Re: [WISPA] Could Radio Waves Replace Fiber?
There is no advantage for wisps in what was written in the article. In general we're limited by Nyquist's and associated theorems which predict the maximum amount of data we can put into a given wavelength band. That hasn't changed. The speed of light in fiber is NOT why fiber has an advantage over a WISP. The only possible reason (slightly hinted at by the statement that pulsar light travels farther than expected) that I could see this being of interest for a WISP is if radio waves generated thusly don't follow normal 1/r^2 propagation patterns like a point source does. Also, light *does* have (if I remember correctly) a near-field fall- off pattern that doesn't fall off as 1/r^2. Unfortunately, it falls off faster in the near-field. It's not really clear (and I didn't feel like following it up) what he really did. There's always the spooky action at a distance phenomena whereby it seems that you can send information faster than the speed of light by using paired spins (observing one automatically forces the opposite spin instantaneously on the second one regardless of how far away it is). But getting high data throughputs on something like that is probably centuries away ;-). Also, I seem to recall that not 'faster' than the speed of light means speed of light in a vacuum. I think it's possible even in the mundane world to go faster than the speed of light if the light isn't in a vacuum. A few years ago photons were even essentially stopped for some period of time. I don't actually remember the math for this at the moment (and again, I don't feel like looking it up), but I believe Einstein's equations do not say nothing can go faster than light. They say anything slower than the speed of light can never reach the speed of light in a vacuum while anything faster than the speed of light can never slow down to the speed of light in a vacuum. Chuck On Jun 30, 2009, at 8:20 PM, Tom DeReggi wrote: Really cool! Except, Singleton started to lose me when he gave hypothetical uses for the technology. Why does radiowaves have to go the speed if light, for it to pin point a tumor inches away, or why would a pencil beam be more benefical for satelite cell phone technology. Somewhat clueless examples. I will say, millimeter wave technology is already being used for medical uses like pinpointing tumors, but it doesn't need to go the speed of light. Now If they were to use that speed of light pencil beam for my Network Backbone... That would be cluefull :-) As for... Can radiowaves replace fiber? Well, the problem is not just getting waves to travel the speed of light. The problem is whether enough of the wave detail can be received, a long enough distance, without errors and distortion, for it to be useful and reliable. It can be challenging when the medium (air, rain, wood, etc) in which the radiowave travels through is not a constant, compared to fiber and wire technologies which are more consistent mediums for passing electricity or light. It will be interesting to follow Singleton's work. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com To: 'Motorola Canopy User Group' motor...@wispa.org; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 3:43 PM Subject: [WISPA] Could Radio Waves Replace Fiber? http://current.com/items/90301786_scientists-make-radio-waves-travel-faster- than-light.htm Victoria Proffer - CEO http://stlbroadband.com/ StLouisBroadband.com 314.974.5600 SBA Certified WOSB - SBA 8 (a) Certification - in process. STLBBLogo WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 If all is not lost, where is it? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] Could Radio Waves Replace Fiber?
