Re: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today

[Eric Walker]

I believe an oscilloscope can also be used to check for high-frequency
components in the input power waveform.

Eric

Re: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356 reactor today

[Adrian Ashfield]

Don;t know what all the fuss is about.  It easy enough to look at the signal 
with a good oscilloscope and see if there is likely to be a problem.
Seems to me the skeptics are busy looking for exotic ways to cheat so they can 
console themselves that it doesn't work even if me356's reactor actually does 
work.  Considering its ancestry I don't know know why Brian hasn't said it 
should be colored purple.
MFMP seem a competent bunch and short of seeing the actual test I have no 
reason to doubt their results. 

 

 

 

-Original Message-
From: Bob Higgins 
To: vortex-l 
Sent: Thu, May 25, 2017 3:39 pm
Subject: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356 reactor today




I do not believe the Aura device is a plasma electrolysis system.  I believe it 
is a Ni-H system with a dry reactor that is electrically stimulated.  The water 
is from cooling of the reactor.  MFMP will be measuring wall plug power as the 
input to the Aura device with two different power analyzers.  The wall plug 
power should not be as hard to measure as plasma electrolysis input power.


I agree that there are serious issues with measuring the power of a plasma 
electrolysis system by measuring voltage and current.  With the bubbles popping 
up and instantly changing the cell voltage and current, it doesn't surprise me 
in the least that ultrasound and low RF signals are detected.


I also agree that measuring steam accurately is an issue.  However, measuring 
steam via heat exchanger or by sparging the steam is conservative - if anything 
it will report less energy than actually exists in the steam (with any 
entrained hot water).  Thus, the COP measured would be lower than the actual 
device is producing.




On Thu, May 25, 2017 at 6:24 AM, Brian Ahern  wrote:


May I make a prediction?
When the COP is around 6-8 and the process is plasma  electrolysis, the input 
is invariably under reported.
The plasma is actually a series of sporadic arcs. Measuring the I(t)  and V(t) 
simultaneously is impossible for all but the most sophisticated test equipment.
If the plasma electrolysis is not in operation, but boiling is; then we face 
the issue of dry versus wet steam which causes errors consonant with a COp 
around 6-8.

From: Adrian Ashfield 
Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2017 3:53 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today
 

Four members of MFMP are in Czechoslovakia and starting to do a black box test 
of me356' reactor.
It is supposed to be similar to his previous model that has been running 
several months now.
 It was reported to be ~10 Kw with a COP >6.
  
See 
http://www.e-catworld.com/2017/05/23/mfmp-on-site-preparing-for-me356-testing/

Re: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today

[Jed Rothwell]

This wiring diagram shows the AURA Device plugged into something similar to
a "Kill A Watt" brand EZ Electricity Usage Monitor (power meter). Another
brand is the "Watts Up" meter. See:

https://www.amazon.com/P3-International-P4460-Electricity-Monitor/dp/B000RGF29Q/

Those gadgets are great because if me356 is playing some sort of stupid
game hiding electric power, the power meter will burn up. I am not
suggesting he is playing a game, but this meter ensures that he cannot.
Plus, you cannot install the meter incorrectly. The clip on meter shown
below this in the diagram might be clipped on wrong, but the plug-in one
cannot be wrong.

The product names are an added bonus. You gotta love "Kill A Watt" and
"Watts Up"!

- Jed

[Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356 reactor today

[Bob Higgins]

I do not believe the Aura device is a plasma electrolysis system.  I
believe it is a Ni-H system with a dry reactor that is electrically
stimulated.  The water is from cooling of the reactor.  MFMP will be
measuring wall plug power as the input to the Aura device with two
different power analyzers.  The wall plug power should not be as hard to
measure as plasma electrolysis input power.

I agree that there are serious issues with measuring the power of a plasma
electrolysis system by measuring voltage and current.  With the bubbles
popping up and instantly changing the cell voltage and current, it doesn't
surprise me in the least that ultrasound and low RF signals are detected.

