 29 
>>>>> Jul 2024 16:49:52 -0400, where the -0400 is the time zone offset
>>>>> 
>>>>> Anyone have some already written code to convert this to a time in GMT 
>>>>> (i.e where the time zone offset is +, i.e. Mon, 29 Jul 2024 20:49:52 
>>>>> +)?
>>>>> 
>>>>> It is adding the offset to the hours and minutes, but you have to handle 
>>>>> carry over, potentially adding or subtracting a day.
>>>>> 
>>>>> If the best approach converting to seconds and the doing the math and 
>>>>> converting back? (I think this is the answer)
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
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>>>

Re: Date and time format question

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Actually it’s possible in some whacko time zones to get a rounding error by 
dividing first so:

…
> put (tOffset *60 *60) /100 into tOffset
…

Bob S


> On Jul 29, 2024, at 3:14 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Simpler than that: 
> 
> on mouseUp
>   put "Mon, 29 Jul 2024 15:49:52 -0400" into tDateTime
>   put word -1 of tDateTime into tOffset
>   -- delete last word of tDateTime
>   convert tDateTime to seconds
>   put (tOffset / 100) *60 *60 into tOffset
>   add tOffset to tDateTime
>   convert tDateTime to  long date and  long time
>   put tDateTime
> end mouseUp
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
>> On Jul 29, 2024, at 3:02 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> dateItems does not contain the timezone offset, so you would need to get the 
>> timezone offset from the internet date (the only format I can find that has 
>> it) and the break the offset into minutes and hours and perform the math.
>> 
>> I haven't tested this code (yet), but I think the seconds is the way to go.
>> 
>> function refiXMLTimestamp
>>  -- Need to return the timestamp (current time) in UTC format, or 
>> -MM-DDTHH:MM:SSZ where Z is zulu or GMT
>>  local tTimestamp
>>  get the internet date -- Mon, 29 Jul 2024 16:49:52 -0400
>>  -- the day of the week followed by a comma, all other item delimited by a 
>> space
>>  -- the day of the month
>>  -- the three-letter abbreviation for the month name
>>  -- the four-digit year
>>  -- the time in 24-hour format, including seconds, delimited by colons
>>  -- the four-digit time zone relative to UTC (Greenwich) time
>>  set the itemDel to space
>>  put last item of it into tZoneOffset -- +/-hhmm
>>  set the itemDel to comma
>>  convert it to seconds
>>  -- the year
>>  -- the month number
>>  -- the day of the month
>>  -- the hour in 24-hour time
>>  -- the minute
>>  -- the second
>>  -- the numeric day of the week where Sunday is day 1, Monday is day 2, and 
>> so forth
>>  putchar -1 to -2 of tZoneOffset into tMinOffset
>>  delete char -1 to -2 of tZoneOffset
>>  put ((tZoneOffset*3600)+(tMinOffset*60)) into tSecOffset
>>  -- adjust time to zulu/gmt
>>  add tSecOffset to it
>>  convert it to dateItems
>>  -- Now convert to -MM-DDTHH:MM:SSZ where Z is zulu of GMT/UTC
>>  put format("%4u",item 1 of it) &"-"& format("%2u",item 2 of it) &"-"& 
>> format("%2u",item 3 of it)   into tTimestamp -- the date in new 
>> format
>>  put "T"& format(%2u",item 4 of it) &":"& format("%2u",item 5 of it) &":"& 
>> format("%2u",item 6 of it) &"Z" after tTimestamp -- the time in new format
>>  return tTimestamp
>> end refiXMLTimestamp
>> 
>> On 7/29/2024 5:37 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode wrote:
>>> Convert it to dateitems, then back again.
>>> 
>>> Bob S
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Jul 29, 2024, at 2:09 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Follow up question/request:
>>>> 
>>>> put the internet date into tTimestamp -- stores something like Mon, 29 Jul 
>>>> 2024 16:49:52 -0400, where the -0400 is the time zone offset
>>>> 
>>>> Anyone have some already written code to convert this to a time in GMT 
>>>> (i.e where the time zone offset is +, i.e. Mon, 29 Jul 2024 20:49:52 
>>>> +)?
>>>> 
>>>> It is adding the offset to the hours and minutes, but you have to handle 
>>>> carry over, potentially adding or subtracting a day.
>>>> 
>>>> If the best approach converting to seconds and the doing the math and 
>>>> converting back? (I think this is the answer)
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>>> subscription preferences:
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Re: Date and time format question

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Simpler than that: 

on mouseUp
   put "Mon, 29 Jul 2024 15:49:52 -0400" into tDateTime
   put word -1 of tDateTime into tOffset
   -- delete last word of tDateTime
   convert tDateTime to seconds
   put (tOffset / 100) *60 *60 into tOffset
   add tOffset to tDateTime
   convert tDateTime to  long date and  long time
   put tDateTime
end mouseUp

Bob S


> On Jul 29, 2024, at 3:02 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> dateItems does not contain the timezone offset, so you would need to get the 
> timezone offset from the internet date (the only format I can find that has 
> it) and the break the offset into minutes and hours and perform the math.
> 
> I haven't tested this code (yet), but I think the seconds is the way to go.
> 
> function refiXMLTimestamp
>   -- Need to return the timestamp (current time) in UTC format, or 
> -MM-DDTHH:MM:SSZ where Z is zulu or GMT
>   local tTimestamp
>   get the internet date -- Mon, 29 Jul 2024 16:49:52 -0400
>   -- the day of the week followed by a comma, all other item delimited by a 
> space
>   -- the day of the month
>   -- the three-letter abbreviation for the month name
>   -- the four-digit year
>   -- the time in 24-hour format, including seconds, delimited by colons
>   -- the four-digit time zone relative to UTC (Greenwich) time
>   set the itemDel to space
>   put last item of it into tZoneOffset -- +/-hhmm
>   set the itemDel to comma
>   convert it to seconds
>   -- the year
>   -- the month number
>   -- the day of the month
>   -- the hour in 24-hour time
>   -- the minute
>   -- the second
>   -- the numeric day of the week where Sunday is day 1, Monday is day 2, and 
> so forth
>   putchar -1 to -2 of tZoneOffset into tMinOffset
>   delete char -1 to -2 of tZoneOffset
>   put ((tZoneOffset*3600)+(tMinOffset*60)) into tSecOffset
>   -- adjust time to zulu/gmt
>   add tSecOffset to it
>   convert it to dateItems
>   -- Now convert to -MM-DDTHH:MM:SSZ where Z is zulu of GMT/UTC
>   put format("%4u",item 1 of it) &"-"& format("%2u",item 2 of it) &"-"& 
> format("%2u",item 3 of it)   into tTimestamp -- the date in new format
>   put "T"& format(%2u",item 4 of it) &":"& format("%2u",item 5 of it) &":"& 
> format("%2u",item 6 of it) &"Z" after tTimestamp -- the time in new format
>   return tTimestamp
> end refiXMLTimestamp
> 
> On 7/29/2024 5:37 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode wrote:
>> Convert it to dateitems, then back again.
>> 
>> Bob S
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 29, 2024, at 2:09 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Follow up question/request:
>>> 
>>> put the internet date into tTimestamp -- stores something like Mon, 29 Jul 
>>> 2024 16:49:52 -0400, where the -0400 is the time zone offset
>>> 
>>> Anyone have some already written code to convert this to a time in GMT (i.e 
>>> where the time zone offset is +, i.e. Mon, 29 Jul 2024 20:49:52 +)?
>>> 
>>> It is adding the offset to the hours and minutes, but you have to handle 
>>> carry over, potentially adding or subtracting a day.
>>> 
>>> If the best approach converting to seconds and the doing the math and 
>>> converting back? (I think this is the answer)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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Re: Date and time format question

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

That doesn’t work I’ll get back to you. 

