Re: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
Michael Erskine (804) 436-9428 wrote: LOL. I see I ruffled a few feathers. Of course that works both ways. You kind of like that. I guess you didn't actually read the FAQ or you would understand how it was actually realized. The last markup on the WISPA FAQ was done by the FBIs CALEA attorney. Yes. I did. The version out at http://www.wispa.org/?page_id=22 is dated March 27. And no where in there does it say anything about written by the FBI. It says reviewed by numerous people. Don't you suppose if we had any worries at this point that we would be in here telling you the sky was falling ourselves? Perhaps it is the carefree, don't worry about compliance attitude that makes me think that the grasp you have on the subject differs from the grasp other folks I have talked to (at the DOJ, at the FCC, with TTP's) have. At least the TTP's will tell you that it's an experiment. We don't know for sure it will work. There are many working parts and no one covers all of them. The only one with a tested product is Solera who has real-world experience doing this at the Winter Olympics alongside the Feds. And even their box is just DPI. That's only 1/3 of the solution. (Plans Process being another third; filtering and transfer to the LEA per the court order the final third). And people want a solution. You say it would be $200, but you don't say how, why, what. Read the FAQ. Read the FAQ. It's easy. I am still getting calls from people who are just finding out; have not filed any forms yet; and have no idea how to be compliant. Am I selling a solution? No. In fact, I have spent hours researching CALEA so ISPs' that I deal with can be compliant and rest easy. It is unlikely that a business only ISP will see a warrant, since most criminals sit at home. So Resi based WISP's will LIKELY see a warrant, because local, county and state police will have a new tool next week. (This from the DOJ, btw). And what is the majority of this list? Resi. So who will likely see a warrant? List members. You try to get people to pay attention and follow the rules and move the industry forward and it's nothing but arguing, name calling, and other bull shit. Good luck! Regards, Peter Radizeski RAD-INFO, Inc. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
Bravo Michael. Ezlinx.net, Inc. Jack Weinberg 69 Public Square, 14th Floor Wilkes-Barre, PA 18701 ph: 1-866-439-5469 1-570-823-9804 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Erskine Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2007 10:08 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale? Matt; This is going to be a bit rough but I feel the need to call a this as I see it. You are running roughshod on a lot of people with your fear mongering and it needs to be called into the open. So... In discussions with others it has come to my attention that several companies are looking to exit the business for various reasons not the least of which is CALEA. If you're serious about exploring an exit, contact me offlist. I am interested in a variety of optionsfrom taking a controlling interest to an outright cash buyout. I don't want to sound like a vulture, but ... ... but you most certainly do sound like a vulture ... What makes you such an authority on CALEA, Matt? What qualifications or experience with CALEA do you bring to the table that give credence to the fear that you are mongering on this list? Purchasing compliance does not constitute authoritative knowledge. Most ISPs will be able to satisfy the CALEA requirements for less than $200.00. Yep, that is what I said. When the WISPA Standard gets blessed, and I did say when, there will be an open source implementation. It will provide safe harbor and it will run on low end hardware. Having had the personal experience of working with the LEAs a number of times since about 1990 I feel perfectly comfortable in expressing my dismay at the egregious misinformation and negative speculation you have posted on this list. CALEA compliance is only going to be a problem for those WISPs who refuse to do due diligence in coming to compliance. Honestly Matt, what you have demonstrated on this list is that you have a talent for fear mongering and then exploiting the poor gullible people who bought into that fear mongering. Mind you that is only my opinion, but I am keeping it. I strongly encourage anyone who is currently in fear of CALEA to just go reread the FAQ. Read it critically, ensure that you have filed your documents thru Kris to the FBI. Then relax. The FBI is working very well with the committee. Progress is being made very quickly on a tough problem. Just relax people. Don't make a stupid mistake based upon pure horse hockey and spin which only serves to benefit those who would exploit your fear. If you want to sell, don't let CALEA compliance be any part of your decision. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.5/793 - Release Date: 5/7/2007 2:55 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.5/793 - Release Date: 5/7/2007 2:55 PM -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
