Re: [WSG] Standards compliance and Autocomplete
2008/7/1 Patrick H. Lauke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Lisa Herrod wrote: > >> Just wondering if there is a standards compliant way of implementing >> 'autocomplete' on forms, which I believe is proprietry...? >> > > Not tested it, but...could you inject the autocomplete="off" via javascript > to the form element? Thanks Pat, yeah that's what I thought. I wanted confirmation from smart people like you though :) > If all else fails, I'd rather have an invalid attribute (with a good > rationale why it was used) that doesn't have adverse effects (as opposed to > invalid elements, which have the potential of messing up the DOM more > dramatically) any day if it actually provides an improvement to usability. > Yeah that's what I reckon too. if all else passes i can live with something like this. But I did want to see if there was anything out there before I went with it. Thanks for that ;) lisa -- Lisa Herrod Web Usability: User Experience Research, Consulting and Training Business: http://www.Scenarioseven.com.au Blog: http://www.Scenariogirl.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Standards compliance and Autocomplete
Hi Guys, Just wondering if there is a standards compliant way of implementing 'autocomplete' on forms, which I believe is proprietry...? An example might be that there is a login and password field on a banking site and you don't want the browser to remember the data. I realise there are ways around this and that smart people can still work it out :) Thanks, Lisa -- Lisa Herrod Web Usability: User Experience Research, Consulting and Training Business: http://www.Scenarioseven.com.au Blog: http://www.Scenariogirl.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] card sort with disabled users (OT?)
hi Andreas On 30/10/2007, Andreas Boehmer [Addictive Media] < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I am working on a website that targets people with many different > disabilities. So that will include users with visual, mental, hearing or > physical impairments. > > The website has got quite a large amount of content, so in a normal > situation I would conduct a card sort to get feedback from all target > groups > as to how to structure the information. But I am wrecking my brain at the > moment how to best put this into practice with the group of users I have. > Using normal index cards for the card sort probably won't be a good idea > in > particular for some of the visually disabled users. Also normally I would > let the users create new cards/categories by writing on the index cards, > but > this could be a problem with some of the physically disabled users. > > > Maybe somebody has got a different suggestion on how to achieve this? > > Thanks heaps. > > Andreas. I think you probably need to work with individual groups in a way that is appropriate for them, rather than trying to find one way to do it all. For example, unless you transpose labels into braille (for the blind users who read Braille) you'll probably need to read out the cards and write down the answers. Obviously this wouldn't be appropriate for the deaf users. For the deaf participants, this actually requires other considerations. I would ask them to read the cards and write the labels themselves. But you really need to engage an interpreter if you're planning on working with deaf participants. And I want to stress here that it's really essential that if you're including deaf users in card sorting activities (which focuses on content and navigation labelling etc.) you remember that Auslan and English are two unique languages. most likely English will be their second language. So in essence this is an ESL consideration as well. Please don't rely on lip reading (I don't mean to infer that you would Andreas). I have to say personally I find that really very offensive and dismissive of the participants needs. And on a technical point, you will not know how much information the participant has clearly understood e.g. when briefing/ giving instructions for the session. This goes for providing a written explanation as well. Users with physical disabilities may require other support, such as writing, but this will depend on the individual and the assistive technology they're using. Given your work you're probably already aware of this, but I thought it might be useful info for others on the list. I understand your concerns about your time and effort, but for the sake of data integrity, if you have to establish different ways of working with each profile to get accurate results, then there really isn't a choice. Have a look at this online card sorting tool, I don't really think it's going to help you much in this situation, but it is a good tool and there may be something you can use it for, even if it makes recording participant responses easier for you. http://www.optimalsort.com/pages/default.html All the best! It sounds like a really interesting project... lisa -- Lisa Herrod Web Usability: User Experience Research, Consulting and Training Business: http://www.Scenarioseven.com.au Blog: http://www.Scenariogirl.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Investigating the proposed alt attribute recommendations in HTML 5
Hi Stuart On 10/09/2007, Stuart Foulstone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Mon, September 10, 2007 1:44 am, Nick Gleitzman wrote: > > Hassan Schroeder wrote: > > > > Absolutely. But this whole thread started with the issue of whether alt > > text should be optional in HTML5. > > > > > Well, that's simple enough. > > The only reason the alt-text is being proposed to be optional is because > Microsoft are involved with defining HTML5. OK I have *no intention* of stirring the pot on this one, but I do need to know how much of your statement is Fact and how much is Opinion? I know that there are members of the HTML 5 WG that don't support inclusion of the alt attribute in the proposed specs - that's how this thread started- but if you're going to throught comments like that around, can you reference them for readers of the thread? Microsoft have always been against standards; they chose not to be > involved with XHTML and (having seen the threat that represented to them) > have joined with HTML5 in order to water down the standards. The HTML 5 WG actually has both MS and Opera staff working on it. Lachlan Hunt who commented on this thread earlier is on the HTML 5 WG and is going to work for opera in a month or so. ... -- Lisa Herrod Scenarioseven.com.au Scenariogirl.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Investigating the proposed alt attribute recommendations in HTML 5
On 30/08/2007, Brad Pollard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > If the developers of flickr.com or Photobucket were to implement the
> recommendations regarding the omission of the alt attribute within the
lines:> current HTML 5 draft what are the potential effects upon the
accessibility
> of the sites for users of assistive technology such as screen readers?
