Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Tony Brian Albers]

Also keep in mind that extensive logging in the vm's can seriously 
impact your fs performance, so using a central syslogserver is a really 
good idea.

/tony


On 2018-04-06 17:03, Karli Sjöberg wrote:
> 
> 
> Den 6 apr. 2018 15:46 skrev Jayme :
> 
> Yaniv,
> 
> I appreciate your input, thanks!
> 
> I understand that everyone's use case is different, but I was hoping
> to hear from some users that are using oVirt hyper-converged setup
> and get some input on the performance.  When I research GlusterFS I
> hear a lot about how it can be slow especially when dealing with
> small files.  I'm starting to wonder if a straight up NFS server
> with a few SSDs would be less hassle and perhaps offer better VM
> performance than glusterFS can currently.
> 
> I want to get the best oVirt performance I can get (on somewhat of a
> budget) with a fairly small amount of required disk space (under
> 2TB).  I'm not sure if hyper-converged setup w/GlusterFS is the
> answer or not.  I'd like to avoid spending 15k only to find out that
> it's too slow. 
> 
> 
> What is "too slow" for you, what are your expectations?
> 
> Much depending on that, you will find that different goals require 
> different tools. Like hammering on a screw and all that :)
> 
> /K
> 
> 

-- 
Tony Albers
Systems administrator, IT-development
Royal Danish Library, Victor Albecks Vej 1, 8000 Aarhus C, Denmark.
Tel: +45 2566 2383 / +45 8946 2316
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Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Karli Sjöberg]

Den 6 apr. 2018 15:46 skrev Jayme :Yaniv,I appreciate your input, thanks!  I understand that everyone's use case is different, but I was hoping to hear from some users that are using oVirt hyper-converged setup and get some input on the performance.  When I research GlusterFS I hear a lot about how it can be slow especially when dealing with small files.  I'm starting to wonder if a straight up NFS server with a few SSDs would be less hassle and perhaps offer better VM performance than glusterFS can currently.  I want to get the best oVirt performance I can get (on somewhat of a budget) with a fairly small amount of required disk space (under 2TB).  I'm not sure if hyper-converged setup w/GlusterFS is the answer or not.  I'd like to avoid spending 15k only to find out that it's too slow. What is "too slow" for you, what are your expectations?Much depending on that, you will find that different goals require different tools. Like hammering on a screw and all that :)/KOn Fri, Apr 6, 2018 at 6:05 AM, Yaniv Kaul  wrote:On Thu, Apr 5, 2018, 11:39 PM Vincent Royer  wrote:Jayme, I'm doing a very similar build, the only difference really is I am using SSDs instead of HDDs.   I have similar questions as you regarding expected performance. Have you considered JBOD + NFS?   Putting a Gluster Replica 3 on top of RAID 10 arrays sounds very safe, but my gosh the capacity takes a massive hit.  Am I correct in saying you will only get 4TB total usable capacity out of 24TB worth of disks?  The cost per TB in that sort of scenario is immense. My plan is two 2TB SSDs per server in JBOD with a caching raid card, with replica 3.  I would end up with the same 4TB total capacity using 12TB of SSDs. I'm not sure I see the value in RAID card if you don't use RAID and I'm not sure you really need caching on the card. Y. I think Replica 3 is safe enough that you could forgo the RAID 10. But I'm talking from zero experience...  Would love others to chime in with their opinions on both these setups. Vincent Royer778-825-1057SUSTAINABLE MOBILE ENERGY SOLUTIONS
On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Jayme  wrote:Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?  I'm very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may be, there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.  On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:Hi,You should be ok with the setup.I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size) with the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok. AlexOn Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.  Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.  3X of the following:Dell PowerEdge R7202x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)256GB RAMPERC H7102x10GB NicBoot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.  Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10 per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just one? I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very difficult to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in hardware (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the performance will be adequate enough for my needs. I will be using an all ready existing Netgear XS716T 10GB switch for Gluster storage network. In addition I plan to build another simple glusterFS storage server that I can use to georeplicate the gluster volume to for DR purposes and use existing hardware to build an independent standby oVirt host that is able to start up a few high priority VMs from the georeplicated glusterFS volume if for some reason the primary oVirt cluster/glusterFS volume ever failed. I would love to hear any advice or critiques on this plan.  Thanks!
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Yaniv,I appreciate your input, thanks!  I understand that everyone's use case is different, but I was hoping to hear from some users that are using oVirt hyper-converged 

Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[FERNANDO FREDIANI]

It's likely possibile you will get more performance from a NFS server
compared to Gluster. Specially if on your NFS server you have something
like ZFS + SSD for L2ARC or ext4 + Bcache, but you get not redundancy. If
you NFS server dies everything stops working, which is not the case with
Distributed Storage.

