Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
Bernd wrote: >>From the dictionary p 59 > > Maximum length of a LINE in a field: > > 65,536 characters storage > No more than 32,786 pixels wide for display I had thought there had been some work on that in recent years, but I dug up the bug report and it seems it's been "hibernated": https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10465 -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 3:42 AM Niggemann, Bernd via use-livecode < use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote: > From the dictionary p 59 > > > Maximum length of a LINE in a field: > > 65,536 characters storage > No more than 32,786 pixels wide for display > > Kind regards > Bernd > I guess I should have just checked the dictionary :-) So whether you use a DataGrid or simply a field, if the data you want to display exceeds a certain width, you're going to have to do some work to virtualize the display. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
>From the dictionary p 59
Maximum length of a LINE in a field:
65,536 characters storage
No more than 32,786 pixels wide for display
Kind regards
Bernd
From: Geoff Canyon
I just checked, and (LC 8 on a Mac) indeed fields fail beyond a certain
width/character limit/???
This:
on mouseUp
repeat with i = 1 to 1
put char -10 to -1 of ("aa" & i & " ") after x
end repeat
put x into fld 1
end mouseUp
results in a field that scrolls right only until it displays about "aa294
aa295 aa296 aa2" So, something like 3,000 characters wide.
Again, something that could be worked around, but basically whether it's a
field or the DG, some sort of virtualized display seems necessary.
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Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
I just checked, and (LC 8 on a Mac) indeed fields fail beyond a certain
width/character limit/???
This:
on mouseUp
repeat with i = 1 to 1
put char -10 to -1 of ("aa" & i & " ") after x
end repeat
put x into fld 1
end mouseUp
results in a field that scrolls right only until it displays about "aa294
aa295 aa296 aa2" So, something like 3,000 characters wide.
Again, something that could be worked around, but basically whether it's a
field or the DG, some sort of virtualized display seems necessary.
On Tue, Nov 27, 2018 at 5:31 PM Geoff Canyon wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 26, 2018 at 3:08 PM Richard Gaskin via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>
>> Try the field object.
>>
>
> Not that this couldn't be worked around, but isn't a field limited in the
> width of what it can display? i.e. put a single line 100,000 characters
> long into an un-wrapped field, and the field fails in some way.
>
> gc
>
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Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
dunbarxx wrote: > What really needs to happen is that the DG or table field visual > display is loaded under script control. So the idea of jumping from > a display of columns 1-10 over to 6000-6010 is managed live, using > the scrollbarDrag message as the thumb is moved. Yes, that's exactly what I was referring to a couple days ago when I wrote: "Grab the DG code and enhance it. The virtualization method used for vscroll could be adapted for hscroll." http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-livecode/2018-November/251675.html -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
On Mon, Nov 26, 2018 at 3:08 PM Richard Gaskin via use-livecode < use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote: > Try the field object. > Not that this couldn't be worked around, but isn't a field limited in the width of what it can display? i.e. put a single line 100,000 characters long into an un-wrapped field, and the field fails in some way. gc ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Limit on pixles in a group [ was: Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?]
On 27/11/2018 18:34, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote: The existing field object does a fine job buffering for smooth scrolling of just about any text of practical length. Logically, the limit of field contents is about 4GB (UINT4), but in practical terms other memory needs may not allow quite that much. FWIW I've loaded the Bible into a field and it scroll quite nicely, much more smoothly than Microsoft Word's paging scroll. Yes, a scrolling field is fine. But if you wanted to have a field (no scroll bar) and other controls overlaid (or beside) the field and have the whole thing scroll (as a group), then you could run into the pixel limitation. Wouldn't you ? Or maybe I'm missing something. > And if we were to consider non-European languages, maybe that would > apply horizontally as well ?? What non-European languages have no line wrapping? How do such languages display anything on any electronic or printed surface? I didn't say "no line wrapping". There are (I think) languages which can be written vertically (e.g. Japanese, Korean), and in this case you get a series of vertical lines - and a series of those vertical lines placed adjacent to each other, requiring horizontal scroll to get through the document (i.e. a complete transposition of English). So the pixel limit night then be relevant for horizontal, just as it is for vertical. But as you say - so long as you stick to scrolling the field, not putting an unscrolled field into a scrolled group, you won't hit the group pixel limit anyway. And - since I can barely spell Unicode, far less understand all the implications - I'll go back to being quiet now :-) Alex. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
What really needs to happen is that the DG or table field visual display is loaded under script control. So the idea of jumping from a display of columns 1-10 over to 6000-6010 is managed live, using the scrollbarDrag message as the thumb is moved. What the user sees during that process is a matter of style. This would be a useful tool; it would effectively obviate the limits we have been discussing. Craig -- Sent from: http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Limit on pixles in a group [ was: Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?]
