Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Wynne Hunkler]

Agree with Keryx very much regarding Sitepoint books. Sitepoint is one  
of my commonly used references. If you are looking to gain an  
excellent understanding of javascript and how it interprets the DOM, I  
would recommend Simply Javascript at http://www.sitepoint.com/books/javascript1/?SID=fd6872659b8d4823a0eb3ce170479b37 
.


It starts from the very beginning and rapidly takes you through the  
process. I believe gaining the basic javascript understanding would  
provide excellent benefits before jumping right into a framework.  
Similar to learning how to write solid HTML/CSS before attempting to  
use DW or some other visual tool.


Wynne Hunkler

Usability Evangelist
Wynnefields Creative

( (817) 605-1012 Office | ( (817) 915-9427 Cell | ( (817) 605-1012 Fax



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Katrina]

Simon wrote:

Hi all,

I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly, and by this I
mean not filling my page with onclick and sending hrefs to #. But instead
abstracting it all into the .js file and keeping my markup clean.

I've followed the book by Jeremy Keith called DOM Scripting which teaches
just that but it only goes so far. Everywhere else I look seems to have all
the old school techniques which I want to shy away from.

Does anyone have any resources?



Bulletproof Ajax by Jeremy Keith.

When you say it 'only goes so far', what is it that you want to know but 
are not fining in DOM Scripting?



I recommend caution when using Javascript:

You have to remember not only is it yet another thing to download, which 
is an issue in terms of speed (extra HTTP calls and file size -> 
download time) but it can also hamper accessibility (although not 
necessarily) and slow the browser down.


Note www.realestate.com.au on Safari on a mobile device (either iPod 
Touch or iPhone). Far too heavy on the Javascript and ruins the site 
really. If they took back the Javascript and made the site lighter, it 
would run smoothly on these mobile devices.


You need to really justify each bit of Javascript. Library are all well 
and good, but again, are something extra to download, and sometimes at 
100KB, can you really justify it?


It's a trade-off on what you want to do and how useful it is, but put 
the user first - is it in their interest?


Kat
(Who recommends caution in most areas)



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

RE: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Jens-Uwe Korff]

> I've been trying to convince people here at work to  use JQuery for
UI...

Are there any takes on JQuery vs. Mootools?
 
Easier? More compatible? Less filesize?
 
Thanks!
 
Cheers,
Jens 

The information contained in this e-mail message and any accompanying files is 
or may be confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, 
dissemination, reliance, forwarding, printing or copying of this e-mail or any 
attached files is unauthorised. This e-mail is subject to copyright. No part of 
it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the written consent of 
the copyright owner. If you have received this e-mail in error please advise 
the sender immediately by return e-mail or telephone and delete all copies. 
Fairfax does not guarantee the accuracy or completeness of any information 
contained in this e-mail or attached files. Internet communications are not 
secure, therefore Fairfax does not accept legal responsibility for the contents 
of this message or attached files.


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

RE: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Kepler Gelotte]

> I've been trying to convince people here at work to  use JQuery for UI,
but most are reluctant, because it's a framework.   
> Any good arguments of Why it is still OK to use JQuery? 



jQuery is not really a framework. jQuery is a library of javascript
functions. The fact that they have a synonym to the main jquery function
called '$' makes some people think that you are no longer coding in
javascript. The reality is that you can code javascript and jQuery function
calls together. It's just a library.

 

A framework means you have some configuration file that the application
constructs itself around. This is called "inversion of control". I have
never seen this done in any javascript application. An example of inversion
of control would be Struts or Spring in Java.

 

Your co-workers have nothing to fear.

Best regards,

Kepler Gelotte

Neighbor Webmaster, Inc.