Fernando

2018-04-06 10:45 GMT-03:00 Jayme :

> Yaniv,
>
> I appreciate your input, thanks!
>
> I understand that everyone's use case is different, but I was hoping to
> hear from some users that are using oVirt hyper-converged setup and get
> some input on the performance.  When I research GlusterFS I hear a lot
> about how it can be slow especially when dealing with small files.  I'm
> starting to wonder if a straight up NFS server with a few SSDs would be
> less hassle and perhaps offer better VM performance than glusterFS can
> currently.
>
> I want to get the best oVirt performance I can get (on somewhat of a
> budget) with a fairly small amount of required disk space (under 2TB).  I'm
> not sure if hyper-converged setup w/GlusterFS is the answer or not.  I'd
> like to avoid spending 15k only to find out that it's too slow.
>
> On Fri, Apr 6, 2018 at 6:05 AM, Yaniv Kaul  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018, 11:39 PM Vincent Royer 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Jayme,
>>>
>>> I'm doing a very similar build, the only difference really is I am using
>>> SSDs instead of HDDs.   I have similar questions as you regarding expected
>>> performance. Have you considered JBOD + NFS?   Putting a Gluster Replica 3
>>> on top of RAID 10 arrays sounds very safe, but my gosh the capacity takes a
>>> massive hit.  Am I correct in saying you will only get 4TB total usable
>>> capacity out of 24TB worth of disks?  The cost per TB in that sort of
>>> scenario is immense.
>>>
>>> My plan is two 2TB SSDs per server in JBOD with a caching raid card,
>>> with replica 3.  I would end up with the same 4TB total capacity using 12TB
>>> of SSDs.
>>>
>>
>> I'm not sure I see the value in RAID card if you don't use RAID and I'm
>> not sure you really need caching on the card.
>> Y.
>>
>>
>>> I think Replica 3 is safe enough that you could forgo the RAID 10. But
>>> I'm talking from zero experience...  Would love others to chime in with
>>> their opinions on both these setups.
>>>
>>> *Vincent Royer*
>>> *778-825-1057*
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> *SUSTAINABLE MOBILE ENERGY SOLUTIONS*
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Jayme  wrote:
>>>
 Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?
 I'm very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may
 be, there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any
 feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.

 On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> You should be ok with the setup.
> I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size)
> with the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.
>
> Alex
>
> On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:
>
>> I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a
>> budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a
>> couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.
>> Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.
>>
>> 3X of the following:
>>
>> Dell PowerEdge R720
>> 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
>> 256GB RAM
>> PERC H710
>> 2x10GB Nic
>>
>> Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.
>>
>> Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID
>> 10 per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with 
>> no
>> arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
>> hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just 
>> one?
>>
>> I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very
>> difficult to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in
>> hardware (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the
>> performance will be adequate enough for my needs.
>>
>> I will be using an all ready existing Netgear XS716T 10GB switch for
>> Gluster storage network.
>>
>> In addition I plan to build another simple glusterFS storage server
>> that I can use to georeplicate the gluster volume to for DR purposes and
>> use existing hardware to build an independent standby oVirt host that is
>> able to start up a few high priority VMs from the georeplicated glusterFS
>> volume if for some reason the primary oVirt cluster/glusterFS volume ever
>> failed.
>>
>> I would love to hear 

Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Jayme]

Yaniv,

I appreciate your input, thanks!

I understand that everyone's use case is different, but I was hoping to
hear from some users that are using oVirt hyper-converged setup and get
some input on the performance.  When I research GlusterFS I hear a lot
about how it can be slow especially when dealing with small files.  I'm
starting to wonder if a straight up NFS server with a few SSDs would be
less hassle and perhaps offer better VM performance than glusterFS can
currently.

I want to get the best oVirt performance I can get (on somewhat of a
budget) with a fairly small amount of required disk space (under 2TB).  I'm
not sure if hyper-converged setup w/GlusterFS is the answer or not.  I'd
like to avoid spending 15k only to find out that it's too slow.

