[WSG] Automated accessibility testers
I've never tried testing my code for accessibility before but I'm becoming more interested in the topic.After some web-research, I've found a mountian ofinformation/guidelines/priority checkpoints (etc., etc.) to wade through and consider. My eyes are glazing over. First question: Is there a site anywhere that can tell me (clearly and concisely) something like: To achieve section 508 compliance you have to: 1) do this, 2) do that, 3) do the other thing. Most of the stuff I've seen is very heavy on reasons, but somewhat light on the "you just need to include this, in this way" type of information. -- Second question: Just as a test, I ran one of my pages through a site called the Cynthia Says Portal(http://www.contentquality.com/Default.asp) According to the Section 508 report option (as well as the WCAG - Priority 1,2,3 option)the pages I submitted to the validator all "passed" according to the validator's result list. Well, that made me smile - but also wonder at the same time. Are these kind of sites a reliable way to verfiy code for Accessibility for Section 508 and/or WCAG Checkpoints? Like, if a client were to say to me "Is the site 508 compliant?" can I say, "well, yeah, the Cynthia Says portal reported that it was. Good enough for me." Well, IS THAT GOOD ENOUGH? Is there a better on-line validator I should be running my pages through vs Cynthia Says? Since I've become interested in this issue , I want to start off on the right foot in order to make sure these automated, web-based results are telling mewhat I need to hear. Bottom line is that I guess it'ss hard for me to believed that I've "aced-it" on the first time out. Any and all input greatly appreciated. Cole Kuryakin Subic Bay, Philippines
Re: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers
Cole, This is my first time to reply to anything on the list, so I hope I am doing it correctly:) I recommend Constructing Accessible Web Sites published by glasshaus. This book focuses on the Section 508 Standards and the WAI, but filters all the legalese. It also gives code examples and application examples. I'm about half-way through it right now, and it has made a huge difference in the way I write code. Shane Lubbock, TX I've never tried testing my code for accessibility before but I'm becoming more interested in the topic. After some web-research, I've found a mountian of information/guidelines/priority checkpoints (etc., etc.) to wade through and consider. My eyes are glazing over. First question: Is there a site anywhere that can tell me (clearly and concisely) something like: To achieve section 508 compliance you have to: 1) do this, 2) do that, 3) do the other thing. Most of the stuff I've seen is very heavy on reasons, but somewhat light on the you just need to include this, in this way type of information. -- Second question: Just as a test, I ran one of my pages through a site called the Cynthia Says Portal (http://www.contentquality.com/Default.asp) According to the Section 508 report option (as well as the WCAG - Priority 1,2,3 option) the pages I submitted to the validator all passed according to the validator's result list. Well, that made me smile - but also wonder at the same time. Are these kind of sites a reliable way to verfiy code for Accessibility for Section 508 and/or WCAG Checkpoints? Like, if a client were to say to me Is the site 508 compliant? can I say, well, yeah, the Cynthia Says portal reported that it was. Good enough for me. Well, IS THAT GOOD ENOUGH? Is there a better on-line validator I should be running my pages through vs Cynthia Says? Since I've become interested in this issue , I want to start off on the right foot in order to make sure these automated, web-based results are telling me what I need to hear. Bottom line is that I guess it'ss hard for me to believed that I've aced-it on the first time out. Any and all input greatly appreciated. Cole Kuryakin Subic Bay, Philippines ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers
Thanks Shane. I'll give it a look - Getting specific books from local bookstores here (in the philipines) can be a real challenge, but I'll see if I can source the one you've recommended. After you do a site (or during) do you validate your code against one of these Accessibility web sites I mentioned? Cole - Original Message - From: Shane Shepherd [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2005 10:02 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers Cole, This is my first time to reply to anything on the list, so I hope I am doing it correctly:) I recommend Constructing Accessible Web Sites published by glasshaus. This book focuses on the Section 508 Standards and the WAI, but filters all the legalese. It also gives code examples and application examples. I'm about half-way through it right now, and it has made a huge difference in the way I write code. Shane Lubbock, TX I've never tried testing my code for accessibility before but I'm becoming more interested in the topic. After some web-research, I've found a mountian of information/guidelines/priority checkpoints (etc., etc.) to wade through and consider. My eyes are glazing over. First question: Is there a site anywhere that can tell me (clearly and concisely) something like: To achieve section 508 compliance you have to: 1) do this, 2) do that, 3) do the other thing. Most of the stuff I've seen is very heavy on reasons, but somewhat light on the you just need to include this, in this way type of information. -- Second question: Just as a test, I ran one of my pages through a site called the Cynthia Says Portal (http://www.contentquality.com/Default.asp) According to the Section 508 report option (as well as the WCAG - Priority 1,2,3 option) the pages I submitted to the validator all passed according to the validator's result list. Well, that made me smile - but also wonder at the same time. Are these kind of sites a reliable way to verfiy code for Accessibility for Section 508 and/or WCAG Checkpoints? Like, if a client were to say to me Is the site 508 compliant? can I say, well, yeah, the Cynthia Says portal reported that it was. Good enough for me. Well, IS THAT GOOD ENOUGH? Is there a better on-line validator I should be running my pages through vs Cynthia Says? Since I've become interested in this issue , I want to start off on the right foot in order to make sure these automated, web-based results are telling me what I need to hear. Bottom line is that I guess it'ss hard for me to believed that I've aced-it on the first time out. Any and all input greatly appreciated. Cole Kuryakin Subic Bay, Philippines ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers
Cole The real trick is to understand what the specification means and why it says what it says. There has always been disputes about the validity of an automated tester saying 'Yes this site is compliant'. You can code a terrible page that will pass an automated test. It is important to code in the spirit and intent of the specification and not necessarily to the word of the specification. Online validators are a tool to help you get there. I do use an automated tester, but not very often. I am familiar enough with the specs that I do not need to. As the page near completion I will run a validator to fix a few probs. I have friends in Iriga - visit Iriga Joe Motors. =)On 4/13/05, Cole Kuryakin - x7m [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks Shane. I'll give it a look - Getting specific books from localbookstores here (in the philipines) can be a real challenge, but I'll see if I can source the one you've recommended.After you do a site (or during) do you validate your code against one ofthese Accessibility web sites I mentioned?Cole -- __Bugs are, by definition, necessary. Just ask Microsoft!www.co.sauk.wi.us (Work) www.arionshome.com (Personal)www.freexenon.com (Consulting)__Take Back the Web with Mozilla Fire Fox http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/Making a Commercial Case for Adopting Web Standardshttp://www.maccaws.org/Web Standards Project http://www.webstandards.org/Web Standards Grouphttp://www.webstandardsgroup.org/Guild of Accessible Web Designers http://www.gawds.org/
RE: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers
Hi Cole I really cant remember where I got it, but I have a pdf file called Dive into Accessibility that is freely distributable under a GNU Free Documentation license. I found it a brilliant description of the what, why and how of accessibility. If you like I will send you a copy privately. Rowena From: Cole Kuryakin - x7m [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 April 2005 13:02 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers I've never tried testing my code for accessibility before but I'm becoming more interested in the topic.After some web-research, I've found a mountian ofinformation/guidelines/priority checkpoints (etc., etc.) to wade through and consider. My eyes are glazing over. First question: Is there a site anywhere that can tell me (clearly and concisely) something like: To achieve section 508 compliance you have to: 1) do this, 2) do that, 3) do the other thing. Most of the stuff I've seen is very heavy on reasons, but somewhat light on the you just need to include this, in this way type of information. -- Second question: Just as a test, I ran one of my pages through a site called the Cynthia Says Portal(http://www.contentquality.com/Default.asp) According to the Section 508 report option (as well as the WCAG - Priority 1,2,3 option)the pages I submitted to the validator all passed according to the validator's result list. Well, that made me smile - but also wonder at the same time. Are these kind of sites a reliable way to verfiy code for Accessibility for Section 508 and/or WCAG Checkpoints? Like, if a client were to say to me Is the site 508 compliant? can I say, well, yeah, the Cynthia Says portal reported that it was. Good enough for me. Well, IS THAT GOOD ENOUGH? Is there a better on-line validator I should be running my pages through vs Cynthia Says? Since I've become interested in this issue , I want to start off on the right foot in order to make sure these automated, web-based results are telling mewhat I need to hear. Bottom line is that I guess it'ss hard for me to believed that I've aced-it on the first time out. Any and all input greatly appreciated. Cole Kuryakin Subic Bay, Philippines
