Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] [Press] : The Economic Times : "Oral citations to be part of wikipedia entries"
The project page can be found here http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:Oral_Citations Discussions are currently happening on foundation-l mailing list http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2011-July/thread.html and respective language Wikipedias eg: Malayalam Wikipedia http://ml.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E0%B4%B5%E0%B4%BF%E0%B4%95%E0%B5%8D%E0%B4%95%E0%B4%BF%E0%B4%AA%E0%B5%80%E0%B4%A1%E0%B4%BF%E0%B4%AF:%E0%B4%B5%E0%B4%BE%E0%B4%AE%E0%B5%8A%E0%B4%B4%E0%B4%BF_%E0%B4%85%E0%B4%B5%E0%B4%B2%E0%B4%82%E0%B4%AC%E0%B4%82 I am planning to create a discussion page on English Wikipedia soon. Please join in the discussion. :) It will be great if other language Wikipedia discuss and evaluate the possibility of Oral citations. Btw note that *The Economic Times *story headline is slightly misleading and is the job of desk/editors as usual. But I am more than happy with the coverage they did on this. Regards Tinu Cherian On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 9:09 AM, Ashwin Baindur wrote: > Tinu, where is that long discussion thread to be found? > > Warm regards, > > Ashwin Baindur > -- > > > > On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 8:41 AM, CherianTinu Abraham < > tinucher...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Thanks Anirudh. >> >> Essentially we wanted a more balanced article this time, collating both >> sides of view. Oral citations is still much to be debated and discussed in >> the current form. >> >> Regards >> Tinu Cherian >> >> >> On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 8:34 AM, Anirudh Bhati wrote: >> >>> This is a well-rounded article. Thanks for posting, Tinu. >>> >>> Yours sincerely, >>> >>> Anirudh Bhati >>> >>> +855 975 529 803 >>> Skype: anirudhsbh >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 9:55 AM, CherianTinu Abraham < >>> tinucher...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> *The Economic Times : "Oral citations to be part of wikipedia entries"* http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/tech/internet/oral-citations-to-be-part-of-wikipedia-entries/articleshow/9728638.cms *When you set out to make the entire global knowledge base freely accessible , can you leave out subjects that find very little mention in print? The question posed by Bangalore based researcher Achal Prabhala, has kicked off a debate among Wikipedia editors, the volunteers behind world's largest encyclopedia . The collaborative online encyclopedia , supported by the non-profit Wikimedia Foundation, has over 19 million articles written by about 90,000 editors across the world. Achal began working on the problem in January 2011 and carried out a project called the Oral Citations to find ways to increase local language entries into Wikipedia . At the crux of the problem is the lack of printed material in local languages and for topics related to indigenous culture. Editors find it difficult to add articles because of the lack of citable material. * * * *Right now, the online encyclopedia relies heavily on published material like newspapers , journals and magazines for citations . However, when it comes to vernaculars , there is very little published material available and editors often find a huge amount of knowledge being left out defeating the entire objective of Wikipedia. Take for instance, Dabba Kali, a traditional game played in North Kerala is finds very little or almost no reference in citable sources. "But that's also an important part of culture," says Achal. "The sum of human knowledge is far greater than the sum of printed knowledge ," he argues. Of late, the Wikimedia foundation has been trying to make its projects more global. While this is relatively easy in developed countries with better infrastructure which generate a lot of citable material, the problem in developing and underdeveloped countries are acute. * * * *" Germany, whose entire population is a fraction of India's online population has a massive footprint on Wikipedia. While a country like India is behind. Why is that?" asks Achal. "Because there is a lot more published material which can be used for citations out there... maybe, because the people who made the project largely were from the Anglo European or Japanese world, there has been a conflation of the sum of human knowledge and sum of printed knowledge," says Achal who mainly works on intellectual property issues related to medicine. With Shiju Alex, a Malayalam Wikipedian , Mayur, one of the top 20 global contributors to the encyclopedia and Mohau Monaledi, a software developer from South Africa, Achal set out to find how easy it is to create original articles that discuss things that have not been discussed before and are particular to a linguistic culture. "We found that the citation rules are a huge problem. What do you do when the largest university library in S
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] [Press] : The Economic Times : "Oral citations to be part of wikipedia entries"