Alex Tweedly wrote: > On 25/11/2018 23:04, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote: >> >> This limitation may have been eliminated, or close to eliminated, >> with the field object. And now that fields have column-independent >> alignment, it's rare that there's ever a need to replace that one >> object with a thousand-object DataGrid for simple list views. >> >> The DataGrid is bound to a limitation within LC for group contents: >> the formattedWidth and formattedHeight of a group cannot exceed 32765 >> px. Attempting to go beyond that flips the signed bit internally and >> objects will be rendered incorrectly. >> >> I suppose it might be nice to see that extended, but in practice do we >> really need it? How big should a group meaningfully be? >> >> 32,765 px is about 30 feet in size. That's a lot to ask a user to >> scroll through, not to mention being a lot to ask LC to buffer so it >> can handle the scroll efficiently. > > H - 32765 pixels at 227 dpi is "only" about 12 feet :-) > Still too much - except If LC is rendering such high resolution so small, that would be a bug, and a clear indicator that resolution independence would need to be ported from the mobile engine to the desktop engine if it hasn't been already. > While it might be too much for horizontal scrolling, it's not so clear > for vertical scrolling. Twelve feet is about 13 pages vertically of > A4/letter paper; so if I had a document that (for its own reasons) was > in continuous format rather than paginated, I might well want to have > it all in a single group. I probably wouldn't want to scroll through > it - but I might want to have some method of (say) going directy to a > specified chapter or verse - and then see it in its continuous > context. The existing field object does a fine job buffering for smooth scrolling of just about any text of practical length. Logically, the limit of field contents is about 4GB (UINT4), but in practical terms other memory needs may not allow quite that much. FWIW I've loaded the Bible into a field and it scroll quite nicely, much more smoothly than Microsoft Word's paging scroll. > And if we were to consider non-European languages, maybe that would > apply horizontally as well ?? What non-European languages have no line wrapping? How do such languages display anything on any electronic or printed surface? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Limit on pixles in a group [ was: Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?]
On 25/11/2018 23:04, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote: This limitation may have been eliminated, or close to eliminated, with the field object. And now that fields have column-independent alignment, it's rare that there's ever a need to replace that one object with a thousand-object DataGrid for simple list views. The DataGrid is bound to a limitation within LC for group contents: the formattedWidth and formattedHeight of a group cannot exceed 32765 px. Attempting to go beyond that flips the signed bit internally and objects will be rendered incorrectly. I suppose it might be nice to see that extended, but in practice do we really need it? How big should a group meaningfully be? 32,765 px is about 30 feet in size. That's a lot to ask a user to scroll through, not to mention being a lot to ask LC to buffer so it can handle the scroll efficiently. H - 32765 pixels at 227 dpi is "only" about 12 feet :-) Still too much - except While it might be too much for horizontal scrolling, it's not so clear for vertical scrolling. Twelve feet is about 13 pages vertically of A4/letter paper; so if I had a document that (for its own reasons) was in continuous format rather than paginated, I might well want to have it all in a single group. I probably wouldn't want to scroll through it - but I might want to have some method of (say) going directy to a specified chapter or verse - and then see it in its continuous context. And if we were to consider non-European languages, maybe that would apply horizontally as well ?? Alex. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
correction set the dgtext. Stupid spell correct. Bob S > On Nov 26, 2018, at 16:06 , Bob Sneidar via use-livecode > wrote: > > Also, I was concerned because I didn't just fail to set the detect ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
That makes sense. Anyone working with this much data should probably build in their own limits into the data they put into the grid. I know I will. Bob S > On Nov 26, 2018, at 15:17 , hh via use-livecode > wrote: > > The limit of LC is not the sky but the 65535-limit > for coordinates of every object. > A line width can't be longer than 65535 pixels. > And if you have columns with a width of 11 pixels > each, then the right of column 5958 is 65538 what > is "off-limits". ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