RE: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers
http://www.diveintoaccessibility.org/ -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Rowena PadelSent: 13 April 2005 16:49To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.orgSubject: RE: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers Hi Cole I really cant remember where I got it, but I have a pdf file called Dive into Accessibility that is freely distributable under a GNU Free Documentation license. I found it a brilliant description of the what, why and how of accessibility. If you like I will send you a copy privately. Rowena From: Cole Kuryakin - x7m [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 April 2005 13:02To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.orgSubject: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers I've never tried testing my code for accessibility before but I'm becoming more interested in the topic.After some web-research, I've found a mountian ofinformation/guidelines/priority checkpoints (etc., etc.) to wade through and consider. My eyes are glazing over. First question: Is there a site anywhere that can tell me (clearly and concisely) something like: To achieve section 508 compliance you have to: 1) do this, 2) do that, 3) do the other thing. Most of the stuff I've seen is very heavy on reasons, but somewhat light on the "you just need to include this, in this way" type of information. -- Second question: Just as a test, I ran one of my pages through a site called the Cynthia Says Portal(http://www.contentquality.com/Default.asp) According to the Section 508 report option (as well as the WCAG - Priority 1,2,3 option)the pages I submitted to the validator all "passed" according to the validator's result list. Well, that made me smile - but also wonder at the same time. Are these kind of sites a reliable way to verfiy code for Accessibility for Section 508 and/or WCAG Checkpoints? Like, if a client were to say to me "Is the site 508 compliant?" can I say, "well, yeah, the Cynthia Says portal reported that it was. Good enough for me." Well, IS THAT GOOD ENOUGH? Is there a better on-line validator I should be running my pages through vs Cynthia Says? Since I've become interested in this issue , I want to start off on the right foot in order to make sure these automated, web-based results are telling mewhat I need to hear. Bottom line is that I guess it'ss hard for me to believed that I've "aced-it" on the first time out. Any and all input greatly appreciated. Cole Kuryakin Subic Bay, Philippines
Re: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers
On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 16:48:46 +0100, Rowena Padel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Cole I really can't remember where I got it, but I have a pdf file called Dive into Accessibility that is freely distributable under a GNU Free Documentation license. I found it a brilliant description of the what, why and how of accessibility. If you like I will send you a copy privately. click click http://diveintoaccessibility.org/ -- regards, Kornel Lesiski ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers
Thats where I got it from then! ;-) From: Patrick Lauke [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 April 2005 16:58 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers http://www.diveintoaccessibility.org/
Re: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers
I use Firefox's Web Developer's Toolbar Extension which has multiple validators including one for section 508 and one for WAI. I recommend it. Shane Lubbock, TX Thanks Shane. I'll give it a look - Getting specific books from local bookstores here (in the philipines) can be a real challenge, but I'll see if I can source the one you've recommended. After you do a site (or during) do you validate your code against one of these Accessibility web sites I mentioned? Cole - Original Message - From: Shane Shepherd [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2005 10:02 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers Cole, This is my first time to reply to anything on the list, so I hope I am doing it correctly:) I recommend Constructing Accessible Web Sites published by glasshaus. This book focuses on the Section 508 Standards and the WAI, but filters all the legalese. It also gives code examples and application examples. I'm about half-way through it right now, and it has made a huge difference in the way I write code. Shane Lubbock, TX I've never tried testing my code for accessibility before but I'm becoming more interested in the topic. After some web-research, I've found a mountian of information/guidelines/priority checkpoints (etc., etc.) to wade through and consider. My eyes are glazing over. First question: Is there a site anywhere that can tell me (clearly and concisely) something like: To achieve section 508 compliance you have to: 1) do this, 2) do that, 3) do the other thing. Most of the stuff I've seen is very heavy on reasons, but somewhat light on the you just need to include this, in this way type of information. -- Second question: Just as a test, I