156 Normandy Dr., Piscataway, NJ 08854

  www.neighborwebmaster.com

phone/fax: (732) 302-0904



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***BEGIN:VCARD
VERSION:2.1
N:Gelotte;Kepler;;Mr.
FN:Kepler Gelotte ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
ORG:Neighbor Webmaster
TITLE:Web Designer
TEL;WORK;VOICE:(732) 302-0904
TEL;WORK;FAX:(732) 302-0904
ADR;WORK:;;156 Normandy Dr;Piscataway;NJ;08854;United States of America
LABEL;WORK;ENCODING=QUOTED-PRINTABLE:156 Normandy Dr=0D=0APiscataway, NJ 08854=0D=0AUnited States of America
URL;WORK:http://www.neighborwebmaster.com
EMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
REV:20070415T052107Z
END:VCARD

Re: [WSG] Learning JavaScript properly

[Susie Gardner-Brown]

I've been using 'Javascript: A Beginner's Guide' (2nd Edition) by John
Pollock and have found that pretty useful.

- susie


On 19/09/08 11:34 AM, "William Donovan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
> I can vouch for Simply JavaScript by Sitepoint as well. I used it in
> combination with some of their other javascript books.
> 
> William
> 
> 
>> Design <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> 
>> I can personally vouch for Simply JavaScript by Sitepoint. Very good
>> book
>> for the beginner level.
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> On
>> Behalf Of Keryx Web
>> Sent: Friday, 19 September 2008 8:52 AM
>> To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
>> Subject: Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly
>> 
>> Simon skrev:
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly,
>> 
>> Learn the basics first - then libraries:
>> http://www.456bereastreet.com/archive/200701/learn_javascript_before_tast
>> ing
>> _the_library_koolaid/
>> 
>> Mozilla Developer Central is a nice resource.
>> 
>> All Sitepoint books are great as well. PPK's books i also very good.
>> 
>> 
>> Lars Gunther
>> 
>> 
>> ***
>> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
>> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
>> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> ***
>> 
>> 
>> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
>> signature
>> database 3451 (20080918) __
>> 
>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>> 
>> http://www.eset.com
>> 
>> 
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
>> Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.6.21/1670 - Release Date:
>> 17/09/2008
>> 5:07 PM
>>  
>> 
>> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
>> signature
>> database 3451 (20080918) __
>> 
>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>> 
>> http://www.eset.com
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ***
>> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
>> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
>> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> ***
> 
> 
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> ***
> 



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: RE: [WSG] Learning JavaScript properly

[William Donovan]

I can vouch for Simply JavaScript by Sitepoint as well. I used it in 
combination with some of their other javascript books.

William


> Design <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> I can personally vouch for Simply JavaScript by Sitepoint. Very good 
> book
> for the beginner level.
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> On
> Behalf Of Keryx Web
> Sent: Friday, 19 September 2008 8:52 AM
> To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> Subject: Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly
> 
> Simon skrev:
> > Hi all,
> > 
> > I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly,
> 
> Learn the basics first - then libraries:
> http://www.456bereastreet.com/archive/200701/learn_javascript_before_tast
> ing
> _the_library_koolaid/
> 
> Mozilla Developer Central is a nice resource.
> 
> All Sitepoint books are great as well. PPK's books i also very good.
> 
> 
> Lars Gunther
> 
> 
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> ***
> 
> 
> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
> signature
> database 3451 (20080918) __
> 
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
> 
> http://www.eset.com
> 
> 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com 
> Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.6.21/1670 - Release Date: 
> 17/09/2008
> 5:07 PM
>  
> 
> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
> signature
> database 3451 (20080918) __
> 
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
> 
> http://www.eset.com
>  
> 
> 
> 
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> ***


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

RE: [WSG] Learning JavaScript properly

[Design]

I can personally vouch for Simply JavaScript by Sitepoint. Very good book
for the beginner level.


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Keryx Web
Sent: Friday, 19 September 2008 8:52 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

Simon skrev:
> Hi all,
> 
> I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly,

Learn the basics first - then libraries:
http://www.456bereastreet.com/archive/200701/learn_javascript_before_tasting
_the_library_koolaid/

Mozilla Developer Central is a nice resource.