Tinu, where is that long discussion thread to be found? Warm regards, Ashwin Baindur -- On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 8:41 AM, CherianTinu Abraham wrote: > Thanks Anirudh. > > Essentially we wanted a more balanced article this time, collating both > sides of view. Oral citations is still much to be debated and discussed in > the current form. > > Regards > Tinu Cherian > > > On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 8:34 AM, Anirudh Bhati wrote: > >> This is a well-rounded article. Thanks for posting, Tinu. >> >> Yours sincerely, >> >> Anirudh Bhati >> >> +855 975 529 803 >> Skype: anirudhsbh >> >> >> On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 9:55 AM, CherianTinu Abraham < >> tinucher...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> >>> *The Economic Times : "Oral citations to be part of wikipedia entries"* >>> >>> http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/tech/internet/oral-citations-to-be-part-of-wikipedia-entries/articleshow/9728638.cms >>> >>> >>> *When you set out to make the entire global knowledge base freely >>> accessible , can you leave out subjects that find very little mention in >>> print? The question posed by Bangalore based researcher Achal Prabhala, >>> has kicked off a debate among Wikipedia editors, the volunteers behind >>> world's largest encyclopedia . The collaborative online encyclopedia , >>> supported by the non-profit Wikimedia Foundation, has over 19 million >>> articles written by about 90,000 editors across the world. Achal began >>> working on the problem in January 2011 and carried out a project called the >>> Oral Citations to find ways to increase local language entries into >>> Wikipedia . At the crux of the problem is the lack of printed material in >>> local languages and for topics related to indigenous culture. Editors find >>> it difficult to add articles because of the lack of citable material. * >>> * >>> * >>> *Right now, the online encyclopedia relies heavily on published material >>> like newspapers , journals and magazines for citations . However, when it >>> comes to vernaculars , there is very little published material available and >>> editors often find a huge amount of knowledge being left out defeating the >>> entire objective of Wikipedia. Take for instance, Dabba Kali, a traditional >>> game played in North Kerala is finds very little or almost no reference in >>> citable sources. "But that's also an important part of culture," says Achal. >>> "The sum of human knowledge is far greater than the sum of printed knowledge >>> ," he argues. Of late, the Wikimedia foundation has been trying to make its >>> projects more global. While this is relatively easy in developed countries >>> with better infrastructure which generate a lot of citable material, the >>> problem in developing and underdeveloped countries are acute. * >>> * >>> * >>> *" Germany, whose entire population is a fraction of India's online >>> population has a massive footprint on Wikipedia. While a country like India >>> is behind. Why is that?" asks Achal. "Because there is a lot more published >>> material which can be used for citations out there... maybe, because the >>> people who made the project largely were from the Anglo European or Japanese >>> world, there has been a conflation of the sum of human knowledge and sum of >>> printed knowledge," says Achal who mainly works on intellectual property >>> issues related to medicine. With Shiju Alex, a Malayalam Wikipedian , >>> Mayur, one of the top 20 global contributors to the encyclopedia and Mohau >>> Monaledi, a software developer from South Africa, Achal set out to find >>> how easy it is to create original articles that discuss things that have not >>> been discussed before and are particular to a linguistic culture. "We found >>> that the citation rules are a huge problem. What do you do when the largest >>> university library in South Africa has only 80 books in Sepedi, a South >>> African language spoken by five million people ? Of that, most are bibles >>> and dictionaries and fiction and poetry which is not good for citations," he >>> says. The situation is no different for Malayalam or Hindi. * >>> * >>> * >>> *In Kannur, the number of Malayalam books in the varsity library is not >>> more than 3,000. "A lot of that is also translation which don't contain >>> original Malayalam knowledge which don't deal with topics intrinsic to >>> Kerala," he said. He also points out a relatively newer problem: the rules >>> for citations were made a few years ago when social media was not big and >>> the Internet was different. While the Internet culture has changed, to >>> become a significant part of people's lives, the idea is to broaden the base >>> of citation "to reflect peoples lives more realistically ." So will this >>> change the way Wikipedia works? "This is a discussion within a community and >>> the desire is to take it to its logical conclusion. Now we want to know what >>> we can do around citations as a whole and depending on the input
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] [Press] : The Economic Times : "Oral citations to be part of wikipedia entries"