ran one of my pages through a site called the Cynthia Says Portal (http://www.contentquality.com/Default.asp) According to the Section 508 report option (as well as the WCAG - Priority 1,2,3 option) the pages I submitted to the validator all passed according to the validator's result list. Well, that made me smile - but also wonder at the same time. Are these kind of sites a reliable way to verfiy code for Accessibility for Section 508 and/or WCAG Checkpoints? Like, if a client were to say to me Is the site 508 compliant? can I say, well, yeah, the Cynthia Says portal reported that it was. Good enough for me. Well, IS THAT GOOD ENOUGH? Is there a better on-line validator I should be running my pages through vs Cynthia Says? Since I've become interested in this issue , I want to start off on the right foot in order to make sure these automated, web-based results are telling me what I need to hear. Bottom line is that I guess it'ss hard for me to believed that I've aced-it on the first time out. Any and all input greatly appreciated. Cole Kuryakin Subic Bay, Philippines ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers
Awesome! Thanks for that link! Shane Lubbock, TX http://www.diveintoaccessibility.org/ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Rowena Padel Sent: 13 April 2005 16:49 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers Hi Cole I really can't remember where I got it, but I have a pdf file called Dive into Accessibility that is freely distributable under a GNU Free Documentation license. I found it a brilliant description of the what, why and how of accessibility. If you like I will send you a copy privately. Rowena _ From: Cole Kuryakin - x7m [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 April 2005 13:02 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers I've never tried testing my code for accessibility before but I'm becoming more interested in the topic. After some web-research, I've found a mountian of information/guidelines/priority checkpoints (etc., etc.) to wade through and consider. My eyes are glazing over. First question: Is there a site anywhere that can tell me (clearly and concisely) something like: To achieve section 508 compliance you have to: 1) do this, 2) do that, 3) do the other thing. Most of the stuff I've seen is very heavy on reasons, but somewhat light on the you just need to include this, in this way type of information. -- Second question: Just as a test, I ran one of my pages through a site called the Cynthia Says Portal ( http://www.contentquality.com/Default.asp) According to the Section 508 report option (as well as the WCAG - Priority 1,2,3 option) the pages I submitted to the validator all passed according to the validator's result list. Well, that made me smile - but also wonder at the same time. Are these kind of sites a reliable way to verfiy code for Accessibility for Section 508 and/or WCAG Checkpoints? Like, if a client were to say to me Is the site 508 compliant? can I say, well, yeah, the Cynthia Says portal reported that it was. Good enough for me. Well, IS THAT GOOD ENOUGH? Is there a better on-line validator I should be running my pages through vs Cynthia Says? Since I've become interested in this issue , I want to start off on the right foot in order to make sure these automated, web-based results are telling me what I need to hear. Bottom line is that I guess it'ss hard for me to believed that I've aced-it on the first time out. Any and all input greatly appreciated. Cole Kuryakin Subic Bay, Philippines ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Automated accessibility testers
A few more useful articles/sites: Big, Stark Chunk - article by Joe Clark on how to use CSS to automatically redesign and reorder your Web site for low-vision people http://www.alistapart.com/articles/lowvision/ Building accessible websites http://joeclark.org/book/ (buy the book or read it online) Joe Clark's blog on accessibility http://blog.fawny.org/category/accessibility/ Andy Budd, Design for Accessibility http://www.andybudd.com/presentations/skillswap05/accessibility/ RNID, 10 things you should know about website accessibility http://www.rnidteaser.co.uk/index.html Accessibility from the ground up http://digital-web.com/articles/accessibility_from_the_ground_up/ Accessify http://www.accessify.com/default.asp Accessify forums http://www.accessifyforum.com/ Guidelines for Accessible and Usable Web Sites: Observing Users Who Work With Screen Readers http://redish.net/content/papers/interactions.html WebAIM http://www.webaim.org/ Kornel Lesinski wrote: On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 16:48:46 +0100, Rowena Padel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Cole I really can't remember where I got it, but I have a pdf file called Dive into Accessibility that is freely distributable under a GNU Free Documentation license. I found it a brilliant description of the what, why and how of accessibility. If you like I will send you a copy privately. click click http://diveintoaccessibility.org/ -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.6 - Release Date: 11/04/2005 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