I also agree that measuring steam accurately is an issue.  However,
measuring steam via heat exchanger or by sparging the steam is conservative
- if anything it will report less energy than actually exists in the steam
(with any entrained hot water).  Thus, the COP measured would be lower than
the actual device is producing.

On Thu, May 25, 2017 at 6:24 AM, Brian Ahern  wrote:

> May I make a prediction?
>
> When the COP is around 6-8 and the process is plasma  electrolysis, the
> input is invariably under reported.
>
> The plasma is actually a series of sporadic arcs. Measuring the I(t)  and
> V(t) simultaneously is impossible for all but the most sophisticated test
> equipment.
>
> If the plasma electrolysis is not in operation, but boiling is; then we
> face the issue of dry versus wet steam which causes errors consonant with a
> COp around 6-8.
> --
> *From:* Adrian Ashfield 
> *Sent:* Thursday, May 25, 2017 3:53 AM
> *To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
> *Subject:* [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today
>
> Four members of MFMP are in Czechoslovakia and starting to do a black box
> test of me356' reactor.
> It is supposed to be similar to his previous model that has been running
> several months now.
>  It was reported to be ~10 Kw with a COP >6.
>
> See http://www.e-catworld.com/2017/05/23/mfmp-on-site-
> preparing-for-me356-testing/
>

[Vo]:teslas

[Frank Znidarsic]

https://teslasforsustainablesociety.wordpress.com/tag/frank-znidarsic/

Re: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today

[Axil Axil]

 

On Thu, May 25, 2017 at 1:15 PM, Alain Sepeda 
wrote:

> Measuring rich HF signal power is tricky
>
> is it not more easy to measure power at the power supply input, adding
> good filters, and why not if paranoid an inverter/UPS or a good old
> predictable batteries ?
> You lose precision and performance, but at least you are sure it is not HF
> tricks..
>
>
>
> 2017-05-25 14:24 GMT+02:00 Brian Ahern :
>
>> May I make a prediction?
>>
>>
>> When the COP is around 6-8 and the process is plasma  electrolysis, the
>> input is invariably under reported.
>>
>>
>> The plasma is actually a series of sporadic arcs. Measuring the I(t)  and
>> V(t) simultaneously is impossible for all but the most sophisticated test
>> equipment.
>>
>> If the plasma electrolysis is not in operation, but boiling is; then we
>> face the issue of dry versus wet steam which causes errors consonant with a
>> COp around 6-8.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> *From:* Adrian Ashfield 
>> *Sent:* Thursday, May 25, 2017 3:53 AM
>> *To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
>> *Subject:* [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today
>>
>> Four members of MFMP are in Czechoslovakia and starting to do a black box
>> test of me356' reactor.
>> It is supposed to be similar to his previous model that has been running
>> several months now.
>>  It was reported to be ~10 Kw with a COP >6.
>>
>> See http://www.e-catworld.com/2017/05/23/mfmp-on-site-preparing-
>> for-me356-testing/
>>
>
>

Re: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today

[Alain Sepeda]

Measuring rich HF signal power is tricky

is it not more easy to measure power at the power supply input, adding good
filters, and why not if paranoid an inverter/UPS or a good old predictable
batteries ?
You lose precision and performance, but at least you are sure it is not HF
tricks..



2017-05-25 14:24 GMT+02:00 Brian Ahern :

> May I make a prediction?
>
>
> When the COP is around 6-8 and the process is plasma  electrolysis, the
> input is invariably under reported.
>
>
> The plasma is actually a series of sporadic arcs. Measuring the I(t)  and
> V(t) simultaneously is impossible for all but the most sophisticated test
> equipment.
>
> If the plasma electrolysis is not in operation, but boiling is; then we
> face the issue of dry versus wet steam which causes errors consonant with a
> COp around 6-8.
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> *From:* Adrian Ashfield 
> *Sent:* Thursday, May 25, 2017 3:53 AM
> *To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
> *Subject:* [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today
>
> Four members of MFMP are in Czechoslovakia and starting to do a black box
> test of me356' reactor.
> It is supposed to be similar to his previous model that has been running
> several months now.
>  It was reported to be ~10 Kw with a COP >6.
>
> See http://www.e-catworld.com/2017/05/23/mfmp-on-site-
> preparing-for-me356-testing/
>

Re: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today

[Axil Axil]

A heat exchanger avoids this wet steam issue.








