[whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Edward O'Connor
Hi, When authors adapt their sites for high-resolution displays such as the iPhone's Retina display, they often need to be able to use different assets representing the same image. Doing this for content images in HTML is currently much more of a pain than it is in CSS (and it can be a pain in

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Aryeh Gregor
On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 10:58 AM, Edward O'Connor eocon...@apple.com wrote: The srcset= attribute takes as its argument a simplified variant of the image-set() microsyntax[2]. It would look something like this: img src=foo-lores.jpg     srcset=foo-hires.jpg 2x, foo-superduperhires.jpg 6.5x  

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Edward O'Connor
Aryeh wrote: I'd like to throw in another use-case that might be addressable by the same feature: allowing Save As... to save a different version of the image (e.g., higher-res) than is actually displayed. […] Another obvious use-case I'd like to point out is print. Yes, these are both

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Aryeh Gregor
On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 2:44 PM, Edward O'Connor eocon...@apple.com wrote: I'm not sure about this one. If a browser doesn't support SVG, I want to be able to provide a bitmap fallback regardless of how I included the SVG—in both the img src or inline svg element cases. img srcset isn't about

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Scott González
You should look into the previous discussions at http://www.w3.org/community/respimg/ There's also a prototype using media queries at https://github.com/scottjehl/picturefill. I realize you specifically said you think media queries don't solve all of the problems, but it seems worth looking at.

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Tab Atkins Jr.
This proposal has a similar issue to image-set() - if the 2x means twice the resolution (which it should), this will *not work by default*. If you make a 5 inch wide image and save it as 200dpi, when you send it to the browser its automatic size will be 10 inches wide. Browsers are constrained by

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Simon Pieters
On Thu, 10 May 2012 15:24:28 +0200, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: This proposal has a similar issue to image-set() - if the 2x means twice the resolution (which it should), this will *not work by default*. If you make a 5 inch wide image and save it as 200dpi, when you send it

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Edward O'Connor
Hi, This proposal has a similar issue to image-set() - if the 2x means twice the resolution (which it should), this will *not work by default*. Just a quick update for the list—Tab and I chatted about this F2F just now and we agree that there isn't really a problem here, so long as the spec

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Tab Atkins Jr.
On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 3:47 PM, Simon Pieters sim...@opera.com wrote: On Thu, 10 May 2012 15:24:28 +0200, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: CSS3 Images has the image-resolution property, which lets you tell the browser what resolution to display the image at (that is, how it should

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Mathew Marquis
On May 10, 2012, at 9:47 AM, Simon Pieters wrote: On Thu, 10 May 2012 15:24:28 +0200, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: This proposal has a similar issue to image-set() - if the 2x means twice the resolution (which it should), this will *not work by default*. If you make a 5

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Boris Zbarsky
On 5/10/12 10:19 AM, Mathew Marquis wrote: Hey guys. Don’t know if it’s too early to chime in with this, but we were told by some members of the Chrome team that any browser that supports DNS prefetching — including assets — wouldn’t consider “looking-ahead” on the img tag as an option. Why

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Simon Pieters
On Thu, 10 May 2012 16:19:13 +0200, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 3:47 PM, Simon Pieters sim...@opera.com wrote: On Thu, 10 May 2012 15:24:28 +0200, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: CSS3 Images has the image-resolution property, which lets

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Mathew Marquis
On May 10, 2012, at 8:36 AM, Scott González wrote: You should look into the previous discussions at http://www.w3.org/community/respimg/ There's also a prototype using media queries at https://github.com/scottjehl/picturefill. I realize you specifically said you think media queries don't

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Tab Atkins Jr.
On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 4:45 PM, Mathew Marquis m...@matmarquis.com wrote: On May 10, 2012, at 8:36 AM, Scott González wrote: You should look into the previous discussions at http://www.w3.org/community/respimg/ There's also a prototype using media queries at

Re: [whatwg] Proposal in supporting the writing of Arabizi

2012-05-10 Thread Sami Eljabali
On Tue, May 8, 2012 at 2:38 PM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: On Thu, 1 Dec 2011, Sami Eljabali wrote: There's a need for phonetic based keyboard support for Arabic speaking users on today's internet. There are two primary reasons for this: 1) Many Arabic speaking users don't surf

Re: [whatwg] Proposal: Add window.getLastError (or modify invocation arguments of window.onerror)

2012-05-10 Thread James Greene
In my opinion, adding the stack trace to the existing message would be messy, breaks existing developer expectations, and possibly even breaks backward compatibility of specific libraries/functions/monitoring/etc. in some more extreme situations. If we can't just have the Error object itself

Re: [whatwg] Proposal in supporting the writing of Arabizi

2012-05-10 Thread Ian Hickson
On Thu, 10 May 2012, Sami Eljabali wrote: I don't understand. Everybody has an operating system. Why would putting things in the operating system limit availability? Operating systems and their GUIs are responsible for almost everything that a browser does, at one level or another.