All Sitepoint books are great as well. PPK's books i also very good.


Lars Gunther


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***


__ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 3451 (20080918) __

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com


No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com 
Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.6.21/1670 - Release Date: 17/09/2008
5:07 PM
 

__ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 3451 (20080918) __

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

RE: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Simon]

Thanks for all your replies, I'm getting stuck into jQuery and it seems
pretty good!

Cheers


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Breton Slivka
Sent: 18 September 2008 22:53
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

jQuery is really good because, unlike some other frameworks, it
doesn't lock you into its little world. You're still coding in
javascript, and jQuery is just a really handy set of functions to help
you out with just the really frustrating parts.

It's really important to use a framework nowadays because of the vast
gulf there is in the behavior between the different browsers.
Frameworks eliminate hours of debugging by presenting just a single
simple interface to do many common tasks, that someone else has
already debugged to work cross browser. In my opinion, it should be
difficult to argue AGAINST using a framework, simply because
frameworks save so much time - and time is money! What are the
arguments against using a framework?

If there's something about "frameworks' that just rubs your colleagues
the wrong way, perhaps look into base2.js, IE7.js and IE8.js by Dean
Edwards. They're basically implementations of the standard w3c dom
interfaces, such that if a browser doesn't support the standard
correctly, his framework fills in the gap. With that, there's no
visible signs of a "framework", just a consistant cross browser dom
api. That's the basic principle anyway. I haven't tried it, myself, so
I can't tell you how well it really works.




***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Keryx Web]

Simon skrev:

Hi all,

I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly,


Learn the basics first - then libraries:
http://www.456bereastreet.com/archive/200701/learn_javascript_before_tasting_the_library_koolaid/

Mozilla Developer Central is a nice resource.

All Sitepoint books are great as well. PPK's books i also very good.


Lars Gunther


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Breton Slivka]

jQuery is really good because, unlike some other frameworks, it
doesn't lock you into its little world. You're still coding in
javascript, and jQuery is just a really handy set of functions to help
you out with just the really frustrating parts.

It's really important to use a framework nowadays because of the vast
gulf there is in the behavior between the different browsers.
Frameworks eliminate hours of debugging by presenting just a single
simple interface to do many common tasks, that someone else has
already debugged to work cross browser. In my opinion, it should be
difficult to argue AGAINST using a framework, simply because
frameworks save so much time - and time is money! What are the
arguments against using a framework?

If there's something about "frameworks' that just rubs your colleagues
the wrong way, perhaps look into base2.js, IE7.js and IE8.js by Dean
Edwards. They're basically implementations of the standard w3c dom
interfaces, such that if a browser doesn't support the standard
correctly, his framework fills in the gap. With that, there's no
visible signs of a "framework", just a consistant cross browser dom
api. That's the basic principle anyway. I haven't tried it, myself, so
I can't tell you how well it really works.


On Fri, Sep 19, 2008 at 2:09 AM,  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I've been trying to convince people here at work to  use JQuery for UI, but
> most are reluctant, because it's a framework.
> Any good arguments of Why it is still OK to use JQuery?
>
>
> Anya V.  Gerasimchuk
> Web Designer, IT - Web Shared Services
> UNIFI Information Technology
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> (513) 595 -2391
>
>
> Aubrey Morrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> 09/18/2008 12:04 PM
>
> Please respond to
> wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> To
> wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> cc
> Subject
> Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly
>
>
>
>
> Simon,
>
> Get into jQuery man. Plain old javascript just doesn't cut it. Best
> library I have used.
> Bit of a learning curve but well worth getting your head around.
>
> Have fun: http://jquery.com/
>
> Regards
>
> Aubrey
>
>
>
>
> Simon wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly, and by this I
>> mean not filling my page with onclick and sending hrefs to #. But instead
>> abstracting it all into the .js file and keeping my markup clean.
>>
>> I've followed the book by Jeremy Keith called DOM Scripting which teaches
>> just that but it only goes so far. Everywhere else I look seems to have
>> all
>> the old school techniques which I want to shy away from.
>>
>> Does anyone have any resources?
>>
>> Thanks so much
>> Simon
>>
>>
>>
>> ***
>> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
>> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
>> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> ***
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> ***[attachment
> "aubrey.vcf" deleted by Anya Gerasimchuk/UnionCentral]
>
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> ***


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Schalk Neethling]

Not sure if someone has mentioned it but, you may want also check 
DOMAssistant as a supporting library.