Michael Erskine wrote: What makes you such an authority on CALEA, Matt? What qualifications or experience with CALEA do you bring to the table that give credence to the fear that you are mongering on this list? Purchasing compliance does not constitute authoritative knowledge. For one, we are actually CALEA compliant. Getting there required understanding the requirements, speaking with our attorney, and working with our vendors. We did this months ago as a necessary and timely thing to knock out. Since that time we have watched people who aren't compliant act as authorities on the subject. So back at you... What qualifications or experience with CALEA do you bring to the table? BTW, working experience with LEAs doesn't mean much since CALEA as it is being applied to ISPs is entirely new and no one has experience with it. Most ISPs will be able to satisfy the CALEA requirements for less than $200.00. Yep, that is what I said. When the WISPA Standard gets blessed, and I did say when, there will be an open source implementation. It will provide safe harbor and it will run on low end hardware. Having had the personal experience of working with the LEAs a number of times since about 1990 I feel perfectly comfortable in expressing my dismay at the egregious misinformation and negative speculation you have posted on this list. CALEA compliance is only going to be a problem for those WISPs who refuse to do due diligence in coming to compliance. Today is May 9th and your discussing a standard that doesn't exist and hasn't be approved. What happens to all the ISPs waiting on WISPAs standard come Monday? Should they just be non-compliant and wait for your solution? Further, while you are dismayed why don't you point out what misinformation and negative speculation I have posted. Honestly Matt, what you have demonstrated on this list is that you have a talent for fear mongering and then exploiting the poor gullible people who bought into that fear mongering. Exactly how? -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
Mike, Somehow, after speaking with 5 of the Mediation companies, including the only one to date that has actually done monitoring with the FBI, I don't think $200 will be a solution. The problem is that most people get their (dis)information from lists from people like me, Matt, and Marlon - all third hand (in court they call this hearsay). Yet no one wants to speak with a lawyer about this... it surprises me. Then I remember that this is the ISP industry, known for burying its head in the sand and using the H.O.P.E. strategy. Mike, I tried to check the references for the people who wrote the FAQ. Uh. You guys have no more experience than Matt or me or Marlon. I have spoken with the DOJ and the FCC. You say they give Guidance. I say that they will vaguely answer your questions and tell you to re-read the CALEA Order and CFR. The problem is not the data capture for broadband. That is the Easy part. It is the chain of evidence piece. The securing the data. The transparency to the perp and your staff. The transferring the data cleanly to the LEA. File your compliance plan, because that is where they will get you. Then if ever given a court order, follow the plan to the letter. Even the TTP only does so much. And is not liable. This isn't one of those issues you can scan and worry about later, unless you have worked with LEA (like Matt) or have 100% business clients. Because let's face it, most subpoenas are going to be for someone's home. It would be a rare instance when someone would be sitting at the office downloading child porn or planning a crime. Is there FUD? Sure. Why? Mainly because no one wants to take the time to do their own Due Diligence or talk to an Authority. They want the Cliff Notes from the list. No such thing in this case. Are there WISP's for sale? Oh yeah. Before the CALEA thing. But a couple I have spoken with want out now more than before. So is it a good time to buy? Sure. Is Matt a vulture? He comes off a little brusque, but if people want to execute an exit strategy, he is offering a path. Hey. Who's to say that your $200 CALEA plan won't result in millions in fines? Can you guarantee that, Mike? I doubt it. Can Open CALEA with all the resources of Merit Networks? Nope. Can any of the TTP's? Maybe Verisign or Neustar. So file your plan. It's due before Monday (5 copies). Go to a meeting and talk with a CALEA expert or Attorney. Stop getting legal advice from amateurs like us. If there is enough interest, I can get Chris Savage's law firm to do another QA tele-seminar or maybe Kris Twomey will do one. Regards, Peter @ RAD-INFO, Inc. Michael Erskine wrote: Matt; This is going to be a bit rough but I feel the need to call a this as I see it. You are running roughshod on a lot of people with your fear mongering and it needs to be called into the open. So... In discussions with others it has come to my attention that several companies are looking to exit the business for various reasons not the least of which is CALEA. If you're serious about exploring an exit, contact me offlist. I am interested in a variety of options from taking a controlling interest to an outright cash buyout. I don't want to sound like a vulture, but ... ... but