I read it. :-) My original question was simply, how many columns can a datagrid have? In other words is there a limit? The reason it mattered to me at the time was because I was importing a csv file with a lot of columns and it was easier for me to set the dgProp ["columns"] to the first line of the file, and the dgText [true] to the whole file. Down and dirty, no looping to grab just the pertinent data. The problem was that one of the file formats exported by the copier had way too many columns, so if I was going to use that file, I was going to have to preprocess the file. Also, I was concerned because I didn't just fail to set the detect, I KILLED the datagrid object and had to delete it and create a new one. That could present a problem for anyone trying the same thing in an app in the future. Think importing complex spreadsheets. Now I've decided not to use that file, but another one I can get from the copier and that is far less granular. I don't even need to use a datagrid, but it happens to be a really handy way to convert a csv file to an array without having to write my own code to do it. :-) Plus, I can show the end user something to indicate that I have the data, and allow them to peruse it and even get stats for a particular selected row. I did not intend for this thread to become a debate on how datagrids should work. I love the fact that we even have them! Just to be clear how fundamental I think a real table object is, where row and column data can be referenced like a spreadsheet, the only reason I have gon on to develop in Livecode is due almost exclusively to the datagrid. Bob S > On Nov 26, 2018, at 15:04 , Richard Gaskin via use-livecode > wrote: > > Few read what I write here, so this will likely be as lost as the last time I > addressed this a couple days ago. But I'm just OCD enough to keep trying, so > here goes: > > > A field is a single control. > > A DataGrid is many hundreds of countrols, many of which are fields. > > The DG is a good option where you need the unprecedented flexibility it > provides with form layouts. > > For everything else using a single control, the engine-native field object, > will outperform because all the processing needed to render the contents > happens in highly-optimized machine-compiled C++. > > Try the field object. > > Really. > > I don't keep writing this to mislead. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
The limit of LC is not the sky but the 65535-limit for coordinates of every object. A line width can't be longer than 65535 pixels. And if you have columns with a width of 11 pixels each, then the right of column 5958 is 65538 what is "off-limits". ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
Dunbarxx wrote: > It is certainly possible that one might need an enormous DG or table > field. > It never happens that one must view such a beast all at once, or even > a large part of it; that is not the issue. The point is that one > cannot have such a control at all, and that seems unfair. Don't settle for unfair. Grab the DG code and enhance it. The virtualization method used for vscroll could be adapted for hscroll. > If one is looking at the first ten columns, and it is desired to jump > over to columns 6000-6010, well, you cannot. I wouldn't ask a user to scroll 30 feet. I'd rethink the design. > Surely the dataSet can be stored in a field or custom property, and > loaded as needed, but that requires a significant amount of pre- > processing. The whole point of DG's and tableFields is that they can > be navigated with virtually unconscious well-worn user actions. Few read what I write here, so this will likely be as lost as the last time I addressed this a couple days ago. But I'm just OCD enough to keep trying, so here goes: A field is a single control. A DataGrid is many hundreds of countrols, many of which are fields. The DG is a good option where you need the unprecedented flexibility it provides with form layouts. For everything else using a single control, the engine-native field object, will outperform because all the processing needed to render the contents happens in highly-optimized machine-compiled C++. Try the field object. Really. I don't keep writing this to mislead. > The limit may be intrinsic. It at least should be published. Perhaps it should. I believe the 65,535px limit for group contents is documented, and since a DG is a collection of groups it applies there. If you feel we should replicate limits of groups in the discussion of the DG I would have no problem with you submitting a pull request for that. Where would be the appropriate place for that addition, Dict, Lessons, or User Guide? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
All: It is certainly possible that one might need an enormous DG or table field. It never happens that one must view such a beast all at once, or even a large part of it; that is not the issue. The point is that one cannot have such a control at all, and that seems unfair. If one is looking at the first ten columns, and it is desired to jump over to columns 6000-6010, well, you cannot. Surely the dataSet can be stored in a field or custom property, and loaded as needed, but that requires a significant amount of pre-processing. The whole point of DG's and tableFields is that they can be navigated with virtually unconscious well-worn user actions. The limit may be intrinsic. It at least should be published. Craig -- Sent from: http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