Regards,
Schalk

Dinh wrote:
What I learn from JQuery community is that it is quite stable, BC and 
consistent. It saves me a lot of headaches when dealing with weird 
behaviors of different browsers including bad ones: IE6 or IE7. If 
anyone want to write JavaScript from the scratch, he will encounter a 
lot of problem, especially working with IE. JavaScript is not a 
technology like PHP or Java when their compilers and runtime engines are 
responsible for making applications portable across different platforms. 
With JavaScript you need to be familiar yourself with browsers, which 
are actual platforms. If there is something that makes your JavaScript 
code portable, it is such a JavaScript library like JQuery.


pcdinh

On Thu, Sep 18, 2008 at 11:34 PM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> wrote:



I agree. Also I think their argument is that frameworks change, and
if that happens, we are going to be stuck with what we had before...

Anya V.  Gerasimchuk
Web Designer, IT - Web Shared Services
UNIFI Information Technology
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
(513) 595 -2391



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***





No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com 
Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.6.21/1673 - Release Date: 2008/09/15 06:49 PM





***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Stepan Reznikov]

> Does anyone have any resources?

I highly recommend Douglas Crockford's lectures on JavaScript:

http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/theater/

* The JavaScript Programming Language
* An Inconvenient API: The Theory of the DOM
* Advanced JavaScript

Douglas also wrote a very good book "JavaScript: The Good Parts".

I also liked "Pro JavaScript Techniques" by John Resig (jQuery author)
and "Pro JavaScript Design Patterns" by Ross Harmes and Dustin Diaz.

-- 
Stepan


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Dinh]

What I learn from JQuery community is that it is quite stable, BC and
consistent. It saves me a lot of headaches when dealing with weird behaviors
of different browsers including bad ones: IE6 or IE7. If anyone want to
write JavaScript from the scratch, he will encounter a lot of problem,
especially working with IE. JavaScript is not a technology like PHP or Java
when their compilers and runtime engines are responsible for making
applications portable across different platforms. With JavaScript you need
to be familiar yourself with browsers, which are actual platforms. If there
is something that makes your JavaScript code portable, it is such a
JavaScript library like JQuery.

pcdinh

On Thu, Sep 18, 2008 at 11:34 PM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>
> I agree. Also I think their argument is that frameworks change, and if that
> happens, we are going to be stuck with what we had before...
>
> Anya V.  Gerasimchuk
> Web Designer, IT - Web Shared Services
> UNIFI Information Technology
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> (513) 595 -2391
>


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[AGerasimchuk]

I agree. Also I think their argument is that frameworks change, and if 
that happens, we are going to be stuck with what we had before...

Anya V.  Gerasimchuk
Web Designer, IT - Web Shared Services
UNIFI Information Technology 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(513) 595 -2391



Aubrey Morrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
09/18/2008 12:31 PM
Please respond to
wsg@webstandardsgroup.org


To
wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
cc

Subject
Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly






Anya,

It just makes good business sense, If you can write what would normally 
take 40 lines of code to do and can condense it to a half dozen. That's 
reason enough for me.

Today's customers are demanding a lot more for less so if you can do 
something in half the time - why not.