Bob S


> On Jul 29, 2024, at 2:37 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Convert it to dateitems, then back again. 
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
>> On Jul 29, 2024, at 2:09 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Follow up question/request:
>> 
>> put the internet date into tTimestamp -- stores something like Mon, 29 Jul 
>> 2024 16:49:52 -0400, where the -0400 is the time zone offset
>> 
>> Anyone have some already written code to convert this to a time in GMT (i.e 
>> where the time zone offset is +, i.e. Mon, 29 Jul 2024 20:49:52 +)?
>> 
>> It is adding the offset to the hours and minutes, but you have to handle 
>> carry over, potentially adding or subtracting a day.
>> 
>> If the best approach converting to seconds and the doing the math and 
>> converting back? (I think this is the answer)
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: unsubscribing

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Many are losing their ability to maintain internal apps, others are losing 
their ability to make at least a part of their living. I would not characterize 
that as cat in-fighting.

On Jul 29, 2024, at 2:09 PM, Sean Cole via use-livecode 
 wrote:

once the cat
in-fighting has gone away.

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Re: Date and time format question

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Convert it to dateitems, then back again. 

Bob S


> On Jul 29, 2024, at 2:09 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Follow up question/request:
> 
> put the internet date into tTimestamp -- stores something like Mon, 29 Jul 
> 2024 16:49:52 -0400, where the -0400 is the time zone offset
> 
> Anyone have some already written code to convert this to a time in GMT (i.e 
> where the time zone offset is +, i.e. Mon, 29 Jul 2024 20:49:52 +)?
> 
> It is adding the offset to the hours and minutes, but you have to handle 
> carry over, potentially adding or subtracting a day.
> 
> If the best approach converting to seconds and the doing the math and 
> converting back? (I think this is the answer)
> 
> 
> 
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Re: use-livecode Digest, Vol 250, Issue 1

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I don’t see how that would be faster. You are adding string processing 
overhead, not reducing it. Arrays work well because you already have an index 
of sorts (the keys of the array).



On Jul 27, 2024, at 5:01 AM, David V Glasgow via use-livecode 
 wrote:

I have long intended to see if I can speed things up a bit.  Should I go back 
and look at converting string lists to arrays, then using filter, and finally 
converting back to a variable?  I suppose I could do this contingent upon 
number of lines just in case time penalties and benefits are not linear…

Any thoughts/advice welcome.

Cheers

David G



David Glasgow

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Re: Livecode Future

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Well given recent posts this morning I would contact Livecode Support and 
discuss you specific situation with them. 

Bob S


> On Jul 26, 2024, at 8:36 AM, Heriberto Torrado via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Bob,
> 
> Thank you very much for clarifying my question. Based on your response, it's 
> clear that LiveCode is not suitable for our needs.
> 
> In my current role at the new company, I've developed several small 
> applications using LiveCode for internal use: a client onboarding form, a 
> workflow management app for our printers, and a folder encryption tool. These 
> are small utilities, and it wouldn't be feasible for each user to pay $150 
> per app, resulting in $450 per employee.
> 
> I previously purchased the Indy license and intended to buy a similar one 
> now. However, it seems I will need to find another solution.
> 
> As you mentioned, the Mobile development license is not relevant for us since 
> I only develop desktop applications.
> 
> Additionally, our strict security measures mean our firewalls won't allow 
> LiveCode applications to communicate externally.
> 
> After 15 years of working with LiveCode, I've learned that relying on 
> programming languages  without a big community and free licensing can lead to 
> significant risks and potential loss of knowledge.
> 
> Best regards,
> Heriberto
> 
> On 7/26/24 11:07, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode wrote:
>> Yes each user who uses your app will require a seat license.
>> 
>> Bob S
>> 
>> 
>> On Jul 25, 2024, at 5:28 PM, Heriberto Torrado via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello,
>> 
>> I apologize for asking my questions again, but after carefully reading the 
>> previous email, I am still a bit confused.
>> 
>> My situation is as follows: I work as the IT Director at a company in New 
>> York. Among many other responsibilities, I have developed several apps for 
>> internal use by our employees. My question is straightforward: With the new 
>> licensing model, does each employee need to pay for a license? I am 
>> currently using the "Community" version, but it does not work on Apple 
>> Silicon devices. Therefore, I am considering purchasing a new license.
>> 
>> Thank you for your assistance.
>> 
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Re: The story so far

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Concerning hosting, in my case when I initially developed the database for my 
application, it was hosted on the Livecode servers. When the owner of the 
company found out he had me take it down because he didn’t want company data on 
servers he did not own / control. That is probably going to be an issue that 
crops up with more developers using your hosting services.

Bob S


On Jul 26, 2024, at 3:45 AM, Kevin Miller via use-livecode 
 wrote:

The Internal apps model (for people building apps for use within their own 
organization) has gone over well in many cases. However I think there is 
perhaps a bit of a split between those who want to use the new Cloud hosting 
and data back end and those that don't want to use it, either because you have 
your own data back end or because you are creating smaller utilities that don't 
use data. Looking at the market as a whole and including new users, we've 
spoken to hundreds of people who do want to use the back end and the model and 
it is sitting pretty well for that group. For those of you that don't, my 
question is whether we have the volume discounting correct or whether we want 
to introduce a lower cost model at scale for that specific group.

I'm not talking about changing the per-seat-for-commercial-end-users model, 
we're confident that's the right way forward. Our entire IP is in each 
standalone, and we have to scale with the value we create to have a successful 
business. We've learned that in our 20 years of history and the feedback this 
week has been ok on this point overall. I'm also not talking about changing 
costs for smaller numbers of seats. The question is whether we as a business 
want to also serve a segment without the Cloud hosting, at a better volume 
discount for higher seat numbers.

This is a harder question than it looks, because so much of the benefit from 
the new platform comes from the new data back end. Giving new users a choice 
early in the process complicates their initial journey with us and potentially 
creates a confusing decision around one of the best new capabilities. It also 
has an impact on product engineering and the decisions we take there. On the 
other hand we want the platform to go on being practical for as many of you as 
possible. We appreciate your support over the years and this remains very 
important to us. There is a subset of you who are clearly not going to use the 
Cloud and for whom the new Internal model is presenting a challenge at scale. 
We will be reflecting on this question in the coming days.

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Re: I seem to have missed something

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Because Kevin’s response to me in this exact scenario where I develop apps 
myself with I license I pay for myself, but employees of the company I work for 
use the app for business purposes, was that I have to pay for each user that 
uses my app. It is a commercial app because it is used in the workflow of the 
company I am an employee of, but I do not make any money on it, and if I 
approached my employer and asked for them to pay for it, they would decline.

Bob S


On Jul 26, 2024, at 3:13 AM, Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Hm, how could one offer commercially a free app?

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Re: Lockscreen and progress bar

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Try wait 1 millisecond with messages then lock screen again. But I have run 
into this issue where even when I pause execution by some means the screen does 
not update. I find the whole process unreliable, and by the way when you lock 
the screen then do something with a datagrid, the screen gets unlocked in the 
process because the datagrid library for reasons unknown unlocks the screen for 
certain operations. 

Bob S


> On Jul 26, 2024, at 12:12 AM, jbv via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello Terry,
> 
> Yes I thought of that. The problem is that "lock screen" hinders
> the progress bar to be updated while the loop is running.
> I also tried to shortly "break" the lock screen by inserting
>  unlock screen
>  lock screen
> within the loop, hoping that it would update the display, but
> to no avail.
> 
> Thank you anyway for the idea.
> 
> Le 2024-07-26 02:54, Terry Judd via use-livecode a écrit :
>> How about taking a screengrab just before you run the loop, place that over 
>> the top of the content that changes, layer the progress thingy over that and 
>> then delete the screengrab and hide the thingy when the loop is done?
>> From: use-livecode  on behalf of jbv 
>> via use-livecode 
>> Date: Friday, 26 July 2024 at 4:44 PM
>> To: How to use LiveCode 
>> Cc: j...@souslelogo.com 
>> Subject: Lockscreen and progress bar
>> Hi list,
>> I have a main loop that does a lot of things, like resizing images,
>> precessing imagedata, creating fields and groups, etc.
>> On top of the loop I have added "lock screen" to speed things up, and
>> also because I don't want users to see what is going on, only the final
>> layout when the loop is over.
>> However, while the loop is running, I would like to have a progress bar
>> and a message such as "step 1/20" etc.
>> How can I handle that ? I took a look at callbacks, but unless I missed
>> something, it seems limited to players.
>> Thank you in advance.
>> jbv
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Re: Lockscreen and progress bar

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

The solution I came up with was a standalone that I could send messages to. I 
called it Spinner because I wanted to show a dialog that displayed a message 
and a spinning graphic while Livecode was processing handlers. I could send 
commands to show itself, hide itself, display a message and activate the 
graphic. A progress bar could have been added but I stopped using it for some 
reason. On MacOS I used Applescript to send commands, but you could use sockets 
just as easily. 

