On Mar 9, 2006, at 12:19 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote:
See:
http://rael.berkeley.edu/EBAMM/ERG-NPR-letter-1-30-06.pdf
Farrell agrees with Pimentel that ethanol takes a lot of input
energy -- although he does not specify how much in this letter. He
says that Pimentel was wrong and that the
- Original Message -
From: Horace Heffner [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, March 10, 2006 12:01 PM
Subject: Re: Farrell responds to Pimentel regarding ethanol
On Mar 9, 2006, at 12:19 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote:
See:
http://rael.berkeley.edu/EBAMM/ERG-NPR-letter
Crop rotation fixes the nitrogen energy problem.
Using hybrid seed I had no problem getting 120 bushel/acre corn planted on
land that grew soybeans the year before.
I doubt the Amish in that northwester Pennsylvania area now, don't sweat it either.
PROTECTED]
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, March 10, 2006 1:25 PM
Subject: Re: Farrell responds to Pimentel regarding ethanol
Crop rotation fixes the nitrogen energy problem.
Using hybrid seed I had no problem getting 120 bushel/acre corn planted on
land that grew soybeans
-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, March 10, 2006 1:25 PM
Subject: Re: Farrell responds to Pimentel regarding ethanol
Crop rotation fixes the nitrogen energy problem.
Using hybrid seed I had no problem getting 120 bushel/acre corn planted
on
land that grew soybeans the year before.
I doubt
-Original Message-
From: Horace Heffner
Looking at Farrel's original article, I don't see any mention of the
energy required for soil restoration.
Wasn't it George Washington Carver that showed that certain tubers
actually restored nitrogen?
Peanuts!
Terry
-Original Message-
From: Michel Jullian
Thanks for the very documented enlightenment on air nitrogen fixing
plants (legumes), would there be a problem in using them directly as
biofuel convertible biomass do you think?
I guess I should read all the messages before posting.
of the
biofuel wheel? ;)
Michel
- Original Message -
From: Frederick Sparber [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, March 10, 2006 2:21 PM
Subject: Re: Farrell responds to Pimentel regarding ethanol
Michel Jullian writes:
Hi Fred (your reply-to pb isn't fixed BTW
-Original Message-
From: Frederick Sparber
Soydiesel from soybean crops is a hot item these days,
Michel.
My first wife was from Indiana. Interesting agriculture there. On
even years, corn is planted on the right and soybean on the left. Odd
years, vice versa.
Terry
Good point Horace.
- Original Message -
From: Horace Heffner [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, March 10, 2006 8:21 PM
Subject: Re: Farrell responds to Pimentel regarding ethanol
On Mar 10, 2006, at 4:57 AM, Michel Jullian wrote:
Again thanks for the teaching
Horace Heffner wrote
The problem with regard to nitrogen fixation and other soil depletion
is the not that it *can* be circumvented by judicious management, but
rather what *may* actually happen and what is actually proposed to
happen. For example, elephant grass is touted as the
Most of the studies I'm aware of discuss the manufacture of ethanol from
corn. I know first-hand of an interesting process that uses cellulose as
its feedstock. The reaction is via an enzyme that initially converts the
cellulose to sugar... then the normal fermentation process to ethanol.
responds to Pimentel regarding ethanol
Most of the studies I'm aware of discuss the manufacture of ethanol from
corn. I know first-hand of an interesting process that uses cellulose as
its feedstock. The reaction is via an enzyme that initially converts the
cellulose to sugar
Michel Jullian wrote:
I heard that the limit on biofuels is that they would require
devoting the entirety of our agricultural surfaces to the
corresponding cultivations if we wanted to run all our vehicles on them.
I have discussed that issue here before. Actually, it would take much
more
for their
photosynthesis, unlike fossil fuels which did so a very long time ago.
Michel
- Original Message - From: Philip Winestone
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Thursday, March 09, 2006 11:39 PM
Subject: Re: Farrell responds to Pimentel regarding ethanol
Most
Philip Winestone wrote:
Many energy expenditures occur, even/especially with oil-based
fuels. Imagine how much energy it takes to transport fuel from the
the wells to the refineries dotted about North America to the fuel
depots and then to the individual retail outlets.
Oil energy overhead
Philip Winestone wrote:
If all gasoline suppliers were to supplement their fuel with 10%
ethanol, that's simply 10% less gasoline used.
It is not that simple. The amount reduced would depend upon how much
oil is needed to produce the ethanol. That subject is sharply
disputed, but as far as
I wrote:
. . . no tractor or ethanol factory boiler is fired by ethanol, or
as all oil wells, refineries and tankers are powered by oil.
Meant: whereas all oil wells, refineries . . .
Sooner or later -- probably within 50 years -- oil production
overhead will exceed 100%. That is to say, it
Well, I keep saying it: no corn... only cellulose, preferably waste
cellulose, of which there's lots. So there's no question of starving. In
the ethanol manufacturing process, there's really only one main user of
energy, which is the distillation operation. In addition, because ethanol
forms
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