Regards

Aubrey


[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> I've been trying to convince people here at work to  use JQuery for 
> UI, but most are reluctant, because it's a framework. 
> Any good arguments of Why it is still OK to use JQuery?
>
>
> Anya V.  Gerasimchuk
> Web Designer, IT - Web Shared Services
> UNIFI Information Technology
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> (513) 595 -2391
>
>
> *Aubrey Morrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>*
> Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> 09/18/2008 12:04 PM
> Please respond to
> wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
>
>
> 
> To
>    wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> cc
> 
> Subject
>Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
>
> Simon,
>
> Get into jQuery man. Plain old javascript just doesn't cut it. Best
> library I have used.
> Bit of a learning curve but well worth getting your head around.
>
> Have fun: http://jquery.com/
>
> Regards
>
> Aubrey
>
>
>
>
> Simon wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly, and by 
> this I
> > mean not filling my page with onclick and sending hrefs to #. But 
> instead
> > abstracting it all into the .js file and keeping my markup clean.
> >
> > I've followed the book by Jeremy Keith called DOM Scripting which 
> teaches
> > just that but it only goes so far. Everywhere else I look seems to 
> have all
> > the old school techniques which I want to shy away from.
> >
> > Does anyone have any resources?
> >
> > Thanks so much
> > Simon
> >
> >
> >
> > ***
> > List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> > Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> > Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > ***
> >
> >
> > 
>
>
>
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
***[attachment 

> "aubrey.vcf" deleted by Anya Gerasimchuk/UnionCentral]
>
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> *** 



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***[attachment 
"aubrey.vcf" deleted by Anya Gerasimchuk/UnionCentral] 


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[David Dorward]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I've been trying to convince people here at work to  use JQuery for
> UI, but most are reluctant, because it's a framework.  
They are reluctant because it has prewritten code to handle a bunch of
common tasks that lots of people want to do (and, as a result, is
robuster then most homebrew things because it has more eyes spotting
problems and fixing bugs)?

> Any good arguments of Why it is still OK to use JQuery?
"It's a framework" should be a good one.

-- 
David Dorward
http://dorward.me.uk/



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Aubrey Morrell]

Anya,

It just makes good business sense, If you can write what would normally 
take 40 lines of code to do and can condense it to a half dozen. That's 
reason enough for me.


Today's customers are demanding a lot more for less so if you can do 
something in half the time - why not.


Regards

Aubrey


[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


I've been trying to convince people here at work to  use JQuery for 
UI, but most are reluctant, because it's a framework.  
Any good arguments of Why it is still OK to use JQuery?



Anya V.  Gerasimchuk
Web Designer, IT - Web Shared Services
UNIFI Information Technology
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(513) 595 -2391


*Aubrey Morrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>*
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

09/18/2008 12:04 PM
Please respond to
wsg@webstandardsgroup.org



To
wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
cc
    
Subject
    Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly









Simon,

Get into jQuery man. Plain old javascript just doesn't cut it. Best
library I have used.
Bit of a learning curve but well worth getting your head around.

Have fun: http://jquery.com/

Regards

Aubrey




Simon wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly, and by 
this I
> mean not filling my page with onclick and sending hrefs to #. But 
instead

> abstracting it all into the .js file and keeping my markup clean.
>
> I've followed the book by Jeremy Keith called DOM Scripting which 
teaches
> just that but it only goes so far. Everywhere else I look seems to 
have all

> the old school techniques which I want to shy away from.
>
> Does anyone have any resources?
>
> Thanks so much
> Simon
>
>
>
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> ***
>
>
>  




***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***[attachment 
"aubrey.vcf" deleted by Anya Gerasimchuk/UnionCentral]


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
*** 




***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***begin:vcard
fn:Aubrey Morrell
n:Morrell;Aubrey
org:ambiguousmoose
adr:Beverley;;28 Mace View;;East Yorkshire;HU17 8YP;England
email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
tel;home:01482 880021
tel;cell:07952 314 823
url:www.ambiguousmoose.co.uk
version:2.1
end:vcard

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[AGerasimchuk]

I've been trying to convince people here at work to  use JQuery for UI, 
but most are reluctant, because it's a framework. 
Any good arguments of Why it is still OK to use JQuery?