I think there are widgets now that will do what you want. My understanding is 
that widgets can be designed to run independent of Livecode’s single processing 
thread. 

Bob S


> On Jul 25, 2024, at 11:42 PM, jbv via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi list,
> 
> I have a main loop that does a lot of things, like resizing images,
> precessing imagedata, creating fields and groups, etc.
> On top of the loop I have added "lock screen" to speed things up, and
> also because I don't want users to see what is going on, only the final
> layout when the loop is over.
> However, while the loop is running, I would like to have a progress bar
> and a message such as "step 1/20" etc.
> 
> How can I handle that ? I took a look at callbacks, but unless I missed
> something, it seems limited to players.
> 
> Thank you in advance.
> jbv
> 
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Re: I seem to have missed something

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

According to the CEO of Livecode, my scenario DOES qualify as a commercial app, 
hence my consternation. I will have to pay 3 times what I currently pay now for 
a license just to maintain status quo, and expanding the number of users of my 
app is completely out of the question since I pay for the license myself. 

Bob S


> On Jul 25, 2024, at 5:02 PM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> On 26/07/2024 00:46, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode wrote:
>> But the primary app I developed IS commercial by their definition.
>> 
>> Bob S
> 
> Commercial ?  I guess so.
> 
> But I don't see that it fits the criteria for "Internal apps"; that category 
> is for apps that have been developed by a company, paying either an employee 
> or contractor to develop it.
> 
> In your case, you did the app in your own time, using your own LC license. 
> You're not employed to do coding, and didn't get paid for any coding you did. 
> The app, and any associated IP, belongs to you - not to any company. It 
> therefore qualifies as an "app for sale".
> 
> So put the app on an AppStore (or sell it directly), and pay the 5% of 
> revenue plus one developer seat.
> 
> Alex.

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Re: Livecode Future

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Yes each user who uses your app will require a seat license.

Bob S


On Jul 25, 2024, at 5:28 PM, Heriberto Torrado via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Hello,

I apologize for asking my questions again, but after carefully reading the 
previous email, I am still a bit confused.

My situation is as follows: I work as the IT Director at a company in New York. 
Among many other responsibilities, I have developed several apps for internal 
use by our employees. My question is straightforward: With the new licensing 
model, does each employee need to pay for a license? I am currently using the 
"Community" version, but it does not work on Apple Silicon devices. Therefore, 
I am considering purchasing a new license.

Thank you for your assistance.

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Re: I seem to have missed something

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

But the primary app I developed IS commercial by their definition.

Bob S


On Jul 25, 2024, at 4:29 PM, matthias rebbe via use-livecode 
 wrote:

First of all, it's 3 years not 2. ;)

I am in the same boat regarding the utility apps to make life and jobs of 
family members and colleagues easier.
Over the years I've created plenty of them and I am sure some of them need to 
be maintained in the future.
Sometimes I even cannot remember an app when people tell me that they still use 
it. ;)

The new licenses allow to create free apps as long as they are not used 
commercially.

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Re: I seem to have missed something

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

It’s water under the bridge, but in retrospect I think the proper way for 
Livecode to have structured their business was to have 3 products: Livecode 
Desktop, Livecode Mobile and Livecode Web. Each product should have maintained 
their own revenue stream unbound and unburdened by the other two. As it is, any 
financial burden developing for Mobile or Web is shared by Desktop. If one 
fails, all fail.

I also think that the Non-Commercial version we used to have (as much as I took 
advantage of it) was a bad idea. Give people something for free that they would 
otherwise have to pay for, guess what? They will use the free thing.

Finally, I think that Livecode, much like Now Software of the past, 
overextended themselves. Now Software tried to develop a new product from the 
ground up and learned what all developers learn: It’s REALLY HARD to do.

Livecode attempted to incorporate what I would consider to be niche 
technologies, so their resources have become much diluted. The native compiler 
project is dead I assume. Mobile is probably sucking resources from other 
things because it seems like every other week iOS or Android are making prior 
builds obsolete by their incessant changes. V10 has taken how many years to 
produce? Don’t get me started on Artificial Intelligence!! And I don’t NEED a 
no-code way to develop apps. I LIKE CODING!!

All I ever wanted was to create utility apps to make my life and my job easier. 
That is it. I don’t need the bells and whistles, but I have been investing in 
those all these years just to keep desktop deveopment alive. Now I will not be 
able to afford developing for just the 3 internal users I have, and approaching 
my employer to incorporate my applipaction throughout the company is dead in 
the water. Thank GOD I didn’t already do so!

So by whenever in 2027 this awesome party ends, I will likely bid farewell to 
you all and consider abandoning my development hobby completely. It feels like 
I have been given 2 years to live.

Bob S


On Jul 25, 2024, at 9:30 AM, William Prothero via use-livecode 
 wrote:

I second Graham's comment about apple's requirements for getting an app to work 
on the iphone are a huge pita.
Bill
William A. Prothero, PhD
Prof Emeritus, Dept of Earth Science
University of California, Santa Barbara

On Jul 25, 2024, at 7:31 AM, Graham Samuel via use-livecode 
mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>> wrote:

I’m in roughly the same position as Bill. Long ago I wrote Livecode apps for 
sale,  but in the last several years I’ve just written a few personal apps, and 
have more or less stopped work, due mostly to old age. However I don’t like to 
say I’ve entirely given up as a hobbyist, and I was thinking of revisiting an 
app idea I had at the time of the pandemic - so I’m glad of Kevin’s reply.

At present I’m thinking about iOS apps and wonder how much help from Create I 
will get for deployment  - obeying all of Apple’s rules for the publication of 
an app (even a free one) into the public space. For me this part of app 
development proved far more of a PITA than the actual coding, and I know I will 
always need all the help I can get on this aspect. Maybe I missed it, but I am 
not clear what Create will offer.

My other use of Livecode scripting has been to use it as “IYSWIM” (“if you see 
what I mean”) modelling tool, where I get the logic straight before plunging 
into a relatively hostile coding environment (think the Apple Watch, which will 
never be covered by Livecode in any form). As far as I can see, I will be able 
to go on using versions of Classic for this, even if the become outdated over 
time. I’m glad about this.

Best

Graham

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Re: Livecode Future

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

If that is true then I misunderstand the licensing model. My understanding is 
that every app I distribute for someone else to use is a “seat” as well as me 
the developer, another seat. I have 3 “seats” at present including myself, all 
are internal users to the company I work for, but the company does not pay me 
to do this development. I wrote the application to make generating forms easier 
for the IT technicians in the field. 

Are you saying I can purchase one developer seat for $499, build 2 standalone 
apps and not have to pay for the other two seats, as long as I do not make any 
money from the app?? 

Bob S


> On Jul 24, 2024, at 7:44 PM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> It’s the one signposted as something like “growing the community”.
> 
> I too dislike videos, so avoided watching this until Kevin said there was 
> info about lifetime license holders in a video.
> 
> btw, I am a hobbyist deriving no income from LC, and I think you’re incorrect 
> about there being no place for us in LC’s future. We can build and distribute 
> our non-íncome-producing apps by getting a single developer seat ($449 per 
> year); not a trivial amount but not much for a hobby (less than membership at 
> my local golf club or gym, even before I think about buying clubs or trainers 
> or replacing all the lost golf balls). The expiration of the lifetime license 
> will be compensated for by a discount at the first license renewal (in 
> December 2025??), though we don’t yet know how that will be calculated.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 

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Re: Livecode Future

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Thanks Kevin that is much more encouraging. At least I won’t have to abandon 
the work I have already done. 

