[WSG] Standards compliance and Autocomplete

2008-06-30 Thread Lisa Herrod
Hi Guys,

Just wondering if there is a standards compliant way of implementing
'autocomplete' on forms, which I believe is proprietry...?

An example might be that there is a login and password field on a banking
site and you don't want the browser to remember the data. I realise there
are ways around this and that smart people can still work it out :)

Thanks,

Lisa


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Lisa Herrod
Web Usability: User Experience Research, Consulting and Training

Business: http://www.Scenarioseven.com.au
Blog: http://www.Scenariogirl.com


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Re: [WSG] Standards compliance and Autocomplete

2008-06-30 Thread Lisa Herrod
2008/7/1 Patrick H. Lauke [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

 Lisa Herrod wrote:

 Just wondering if there is a standards compliant way of implementing
 'autocomplete' on forms, which I believe is proprietry...?


 Not tested it, but...could you inject the autocomplete=off via javascript
 to the form element?


Thanks Pat, yeah that's what I thought. I wanted confirmation from smart
people like you though :)



 If all else fails, I'd rather have an invalid attribute (with a good
 rationale why it was used) that doesn't have adverse effects (as opposed to
 invalid elements, which have the potential of messing up the DOM more
 dramatically) any day if it actually provides an improvement to usability.


Yeah that's what I reckon too. if all else passes i can live with something
like this. But I did want to see if there was anything out there before I
went with it.


 Thanks for that ;)

lisa


-- 
Lisa Herrod
Web Usability: User Experience Research, Consulting and Training

Business: http://www.Scenarioseven.com.au
Blog: http://www.Scenariogirl.com


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Re: [WSG] card sort with disabled users (OT?)

2007-10-30 Thread lisa herrod
hi Andreas

On 30/10/2007, Andreas Boehmer [Addictive Media] 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 I am working on a website that targets people with many different
 disabilities. So that will include users with visual, mental, hearing or
 physical impairments.

 The website has got quite a large amount of content, so in a normal
 situation I would conduct a card sort to get feedback from all target
 groups
 as to how to structure the information. But I am wrecking my brain at the
 moment how to best put this into practice with the group of users I have.
 Using normal index cards for the card sort probably won't be a good idea
 in
 particular for some of the visually disabled users. Also normally I would
 let the users create new cards/categories by writing on the index cards,
 but
 this could be a problem with some of the physically disabled users.


 Maybe somebody has got a different suggestion on how to achieve this?

 Thanks heaps.

 Andreas.




I think you probably need to work with individual groups in a way that is
appropriate for them, rather than trying to find one way to do it all.  For
example, unless you transpose labels into braille (for the blind users who
read Braille) you'll probably need to read out the cards and write down the
answers. Obviously this wouldn't be appropriate for the deaf users.

For the deaf participants, this actually requires other considerations. I
would ask them to read the cards and write the labels themselves. But you
really need to engage an interpreter if you're planning on working with deaf
participants. And I want to stress here that it's really essential that if
you're including deaf users in card sorting activities (which focuses on
content and navigation labelling etc.) you remember that Auslan and English
are two unique languages. most likely English will be their second language.
So in essence this is an ESL consideration as well. Please don't rely on lip
reading (I don't mean to infer that you would Andreas). I have to say
personally I find that really very offensive and dismissive of the
participants needs. And on a technical point, you will not know how much
information the participant has clearly understood e.g. when briefing/
giving instructions for the session. This goes for providing a written
explanation as well.

Users with physical disabilities may require other support, such as writing,
but this will depend on the individual and the assistive technology they're
using.

Given your work you're probably already aware of this, but I thought it
might be useful info for others on the list.

I understand your concerns about your time and effort, but for the sake of
data integrity, if you have to establish different ways of working with each
profile to get accurate results, then there really isn't a choice.

Have a look at this online card sorting tool, I don't really think it's
going to help you much in this situation, but it is a good tool and there
may be something you can use it for, even if it makes recording participant
responses easier for you.

http://www.optimalsort.com/pages/default.html

All the best! It sounds like a really interesting project...

lisa

-- 
Lisa Herrod
Web Usability: User Experience Research, Consulting and Training

Business: http://www.Scenarioseven.com.au
Blog: http://www.Scenariogirl.com


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Re: [WSG] Investigating the proposed alt attribute recommendations in HTML 5

2007-09-10 Thread lisa herrod
Hi Stuart

On 10/09/2007, Stuart Foulstone [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 On Mon, September 10, 2007 1:44 am, Nick Gleitzman wrote:
  Hassan Schroeder wrote:
 
  Absolutely. But this whole thread started with the issue of whether alt
  text should be optional in HTML5.
 


 Well, that's simple enough.

 The only reason the alt-text is being proposed to be optional is because
 Microsoft are involved with defining HTML5.




OK I have *no intention* of stirring the pot on this one, but I do need to
know how much of your  statement is Fact and how much is Opinion?

I know that there are members of the HTML 5 WG that don't support inclusion
of the alt attribute in the proposed specs - that's how this thread started-
but if you're going to throught comments like that around, can you reference
them for readers of the thread?



Microsoft have always been against standards; they chose not to be
 involved with XHTML and (having seen the threat that represented to them)
 have joined with HTML5 in order to water down the standards.



The HTML 5 WG actually has both MS and Opera staff working on it. Lachlan
Hunt who commented on this thread earlier is on the HTML 5 WG and is going
to work for opera in a month or so.

...