Now, that was an interesting reply :-) general we're limited by Nyquist's and associated theorems which predict the maximum amount of data we can put into a given wavelength band. That hasn't changed I agree we might not be able to increase the amount of data in the wavelength, however we can't forget the concept of time space. If a wave goes faster than the speed of light, we first have to understand why amd what method made that possible, to understand how we can exploit it. For example, lets say it was only theoreticly possible to send 100 units of whatever in a given time with standard process. And lets say this new process beating the speed of light now allowed 100 units to be sent 4 times faster to its destination. Even if more data could not be theoretically fit into the send (wave), it might be possible to replicate the task 4 times, via the new process, in the same time space as the old process. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Chuck Bartosch ch...@clarityconnect.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 8:10 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Could Radio Waves Replace Fiber? There is no advantage for wisps in what was written in the article. In general we're limited by Nyquist's and associated theorems which predict the maximum amount of data we can put into a given wavelength band. That hasn't changed. The speed of light in fiber is NOT why fiber has an advantage over a WISP. The only possible reason (slightly hinted at by the statement that pulsar light travels farther than expected) that I could see this being of interest for a WISP is if radio waves generated thusly don't follow normal 1/r^2 propagation patterns like a point source does. Also, light *does* have (if I remember correctly) a near-field fall- off pattern that doesn't fall off as 1/r^2. Unfortunately, it falls off faster in the near-field. It's not really clear (and I didn't feel like following it up) what he really did. There's always the spooky action at a distance phenomena whereby it seems that you can send information faster than the speed of light by using paired spins (observing one automatically forces the opposite spin instantaneously on the second one regardless of how far away it is). But getting high data throughputs on something like that is probably centuries away ;-). Also, I seem to recall that not 'faster' than the speed of light means speed of light in a vacuum. I think it's possible even in the mundane world to go faster than the speed of light if the light isn't in a vacuum. A few years ago photons were even essentially stopped for some period of time. I don't actually remember the math for this at the moment (and again, I don't feel like looking it up), but I believe Einstein's equations do not say nothing can go faster than light. They say anything slower than the speed of light can never reach the speed of light in a vacuum while anything faster than the speed of light can never slow down to the speed of light in a vacuum. Chuck On Jun 30, 2009, at 8:20 PM, Tom DeReggi wrote: Really cool! Except, Singleton started to lose me when he gave hypothetical uses for the technology. Why does radiowaves have to go the speed if light, for it to pin point a tumor inches away, or why would a pencil beam be more benefical for satelite cell phone technology. Somewhat clueless examples. I will say, millimeter wave technology is already being used for medical uses like pinpointing tumors, but it doesn't need to go the speed of light. Now If they were to use that speed of light pencil beam for my Network Backbone... That would be cluefull :-) As for... Can radiowaves replace fiber? Well, the problem is not just getting waves to travel the speed of light. The problem is whether enough of the wave detail can be received, a long enough distance, without errors and distortion, for it to be useful and reliable. It can be challenging when the medium (air, rain, wood, etc) in which the radiowave travels through is not a constant, compared to fiber and wire technologies which are more consistent mediums for passing electricity or light. It will be interesting to follow Singleton's work. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com To: 'Motorola Canopy User Group' motor...@wispa.org; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 3:43 PM Subject: [WISPA] Could Radio Waves Replace Fiber? http://current.com/items/90301786_scientists-make-radio-waves-travel-faster- than-light.htm Victoria Proffer - CEO http://stlbroadband.com/ StLouisBroadband.com 314.974.5600 SBA Certified WOSB - SBA 8 (a) Certification - in process. STLBBLogo
[WISPA] Could Radio Waves Replace Fiber?
http://current.com/items/90301786_scientists-make-radio-waves-travel-faster- than-light.htm Victoria Proffer - CEO http://stlbroadband.com/ StLouisBroadband.com 314.974.5600 SBA Certified WOSB - SBA 8 (a) Certification - in process. STLBBLogo image001.jpg WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Could Radio Waves Replace Fiber?
Really cool! Except, Singleton started to lose me when he gave hypothetical uses for the technology. Why does radiowaves have to go the speed if light, for it to pin point a tumor inches away, or why would a pencil beam be more benefical for satelite cell phone technology. Somewhat clueless examples. I will say, millimeter wave technology is already being used for medical uses like pinpointing tumors, but it doesn't need to go the speed of light. Now If they were to use that speed of light pencil beam for my Network Backbone... That would be cluefull :-) As for... Can radiowaves replace fiber? Well, the problem is not just getting waves to travel the speed of light. The problem is whether enough of the wave detail can be received, a long enough distance, without errors and distortion, for it to be useful and reliable. It can be challenging when the medium (air, rain, wood, etc) in which the radiowave travels through is not a constant, compared to fiber and wire technologies which are more consistent mediums for passing electricity or light. It will be interesting to follow Singleton's work. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com To: 'Motorola Canopy User Group' motor...@wispa.org; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 3:43 PM Subject: [WISPA] Could Radio Waves Replace Fiber? http://current.com/items/90301786_scientists-make-radio-waves-travel-faster- than-light.htm Victoria Proffer - CEO http://stlbroadband.com/ StLouisBroadband.com 314.974.5600 SBA Certified WOSB - SBA 8 (a) Certification - in process. STLBBLogo WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