On Fri, Apr 6, 2018 at 6:05 AM, Yaniv Kaul  wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018, 11:39 PM Vincent Royer  wrote:
>
>> Jayme,
>>
>> I'm doing a very similar build, the only difference really is I am using
>> SSDs instead of HDDs.   I have similar questions as you regarding expected
>> performance. Have you considered JBOD + NFS?   Putting a Gluster Replica 3
>> on top of RAID 10 arrays sounds very safe, but my gosh the capacity takes a
>> massive hit.  Am I correct in saying you will only get 4TB total usable
>> capacity out of 24TB worth of disks?  The cost per TB in that sort of
>> scenario is immense.
>>
>> My plan is two 2TB SSDs per server in JBOD with a caching raid card, with
>> replica 3.  I would end up with the same 4TB total capacity using 12TB of
>> SSDs.
>>
>
> I'm not sure I see the value in RAID card if you don't use RAID and I'm
> not sure you really need caching on the card.
> Y.
>
>
>> I think Replica 3 is safe enough that you could forgo the RAID 10. But
>> I'm talking from zero experience...  Would love others to chime in with
>> their opinions on both these setups.
>>
>> *Vincent Royer*
>> *778-825-1057*
>>
>>
>> 
>> *SUSTAINABLE MOBILE ENERGY SOLUTIONS*
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Jayme  wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?
>>> I'm very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may
>>> be, there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any
>>> feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:
>>>
 Hi,

 You should be ok with the setup.
 I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size)
 with the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.

 Alex

 On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:

> I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a
> budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a
> couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.
> Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.
>
> 3X of the following:
>
> Dell PowerEdge R720
> 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
> 256GB RAM
> PERC H710
> 2x10GB Nic
>
> Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.
>
> Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10
> per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no
> arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
> hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just 
> one?
>
> I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very
> difficult to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in
> hardware (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the
> performance will be adequate enough for my needs.
>
> I will be using an all ready existing Netgear XS716T 10GB switch for
> Gluster storage network.
>
> In addition I plan to build another simple glusterFS storage server
> that I can use to georeplicate the gluster volume to for DR purposes and
> use existing hardware to build an independent standby oVirt host that is
> able to start up a few high priority VMs from the georeplicated glusterFS
> volume if for some reason the primary oVirt cluster/glusterFS volume ever
> failed.
>
> I would love to hear any advice or critiques on this plan.
>
> Thanks!
> ___
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> Users@ovirt.org
> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>

>>>
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>>>
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>> 

Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Yaniv Kaul]

On Fri, Apr 6, 2018, 12:39 AM Jayme  wrote:

> Vincent,
>
> I've been back and forth on SSDs vs HDDs and can't really get a clear
> answer.  You are correct though, it would only equal 4TB usable in the end
> which is pretty crazy but that amount of 7200 RPM HDDs equals about the
> same cost as 3 2TB ssds would.  I actually posted a question to this list
> not long ago asking how GlusterFS might perform with a small amount of
> disks such as one 2TB SSD per host and some glusterFS users commented
> stating that network would be the bottleneck long before the disks and a
> small amount of SSDs could bottleneck at RPC layer.   Also, I believe at
> this time GlusterFS is not exactly developed to take full advantage of SSDs
> (but I believe there has been strides being made in that regard, I could be
> wrong here).
>

Coming real soon now are some very cool features that will make decisions
somewhat harder: dedup+compression (from VDO) and lvmcache setup.


> As for replica 3 being overkill that may be true as well but from what
> I've read on Ovirt and GlusterFS list archives people typically feel safer
> with replica 3 and run in to less disaster scenarios and can provide easier
> recovery.  I'm not sold on Replica 3 either, Rep 3 Arbiter 1 may be more
> than fine but I wanted to err on the side of caution as this setup may host
> production servers sometime in the future.
>
> I really wish I could get some straight answers on best configuration for
> Ovirt + GlusterFS but thus far it has been a big question mark.  I don't
> know if Raid is better than JBOD and I don't know if a smaller number of
> SSDs would perform any better/worse than larger number of spinning disks in
> raid 10.
>

RAID is better than JBOD in terms of availability and most likely
performance.
It's also more expensive and requires initial setup.
SSD will perform better than HDD.
It's also more expensive than HDD.

No one but you can provide what works best for your requirements.
Y.


> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 5:38 PM, Vincent Royer 
> wrote:
>
>> Jayme,
>>
>> I'm doing a very similar build, the only difference really is I am using
>> SSDs instead of HDDs.   I have similar questions as you regarding expected
>> performance. Have you considered JBOD + NFS?   Putting a Gluster Replica 3
>> on top of RAID 10 arrays sounds very safe, but my gosh the capacity takes a
>> massive hit.  Am I correct in saying you will only get 4TB total usable
>> capacity out of 24TB worth of disks?  The cost per TB in that sort of
>> scenario is immense.
>>
>> My plan is two 2TB SSDs per server in JBOD with a caching raid card, with
>> replica 3.  I would end up with the same 4TB total capacity using 12TB of
>> SSDs.
>>
>> I think Replica 3 is safe enough that you could forgo the RAID 10. But
>> I'm talking from zero experience...  Would love others to chime in with
>> their opinions on both these setups.
>>
>> *Vincent Royer*
>> *778-825-1057*
>>
>>
>> 
>> *SUSTAINABLE MOBILE ENERGY SOLUTIONS*
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Jayme  wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?
>>> I'm very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may
>>> be, there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any
>>> feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:
>>>
 Hi,

 You should be ok with the setup.
 I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size)
 with the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.

 Alex

 On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:

> I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a
> budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a
> couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.
> Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.
>
> 3X of the following:
>
> Dell PowerEdge R720
> 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
> 256GB RAM
> PERC H710
> 2x10GB Nic
>
> Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.
>
> Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10
> per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no
> arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
> hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just 
> one?
>
> I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very
> difficult to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in
> hardware (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the
> performance will be adequate enough for my needs.
>
> I will be using an all 

Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Yaniv Kaul]

On Thu, Apr 5, 2018, 11:39 PM Vincent Royer  wrote:

> Jayme,
>
> I'm doing a very similar build, the only difference really is I am using
> SSDs instead of HDDs.   I have similar questions as you regarding expected
> performance. Have you considered JBOD + NFS?   Putting a Gluster Replica 3
> on top of RAID 10 arrays sounds very safe, but my gosh the capacity takes a
> massive hit.  Am I correct in saying you will only get 4TB total usable
> capacity out of 24TB worth of disks?  The cost per TB in that sort of
> scenario is immense.
>
> My plan is two 2TB SSDs per server in JBOD with a caching raid card, with
> replica 3.  I would end up with the same 4TB total capacity using 12TB of
> SSDs.
>

I'm not sure I see the value in RAID card if you don't use RAID and I'm not
sure you really need caching on the card.
Y.


> I think Replica 3 is safe enough that you could forgo the RAID 10. But I'm
> talking from zero experience...  Would love others to chime in with their
> opinions on both these setups.
>
> *Vincent Royer*
> *778-825-1057*
>
>
> 
> *SUSTAINABLE MOBILE ENERGY SOLUTIONS*
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Jayme  wrote:
>
>> Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?
>> I'm very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may
>> be, there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any
>> feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> You should be ok with the setup.
>>> I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size)
>>> with the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.
>>>
>>> Alex
>>>
>>> On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:
>>>
 I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a
 budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a
 couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.
 Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.

 3X of the following:

 Dell PowerEdge R720
 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
 256GB RAM
 PERC H710
 2x10GB Nic

 Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.

 Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10
 per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no
 arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
 hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just one?

 I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very
 difficult to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in
 hardware (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the
 performance will be adequate enough for my needs.

 I will be using an all ready existing Netgear XS716T 10GB switch for
 Gluster storage network.

 In addition I plan to build another simple glusterFS storage server
 that I can use to georeplicate the gluster volume to for DR purposes and
 use existing hardware to build an independent standby oVirt host that is
 able to start up a few high priority VMs from the georeplicated glusterFS
 volume if for some reason the primary oVirt cluster/glusterFS volume ever
 failed.

 I would love to hear any advice or critiques on this plan.

 Thanks!
 ___
 Users mailing list
 Users@ovirt.org
 http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users

>>>
>>
>> ___
>> Users mailing list
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>> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>>
>>
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Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Yaniv Kaul]

On Thu, Apr 5, 2018, 11:51 PM FERNANDO FREDIANI 
wrote:

> I always found replica 3 a complete overkill. Don't know people made that
> up that was necessary. Just looks good and costs a lot with little benefit.
>

It's not very easy to solve split brain with only 2.
You can use 2+arbiter.
Y.