Bob S


> On Jul 24, 2024, at 9:37 AM, Kevin Miller via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> No, those apps will continue to work.
> 
> Kind regards, 
> 
> Kevin 
> 
> Kevin Miller ~ ke...@livecode.com ~ http://www.livecode.com/ 
> LiveCode: Build Amazing Things 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 24/07/2024, 17:09, "use-livecode on behalf of Bob Sneidar via 
> use-livecode"  <mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com> on behalf of 
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com <mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> Are the current compiled classic apps going to be disabled when the classic 
> license expires? That will suck big time. I just compared my current license 
> with what I would pay under the new one for 3 users. It isn’t encouraging. 
> And right now I can distribute my app to as many users as I want. So the 
> value for the new pricing model goes into the tank right from the outset, and 
> gets worse the more users I want to add. 
> 
> 
> I am sorry to say, this is a hard no for me. 
> 
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 24, 2024, at 8:54 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>> mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> I think that there ought to be an option to continue to pay the classic 
>> license fee to continue to use classic, with the understanding that no 
>> future updates would be provided. I am the only developer, but I have 2 
>> other people who use my compiled app internally. I *might* be able to 
>> convince the owners to pay for the yearly license fee for classic (I’ve 
>> footed the bill all this time), on the basis that I could expand the use of 
>> my app to anyone in the company, but not if they have to pay for each user 
>> of my app. 
>> 
>> Bob S
>> 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: I seem to have missed something

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Too late. 

Bob S


> On Jul 24, 2024, at 9:14 AM, Heather Laine via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Folks... please don't click that link, its a personally tracked link and will 
> skew our stats weirdly :)
> 
> The minisite link you want is here:
> 
> https://future.livecode.com/
> 
> Best Regards,
> 
> Heather
> 
> Heather Laine
> Customer Services Manager
> LiveCode Ltd
> www.livecode.com
> 
> 
> 
>> On 24 Jul 2024, at 16:56, Peter Bogdanoff via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Find Out More 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 24, 2024, at 11:52 AM, William Prothero via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Folks,
>>> I have full lucrsnses for livecode, yet seem to have missed descriptions of 
>>> the new livecode services that are being discussed. What is the "Create" 
>>> platform being added? Is there a place I can get info?
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> Bill
>>> 
>>> William A. Prothero, PhD
>>> Prof Emeritus, Dept of Earth Science
>>> University of California, Santa Barbara
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Re: Livecode Future

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Are the current compiled classic apps going to be disabled when the classic 
license expires? That will suck big time. I just compared my current license 
with what I would pay under the new one for 3 users. It isn’t encouraging. And 
right now I can distribute my app to as many users as I want. So the value for 
the new pricing model goes into the tank right from the outset, and gets worse 
the more users I want to add. 

I am sorry to say, this is a hard no for me. 

Bob S


> On Jul 24, 2024, at 8:54 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I think that there ought to be an option to continue to pay the classic 
> license fee to continue to use classic, with the understanding that no future 
> updates would be provided. I am the only developer, but I have 2 other people 
> who use my compiled app internally. I *might* be able to convince the owners 
> to pay for the yearly license fee for classic (I’ve footed the bill all this 
> time), on the basis that I could expand the use of my app to anyone in the 
> company, but not if they have to pay for each user of my app. 
> 
> Bob S
> 
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Re: Livecode Future

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I think that there ought to be an option to continue to pay the classic license 
fee to continue to use classic, with the understanding that no future updates 
would be provided. I am the only developer, but I have 2 other people who use 
my compiled app internally. I *might* be able to convince the owners to pay for 
the yearly license fee for classic (I’ve footed the bill all this time), on the 
basis that I could expand the use of my app to anyone in the company, but not 
if they have to pay for each user of my app. 

Bob S

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Re: Encrypted text files

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Also be sure to write and read binary. 

Bob S


> On Jul 18, 2024, at 8:08 AM, Bob Sneidar  wrote:
> 
> I use the built-in encryption library. See encrypt and decrypt in the 
> dictionary. Not sure if there are size limits though. How big might your 
> biggest text files be? 
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
>> On Jul 18, 2024, at 6:53 AM, Charles Szasz via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Is there a reliable method to encrypt a text file using LC?  I have an app 
>> that generates text files and wanted encryption to my app.  
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
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Re: Encrypted text files

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I use the built-in encryption library. See encrypt and decrypt in the 
dictionary. Not sure if there are size limits though. How big might your 
biggest text files be? 

Bob S


> On Jul 18, 2024, at 6:53 AM, Charles Szasz via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Is there a reliable method to encrypt a text file using LC?  I have an app 
> that generates text files and wanted encryption to my app.  
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
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Re: fwGestalt() function

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Wonderful, thanks all.

Bob S


On Jul 15, 2024, at 6:01 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
 wrote:

With due credit to Richard for the original, you might want to update it for 
today's disk sizes, This adds GB and TB

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Re: fwGestalt() function

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Spell Correction: 

Avilable disk space: 454737.3 MB

Bob S

> On Jul 15, 2024, at 4:24 PM, Bob Sneidar  wrote:
> 
> Thanks Richard. 
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2024, at 4:07 PM, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> function Bytes2Size n
>>  set the numberformat to "0.#"
>>  if n < 1024 then put n &" bytes" into n
>>  else
>>put n / 1024 into n
>>if n < 1024 then put n &" k" into n
>>else
>>  put n / 1024 &" MB" into n
>>end if
>>  end if
>>  return n
>> end Bytes2Size
> 
> 


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Re: fwGestalt() function

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Thanks Richard.

Bob S


On Jul 15, 2024, at 4:07 PM, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
 wrote:

function Bytes2Size n
 set the numberformat to "0.#"
 if n < 1024 then put n &" bytes" into n
 else
   put n / 1024 into n
   if n < 1024 then put n &" k" into n
   else
 put n / 1024 &" MB" into n
   end if
 end if
 return n
end Bytes2Size

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fwGestalt() function

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I got ahold of a function someone wrote years ago called fwGestalt(). It looks 
to provide information about the current application it belongs to in a report. 
However it is calling a function called Bytes2Size() which apparently converts 
hard drive space from bytes to actual free space. Does anyone have the 
byte2Size() function? 

Bob S


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Re: [ ANN ] Release 9.6.13 RC-1

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

You can also get it from the Check For Updates menu option of the Help menu in 
LC. 

Bob S


> On Jul 15, 2024, at 1:31 PM, matthias rebbe via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I found the link here
> https://livecode.com/account/products/livecode
> 
> and then in the dropdown menu in the second section where the RC builds are 
> listed.
> 
> See a screenshot here
> https://livecode.dermattes.de/images/9_6_13_rc1.jpg
> 
> Regards,
> Matthias
> 
> 
> 
>> Am 15.07.2024 um 21:18 schrieb Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
>> :
>> 
>> Panos wrote:
>> 
>>> We are pleased to announce the release of LiveCode 9.6.13 RC-1.
>> ...
>>> You can find the release in your LiveCode account area or get
>>> it via the automatic updater.
>> 
>> Thank you for the release. The Windows pasting issue is especially 
>> noteworthy, much appreciated.
>> 
>> I don't see 9.6.13 RC1 in my account or on the Downloads page. Will it 
>> appear in those soon, or is the in-app updater the only method now?
>> 
>> --
>> Richard Gaskin
>> FourthWorld.com
>> 
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Re: web/Happy 4th

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Merry FREEDOM FROM TYRANNY DAY! LOL!

