Re: Fw: [Vo]:Interest in cold fusion has waned

[Che]

On Sun, Jul 9, 2017 at 2:26 AM, Kevin O'Malley  wrote:
>
> The classic case is the Aztecs.   They were taken out over a few short
months in a military engagement from a vastly outnumbered force, not by
disease.


There are a lot of factors involved in any historical developments -- most
all of them acting non-linearly. For instance, the spanish 'Conquista'
would not have proceeded as easily -- spectacularly -- as it did in México,
if the Aztecs were not actually holding a tenuous balance-of-power over
other, resentful peoples: who joined-in with the spanish to attack the
mexicas. The spanish had plenty of experience in intrigue and duplicity and
bribery, etc. Europa was full of it. The spanish had a well-blooded,
experienced military structure, having begun in Afrika and the Canary
Islands... etc. The balance of forces _favored_ any powerful outsider
coming in to stir things up.

So if the Aztecs had been in a stronger position -- the Conquista would
have taken a different course; but the outcome would *still* have been much
the same, in the end. At a longer, larger scale (i.e., the spanish might
not have gotten such a large empire out of the process, etc.)



>
>
> On Sat, Jul 8, 2017 at 5:20 AM, Brian Ahern  wrote:
>>
>> The Spanish had cholera. It was 100 times as effective as gunpowder.

Re: Fw: [Vo]:Interest in cold fusion has waned

[Kevin O'Malley]

The classic case is the Aztecs.   They were taken out over a few short
months in a military engagement from a vastly outnumbered force, not by
disease.

On Sat, Jul 8, 2017 at 5:20 AM, Brian Ahern  wrote:

> The Spanish had cholera. It was 100 times as effective as gunpowder.
>
>
> --
> *From:* Kevin O'Malley 
> *Sent:* Friday, July 7, 2017 7:04 PM
> *To:* vortex-l
> *Subject:* Re: [Vo]:Interest in cold fusion has waned
>
> One of the cool things about cold fusion in a 500 year outlook is that it
> makes for a very ineffective weapon.   Even fire is a more effective weapon.
>
> You know why potatoes became a crop of choice in Europe?   Because when a
> king's army sieged your castle and burned your crops, there were still
> potatoes in the ground that you could eat and you wouldn't starve to death.
>
>
> Why did the Spanish overtake a continent with a few thousand men while the
> Vikings were vanquished 500 years earlier?   Because the Spanish had
> FIREarms.   They had harnessed gunpowder (for evil purposes, albeit).
>
> In 500 years there will be LENR cars, widespread cheap desalination, and
> Cold Fusion powered spacecraft.
>
> On Fri, Jul 7, 2017 at 1:18 PM, Jed Rothwell 
> wrote:
>
>> I wrote:
>>
>>
>>> If I succeed at promoting cold fusion and it becomes generally used, I
>>> shall play an important role in changing the world more than Marxism and
>>> Capitalism combined.
>>>
>>
>> That sounds like hyperbole, but I mean it. I think that Marxism and
>> capitalism are both on their way out. As we have discussed here, I think
>> robots and intelligent computers will compel us to adapt a new form of
>> economy that is neither capitalist or communist.
>>
>> Capitalism began around the year 1500, gradually replacing feudalism.
>> Communism began around 1850. Both are now in their twilight. I expect that
>> by 2100 we will have a new economic system. Unlike every previous system it
>> will not mainly depend on the exchange of human labor for goods and
>> services. It remains to be seen what it will be like. I hope it will be
>> better for everyone, and better for the ecology, but you never know how
>> things will turn out.
>>
>> If cold fusion succeeds I expect it will last much longer than 500 years,
>> and ultimately it will have a larger impact than capitalism had. If the
>> human race survives for millions of years -- as I hope it will -- over the
>> next few million years cold fusion should have roughly the same impact as
>> the discovery of fire. Unless something better is discovered.
>>
>> People who have not read history have the notion that institutions such
>> as capitalism, nation states, universities, corporations and so on have
>> been part of society forever and they will always be with us. Actually,
>> they are recent inventions and there is no reason to think they will
>> continue centuries into the future. They will continue as long as people
>> find them useful.
>>
>> - Jed
>>
>>
>

Re: Fw: [Vo]:Interest in cold fusion has waned

[Daniel Rocha]

Wasn't it small pox and other viral infections? And yes, it was a non
intended conquering, the same happened in pacific islands, or any place
that did not have contacts with Europe since the ice age. Though, it was
only a matter of time, just like anywhere else in the world. If you go to
places where theses civilizations lived, people do have a phenotype which
is like those of natives. Contrast that with places where there wasn't
civilizations, such South America outside the Andes. People do tend to look
far less native American than anywhere else. I think the death was much
more limited then though, but enough to speed their demise.


2017-07-08 9:20 GMT-03:00 Brian Ahern :

> The Spanish had cholera. It was 100 times as effective as gunpowder.
> --
>
-- 
Daniel Rocha - RJ
danieldi...@gmail.com

Fw: [Vo]:Interest in cold fusion has waned

[Brian Ahern]

The Spanish had cholera. It was 100 times as effective as gunpowder.



From: Kevin O'Malley 
Sent: Friday, July 7, 2017 7:04 PM
To: vortex-l
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Interest in cold fusion has waned

One of the cool things about cold fusion in a 500 year outlook is that it makes 
for a very ineffective weapon.   Even fire is a more effective weapon.

You know why potatoes became a crop of choice in Europe?   Because when a 
king's army sieged your castle and burned your crops, there were still potatoes 
in the ground that you could eat and you wouldn't starve to death.

Why did the Spanish overtake a continent with a few thousand men while the 
Vikings were vanquished 500 years earlier?   Because the Spanish had FIREarms.  
 They had harnessed gunpowder (for evil purposes, albeit).

In 500 years there will be LENR cars, widespread cheap desalination, and Cold 
Fusion powered spacecraft.

On Fri, Jul 7, 2017 at 1:18 PM, Jed Rothwell 
> wrote:
I wrote:

If I succeed at promoting cold fusion and it becomes generally used, I shall 
play an important role in changing the world more than Marxism and Capitalism 
combined.

That sounds like hyperbole, but I mean it. I think that Marxism and capitalism 
are both on their way out. As we have discussed here, I think robots and 
intelligent computers will compel us to adapt a new form of economy that is 
neither capitalist or communist.

Capitalism began around the year 1500, gradually replacing feudalism. Communism 
began around 1850. Both are now in their twilight. I expect that by 2100 we 
will have a new economic system. Unlike every previous system it will not 
mainly depend on the exchange of human labor for goods and services. It remains 
to be seen what it will be like. I hope it will be better for everyone, and 
better for the ecology, but you never know how things will turn out.

If cold fusion succeeds I expect it will last much longer than 500 years, and 
ultimately it will have a larger impact than capitalism had. If the human race 
survives for millions of years -- as I hope it will -- over the next few 
million years cold fusion should have roughly the same impact as the discovery 
of fire. Unless something better is discovered.

People who have not read history have the notion that institutions such as 
capitalism, nation states, universities, corporations and so on have been part 
of society forever and they will always be with us. Actually, they are recent 
inventions and there is no reason to think they will continue centuries into 
the future. They will continue as long as people find them useful.

- Jed