you most certainly do sound like a vulture ... What makes you such an authority on CALEA, Matt? What qualifications or experience with CALEA do you bring to the table that give credence to the fear that you are mongering on this list? Purchasing compliance does not constitute authoritative knowledge. Most ISPs will be able to satisfy the CALEA requirements for less than $200.00. Yep, that is what I said. When the WISPA Standard gets blessed, and I did say when, there will be an open source implementation. It will provide safe harbor and it will run on low end hardware. Having had the personal experience of working with the LEAs a number of times since about 1990 I feel perfectly comfortable in expressing my dismay at the egregious misinformation and negative speculation you have posted on this list. CALEA compliance is only going to be a problem for those WISPs who refuse to do due diligence in coming to compliance. Honestly Matt, what you have demonstrated on this list is that you have a talent for fear mongering and then exploiting the poor gullible people who bought into that fear mongering. Mind you that is only my opinion, but I am keeping it. I strongly encourage anyone who is currently in fear of CALEA to just go reread the FAQ. Read it critically, ensure that you have filed your documents thru Kris to the FBI. Then relax. The FBI is working very well with the committee. Progress is being made very quickly on a tough problem. Just relax people. Don't make a stupid mistake based upon pure horse hockey and spin which only serves to benefit those who would exploit your fear. If you want to sell, don't let CALEA compliance be any
RE: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
Man, go easy on the guy. His intentions, whether good or bad, was that of a capitalist. Here is my big hangup on this: It would be a two way negotiation, give these so-called VULTURE VICTIM'S the benefit of the doubt that they would have half a brain to know if they are getting screwed. They can walk away just as easy as Matt could retract his offer. It's called due dilligence. The bottom line is this: 1. If someone views CALEA as such a burden and they are incapable of doing the due diligence themselves and are so easily convinced that the sky is falling and that they want out, then Matt's offer would be welcome news. 2. If that's not the case, I am sure a conversation with Matt about fair market value, or PARTNERSHIP oppurtunities for your orginazation wouldn't hurt either. As far as him exploting these people, it appeared to me that it was an open offer to all companies looking for an exit, not JUST because of CALEA. If you do not fall into one of the top two categories then do YOUR due diligence in finding your delete key. From what I have gathered and read, Matt is doing some pretty neat things in our industry. He also seems to be willing to take the time to actively participate in these lists, I've learnt a couple things from him reading his posts. Don't bother replying to me or attacking me, just remember who the real enemy is, and that for sure isn't your fellow WISP. We as people and as companies are all good at something, if we could just stop attacking each other and work together, man, immagine what we could do. -Russ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jack Weinberg Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 5:58 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: RE: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale? Bravo Michael. Ezlinx.net, Inc. Jack Weinberg 69 Public Square, 14th Floor Wilkes-Barre, PA 18701 ph: 1-866-439-5469 1-570-823-9804 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Erskine Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2007 10:08 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale? Matt; This is going to be a bit rough but I feel the need to call a this as I see it. You are running roughshod on a lot of people with your fear mongering and it needs to be called into the open. So... In discussions with others it has come to my attention that several companies are looking to exit the business for various reasons not the least of which is CALEA. If you're serious about exploring an exit, contact me offlist. I am interested in a variety of optionsfrom taking a controlling interest to an outright cash buyout. I don't want to sound like a vulture, but ... ... but you most certainly do sound like a vulture ... What makes you such an authority on CALEA, Matt? What qualifications or experience with CALEA do you bring to the table that give credence to the fear that you are mongering on this list? Purchasing compliance does not constitute authoritative knowledge. Most ISPs will be able to satisfy the CALEA requirements for less than $200.00. Yep, that is what I said. When the WISPA Standard gets blessed, and I did say when, there will be an open source implementation. It will provide safe harbor and it will run on low end hardware. Having had the personal experience of working with the LEAs a number of times since about 1990 I feel perfectly comfortable in expressing my dismay at the egregious misinformation and negative speculation