Bob S


> On Jul 3, 2024, at 10:51 AM, Mike Kerner via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> HAPPY TREASON DAY!
> 
> On Wed, Jul 3, 2024 at 8:46 AM Curry Kenworthy via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> 
>> I've been wanting to say, with a slight delay...
>> Thanks for your comment - It's a great year for encouragement!
>> 
>> I hope everyone has a great week, and 4th!
>> 
>> Mark Smith:
>> 
>>> My goodness Curry, how beautifully said. Thanks for sharing
>>> your thoughts. It reminds me of a quote I saw recently, “Resilience
>>> is my superpower”. Wishing everyone all the best in 2024.
>> 
>> Me:
>> 
>>> What doesn’t kill us ... makes us awesome and mighty.
>>> Life requires that faith and perseverance. Here’s hoping for a
>>> great 2024 for all, whatever it holds, and an even BETTER 2025!
>> 
>> Best wishes,
>> 
>> Curry Kenworthy
>> 
>> Radically Innovative Christian LiveCode Development
>> "PASSION for Elegant, Efficient Code!"
>> https://livecodeconsulting.com/
>> 
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> 
> 
> -- 
> On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
> On the second day, God created the oceans.
> On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
>   and did a little diving.
> And God said, "This is good."
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Re: url no longer working as expected

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Did you try that in the message box? 

Bob S


> On Jun 28, 2024, at 10:50 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I get a response from Yahoos that is an html page with a 404 information as 
> part of it.
> 
> This happens under LC 9.6.12 and 9.6.11
> 
> I think this is Yahoo Finance not being able to detect the browser type and 
> intentionally returning a 404 as a method of deterring screen scraping.
> 
> 
> On 6/28/2024 1:04 PM, Hugh Senior via use-livecode wrote:
>> Platform: Windows 11, LC 9.6.12
>> Query: Using URL to access a web page
>> 
>> Problem:
>> Enter "https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/quote/SHEL.L/history/"; into any web
>> browser and the page is displayed as expected.
>> 
>> Use LC's URL command to access the same page direct returns a 404
>> put url "https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/quote/SHEL.L/history/";
>> 
>> Anyone got any insights?
>> 
>> Hugh Senior
>> 
>> 
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Re: url no longer working as expected

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I get the HTML of the page. Are you trying to open the page in a browser? 

Bob S


> On Jun 28, 2024, at 10:04 AM, Hugh Senior via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Platform: Windows 11, LC 9.6.12
> Query: Using URL to access a web page
> 
> Problem:
> Enter "https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/quote/SHEL.L/history/"; into any web
> browser and the page is displayed as expected.
> 
> Use LC's URL command to access the same page direct returns a 404
> put url "https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/quote/SHEL.L/history/";
> 
> Anyone got any insights?
> 
> Hugh Senior
> 
> 
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Re: Socket Packaging

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Added error checking. Also the payload can now be a string or an array. 

command packagePayload @pPayload, pUseEncryption
   try   
  if pPayload is an array then \
put arrayEncode(pPayload) into pPayload
  
  if pUseEncryption then \
put slyEncrypt(pPayload) into pPayload
  
  put base64Encode(pPayload) into pPayload
   catch tError
  return "ERROR:" && tError
   end try
end packagePayload

command unpackPayload @pPayload, pUseEncryption
   try
  put base64Decode(pPayload) into pPayload
  
  if pUseEncryption is true or pPayload begins with "salted" then \
put slyDecrypt(pPayload) into pPayload
  
  if pPayload is an array then \
put arrayDecode(pPayload) into pPayload
   catch tError
  return "ERROR:" && tError
   end try
end unpackPayload

Bob S


> On Jun 24, 2024, at 9:21 AM, Bob Sneidar  wrote:
> 
> Hi all. 
> 
> I came up with deceptively simple wrappers for packaging data for 
> transmission over raw sockets. I can’t send the slyEncrypt and slyDecrypt 
> handlers because I use methods no one else knows. But you can roll your own 
> or else eliminate encryption altogether. 
> 
> And to answer the question befor it’s asked, I don’t use SSL because I don’t 
> like having to deal with certificates, and also because I use a method for 
> encryption that I don’t think anyone else has thought of, or at least I can’t 
> find any info online. 
> 
> Bob S
> 
> command packagePayload @pPayload, pUseEncryption
>   if pPayload is an array then \
> put arrayEncode(pPayload) into pPayload
> 
>   if pUseEncryption then \
> put slyEncrypt(pPayload) into pPayload
> 
>   put base64Encode(pPayload) into pPayload
> end packagePayload
> 
> command unpackPayload @pPayload
>   put base64Decode(pPayload) into pPayload
> 
>   if pPayload begins with "salted" then \
> put slyDecrypt(pPayload) into pPayload
> 
>   try
>  put arrayDecode(pPayload) into tResult
>  put tResult into pPayload
>   catch tError
>  -- not an array
>   end try
> end unpackPayload
> 

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Re: Slow stack problem

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I love using red herring in conversations. Most people don’t know what that is, 
so they can’t contradict me! :-)

Bob S


On Jun 28, 2024, at 5:02 AM, Mark Waddingham via use-livecode 
 wrote:

so thinking this is regex related is a red-herring.

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Re: Planning upgrade to Mac OS Sonoma 14.5 – any issues with LiveCode 9.6.12 or LC 10 Create?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I think your instincts are correct. While letting your OS lag behind by 2 or 
more major versions is probably a bad practice, I don’t see any reason to just 
automatically update everytime it’s offered. But eventually Microsoft or Apple 
will make it, “compelling” as Mike Kerner put it. 

Bob S


> On Jun 27, 2024, at 5:10 AM, Martin Koob via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all
> 
> I am always a laggard when it comes to doing system upgrades. Long ago 
> traumas still linger I guess.  Anyway, it is usually between the Apple 
> Developer Conference iatn the beginning of summer and the release of the new 
> OS version in the fall when I get enough courage to go for it and upgrade to 
> the current macOS.
> 
> So, as the subject said are there any issues with LiveCode 9.6.12 or LC 10 
> Create that should give me pause or should I take the plunge?
> 
> Martin Koob

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Re: eMail attachment: best practice?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

You would need to present the user with an interface where they can enter their 
corporate or business SMTP information, then use that. But more mail providers 
are forcing MFA these days (as I mentioned) and Microsoft has even gone so far 
as to completely disable ALL SMTP relaying when Modern Security is enabled, and 
are progressively enforcing Modern Security permanently. Mail Clients that 
communicate with Office365 do not use SMTP, they use MAPI so they are not 
effected. 

The only thing I can suggest is to subscribe to a web based SMTP relay. Bundle 
the cost of that (which isn’t very much) into the price of your product. 

Bob S


> On Jun 26, 2024, at 6:00 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> So this tsNet example for sending an email look great IF you are using it in 
> an corporate or institutional setting. One where you have a known SMTP server 
> and you know whether or not that SMTP server requires authentication.
> 
> However, in the "wild" of a distributed application that could be on any 
> customer's computer in any setting, how do you know what the customer's SMTP 
> server is or whether it requires authentication. If it does require 
> authentication, most people set this up in their email client ONCE (or 
> rarely) and may not know or remember what the credentials are.
> 
> So I considered using our company SMTP server, but increasingly, SMTP servers 
> will reject messages if they are from a client computer that is not in the 
> same domain, as is the case with ours (for anti-spamming/spoofing), so that 
> it out as an option.
> 
> I kinda need a solution that uses the clients own email client (and server). 
> Maybe I should look at how to encode the array in a pure text form that can 
> be part of the email body and send it that way. The problem there is that 
> some email clients (like gMail) limit the size of the message body that can 
> be generated from their APIs. If you use revMail with someone with gMail as 
> their default mail, the message body can only be about 2500 characters (or 
> maybe 5000, I forget the exact limit).
> 
> I suppose I could output the array as an encoded file to the customer's 
> desktop and ASK them to manually attach it to the generated email? I wish 
> there was a better option.
> 
> 
> On 6/25/2024 6:15 PM, matthias rebbe via use-livecode wrote:
>> Instead of using revMail which opens the default mail client app you could 
>> use tsNET external, which is availlable  for Win/Mac/Linux/iOS and Android.
>> 
>> The only thing you have to keep in mind is that tsNet directly sends the 
>> email instead of opening the default email client.
>> 
>> Here you can find an sample stack
>> https://downloads.techstrategies.com.au/tsnet/smtpexample.livecode
>> 
>> And here is a link to a Livecode Lesson
>> https://lessons.livecode.com/m/4071/l/685661-how-to-send-e-mail-using-the-tsnet-external
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> Am 25.06.2024 um 22:35 schrieb Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>> :
>>> 
>>> Under a specific condition, my app creates an email with some pre-populated 
>>> information using revMail:
>>> 
>>> revMail address, [ccAddress, [mailSubject, [messageBody]]]
>>> 
>>> So, my call is: revMail tSupportEmail, , "Diagnostic Report Information", 
>>> tEmailBody
>>> Where tSupportEmail contains a valid email address and tEmailBody contain 
>>> the information I want to send.
>>> 
>>> I realize the user still has to click their send button in their email 
>>> client, but I have 2 questions:
>>> 
>>> 1) I see the Dictionary still lists "revMailUnicode" with the same 
>>> parameters. If tEmailBody contains Unicode characters do I need to 
>>> textEncode(tEmailBody, "UTF-16") and use revMailUnicode OR is plain old 
>>> revMail now Unicode aware
>>> 
>>> 2) My more important question is how does one create an email with an 
>>> attached file? I see no feature of revMail to include an attachment. Is 
>>> there some other way? If there is no way to add an attachment, what might 
>>> the best practice for sending the contents and structure of a Livecode 
>>> array be?
>>> 
>>> 
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Re: eMail attachment: best practice?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I used a properly formatted “url” (it’s not actually a URL) for the server and 
got a response from the server, so I am communicating, but it’s generating an 
error even though the user name and password are correct (They are my 
credentials.) 