For me the issue was converting a csv file exported from a copier. The csv file has a LOT of columns (page counts for virtually everything and paper type black and color the copier is capable, including scans, fax etc.) In the end I decided to not use that file format and instead use the smaller export file which is not so mindbogglingly granular. Bob S > On Nov 21, 2018, at 15:49 , Tom Glod via use-livecode > wrote: > > hahaha!...It never occured to me that people would have such large numbers > of columns ...it sounds like lots of fun. what is the data? > > alsowondering .if there is another way. would a graph database > help? ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
That wasn't the issue. The issue was, how many columns before noticeable decline in performance, and eventually death for the datagrid. Bob S > On Nov 21, 2018, at 13:27 , JJS via use-livecode > wrote: > > what the h*ll you're going to do with 1500 columns? > > who's gonna work with that? > > > Op 21-11-2018 om 17:08 schreef dunbarxx via use-livecode: >> I tested with a table field. It can hold far many more columns, but it, too, >> will go haywire if the tabStops are wide and the number of columns exceeds >> about 1500. >> >> I was surprised that the number of columns matters. Certainly they are not >> all drawn at once, but rather "exposed" based on internal workings and the >> current thumbPos. >> >> This really needs a response from the team. >> >> Craig >> >> >> >> -- >> Sent from: >> http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html >> >> ___ >> use-livecode mailing list >> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription >> preferences: >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode > > > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription > preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
Geoff Canyon wrote: > On Fri, Nov 23, 2018 at 4:38 PM Richard Gaskin wrote: > >> Geoff Canyon wrote: >> >> > It's not relevant to the current discussion, but wy back when, >> > I worked with a guy who had created some monster spreadsheets in >> > Excel with something like 9,000 columns. It was working, but it was >> > incredibly slow -- this was running on 68k Macs. Not expecting >> > success, I suggested he give FileMaker a shot. He did, and >> > amazingly, not only did it happily handle database definitions with >> > 9,000 fields, it was not just faster than Excel, it was actually >> > speedy. It had zero problems, and he built out the entirety of his >> > solution that way. >> >> Did he create a layout in FileMaker with 9,000 fields? >> >> If he had I suspect it would expose the root of the issue as being >> not so much about internal handling of the data, but about rendering >> it all. >> >> One more reason to remember that spreadsheets are not databases. >> Very different tools with very different feature focuses and >> tradeoffs. > > I don't remember what-all he did with it, but FileMaker proved to be > remarkably resilient pretty much no matter what he threw at it. Interesting, but alas missed what I was trying to convey which is relevant for us LC folks: Plenty of tools can put data in memory. Easy to do; most will do it well. The challenge is in also *rendering* all of it on screen. As we consider our options for work in LiveCode, it can be helpful to think about the implications of rendering, both in technical terms and for the user experience. Technically, rendering is computationally expensive. Indeed, it's infinitely more expensive than not rendering. :) So any time we have more data than can be rendered efficiently, we might ask ourselves if we really need to render all of it. And this leads us to the user experience: we render data where doing so has value to the user. Everything that doesn't benefit the user has no place on the user's screen; it becomes just noise, effectively an anti-feature. What meaningful task is a user expected to perform with many thousands of columns rendered on screen? How could it even be cognitively possible for a human to perform such tasks with any useful efficiency? The answer would of course depend on the task in question. But as a general rule, it may be safe to consider that if the user has to scroll horizontally more than the width of the room they're sitting in, it might be time to explore a simpler design that culls the noise for them and lets them see the smaller subset of data they're actually looking for more easily. Furthering awareness of both of these aspects, technical and UX, we come back to the original issue cited in this thread, with LC sometimes not correctly rendering uncommonly large numbers of columns. This limitation may have been eliminated, or close to eliminated, with the field object. And now that fields have column-independent alignment, it's rare that there's ever a need to replace that one object with a thousand-object DataGrid for simple list views. The DataGrid is bound to a limitation within LC for group contents: the formattedWidth and formattedHeight of a group cannot exceed 32765 px. Attempting to go beyond that flips the signed bit internally and objects will be rendered incorrectly. I suppose it might be nice to see that extended, but in practice do we really need it? How big should a group meaningfully be? 32,765 px is about 30 feet in size. That's a lot to ask a user to scroll through, not to mention being a lot to ask LC to buffer so it can handle the scroll efficiently. When we're faced with such monstrous scrolling requirements imposed on our users, a technical limitation in the engine may not be a bad thing at all. It may turn out to be the prompting we need to re-think our designs to deliver a more useful and fluid user experience. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