Thanks Anirudh. Essentially we wanted a more balanced article this time, collating both sides of view. Oral citations is still much to be debated and discussed in the current form. Regards Tinu Cherian On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 8:34 AM, Anirudh Bhati wrote: > This is a well-rounded article. Thanks for posting, Tinu. > > Yours sincerely, > > Anirudh Bhati > > +855 975 529 803 > Skype: anirudhsbh > > > On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 9:55 AM, CherianTinu Abraham < > tinucher...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> *The Economic Times : "Oral citations to be part of wikipedia entries"* >> >> http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/tech/internet/oral-citations-to-be-part-of-wikipedia-entries/articleshow/9728638.cms >> >> >> *When you set out to make the entire global knowledge base freely >> accessible , can you leave out subjects that find very little mention in >> print? The question posed by Bangalore based researcher Achal Prabhala, >> has kicked off a debate among Wikipedia editors, the volunteers behind >> world's largest encyclopedia . The collaborative online encyclopedia , >> supported by the non-profit Wikimedia Foundation, has over 19 million >> articles written by about 90,000 editors across the world. Achal began >> working on the problem in January 2011 and carried out a project called the >> Oral Citations to find ways to increase local language entries into >> Wikipedia . At the crux of the problem is the lack of printed material in >> local languages and for topics related to indigenous culture. Editors find >> it difficult to add articles because of the lack of citable material. * >> * >> * >> *Right now, the online encyclopedia relies heavily on published material >> like newspapers , journals and magazines for citations . However, when it >> comes to vernaculars , there is very little published material available and >> editors often find a huge amount of knowledge being left out defeating the >> entire objective of Wikipedia. Take for instance, Dabba Kali, a traditional >> game played in North Kerala is finds very little or almost no reference in >> citable sources. "But that's also an important part of culture," says Achal. >> "The sum of human knowledge is far greater than the sum of printed knowledge >> ," he argues. Of late, the Wikimedia foundation has been trying to make its >> projects more global. While this is relatively easy in developed countries >> with better infrastructure which generate a lot of citable material, the >> problem in developing and underdeveloped countries are acute. * >> * >> * >> *" Germany, whose entire population is a fraction of India's online >> population has a massive footprint on Wikipedia. While a country like India >> is behind. Why is that?" asks Achal. "Because there is a lot more published >> material which can be used for citations out there... maybe, because the >> people who made the project largely were from the Anglo European or Japanese >> world, there has been a conflation of the sum of human knowledge and sum of >> printed knowledge," says Achal who mainly works on intellectual property >> issues related to medicine. With Shiju Alex, a Malayalam Wikipedian , >> Mayur, one of the top 20 global contributors to the encyclopedia and Mohau >> Monaledi, a software developer from South Africa, Achal set out to find >> how easy it is to create original articles that discuss things that have not >> been discussed before and are particular to a linguistic culture. "We found >> that the citation rules are a huge problem. What do you do when the largest >> university library in South Africa has only 80 books in Sepedi, a South >> African language spoken by five million people ? Of that, most are bibles >> and dictionaries and fiction and poetry which is not good for citations," he >> says. The situation is no different for Malayalam or Hindi. * >> * >> * >> *In Kannur, the number of Malayalam books in the varsity library is not >> more than 3,000. "A lot of that is also translation which don't contain >> original Malayalam knowledge which don't deal with topics intrinsic to >> Kerala," he said. He also points out a relatively newer problem: the rules >> for citations were made a few years ago when social media was not big and >> the Internet was different. While the Internet culture has changed, to >> become a significant part of people's lives, the idea is to broaden the base >> of citation "to reflect peoples lives more realistically ." So will this >> change the way Wikipedia works? "This is a discussion within a community and >> the desire is to take it to its logical conclusion. Now we want to know what >> we can do around citations as a whole and depending on the inputs make it >> more concrete," he said. The project, however, has not been without its >> share of critics within the volunteer community. One of the longest running >> thread, in the recent history of the foundations public mailing list, >> debates the project with scathing criticism, supporting argum