Also, considering that almost all servers are forcing the use of 2 factor or 
Multi-factor authentication these days, it’s probably just better to use the 
local mail client. 

Bob S


> On Jun 25, 2024, at 3:53 PM, Bob Sneidar  wrote:
> 
> The demo stack URL in the script does not look right. I have never used a URL 
> in the form of SMTP://:587/ before. That can’t be right! 
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
>> On Jun 25, 2024, at 3:15 PM, matthias rebbe via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Instead of using revMail which opens the default mail client app you could 
>> use tsNET external, which is availlable  for Win/Mac/Linux/iOS and Android.
>> 
>> The only thing you have to keep in mind is that tsNet directly sends the 
>> email instead of opening the default email client.
>> 
>> Here you can find an sample stack
>> https://downloads.techstrategies.com.au/tsnet/smtpexample.livecode
>> 
>> And here is a link to a Livecode Lesson
>> https://lessons.livecode.com/m/4071/l/685661-how-to-send-e-mail-using-the-tsnet-external
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> Am 25.06.2024 um 22:35 schrieb Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>> :
>>> 
>>> Under a specific condition, my app creates an email with some pre-populated 
>>> information using revMail:
>>> 
>>> revMail address, [ccAddress, [mailSubject, [messageBody]]]
>>> 
>>> So, my call is: revMail tSupportEmail, , "Diagnostic Report Information", 
>>> tEmailBody
>>> Where tSupportEmail contains a valid email address and tEmailBody contain 
>>> the information I want to send.
>>> 
>>> I realize the user still has to click their send button in their email 
>>> client, but I have 2 questions:
>>> 
>>> 1) I see the Dictionary still lists "revMailUnicode" with the same 
>>> parameters. If tEmailBody contains Unicode characters do I need to 
>>> textEncode(tEmailBody, "UTF-16") and use revMailUnicode OR is plain old 
>>> revMail now Unicode aware
>>> 
>>> 2) My more important question is how does one create an email with an 
>>> attached file? I see no feature of revMail to include an attachment. Is 
>>> there some other way? If there is no way to add an attachment, what might 
>>> the best practice for sending the contents and structure of a Livecode 
>>> array be?
>>> 
>>> 
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Re: eMail attachment: best practice?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

The demo stack URL in the script does not look right. I have never used a URL 
in the form of SMTP://:587/ before. That can’t be right! 

Bob S


> On Jun 25, 2024, at 3:15 PM, matthias rebbe via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Instead of using revMail which opens the default mail client app you could 
> use tsNET external, which is availlable  for Win/Mac/Linux/iOS and Android.
> 
> The only thing you have to keep in mind is that tsNet directly sends the 
> email instead of opening the default email client.
> 
> Here you can find an sample stack
> https://downloads.techstrategies.com.au/tsnet/smtpexample.livecode
> 
> And here is a link to a Livecode Lesson
> https://lessons.livecode.com/m/4071/l/685661-how-to-send-e-mail-using-the-tsnet-external
> 
> 
> 
>> Am 25.06.2024 um 22:35 schrieb Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>> :
>> 
>> Under a specific condition, my app creates an email with some pre-populated 
>> information using revMail:
>> 
>> revMail address, [ccAddress, [mailSubject, [messageBody]]]
>> 
>> So, my call is: revMail tSupportEmail, , "Diagnostic Report Information", 
>> tEmailBody
>> Where tSupportEmail contains a valid email address and tEmailBody contain 
>> the information I want to send.
>> 
>> I realize the user still has to click their send button in their email 
>> client, but I have 2 questions:
>> 
>> 1) I see the Dictionary still lists "revMailUnicode" with the same 
>> parameters. If tEmailBody contains Unicode characters do I need to 
>> textEncode(tEmailBody, "UTF-16") and use revMailUnicode OR is plain old 
>> revMail now Unicode aware
>> 
>> 2) My more important question is how does one create an email with an 
>> attached file? I see no feature of revMail to include an attachment. Is 
>> there some other way? If there is no way to add an attachment, what might 
>> the best practice for sending the contents and structure of a Livecode array 
>> be?
>> 
>> 
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Socket Packaging

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi all. 

I came up with deceptively simple wrappers for packaging data for transmission 
over raw sockets. I can’t send the slyEncrypt and slyDecrypt handlers because I 
use methods no one else knows. But you can roll your own or else eliminate 
encryption altogether. 

And to answer the question befor it’s asked, I don’t use SSL because I don’t 
like having to deal with certificates, and also because I use a method for 
encryption that I don’t think anyone else has thought of, or at least I can’t 
find any info online. 

Bob S

command packagePayload @pPayload, pUseEncryption
   if pPayload is an array then \
 put arrayEncode(pPayload) into pPayload
   
   if pUseEncryption then \
 put slyEncrypt(pPayload) into pPayload
   
   put base64Encode(pPayload) into pPayload
end packagePayload

command unpackPayload @pPayload
   put base64Decode(pPayload) into pPayload
   
   if pPayload begins with "salted" then \
 put slyDecrypt(pPayload) into pPayload
   
   try
  put arrayDecode(pPayload) into tResult
  put tResult into pPayload
   catch tError
  -- not an array
   end try
end unpackPayload

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Re: Windows SE how to clone while dragging

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Right you are. I would have sworn I tried that! 

Bob S


> On Jun 23, 2024, at 2:36 AM, Curry Kenworthy via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Bob:
> 
> > On the MacOS LC SE, I can hold the optionKey down while dragging
> > some selected text and it will clone the selection ...
> 
> > Windows SE ... Is there a key combo for cloning?
> 
> Ctrl.
> 
> Best wishes,
> 
> Curry Kenworthy
> 
> Radically Innovative Christian LiveCode Development
> "PASSION for Elegant, Efficient Code!"
> https://livecodeconsulting.com/


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Windows SE how to clone while dragging

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

On the MacOS LC SE, I can hold the optionKey down while dragging some selected 
text and it will clone the selection rather than just move it. For some reason, 
in LC for Windows SE, it still only moves the selected text. Bummer! Is there a 
key combo for cloning? If not, WHY?

Bob S


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Re: Pop Combo Menu

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

BUUUTTT… It looks like that detaches the menu from the button so any subsequent 
click on the actual menu button displays the button as a popup menu. 