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Maciej Stachowiak
On May 10, 2012, at 6:24 AM, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: That all said, I don't like the 2x notation. It's declaring this image's resolution is twice that of a normal image. This has two problems. For one, we already have a unit that means that - the dppx unit. Using

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Maciej Stachowiak
On May 10, 2012, at 6:47 AM, Simon Pieters sim...@opera.com wrote: On Thu, 10 May 2012 15:24:28 +0200, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: For two, I'm not sure that it's particularly obvious that when you say 2x, you should make sure your image was saved as 196dpi. You have to

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Maciej Stachowiak
On May 10, 2012, at 7:26 AM, Boris Zbarsky bzbar...@mit.edu wrote: On 5/10/12 10:19 AM, Mathew Marquis wrote: Hey guys. Don’t know if it’s too early to chime in with this, but we were told by some members of the Chrome team that any browser that supports DNS prefetching — including assets

Re: [whatwg] Proposal in supporting the writing of Arabizi

2012-05-10 Thread Sami Eljabali
Because then they wouldn't be HMTL5 compliant vs not having a nifty feature. How would you push this forward being adopted? I'm mostly likely not thinking creatively enough. On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 12:38 PM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: On Thu, 10 May 2012, Sami Eljabali wrote: I

Re: [whatwg] Proposal in supporting the writing of Arabizi

2012-05-10 Thread Ryosuke Niwa
On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 1:28 PM, Sami Eljabali seljab...@gmail.com wrote: Because then they wouldn't be HMTL5 compliant vs not having a nifty feature. How would you push this forward being adopted? I'm mostly likely not thinking creatively enough. Why would it be a part of HTML5 if vendors

Re: [whatwg] Proposal in supporting the writing of Arabizi

2012-05-10 Thread Maciej Stachowiak
On May 10, 2012, at 12:00 PM, Sami Eljabali seljab...@gmail.com wrote: Good luck pushing Apple Microsoft in implementing this. If we create this as a tag then we'd push every OS vendor to support it. Mac OS X supports Arabic, Arabic - PC and Arabic - QWERTY input methods. If none of these

Re: [whatwg] Proposal in supporting the writing of Arabizi

2012-05-10 Thread Sami Eljabali
Will do! Thanks for the feedback, -Sami On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 1:41 PM, Maciej Stachowiak m...@apple.com wrote: On May 10, 2012, at 12:00 PM, Sami Eljabali seljab...@gmail.com wrote: Good luck pushing Apple Microsoft in implementing this. If we create this as a tag then we'd push

Re: [whatwg] Proposal in supporting the writing of Arabizi

2012-05-10 Thread Ian Hickson
On Thu, 10 May 2012, Sami Eljabali wrote: On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 12:38 PM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: On Thu, 10 May 2012, Sami Eljabali wrote: I don't understand. Everybody has an operating system. Why would putting things in the operating system limit availability?

[whatwg] source media attribute behavior, static or dynamic ?

2012-05-10 Thread Paul Adenot
Currently implementing the media attribute of the source element in Gecko, we are unsure about what the specification requires us to do there. Considering this example : video source src=lowres.webm media=max-width:500px source src=highres.webm /video what is the expected behavior of a

Re: [whatwg] source media attribute behavior, static or dynamic ?

2012-05-10 Thread Ian Hickson
On Thu, 10 May 2012, Paul Adenot wrote: The spec [1] says : Dynamically modifying a source element and its attribute when the element is already inserted in a video or audio element will have no effect. To change what is playing, just use the src attribute on the media element

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Kornel Lesiński
On Thu, 10 May 2012 16:02:22 +0100, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: I can’t second Scott’s suggestion enough. There is a ton of history and valuable conversation around this topic already in the Community Group, and we’ve been working with a couple of browser reps trying to get

Re: [whatwg] img srcset for responsive bitmapped content images

2012-05-10 Thread Kornel Lesiński
On Thu, 10 May 2012 21:18:41 +0100, Maciej Stachowiak m...@apple.com wrote: For two, I'm not sure that it's particularly obvious that when you say 2x, you should make sure your image was saved as 196dpi. You have to already know what the default resolution is. As well, I think that values

Re: [whatwg] source media attribute behavior, static or dynamic ?

2012-05-10 Thread Paul Adenot
As far as I can tell, the behaviour here is strictly and unambiguously defined, leaving only one possible interpretation, so it's not clear to me how to make it less ambiguous. Could you elaborate on what interpretations of the spec you think are possible? We have two possible

Re: [whatwg] source media attribute behavior, static or dynamic ?

2012-05-10 Thread Ian Hickson
On Thu, 10 May 2012, Paul Adenot wrote: As far as I can tell, the behaviour here is strictly and unambiguously defined, leaving only one possible interpretation, so it's not clear to me how to make it less ambiguous. Could you elaborate on what interpretations of the spec you think

Re: [whatwg] Proposal: Add window.getLastError (or modify invocation arguments of window.onerror)

2012-05-10 Thread Simon Pieters
On Thu, 10 May 2012 21:14:23 +0200, James Greene james.m.gre...@gmail.com wrote: In my opinion, adding the stack trace to the existing message would be messy, breaks existing developer expectations, and possibly even breaks backward compatibility of specific