> Normally when using magnetic disks 2 copies are fine for most scenarios,
> but if using SSDs for similar scenarios depending on the configuration of
> each node disks it is possible to have a RAID 5/6 ish.
> Fernando
>
> 2018-04-05 17:38 GMT-03:00 Vincent Royer :
>
>> Jayme,
>>
>> I'm doing a very similar build, the only difference really is I am using
>> SSDs instead of HDDs.   I have similar questions as you regarding expected
>> performance. Have you considered JBOD + NFS?   Putting a Gluster Replica 3
>> on top of RAID 10 arrays sounds very safe, but my gosh the capacity takes a
>> massive hit.  Am I correct in saying you will only get 4TB total usable
>> capacity out of 24TB worth of disks?  The cost per TB in that sort of
>> scenario is immense.
>>
>> My plan is two 2TB SSDs per server in JBOD with a caching raid card, with
>> replica 3.  I would end up with the same 4TB total capacity using 12TB of
>> SSDs.
>>
>> I think Replica 3 is safe enough that you could forgo the RAID 10. But
>> I'm talking from zero experience...  Would love others to chime in with
>> their opinions on both these setups.
>>
>> *Vincent Royer*
>> *778-825-1057*
>>
>>
>> 
>> *SUSTAINABLE MOBILE ENERGY SOLUTIONS*
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Jayme  wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?
>>> I'm very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may
>>> be, there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any
>>> feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:
>>>
 Hi,

 You should be ok with the setup.
 I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size)
 with the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.

 Alex

 On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:

> I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a
> budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a
> couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.
> Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.
>
> 3X of the following:
>
> Dell PowerEdge R720
> 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
> 256GB RAM
> PERC H710
> 2x10GB Nic
>
> Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.
>
> Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10
> per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no
> arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
> hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just 
> one?
>
> I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very
> difficult to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in
> hardware (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the
> performance will be adequate enough for my needs.
>
> I will be using an all ready existing Netgear XS716T 10GB switch for
> Gluster storage network.
>
> In addition I plan to build another simple glusterFS storage server
> that I can use to georeplicate the gluster volume to for DR purposes and
> use existing hardware to build an independent standby oVirt host that is
> able to start up a few high priority VMs from the georeplicated glusterFS
> volume if for some reason the primary oVirt cluster/glusterFS volume ever
> failed.
>
> I would love to hear any advice or critiques on this plan.
>
> Thanks!
> ___
> Users mailing list
> Users@ovirt.org
> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>

>>>
>>> ___
>>> Users mailing list
>>> Users@ovirt.org
>>> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ___
>> Users mailing list
>> Users@ovirt.org
>> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>>
>>
> ___
> Users mailing list
> Users@ovirt.org
> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>
___
Users mailing list
Users@ovirt.org
http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users

Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Vincent Royer]

Well good, we can at least bounce ideas off each other, and I'm sure we'll
get some good advice sooner or later! Best way to get good ideas on the
internet is to post bad ones and wait ;)

In the performance and sizing guide PDF, they make this statement:

*Standard servers with 4:2 erasure coding and JBOD bricks provide superior
value in terms of throughput *
*per server cost.*

I don't know enough about erasure coding to know if that applies, but all
the graphs that involve JBOD in that document look pretty good to me.

What do you know about ZFS?  Seems to be popular to use it in combination
with Gluster.


On Thu, Apr 5, 2018, 2:38 PM Jayme,  wrote:

> Vincent,
>
> I've been back and forth on SSDs vs HDDs and can't really get a clear
> answer.  You are correct though, it would only equal 4TB usable in the end
> which is pretty crazy but that amount of 7200 RPM HDDs equals about the
> same cost as 3 2TB ssds would.  I actually posted a question to this list
> not long ago asking how GlusterFS might perform with a small amount of
> disks such as one 2TB SSD per host and some glusterFS users commented
> stating that network would be the bottleneck long before the disks and a
> small amount of SSDs could bottleneck at RPC layer.   Also, I believe at
> this time GlusterFS is not exactly developed to take full advantage of SSDs
> (but I believe there has been strides being made in that regard, I could be
> wrong here).
>
> As for replica 3 being overkill that may be true as well but from what
> I've read on Ovirt and GlusterFS list archives people typically feel safer
> with replica 3 and run in to less disaster scenarios and can provide easier
> recovery.  I'm not sold on Replica 3 either, Rep 3 Arbiter 1 may be more
> than fine but I wanted to err on the side of caution as this setup may host
> production servers sometime in the future.
>
> I really wish I could get some straight answers on best configuration for
> Ovirt + GlusterFS but thus far it has been a big question mark.  I don't
> know if Raid is better than JBOD and I don't know if a smaller number of
> SSDs would perform any better/worse than larger number of spinning disks in
> raid 10.
>
> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 5:38 PM, Vincent Royer 
> wrote:
>
>> Jayme,
>>
>> I'm doing a very similar build, the only difference really is I am using
>> SSDs instead of HDDs.   I have similar questions as you regarding expected
>> performance. Have you considered JBOD + NFS?   Putting a Gluster Replica 3
>> on top of RAID 10 arrays sounds very safe, but my gosh the capacity takes a
>> massive hit.  Am I correct in saying you will only get 4TB total usable
>> capacity out of 24TB worth of disks?  The cost per TB in that sort of
>> scenario is immense.
>>
>> My plan is two 2TB SSDs per server in JBOD with a caching raid card, with
>> replica 3.  I would end up with the same 4TB total capacity using 12TB of
>> SSDs.
>>
>> I think Replica 3 is safe enough that you could forgo the RAID 10. But
>> I'm talking from zero experience...  Would love others to chime in with
>> their opinions on both these setups.
>>
>> *Vincent Royer*
>> *778-825-1057*
>>
>>
>> 
>> *SUSTAINABLE MOBILE ENERGY SOLUTIONS*
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Jayme  wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?
>>> I'm very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may
>>> be, there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any
>>> feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:
>>>
 Hi,