Anya V.  Gerasimchuk
Web Designer, IT - Web Shared Services
UNIFI Information Technology 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(513) 595 -2391



Aubrey Morrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
09/18/2008 12:04 PM
Please respond to
wsg@webstandardsgroup.org


To
wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
cc

Subject
Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly






Simon,

Get into jQuery man. Plain old javascript just doesn't cut it. Best 
library I have used.
Bit of a learning curve but well worth getting your head around.

Have fun: http://jquery.com/

Regards

Aubrey




Simon wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly, and by this 
I
> mean not filling my page with onclick and sending hrefs to #. But 
instead
> abstracting it all into the .js file and keeping my markup clean.
>
> I've followed the book by Jeremy Keith called DOM Scripting which 
teaches
> just that but it only goes so far. Everywhere else I look seems to have 
all
> the old school techniques which I want to shy away from.
>
> Does anyone have any resources?
>
> Thanks so much
> Simon
>
>
>
> ***
> List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
> Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> ***
>
>
> 



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***[attachment 
"aubrey.vcf" deleted by Anya Gerasimchuk/UnionCentral] 


***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Aubrey Morrell]

Simon,

Get into jQuery man. Plain old javascript just doesn't cut it. Best 
library I have used.

Bit of a learning curve but well worth getting your head around.

Have fun: http://jquery.com/

Regards

Aubrey




Simon wrote:

Hi all,

I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly, and by this I
mean not filling my page with onclick and sending hrefs to #. But instead
abstracting it all into the .js file and keeping my markup clean.

I've followed the book by Jeremy Keith called DOM Scripting which teaches
just that but it only goes so far. Everywhere else I look seems to have all
the old school techniques which I want to shy away from.

Does anyone have any resources?

Thanks so much
Simon



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***


  




***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***begin:vcard
fn:Aubrey Morrell
n:Morrell;Aubrey
org:ambiguousmoose
adr:Beverley;;28 Mace View;;East Yorkshire;HU17 8YP;England
email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
tel;home:01482 880021
tel;cell:07952 314 823
url:www.ambiguousmoose.co.uk
version:2.1
end:vcard

Re: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Jeffrey Sambells]

Well I could suggest AdvancED DOM Scripting but I'm a little biased  
since I wrote it :)


--
Jeffrey Sambells
PHP5 Zend Certified Engineer

On 18-Sep-08, at 11:01 AM, Simon wrote:


Hi all,

I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly, and by  
this I
mean not filling my page with onclick and sending hrefs to #. But  
instead

abstracting it all into the .js file and keeping my markup clean.

I've followed the book by Jeremy Keith called DOM Scripting which  
teaches
just that but it only goes so far. Everywhere else I look seems to  
have all

the old school techniques which I want to shy away from.

Does anyone have any resources?

Thanks so much
Simon



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***





***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

RE: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[michael.brockington]

I think that is going to depend a lot on what you are trying to do with
your JS knowledge: are we talking about animation, AJAX or something
entirely different?

Regards,
Mike
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Simon
Sent: 18 September 2008 16:02
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] Learning Javascript properly

Hi all,

I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly, and by this
I mean not filling my page with onclick and sending hrefs to #. But
instead abstracting it all into the .js file and keeping my markup
clean.

I've followed the book by Jeremy Keith called DOM Scripting which
teaches just that but it only goes so far. Everywhere else I look seems
to have all the old school techniques which I want to shy away from.

Does anyone have any resources?

Thanks so much
Simon



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***

[WSG] Learning Javascript properly

[Simon]

Hi all,

I really want to get stuck in and learn Javascript properly, and by this I
mean not filling my page with onclick and sending hrefs to #. But instead
abstracting it all into the .js file and keeping my markup clean.

I've followed the book by Jeremy Keith called DOM Scripting which teaches
just that but it only goes so far. Everywhere else I look seems to have all
the old school techniques which I want to shy away from.

Does anyone have any resources?

Thanks so much
Simon



***
List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
***