> > Investigating the proposed alt attribute recommendations in HTML 5 -
> http://www.paciellogroup.com/resources/articles/altinhtml5.html
>
> Omitting the alt attribute as a requirement may have a level of
> appropriateness for sites like flickr (as it currently stands) but flickr
> should be doing more to encourage their contributors to write a bit more of
> a story about their images - the extra information would be useful to not
> only the visually impaired.
As a default, surely programmes like Flickr and Photobucket can define
a null alt ("") for images?
I'm really disappointed the HTML 5 spec is moving in this direction.
It seems like the only real benefit here is that it might make
validation a little easier on sloppy code.
Lisa
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Re: [WSG] Auto scaling within a table's background image
On 01/08/07, David Dorward <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On 1 Aug 2007, at 09:34, lisa herrod wrote: > > On 01/08/07, Stuart Foulstone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Web Standards say only use tables for tabular data - not > >> presentation. > > > > Stuart, I think you're referring to WGAG 1. > > Lets look at HTML 4.01 instead, which is somewhat clearer on the > subject: hmmm I must have missed the email re doctype. Matt, what doctype are you using? in any case, I don't think it really matters. Let's get back on topic. Matt, your initial question was: "Is there a standardized way to present this without resolving to a Javascript or CSS hack ?" I'd say you have two choices: tables or CSS (or both). Most people will advise against you using tables for layout. However, if you do use them... don't nest them and don't use any markup that will identify them as tabular data - unless it is. Guys feel free to jump in with any CSS layout advice! :) Lisa *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Auto scaling within a table's background image
Hi there On 01/08/07, Stuart Foulstone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi, > > This is the Web Standards Group. > > Web Standards say only use tables for tabular data - not presentation. Stuart, I think you're referring to WGAG 1. It does *sort of* say that, but not quite... While it's not best practice to use tables for layout, it's not illegal. if that were the case, I'd have been locked up for a long time in the late 90's :) I'm not at all advocating the use of tables for layout, but where it is absolutely necessary: 5.3 Do not use tables for layout unless the table makes sense when linearized. Otherwise, if the table does not make sense, provide an alternative equivalent (which may be a linearized version). 5.4 If a table is used for layout, do not use any structural markup for the purpose of visual formatting. [WCAG 1.0 P2] hope that clears it up a bit... Lisa *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Who's A "Front End" Developer?
hey John :) I think highlighting AJAX as a technology would be like highlighting POSH. But that's an interesting point to raise, because there are technical skill sets and methodological/ philosophical approaches to applying technical skills. I think this is perhaps where skills like AJAX, standards, semantics, accessibility and POSH (as much as I do *dislike* that term) fit in. Lisa On 04/07/07, John Horner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I'm interested in the "front end" part of the Dutch group's name. We were having a discussion at work the other day about which skills you should have to have in order to call yourself a "web developer". I just finished a project which required knowledge of the following: * HTML * CSS * Javascript * XML * Perl or PHP * SQL but what's the minimum set of skills we think someone should have to call themselves a web developer? You could make a case, I'm sure, for just HTML and CSS. You develop (non-interactive) web pages with HTML and CSS. Javascript is really a programming language. Should AJAX be listed seperately? However, if that's enough to call yourself a web developer, what do we call someone with all the skills above? = The information contained in this email and any attachment is confidential and may contain legally privileged or copyright material. It is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you are not permitted to disseminate, distribute or copy this email or any attachments. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete this email from your system. The ABC does not represent or warrant that this transmission is secure or virus free. Before opening any attachment you should check for viruses. The ABC's liability is limited to resupplying any email and attachments. = *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- No, you cannot make your navigation out of turtles that move across the screen and are only available for forty percent of the day - Sean Madden *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] What does Semantic mean?