 You should be ok with the setup.
 I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size)
 with the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.

 Alex

 On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:

> I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a
> budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a
> couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.
> Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.
>
> 3X of the following:
>
> Dell PowerEdge R720
> 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
> 256GB RAM
> PERC H710
> 2x10GB Nic
>
> Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.
>
> Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10
> per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no
> arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
> hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just 
> one?
>
> I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very
> difficult to predict the performance of 

Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Jayme]

Vincent,

I've been back and forth on SSDs vs HDDs and can't really get a clear
answer.  You are correct though, it would only equal 4TB usable in the end
which is pretty crazy but that amount of 7200 RPM HDDs equals about the
same cost as 3 2TB ssds would.  I actually posted a question to this list
not long ago asking how GlusterFS might perform with a small amount of
disks such as one 2TB SSD per host and some glusterFS users commented
stating that network would be the bottleneck long before the disks and a
small amount of SSDs could bottleneck at RPC layer.   Also, I believe at
this time GlusterFS is not exactly developed to take full advantage of SSDs
(but I believe there has been strides being made in that regard, I could be
wrong here).

As for replica 3 being overkill that may be true as well but from what I've
read on Ovirt and GlusterFS list archives people typically feel safer with
replica 3 and run in to less disaster scenarios and can provide easier
recovery.  I'm not sold on Replica 3 either, Rep 3 Arbiter 1 may be more
than fine but I wanted to err on the side of caution as this setup may host
production servers sometime in the future.

I really wish I could get some straight answers on best configuration for
Ovirt + GlusterFS but thus far it has been a big question mark.  I don't
know if Raid is better than JBOD and I don't know if a smaller number of
SSDs would perform any better/worse than larger number of spinning disks in
raid 10.

On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 5:38 PM, Vincent Royer  wrote:

> Jayme,
>
> I'm doing a very similar build, the only difference really is I am using
> SSDs instead of HDDs.   I have similar questions as you regarding expected
> performance. Have you considered JBOD + NFS?   Putting a Gluster Replica 3
> on top of RAID 10 arrays sounds very safe, but my gosh the capacity takes a
> massive hit.  Am I correct in saying you will only get 4TB total usable
> capacity out of 24TB worth of disks?  The cost per TB in that sort of
> scenario is immense.
>
> My plan is two 2TB SSDs per server in JBOD with a caching raid card, with
> replica 3.  I would end up with the same 4TB total capacity using 12TB of
> SSDs.
>
> I think Replica 3 is safe enough that you could forgo the RAID 10. But I'm
> talking from zero experience...  Would love others to chime in with their
> opinions on both these setups.
>
> *Vincent Royer*
> *778-825-1057*
>
>
> 
> *SUSTAINABLE MOBILE ENERGY SOLUTIONS*
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Jayme  wrote:
>
>> Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?
>> I'm very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may
>> be, there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any
>> feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> You should be ok with the setup.
>>> I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size)
>>> with the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.
>>>
>>> Alex
>>>
>>> On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:
>>>
 I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a
 budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a
 couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.
 Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.

 3X of the following:

 Dell PowerEdge R720
 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
 256GB RAM
 PERC H710
 2x10GB Nic

 Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.

 Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10
 per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no
 arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
 hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just one?

 I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very
 difficult to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in
 hardware (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the
 performance will be adequate enough for my needs.

 I will be using an all ready existing Netgear XS716T 10GB switch for
 Gluster storage network.