On Thu, May 25, 2017 at 8:24 AM, Brian Ahern  wrote:

> May I make a prediction?
>
>
> When the COP is around 6-8 and the process is plasma  electrolysis, the
> input is invariably under reported.
>
>
> The plasma is actually a series of sporadic arcs. Measuring the I(t)  and
> V(t) simultaneously is impossible for all but the most sophisticated test
> equipment.
>
> If the plasma electrolysis is not in operation, but boiling is; then we
> face the issue of dry versus wet steam which causes errors consonant with a
> COp around 6-8.
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> *From:* Adrian Ashfield 
> *Sent:* Thursday, May 25, 2017 3:53 AM
> *To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
> *Subject:* [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today
>
> Four members of MFMP are in Czechoslovakia and starting to do a black box
> test of me356' reactor.
> It is supposed to be similar to his previous model that has been running
> several months now.
>  It was reported to be ~10 Kw with a COP >6.
>
> See http://www.e-catworld.com/2017/05/23/mfmp-on-site-
> preparing-for-me356-testing/
>

Fw: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today

[Brian Ahern]

From: Brian Ahern 
Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2017 8:24 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today


May I make a prediction?


When the COP is around 6-8 and the process is plasma  electrolysis, the input 
is invariably under reported.


The plasma is actually a series of sporadic arcs. Measuring the I(t)  and V(t) 
simultaneously is impossible for all but the most sophisticated test equipment.

If the plasma electrolysis is not in operation, but boiling is; then we face 
the issue of dry versus wet steam which causes errors consonant with a COp 
around 6-8.





From: Adrian Ashfield 
Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2017 3:53 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today

Four members of MFMP are in Czechoslovakia and starting to do a black box test 
of me356' reactor.
It is supposed to be similar to his previous model that has been running 
several months now.
 It was reported to be ~10 Kw with a COP >6.

See 
http://www.e-catworld.com/2017/05/23/mfmp-on-site-preparing-for-me356-testing/

Re: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today

[Brian Ahern]

May I make a prediction?


When the COP is around 6-8 and the process is plasma  electrolysis, the input 
is invariably under reported.


The plasma is actually a series of sporadic arcs. Measuring the I(t)  and V(t) 
simultaneously is impossible for all but the most sophisticated test equipment.

If the plasma electrolysis is not in operation, but boiling is; then we face 
the issue of dry versus wet steam which causes errors consonant with a COp 
around 6-8.





From: Adrian Ashfield 
Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2017 3:53 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today

Four members of MFMP are in Czechoslovakia and starting to do a black box test 
of me356' reactor.
It is supposed to be similar to his previous model that has been running 
several months now.
 It was reported to be ~10 Kw with a COP >6.

See 
http://www.e-catworld.com/2017/05/23/mfmp-on-site-preparing-for-me356-testing/

[Vo]:Measuring Spin

[Nigel Dyer]

I have been musing about spin and Leonard Susskinds lectures and books 
have got me thinking in a slightly different way:  There is very much 
LENR related, but I will start with a 'simple' question
In the Stern Gerlach experiment the act of 'measuring' the spin of the 
particle has an effect on the spin, in that the information about the 
spin in the non-measured axis has been destroyed.  In what sense has the 
state of the particles spin been changed and what mediates the change. 
Can it be thought of as in terms of a virtual photon exchange?.  I 
assume that overall there must be conservation of spin, so in what sense 
has the spin state of the rest of the system been changed?

Nigel

[Vo]: MFMP starting to test me356' reactor today

[Adrian Ashfield]

Four members of MFMP are in Czechoslovakia and starting to do a black box test 
of me356' reactor.
It is supposed to be similar to his previous model that has been running 
several months now.
 It was reported to be ~10 Kw with a COP >6.
  
See 
http://www.e-catworld.com/2017/05/23/mfmp-on-site-preparing-for-me356-testing/