-- 
Lisa Herrod

Scenarioseven.com.au
Scenariogirl.com


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Re: [WSG] Investigating the proposed alt attribute recommendations in HTML 5

2007-08-30 Thread lisa herrod
On 30/08/2007, Brad Pollard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

   If the developers of flickr.com or Photobucket were to implement the
 recommendations regarding the omission of the alt attribute within the
lines: current HTML 5 draft what are the potential effects upon the
accessibility
 of the sites for users of assistive technology such as screen readers?
   Investigating the proposed alt attribute recommendations in HTML 5 -
 http://www.paciellogroup.com/resources/articles/altinhtml5.html

 Omitting the alt attribute as a requirement may have a level of
 appropriateness for sites like flickr (as it currently stands) but flickr
 should be doing more to encourage their contributors to write a bit more of
 a story about their images - the extra information would be useful to not
 only the visually impaired.



As a default, surely programmes like Flickr and Photobucket can define
a null alt ()  for images?

I'm really disappointed the HTML 5 spec is moving in this direction.
It seems like the only real benefit here is that it might make
validation a little easier on sloppy code.

Lisa


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Re: [WSG] Auto scaling within a table's background image

2007-08-01 Thread lisa herrod
Hi there


On 01/08/07, Stuart Foulstone [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi,

 This is the Web Standards Group.

 Web Standards say only use tables for tabular data - not presentation.


Stuart, I think you're referring to WGAG 1. It does *sort of* say
that, but not quite...

While it's not best practice to use tables for layout, it's not
illegal. if that were the case, I'd have been locked up for a long
time in the late 90's :)

I'm not at all advocating the use of tables for layout, but where it
is absolutely necessary:


5.3 Do not use tables for layout unless the table makes sense when
linearized. Otherwise, if the table does not make sense, provide an
alternative equivalent (which may be a linearized version).

5.4 If a table is used for layout, do not use any structural markup
for the purpose of visual formatting.

[WCAG 1.0 P2]

hope that clears it up a bit...

Lisa


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Re: [WSG] Auto scaling within a table's background image

2007-08-01 Thread lisa herrod
On 01/08/07, David Dorward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 On 1 Aug 2007, at 09:34, lisa herrod wrote:
  On 01/08/07, Stuart Foulstone [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Web Standards say only use tables for tabular data - not
  presentation.
 
  Stuart, I think you're referring to WGAG 1.

 Lets look at HTML 4.01 instead, which is somewhat clearer on the
 subject:

hmmm I must have missed the email re doctype. Matt, what doctype
are you using?
in any case, I don't think it really matters.

Let's get back on topic.

Matt, your initial question was:

Is there a standardized way to present this without resolving to a
Javascript or CSS hack ?

I'd say you have two choices: tables or CSS (or both).

Most people will advise against you using tables for layout. However,
if you do use them... don't nest them and don't use any markup that
will identify them as tabular data - unless it is.

Guys feel free to jump in with any CSS layout advice! :)

Lisa


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Re: [WSG] Who's A Front End Developer?

2007-07-04 Thread lisa herrod

hey John :)

I think highlighting AJAX as a technology would be like highlighting POSH.

But that's an interesting point to raise, because there are technical
skill sets and methodological/ philosophical approaches to applying
technical skills. I think this is perhaps where skills like AJAX,
standards, semantics, accessibility and POSH (as much as I do
*dislike* that term) fit in.


Lisa



On 04/07/07, John Horner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:



I'm interested in the front end part of the Dutch group's name.

We were having a discussion at work the other day about which skills you
should have to have in order to call yourself a web developer.

I just finished a project which required knowledge of the following:

* HTML
* CSS
* Javascript
* XML
* Perl or PHP
* SQL

but what's the minimum set of skills we think someone should have to call
themselves a web developer?

You could make a case, I'm sure, for just HTML and CSS. You develop
(non-interactive) web pages with HTML and CSS. Javascript is really a
programming language. Should AJAX be listed seperately?

However, if that's enough to call yourself a web developer, what do we call
someone with all the skills above?


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Re: [WSG] What does Semantic mean?

2007-06-06 Thread lisa herrod

On 06/06/07, Nick Gleitzman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


On 6 Jun 2007, at 2:59 PM, John Faulds wrote:

 Well if we're going to talk about 'pedanticness' it has to be pointed
 out that there's no such word; the word you're looking for is
 'pedantry'.

Pedanticity?



Isn't that where they all go for their holidays...? :)



No, you cannot make your navigation out of turtles that move across
the screen and are only available for forty percent of the day
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LIST ADMIN: Autoresponders on the list Was: Re: [WSG] equal height columns

2007-04-18 Thread lisa herrod

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LIST ADMIN
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This thread is CLOSED.


If you wish to continue the discussion please take it off list.


WSG List Admin


-- Forwarded message --
From: Quintin Stoltz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 18-Apr-2007 16:32
Subject: RE: Autoresponders on the list Was: Re: [WSG] equal height columns
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org

Benedict Wyss wrote:

 People need to have auto responders for business reasons, does this
 mean we say people on the list have to send and receive from a web
 mail address not a work address?
I don't think View - Options - Uncheck 'request read receipt' box

is too much to ask before clicking on reply, do you?


I find it very annoying, to the point where i auto delete the message

without even reading it even if the subject had interested me before
hand.

If that's how you see it, I don't think that clicking the Send Receipt
button is too much to ask... You can even decline sending it, but it
takes you one click. To change my options is much more trouble, and
then to set it back is is four times as much as you have to do. I have
mine on for a good reason, and if you people are going to throw tantrums
about it, you can count me out.

Moaning and groaning about everything in life will make you a very sad
person! I'm not willing to share in your sadness, so I'll subscribe.
Gees... So much things for us to do... We just can't cope, can we?


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