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] [Press] : The Economic Times : "Oral citations to be part of wikipedia entries"
This is a well-rounded article. Thanks for posting, Tinu. Yours sincerely, Anirudh Bhati +855 975 529 803 Skype: anirudhsbh On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 9:55 AM, CherianTinu Abraham wrote: > > *The Economic Times : "Oral citations to be part of wikipedia entries"* > > http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/tech/internet/oral-citations-to-be-part-of-wikipedia-entries/articleshow/9728638.cms > > > *When you set out to make the entire global knowledge base freely > accessible , can you leave out subjects that find very little mention in > print? The question posed by Bangalore based researcher Achal Prabhala, > has kicked off a debate among Wikipedia editors, the volunteers behind > world's largest encyclopedia . The collaborative online encyclopedia , > supported by the non-profit Wikimedia Foundation, has over 19 million > articles written by about 90,000 editors across the world. Achal began > working on the problem in January 2011 and carried out a project called the > Oral Citations to find ways to increase local language entries into > Wikipedia . At the crux of the problem is the lack of printed material in > local languages and for topics related to indigenous culture. Editors find > it difficult to add articles because of the lack of citable material. * > * > * > *Right now, the online encyclopedia relies heavily on published material > like newspapers , journals and magazines for citations . However, when it > comes to vernaculars , there is very little published material available and > editors often find a huge amount of knowledge being left out defeating the > entire objective of Wikipedia. Take for instance, Dabba Kali, a traditional > game played in North Kerala is finds very little or almost no reference in > citable sources. "But that's also an important part of culture," says Achal. > "The sum of human knowledge is far greater than the sum of printed knowledge > ," he argues. Of late, the Wikimedia foundation has been trying to make its > projects more global. While this is relatively easy in developed countries > with better infrastructure which generate a lot of citable material, the > problem in developing and underdeveloped countries are acute. * > * > * > *" Germany, whose entire population is a fraction of India's online > population has a massive footprint on Wikipedia. While a country like India > is behind. Why is that?" asks Achal. "Because there is a lot more published > material which can be used for citations out there... maybe, because the > people who made the project largely were from the Anglo European or Japanese > world, there has been a conflation of the sum of human knowledge and sum of > printed knowledge," says Achal who mainly works on intellectual property > issues related to medicine. With Shiju Alex, a Malayalam Wikipedian , > Mayur, one of the top 20 global contributors to the encyclopedia and Mohau > Monaledi, a software developer from South Africa, Achal set out to find > how easy it is to create original articles that discuss things that have not > been discussed before and are particular to a linguistic culture. "We found > that the citation rules are a huge problem. What do you do when the largest > university library in South Africa has only 80 books in Sepedi, a South > African language spoken by five million people ? Of that, most are bibles > and dictionaries and fiction and poetry which is not good for citations," he > says. The situation is no different for Malayalam or Hindi. * > * > * > *In Kannur, the number of Malayalam books in the varsity library is not > more than 3,000. "A lot of that is also translation which don't contain > original Malayalam knowledge which don't deal with topics intrinsic to > Kerala," he said. He also points out a relatively newer problem: the rules > for citations were made a few years ago when social media was not big and > the Internet was different. While the Internet culture has changed, to > become a significant part of people's lives, the idea is to broaden the base > of citation "to reflect peoples lives more realistically ." So will this > change the way Wikipedia works? "This is a discussion within a community and > the desire is to take it to its logical conclusion. Now we want to know what > we can do around citations as a whole and depending on the inputs make it > more concrete," he said. The project, however, has not been without its > share of critics within the volunteer community. One of the longest running > thread, in the recent history of the foundations public mailing list, > debates the project with scathing criticism, supporting arguments and > balanced suggestions . * > * > * > *For instance, Ziko van Dijk, a Wikimedian from Netherlands, writes: "So, > when someone believes that those "accessible printed sources" are "biased" , > he comes up with the video of his grand uncle telling the truth? I don't > think that it fits into the scope of Wikimedia. It certainly does not fit > into the scope of Wiki