you have posted on this list. CALEA compliance is only going to be a problem for those WISPs who refuse to do due diligence in coming to compliance. Honestly Matt, what you have demonstrated on this list is that you have a talent for fear mongering and then exploiting the poor gullible people who bought into that fear mongering. Mind you that is only my opinion, but I am keeping it. I strongly encourage anyone who is currently in fear of CALEA to just go reread the FAQ. Read it critically, ensure that you have filed your documents thru Kris to the FBI. Then relax. The FBI is working very well with the committee. Progress is being made very quickly on a tough problem. Just relax people. Don't make a stupid mistake based upon pure horse hockey and spin which only serves to benefit those who would exploit your fear. If you want to sell, don't let CALEA compliance be any part of your decision. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.5/793 - Release Date: 5/7/2007 2:55 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.5/793 - Release Date: 5/7/2007 2:55 PM -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless
Re: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
Isn't this what we filed on March 12? Or is something else due? File your compliance plan, because that is where they will get you. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
Jason wrote: Isn't this what we filed on March 12? Or is something else due? File your compliance plan, because that is where they will get you. If you filed the form 445 and SSI Plan, you are caught up with the paperwork. * Monitoring Reports (Due February 12, 2007) * Updates of Pending Section 107(c) Petitions (Due February 12, 2007) * System Security and Integrity Plans (Due March 12, 2007) -- Regards, Peter Radizeski RAD-INFO, Inc. - NSP Strategist We Help ISPs Connect Communicate 813.963.5884 http://www.marketingIDEAguy.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
Jason wrote: Isn't this what we filed on March 12? Or is something else due? File your compliance plan, because that is where they will get you. A lot of us at WISPA have hired Kris Twoomey to handle the CALEA filings for us. I'm not sure how much it costs, lawyers are never cheap, but I feel safer having an attorney that is FCC versed handing this type of thing. I also was happy to hear Michael Erskine's post seeing he is part of the WISPA/CALEA team. I sounds at least in part more reasonable. I'm feel if a wisp is moving forward with CALEA compliance in a professionals manor, he is fairly safe, as long as he really is performing. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
Peter R. wrote: Jason wrote: Isn't this what we filed on March 12? Or is something else due? File your compliance plan, because that is where they will get you. If you filed the form 445 and SSI Plan, you are caught up with the paperwork. That's just it; many people filled 445, but didn't file an SSI Plan. -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
George Rogato wrote: Jason wrote: Isn't this what we filed on March 12? Or is something else due? File your compliance plan, because that is where they will get you. A lot of us at WISPA have hired Kris Twoomey to handle the CALEA filings for us. I'm not sure how much it costs, lawyers are never cheap, but I feel safer having an attorney that is FCC versed handing this type of thing. I agree with that. Just remember though that just filing is only part of the compliance. A lawyer can't get you compliant; they can only help you with the paperwork. I also was happy to hear Michael Erskine's post seeing he is part of the WISPA/CALEA team. I sounds at least in part more reasonable. I'm feel if a wisp is moving forward with CALEA compliance in a professionals manor, he is fairly safe, as long as he really is performing. I think Peter's point is that if you don't file the necessary paperwork then there will be reason to come after you. Beyond that you will want safe harbor, which is the only way to protect you from liability. Kris or whoever your lawyer is can advise you on safe harbor. -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] RE: Are you for sale?
Matt is right about the importance of filling out both forms. If some of you have only completed your 445 but not your SSI then you need to email [EMAIL PROTECTED] or some other attorney and get it done. Kris Twomey handled both of these for many WISPA members recently (including me). If you only had one form completed you are not done. If you have not done either one then you REALLY need to get on the stick here and get this done. CALEA compliance is more than just waiting around for us to hand you a standard and then you're done. I am hoping Kris Twomey is here and can back this up with his thoughts about what is needed to date for meeting CALEA compliance. Then you do not have to take my word for it. You can hear it from a guy who works communications law all day long. Kris? Can you pass along your thoughts on the importance of filling out your forms? Scriv That's just it; many people filled 445, but didn't file an SSI Plan. -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