On 06/06/07, Nick Gleitzman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 6 Jun 2007, at 2:59 PM, John Faulds wrote: > Well if we're going to talk about 'pedanticness' it has to be pointed > out that there's no such word; the word you're looking for is > 'pedantry'. Pedanticity? Isn't that where they all go for their holidays...? :) No, you cannot make your navigation out of turtles that move across the screen and are only available for forty percent of the day - Sean Madden *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Converting font size from pt to % or em
nice post nick, that's really interesting, thanks... :)
On 25/05/07, Nick Cowie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
On 25/05/07, Katrina <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I think you should respect your users' default. Make sure the design
> scales properly when text size is increased, beyond what MIE allows you
> to do.
I disagree a little here, about user defaults. Yes you should respect
them, but not by using 100% or 1em.
1em = 100% = 16px = 16pt (yes 1px = 1pt for the screen) in all PC based
browsers since 2000 unless changed by the user or PC manufacturer (this is
becoming a little more common with laptops having twice the pixels per inch
or cm that desktop screens).
From experience almost all users do not change the default.
Those that do, tend to push the size up a bit to deal with sites that set
the base pixel size in percentages (usually somewhere between 62 and 76%).
If I as a user want 16px text on sites I visited, I would set my default
size to 20px or 22px.
Due to a bug in an old version of IE most people when choosing to use
scaling fonts is set the body size in percentage and them use ems for all
other font size measurements.
Due to a rounding error bug in an old old version on Opera some people
tend to push the percentage up by 1%.
I would (and regularly do) decided on my base font size for text in px and
set my body font-size to:
percentages to pixels
56.25% or 57% = 9px or 9pt (way too small IMHO)
62.5% or 63% = 10px
69.75, 70 or 71% = 11px
75 or 76% = 12px
81.25 or 82% = 13px
87.5 or 88% = 14px
Then set
p, ol, ul, li, table, tr, td, a, input {font-size: 1em}
h1 {font-size: 2.5em or whatever}
There is another view that you should set your body font-size to 62.5%then 1em
= 10px and calculate your sizes from there, ie 12px body text, 18px
h1 is:
p { font-size: 1.2em or 120%;}
h1{font-size: 1.8em or 180%;}
I don't like this method, just in case I nest something or make small
mistake in my css.
ie if p, ol, ul, li, table, tr, td, a, input {font-size: 120%;}
would be 12px inside a paragraph, 14px links, 14px list and 17px links in
a list.
hopes that makes sense too much caffeine and other things for lunch
and if you want to scale your design to your font-size google "elastic
design "
--
Nick Cowie
http://nickcowie.com
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No, you cannot make your navigation out of turtles that move across the
screen and are only available for forty percent of the day
- Sean Madden
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LIST ADMIN: Autoresponders on the list Was: Re: [WSG] equal height columns
* LIST ADMIN ** This thread is CLOSED. If you wish to continue the discussion please take it off list. WSG List Admin -- Forwarded message -- From: Quintin Stoltz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: 18-Apr-2007 16:32 Subject: RE: Autoresponders on the list Was: Re: [WSG] equal height columns To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org > Benedict Wyss wrote: > People need to have auto responders for business reasons, does this > mean we say people on the list have to send and receive from a web > mail address not a work address? I don't think "View -> Options -> Uncheck 'request read receipt'" box is too much to ask before clicking on reply, do you? I find it very annoying, to the point where i auto delete the message without even reading it even if the subject had interested me before hand. If that's how you see it, I don't think that clicking the "Send Receipt" button is too much to ask... You can even decline sending it, but it takes you "one click". To change my options is much more trouble, and then to set it back is is four times as much as you have to do. I have mine on for a good reason, and if you people are going to throw tantrums about it, you can count me out. Moaning and groaning about everything in life will make you a very sad person! I'm not willing to share in your sadness, so I'll subscribe. Gees... So much things for us to do... We just can't cope, can we? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** ** - NOTICE - This message (including attachments) contains privileged and confidential information intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed. Any review, retransmission, dissemination, copy or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient, is prohibited. If you received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately by e-mail, facsimile or telephone and thereafter delete the material from any computer. Metropolitan Health Group, its subsidiaries or associates, does not accept liability for any personal views expressed in this message. ** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: Autoresponders on the list Was: Re: [WSG] equal height columns
LIST ADMIN : OFF TOPIC *** Hi Guys, I appreciate your concern and can see this is in the interest of making the WSG list a happier place :) However, this discussion is off topic and not related to Web Standards. Please remember that this discussion is going out to thousands of people. Please feel free to continue discussing it off list. All the best, Lisa On 18/04/07, Brian Cummiskey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Benedict Wyss wrote: > People need to have auto responders for business reasons, does this > mean we say people on the list have to send and receive from a web > mail address not a work address? I don't think "View -> Options -> Uncheck 'request read receipt'" box is too much to ask before clicking on reply, do you? I find it very annoying, to the point where i auto delete the message without even reading it even if the subject had interested me before hand. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