Bob S


> On Jun 12, 2024, at 1:25 PM, Bob Sneidar  wrote:
> 
> Hmmm looks like I can use popup button  and provide a location. 
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
>> On Jun 12, 2024, at 1:23 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks I was hoping I could do it without a click. Something like pop menu 
>> . There is a popup menu command but I think that only works with 
>> popup menus. 
>> 
>> Bob S
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jun 12, 2024, at 1:01 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> On 6/12/2024 3:01 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode wrote:
>>>> *click*at(rightofbtn1- 5,topofbtn1+ 5)
>>> 
>>> Sorry that line of code is: (paste of formatted text messed it up)
>>> 
>>> click at (right of btn 1 - 5,top of btn 1 + 5)
>>> 
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>> 
>> 
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Re: Pop Combo Menu

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hmmm looks like I can use popup button  and provide a location. 

Bob S


> On Jun 12, 2024, at 1:23 PM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Thanks I was hoping I could do it without a click. Something like pop menu 
> . There is a popup menu command but I think that only works with 
> popup menus. 
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
>> On Jun 12, 2024, at 1:01 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> On 6/12/2024 3:01 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode wrote:
>>> *click*at(rightofbtn1- 5,topofbtn1+ 5)
>> 
>> Sorry that line of code is: (paste of formatted text messed it up)
>> 
>> click at (right of btn 1 - 5,top of btn 1 + 5)
>> 
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Re: Pop Combo Menu

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Thanks I was hoping I could do it without a click. Something like pop menu 
. There is a popup menu command but I think that only works with 
popup menus. 

Bob S


> On Jun 12, 2024, at 1:01 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> On 6/12/2024 3:01 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode wrote:
>> *click*at(rightofbtn1- 5,topofbtn1+ 5)
> 
> Sorry that line of code is: (paste of formatted text messed it up)
> 
> click at (right of btn 1 - 5,top of btn 1 + 5)
> 
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Pop Combo Menu

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi all. I have a Combo Menu button. I want to have it “pop” open and show the 
options via script, but I cannot find a command to do that. 

Bob S

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Re: Mosquitto library.

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi Richard. 

This email thread now has me curious. If I have an app that starts listening on 
a port, does that server port have a timeout associated with it that needs 
refreshing, or does the timeout only exist when a client connects? I have 
always assumed the latter. 

Bob S


> On Jun 12, 2024, at 10:26 AM, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Mike Kerner wrote:
> 
>> Richard wrote:
>>> Either way, I'd imagine a subscribe client looking to avoid polling
>>> is going to depend on a long-lived socket, no?
>> 
>> That's part of the point of a websocket. you don't have to keep
>> reopening it, and both ends can use it, as needed.
> 
> Exactly, websockets are useful in browser apps because browsers don't offer 
> direct socket support.
> 
> LiveCode makes OS-native apps and supports sockets.
> 
> The socketTimeoutInterval lets us set how long they live.
> 
> What am I missing?
> 
> --
> Richard Gaskin
> FourthWorld.com
> 
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Date Words

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi all. 

Did you ever want to use phrases like yesterday, last tuesday or next friday in 
a date field? 

function dateWords pDate
   if word 1 of pDate is not among the items of 
"last,next,yesterday,today,tomorrow" then \
 return empty
   
   put date() into tCurrentDate
   convert tCurrentDate to dateItems
   
   if the number of words of pDate = 2 then
  put "sunday,monday,tuesday,wednesday,thursday,friday,saturday" into 
tDaysOfWeek
  put itemOffset(word 2 of pDate, tDaysOfWeek) into tDayNumber
  put item 7 of tCurrentDate into tThisDayNumber
  
  if tDayNumber = 0 then \
return empty
   end if
   
   switch
  case word 1 of pDate is "last"
 if tDayNumber >= tThisDayNumber then \
   subtract 7 from item 3 of tCurrentDate
 add (tDayNumber - tThisDayNumber) to item 3 of tCurrentDate
 break
  case word 1 of pDate is "next"
 add 7-tDayNumber to item 3 of tCurrentDate
 break
  case pDate is "yesterday"
 subtract 1 from item 3 of tCurrentDate
 break
  case pDate is "today"
 -- don't do anything
 break
  case pDate is "tomorrow"
 add 1 to item 3 of tCurrentDate
 break
   end switch
   
   put formatDate(tCurrentDate, "standard") into pDate
   return pDate
end dateWords

FUNCTION formatDate theDate, theFormat
   /*
   Accepts any valid date for the first parameter. If not a valid date, it 
simply returns
   what was passed. Second parameter can be any of the following:
   sql date: date in the -mm-dd format
   short date, abbreviated date, internet date, long date: LC versions of the 
same
   julian date: Julian number based on (I believe) Jacques formula
   standard date: The date in the form of "mm/dd/"
   */
   
   put theDate into tSavedDate
   put the itemdelimiter into theOldDelim
   set the itemdelimiter to "-"
   
   IF the length of item 1 of theDate = 4 AND \
 the number of items of theDate = 3 AND \
 item 1 of theDate is a number AND \
 item 2 of theDate is a number AND \
 item 3 of theDate is a number THEN
  put item 2 of theDate & "/" & \
item 3 of theDate & "/" & \
item 1 of theDate into theDate
   END IF
   
   -- replace "." with "/" in theDate
   convert theDate to dateitems
   set the itemdelimiter to theOldDelim
   
   --   if the number of items of theDate <> 7 then
   --  answer "'" & theDate & "' is not a valid date format!"
   --  return tSavedDate
   --   end if
   
   SWITCH word 1 of theFormat
  CASE "sql"
 /*
 put item 1 of theDate & "-" & \
   format("%02d",item 2 of theDate) & "-" & \
   format("%02d",item 3 of theDate) into theDate
 */
 put format("%s-%02d-%02d", item 1 of theDate, item 2 of theDate, \
   item 3 of theDate) into theDate
 break
  CASE "short"
 convert theDate from dateitems to short date
 break
  CASE "abbreviated"
 convert theDate from dateitems to abbreviated date
 break
  CASE "abbr"
 convert theDate from dateitems to abbreviated date
 break
  CASE "internet"
 convert theDate from dateitems to internet date
 break
  CASE "long"
 convert theDate from dateitems to long date
 break
  CASE "julian"
 put the date into theDate
 convert theDate to dateItems
 IF  ((item 2 of theDate = 1) OR (item 2 of theDate = 2)) THEN
put 1 into theDay
 ELSE
put 0 into theDay
 END IF
 put item 1 of theDate + 4800 - theDay into theYear
 put item 2 of theDate + (12 * theDay) - 3 into theMonth
 put item 3 of theDate + \
   ((153 * theMonth + 2) div 5) + \
   (365 * theYear) + \
   (theYear div 4) - \
   (theYear div 100) + \
   (theYear div 400) - \
   32045 into theDate
 break
  case "standard"
 put format("%02d/%02d/%04d", item 2 of theDate, item 3 of theDate, \
   item 1 of theDate) into theDate
 break
  default 
 -- answer info "'" & theFormat & "' is not a valid parameter." 
As sheet
 put tSavedDate into theDate
   END SWITCH
   
   return theDate
END formatDate

Bob S
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Re: Mosquitto library.

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

No, and Yes. ;-)

Bob S


On Jun 8, 2024, at 6:11 PM, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
 wrote:

* if we get websockets working, that will be another way to make this work.

Do we need websockets on this?  XMPP, for example, runs over regular sockets.

Either way, I'd imagine a subscribe client looking to avoid polling is going to 
depend on a long-lived socket, no?


Richard Gaskin
FourthWorld.com

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Re: Hierarchical submenus in option menu buttons

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

You are correct. Essentially, any menu that offers a list of strings to display 
on the menu button itself cannot use submenus. It makes sense really. I’ve 
never seen an option menu in any other application that allows a submenu 
choice. 