I don't remember what-all he did with it, but FileMaker proved to be remarkably resilient pretty much no matter what he threw at it. The one limitation back then was that a given file couldn't be more than 32MB(!). On Fri, Nov 23, 2018 at 4:38 PM Richard Gaskin via use-livecode < use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote: > Geoff Canyon wrote: > > > It's not relevant to the current discussion, but wy back when, I > > worked with a guy who had created some monster spreadsheets in Excel > > with something like 9,000 columns. It was working, but it was > > incredibly slow -- this was running on 68k Macs. Not expecting > > success, I suggested he give FileMaker a shot. He did, and amazingly, > > not only did it happily handle database definitions with 9,000 fields, > > it was not just faster than Excel, it was actually speedy. It had zero > > problems, and he built out the entirety of his solution that way. > > Did he create a layout in FileMaker with 9,000 fields? > > If he had I suspect it would expose the root of the issue as being not > so much about internal handling of the data, but about rendering it all. > > One more reason to remember that spreadsheets are not databases. Very > different tools with very different feature focuses and tradeoffs. > > -- > Richard Gaskin > Fourth World Systems > Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web > > ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com > > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your > subscription preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode > ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
Geoff Canyon wrote: > It's not relevant to the current discussion, but wy back when, I > worked with a guy who had created some monster spreadsheets in Excel > with something like 9,000 columns. It was working, but it was > incredibly slow -- this was running on 68k Macs. Not expecting > success, I suggested he give FileMaker a shot. He did, and amazingly, > not only did it happily handle database definitions with 9,000 fields, > it was not just faster than Excel, it was actually speedy. It had zero > problems, and he built out the entirety of his solution that way. Did he create a layout in FileMaker with 9,000 fields? If he had I suspect it would expose the root of the issue as being not so much about internal handling of the data, but about rendering it all. One more reason to remember that spreadsheets are not databases. Very different tools with very different feature focuses and tradeoffs. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
well it's incredible big! Yes Excell and outlook too can being very slow, on my job i have a laptop from this year(lenovo) and it's running office 360, it's terrible slow. But...it could also be due to the rest of the shitty software we have to use like Labware(that's really crying and a pain in the *ss). But thay say on calculations that Excell is the top. Anyway hope you get it figured out. On 22-11-18 22:36, Geoff Canyon via use-livecode wrote: It's not relevant to the current discussion, but wy back when, I worked with a guy who had created some monster spreadsheets in Excel with something like 9,000 columns. It was working, but it was incredibly slow -- this was running on 68k Macs. Not expecting success, I suggested he give FileMaker a shot. He did, and amazingly, not only did it happily handle database definitions with 9,000 fields, it was not just faster than Excel, it was actually speedy. It had zero problems, and he built out the entirety of his solution that way. On Thu, Nov 22, 2018 at 1:05 PM JJS via use-livecode < use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote: you mean like this one: https://www.legamaster.com/products/product/interactive-products/e-screen-interactive-touch-monitors/ptx-9800uhd-e-screen-8713797081610/?no_cache=1=158c87c7f0527df039ce11bc76eae9ab But who can cope with 1500 columns, most people would stop and lost track before reaching the 50th What kind of data is that? Op 21-11-2018 om 22:39 schreef dunbarxx via use-livecode: People with wide monitors? -- Sent from: http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
It's not relevant to the current discussion, but wy back when, I worked with a guy who had created some monster spreadsheets in Excel with something like 9,000 columns. It was working, but it was incredibly slow -- this was running on 68k Macs. Not expecting success, I suggested he give FileMaker a shot. He did, and amazingly, not only did it happily handle database definitions with 9,000 fields, it was not just faster than Excel, it was actually speedy. It had zero problems, and he built out the entirety of his solution that way. On Thu, Nov 22, 2018 at 1:05 PM JJS via use-livecode < use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote: > you mean like this one: > > > https://www.legamaster.com/products/product/interactive-products/e-screen-interactive-touch-monitors/ptx-9800uhd-e-screen-8713797081610/?no_cache=1=158c87c7f0527df039ce11bc76eae9ab > > > But who can cope with 1500 columns, most people would stop and lost > track before reaching the 50th > > What kind of data is that? > > > Op 21-11-2018 om 22:39 schreef dunbarxx via use-livecode: > > People with wide monitors? > > > > > > > > -- > > Sent from: > http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html > > > > ___ > > use-livecode mailing list > > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your > subscription preferences: > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode > > > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your > subscription preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode > ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