 In addition I plan to build another simple glusterFS storage server
 that I can use to georeplicate the gluster volume to for DR purposes and
 use existing hardware to build an independent standby oVirt host that is
 able to start up a few high priority VMs from the georeplicated glusterFS
 volume if for some reason the primary oVirt cluster/glusterFS volume ever
 failed.

 I would love to hear any advice or critiques on this plan.

 Thanks!
 

Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[FERNANDO FREDIANI]

I always found replica 3 a complete overkill. Don't know people made that
up that was necessary. Just looks good and costs a lot with little benefit.

Normally when using magnetic disks 2 copies are fine for most scenarios,
but if using SSDs for similar scenarios depending on the configuration of
each node disks it is possible to have a RAID 5/6 ish.
Fernando

2018-04-05 17:38 GMT-03:00 Vincent Royer :

> Jayme,
>
> I'm doing a very similar build, the only difference really is I am using
> SSDs instead of HDDs.   I have similar questions as you regarding expected
> performance. Have you considered JBOD + NFS?   Putting a Gluster Replica 3
> on top of RAID 10 arrays sounds very safe, but my gosh the capacity takes a
> massive hit.  Am I correct in saying you will only get 4TB total usable
> capacity out of 24TB worth of disks?  The cost per TB in that sort of
> scenario is immense.
>
> My plan is two 2TB SSDs per server in JBOD with a caching raid card, with
> replica 3.  I would end up with the same 4TB total capacity using 12TB of
> SSDs.
>
> I think Replica 3 is safe enough that you could forgo the RAID 10. But I'm
> talking from zero experience...  Would love others to chime in with their
> opinions on both these setups.
>
> *Vincent Royer*
> *778-825-1057*
>
>
> 
> *SUSTAINABLE MOBILE ENERGY SOLUTIONS*
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Jayme  wrote:
>
>> Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?
>> I'm very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may
>> be, there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any
>> feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> You should be ok with the setup.
>>> I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size)
>>> with the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.
>>>
>>> Alex
>>>
>>> On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:
>>>
 I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a
 budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a
 couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.
 Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.

 3X of the following:

 Dell PowerEdge R720
 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
 256GB RAM
 PERC H710
 2x10GB Nic

 Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.

 Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10
 per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no
 arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
 hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just one?

 I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very
 difficult to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in
 hardware (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the
 performance will be adequate enough for my needs.

 I will be using an all ready existing Netgear XS716T 10GB switch for
 Gluster storage network.

 In addition I plan to build another simple glusterFS storage server
 that I can use to georeplicate the gluster volume to for DR purposes and
 use existing hardware to build an independent standby oVirt host that is
 able to start up a few high priority VMs from the georeplicated glusterFS
 volume if for some reason the primary oVirt cluster/glusterFS volume ever
 failed.

 I would love to hear any advice or critiques on this plan.

 Thanks!
 ___
 Users mailing list
 Users@ovirt.org
 http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users

>>>
>>
>> ___
>> Users mailing list
>> Users@ovirt.org
>> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>>
>>
>
> ___
> Users mailing list
> Users@ovirt.org
> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>
>
___
Users mailing list
Users@ovirt.org
http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users

Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Vincent Royer]

Jayme,

I'm doing a very similar build, the only difference really is I am using
SSDs instead of HDDs.   I have similar questions as you regarding expected
performance. Have you considered JBOD + NFS?   Putting a Gluster Replica 3
on top of RAID 10 arrays sounds very safe, but my gosh the capacity takes a
massive hit.  Am I correct in saying you will only get 4TB total usable
capacity out of 24TB worth of disks?  The cost per TB in that sort of
scenario is immense.

My plan is two 2TB SSDs per server in JBOD with a caching raid card, with
replica 3.  I would end up with the same 4TB total capacity using 12TB of
SSDs.

I think Replica 3 is safe enough that you could forgo the RAID 10. But I'm
talking from zero experience...  Would love others to chime in with their
opinions on both these setups.