Bob S


> On May 31, 2024, at 6:23 AM, Craig Newman via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi.
> 
> I believe that only pullDown and popUp menu styles can support submenus. 
> Combo boxes and Option menus styles do not.
> 
> Craig
> 
>> On May 31, 2024, at 5:32 AM, jbv via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi list,
>> 
>> I am trying to create a hierarchical submenu in an option menu button
>> with LC 9.6.
>> I have found this solution that seems to work only with pulldown buttons :
>> https://use-livecode.runrev.narkive.com/cBfAjix2/cascading-menu
>> 
>> I also found this LC lesson that suggests to use polylists :
>> https://livecode.com/using-polylist-to-create-dropdown-menus/
>> But that seems way too sophisticated for a simple submenu.
>> 
>> Any idea ?
>> Thank you in advance.
>> 
>> jbv
>> 
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Re: Groups id #

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

As I said, the last ID is going to be the stack ID -1. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 25, 2024, at 16:55, Bob Sneidar  wrote:
> 
> sounds logical, but I'm not sure, maybe you could store the ID of the last 
> group somewhere.

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Re: Groups id #

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

IDs are assigned according to the stack ID which increments by 1 every time an 
object is created. So yes, the stack ID is like an auto increment column in 
SQL. It assures that no two objects get the same ID, and the last object 
created is the highest ID in the stack. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 25, 2024, at 07:50, Klaus major-k via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi jbv,
> 
>> Am 25.05.2024 um 16:20 schrieb jbv via use-livecode 
>> :
>> 
>> Hi list,
>> 
>> I have a script that creates groups on the fly
>> with the command "group". These groups contain
>> various flds and imgs.
>> Can I always assume that the group with the highest
>> id # is the last one created ?
> 
> sounds logical, but I'm not sure, maybe you could store the ID of the last 
> group somewhere.
> Use IT right after the groupd command:
> ...
> select this_and_that
> group
> put IT into the_id_of_just_created_group
> ...
> 
>> Thanks,
>> jbv
> 
> Best
> 
> Klaus
> 
> --
> Klaus Major
> https://www.major-k.de
> https://www.major-k.de/bass
> kl...@major-k.de
> 
> 
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Place Phone Call MacOS

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi all. 

With MacOS connected to my iPhone, I can place a phone call and use my computer 
speaker and Mic. I would like to create a button in my app to do that, but I 
cannot find any infor on how to craft a URL to do that. There probably is no 
URL type for that anyway. 

Is there any way I can do that? 

Bob S


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Re: Strange syntax in new widgets!?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Yes I was very surprised when first working with widgets how limited their list 
of commands and properties are. The only widget I use is the segmented control, 
and only then because the tab panel looks godaweful ugly in Windows, and I can 
maintain visual constancy using the segmented control. Well, also because I’m 
too lazy to implement any of the others just yet.

Don’t get me wrong, there are some great widgets. But trying to replicate the 
functionality of datagrids, yeah not so much.

Bob S


On May 21, 2024, at 8:27 AM, Klaus major-k via use-livecode 
 wrote:

It appears to me that the new widgets have been created by someone who has no
or very little knowledge of LC.

We have:
...
delete line 2 of fld 1
...
dispatch "DeleteLine" to group "DataGrid" with 2
...

So why not create a more or less similar syntax for new widgets, so we don't 
have
to use the dictionary for similar tasks. I don't get it...


Best

Klaus

--
Klaus Major
https://www.major-k.de
https://www.major-k.de/bass
kl...@major-k.de

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Re: Return Total of a Given Repeated Number in a List

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Actually:

put tList into tTest — so you don’t lose the original contents of tList
filter items of tTest with 2
put the number of items of tTest

Bob S


> On May 24, 2024, at 8:23 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Filter items of tList with 2;put the number of items of tList
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
>> On May 23, 2024, at 7:07 PM, Roger Guay via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> Please, what’s the easiest way to return the total number of a given 
>> repeated number in a list of numbers? IOW, how many times is 2 repeated in a 
>> list containing 1,2,3,2,4,2,5,2,8 etc. Appreciate your help.
>> 
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Roger

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Re: Return Total of a Given Repeated Number in a List

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Filter items of tList with 2;put the number of items of tList

Bob S


> On May 23, 2024, at 7:07 PM, Roger Guay via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Please, what’s the easiest way to return the total number of a given repeated 
> number in a list of numbers? IOW, how many times is 2 repeated in a list 
> containing 1,2,3,2,4,2,5,2,8 etc. Appreciate your help.
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Roger
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Re: somehow OT, but somehow not - no price information anymore on Livecode website

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I agree. I have a long standing issue with companies that want me to give them 
email, phone and sometimes address in order to get a quote. In the case of your 
friend, he doesn’t know the company, and does not know he can trust them. How 
can he tell, he may just end up on a thousand other mailing lists. 

Bob S


> On May 23, 2024, at 8:29 AM, matthias rebbe via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> today I wanted to show a friend, who is interested in using Livecode, the 
> different subscription plans  and their prices. 
> But to my surprise, prices are no longer displayed on the website. The 
> interested customers have to request a quote.
> 
> I am not sure what to think about this. Was this announced?
> Or can the prices be viewed somewhere else?
> 
> In any case, my friend doesn't want to give his data to Livecode Ltd. in 
> advance just to get price information. 
> 
> What do you think?
> 
> Regards,
> Matthias

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Re: Strange syntax in new widgets!?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I find a lot of the widget properties less than useful. Try setting the widths 
of all the tabs of a segmented control to a specified width based upon the 
total width of the widget.

Bob S


On May 21, 2024, at 7:48 AM, Klaus major-k via use-livecode 
 wrote:

Hi firends,

this came up in the LC forum: How can I delete a line in a PolyGrid?

"deleteline" or something did not work, so I searched the dictionary
and found that one needs to set a PROPERTY to do so:
...
put 2 into tLine
set the pgDeleteRow of widget "PolyGrid" to tLine
...
Very intuitive in my opinion. NOT!

Am I the only one who find this rather ridiculous? 8-)
Come on Livecode, you can do better!



Best

Klaus

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Re: Saving data in standalone

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Including datagrids? I have a save and restore method for Datagrids, but I 
don’t think I back up ALL the properties, just the critical ones.

Bob S


On May 20, 2024, at 5:58 PM, Tom Glod via use-livecode 
 wrote:

I have a plugin that is not complete which can save livecode groups and all
of their properties, custom properties and scripts.  If you'd like I'll
send you some of the code. PM me.
Should be super easy to find the code u need, and then inverse it.
If you did that it would help me complete the plugin and I could release it.

On Thu, May 16, 2024 at 8:05 PM Mike Kerner via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

this is also how levure operates, so if you build with levure, you can just
do this with stacks in the project

On Thu, May 16, 2024 at 5:08 PM Paul Dupuis via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

You can save external stacks or created on the fly stacks where ever you
have *write* (and read) permission on your OS.

Increasingly, whether macOS or Windows, that is not the Applications
(macOS) or Program Files/Program Files (x86) (Windows) folders. I find
the SAFEST place to save something is using
specialFolderPath("documents") and then create a folder structure for
your company or app in the user's Documents folder. OSes are becoming
more and more "sandboxed" to prevent malware and dumb user mistakes from
wrecking apps or the OS itself.

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Re: UPDATE: filterArray()

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Yes but what you may not see is that if a memory database already exists and 
you pass the id it will check for it’s existence, so then all it does is 
replace the table (if it exists) with the name you pass with a new table 
containing that parsed array. There may be other tables in the memory database, 
and those are not touched, so theoretically I could pass multiple arrays with 
different table names, then execute complex queries on those.

In this discussion I can see that there are changes I could make to improve 
it’s efficiency. I should break out the different operations, like creating the 
table, querying the database and returning an array as separate functions.

The main reason I created this function was because I assumed memory databases 
would be considerably faster than file based ones, or network based over slow 
network infrastructures, as well as eliminating the need to create separate 
handlers for each use case.

Bob S


On May 20, 2024, at 12:36 PM, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
 wrote:

I guess the main advantage for using filterArray() is that using the
LC parser, for each use case would require it’s own code. filterArray()
is a one-stop-shop approach. For instance, if you need to compare data
with another dataset (as in an SQL join) or finding the maximum value
in a dataset, or limiting your results.

Somewhat. If I read your code correctly, it create a single table from the 
array, limiting the depth of the array and thereby obviating the complexities 
inherent in operations across multiple tables.

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