you mean like this one: https://www.legamaster.com/products/product/interactive-products/e-screen-interactive-touch-monitors/ptx-9800uhd-e-screen-8713797081610/?no_cache=1=158c87c7f0527df039ce11bc76eae9ab But who can cope with 1500 columns, most people would stop and lost track before reaching the 50th What kind of data is that? Op 21-11-2018 om 22:39 schreef dunbarxx via use-livecode: People with wide monitors? -- Sent from: http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
hahaha!...It never occured to me that people would have such large numbers of columns ...it sounds like lots of fun. what is the data? alsowondering .if there is another way. would a graph database help? On Wed, Nov 21, 2018 at 4:39 PM dunbarxx via use-livecode < use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote: > People with wide monitors? > > > > -- > Sent from: > http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html > > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your > subscription preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode > ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
People with wide monitors? -- Sent from: http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
what the h*ll you're going to do with 1500 columns? who's gonna work with that? Op 21-11-2018 om 17:08 schreef dunbarxx via use-livecode: I tested with a table field. It can hold far many more columns, but it, too, will go haywire if the tabStops are wide and the number of columns exceeds about 1500. I was surprised that the number of columns matters. Certainly they are not all drawn at once, but rather "exposed" based on internal workings and the current thumbPos. This really needs a response from the team. Craig -- Sent from: http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
I tested with a table field. It can hold far many more columns, but it, too, will go haywire if the tabStops are wide and the number of columns exceeds about 1500. I was surprised that the number of columns matters. Certainly they are not all drawn at once, but rather "exposed" based on internal workings and the current thumbPos. This really needs a response from the team. Craig -- Sent from: http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
I had set the dgProp ["columns"] to more than 900. :-) Not only did the DG fail to display any data, but it actually KILLED THE DG! I could no longer set the dgData to empty, nor could I edit the contents in the property inspector and delete the text. I had to delete the DG and create a new one. I have less than 100 now so all good. I don't consider this a bug though. I simply exceeded the limits of LC to handle that many columns of data. I think it has to do with the maximum width of a card. The fields would have to be created whether or not they are displayed. If they exceed the max card width, I can see how there would be problems. Bob S > On Nov 20, 2018, at 19:36 , dunbarxx via use-livecode > wrote: > > Hi. > > Never thought about this. But I made a DG, and put this into a button: > on mouseup > repeat 300 >put random() & tab after temp > end repeat > set the dgText of grp 1 to temp > end mouseup > > No problem. With a horizontal scrollbar, I can zoom to each side of the DG. > > But If I try to change the count to more than 300, the DG loses its hScroll, > and it seems that many separate numbers appear overlapped in column 1. > Further, a lot of time is spent while the DG is digesting this new property > change. > > Trevor is the one to address this, assuming anything I just did makes sense. > > Craig Newman ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Max number of columns in a datagrid?
Hi. Never thought about this. But I made a DG, and put this into a button: on mouseup repeat 300 put random() & tab after temp end repeat set the dgText of grp 1 to temp end mouseup No problem. With a horizontal scrollbar, I can zoom to each side of the DG. But If I try to change the count to more than 300, the DG loses its hScroll, and it seems that many separate numbers appear overlapped in column 1. Further, a lot of time is spent while the DG is digesting this new property change. Trevor is the one to address this, assuming anything I just did makes sense. Craig Newman -- Sent from: http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revolution-User-f278306.html ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Max number of columns in a datagrid?
Hi all. I'm importing a csv file with a LOT of columns, and I am running into an issue with setting the dgProp ["columns"] of the datagrid. It's choking on the number of columns it seems. What is the max? Bob S ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