*Vincent Royer*
*778-825-1057*



*SUSTAINABLE MOBILE ENERGY SOLUTIONS*




On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Jayme  wrote:

> Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?  I'm
> very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may be,
> there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any
> feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.
>
> On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> You should be ok with the setup.
>> I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size)
>> with the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.
>>
>> Alex
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:
>>
>>> I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a
>>> budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a
>>> couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.
>>> Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.
>>>
>>> 3X of the following:
>>>
>>> Dell PowerEdge R720
>>> 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
>>> 256GB RAM
>>> PERC H710
>>> 2x10GB Nic
>>>
>>> Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.
>>>
>>> Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10
>>> per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no
>>> arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
>>> hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just one?
>>>
>>> I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very
>>> difficult to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in
>>> hardware (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the
>>> performance will be adequate enough for my needs.
>>>
>>> I will be using an all ready existing Netgear XS716T 10GB switch for
>>> Gluster storage network.
>>>
>>> In addition I plan to build another simple glusterFS storage server that
>>> I can use to georeplicate the gluster volume to for DR purposes and use
>>> existing hardware to build an independent standby oVirt host that is able
>>> to start up a few high priority VMs from the georeplicated glusterFS volume
>>> if for some reason the primary oVirt cluster/glusterFS volume ever failed.
>>>
>>> I would love to hear any advice or critiques on this plan.
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>> ___
>>> Users mailing list
>>> Users@ovirt.org
>>> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>>>
>>
>
> ___
> Users mailing list
> Users@ovirt.org
> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>
>
___
Users mailing list
Users@ovirt.org
http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users

Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Jayme]

Thanks for your feedback.  Any other opinions on this proposed setup?  I'm
very torn over using GlusterFS and what the expected performance may be,
there seems to be little information out there.  Would love to hear any
feedback specifically from ovirt users on hyperconverged configurations.

On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:56 AM, Alex K  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> You should be ok with the setup.
> I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size) with
> the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.
>
> Alex
>
> On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:
>
>> I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a
>> budget).  I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a
>> couple of heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.
>> Some have a lot of small files from large github repos etc.
>>
>> 3X of the following:
>>
>> Dell PowerEdge R720
>> 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
>> 256GB RAM
>> PERC H710
>> 2x10GB Nic
>>
>> Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.
>>
>> Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10
>> per server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no
>> arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
>> hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just one?
>>
>> I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very difficult
>> to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in hardware
>> (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the performance
>> will be adequate enough for my needs.
>>
>> I will be using an all ready existing Netgear XS716T 10GB switch for
>> Gluster storage network.
>>
>> In addition I plan to build another simple glusterFS storage server that
>> I can use to georeplicate the gluster volume to for DR purposes and use
>> existing hardware to build an independent standby oVirt host that is able
>> to start up a few high priority VMs from the georeplicated glusterFS volume
>> if for some reason the primary oVirt cluster/glusterFS volume ever failed.
>>
>> I would love to hear any advice or critiques on this plan.
>>
>> Thanks!
>> ___
>> Users mailing list
>> Users@ovirt.org
>> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>>
>
___
Users mailing list
Users@ovirt.org
http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users

Re: [ovirt-users] Hardware critique

[Alex K]

Hi,

You should be ok with the setup.
I am running around 20 vms (linux and windows, small and medium size) with
the half of your specs. With 10G network replica 3 is ok.

Alex

On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 16:13 Jayme  wrote:

> I'm spec'ing hardware for a 3-node oVirt build (on somewhat of a budget).
> I plan to do 20-30 Linux VMs most of them very light weight + a couple of
> heavier hitting web and DB servers with frequent rsync backups.  Some have
> a lot of small files from large github repos etc.
>
> 3X of the following:
>
> Dell PowerEdge R720
> 2x 2.9 GHz 8 Core E5-2690 (SR0L0)
> 256GB RAM
> PERC H710
> 2x10GB Nic
>
> Boot/OS will likely be two cheaper small sata/ssd in raid 1.
>
> Gluster bricks comprised of 4x2TB WD Gold 7200RPM SATA HDDs in RAID 10 per
> server.  Using a replica 3 setup (and I'm thinking right now with no
> arbiter for extra redundancy, although I'm not sure what the performance
> hit may be as a result).  Will this allow for two host failure or just one?
>
> I've been really struggling with storage choices, it seems very difficult
> to predict the performance of glusterFS due to the variance in hardware
> (everyone is using something different).  I'm not sure if the performance
> will be adequate enough for my needs.
>
> I will be using an all ready existing Netgear XS716T 10GB switch for
> Gluster storage network.
>
> In addition I plan to build another simple glusterFS storage server that I
> can use to georeplicate the gluster volume to for DR purposes and use
> existing hardware to build an independent standby oVirt host that is able
> to start up a few high priority VMs from the georeplicated glusterFS volume
> if for some reason the primary oVirt cluster/glusterFS volume ever failed.
>
> I would love to hear any advice or critiques on this plan.
>
> Thanks!
> ___
> Users mailing list
> Users@ovirt.org
> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
>
___
Users mailing list
Users@ovirt.org
http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users