Re: [WSG] Target Attributes
frames, iframes and targets become modules in XHTML 1.1. So they will still be around, but not in the core XHTML DTD. Fascinating stuff. I had no idea about modules. I'll have to read in detail before I can claim to understand the whole thing, but at least it solves the mystery and shows how frames fit into the overall strategy. Have You Validated Your Code? John Horner(+612 / 02) 9333 2110 Senior Developer, ABC Online http://www.abc.net.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Target Attributes
The last thing I want to do is start the can I open new windows debate again -- my question is, are we not allowed to use frames any more? To put it another way, I believe that frames should be avoided in all situations *except* the building of online applications. If one wants to build an online email app for instance, surely the use of frames is still valid (in the colloquial rather than the code sense)? But if I were to build that online application, with a left and right frame, and I wanted to make my links in the left frame targe the right frame, they couldn't ever be valid [X]HTML strict. My thought was that there should be a strict DTD which still allows targets, for use in these contexts, but there doesn't seem to be. What am I missing? Do web standards simply forbid frames outright? Have You Validated Your Code? John Horner(+612 / 02) 9333 2110 Senior Developer, ABC Online http://www.abc.net.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Target Attributes
Isn't that what XHTML-1.0-Frameset is for?? http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/#a_dtd_XHTML-1.0-Frameset - Original Message - From: John Horner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 9:28 AM Subject: [WSG] Target Attributes | The last thing I want to do is start the can I open new windows | debate again -- my question is, are we not allowed to use frames any | more? | | To put it another way, I believe that frames should be avoided in all | situations *except* the building of online applications. If one wants | to build an online email app for instance, surely the use of frames | is still valid (in the colloquial rather than the code sense)? | | But if I were to build that online application, with a left and right | frame, and I wanted to make my links in the left frame targe the | right frame, they couldn't ever be valid [X]HTML strict. | | My thought was that there should be a strict DTD which still allows | targets, for use in these contexts, but there doesn't seem to be. | What am I missing? Do web standards simply forbid frames outright? | |Have You Validated Your Code? | John Horner(+612 / 02) 9333 2110 | Senior Developer, ABC Online http://www.abc.net.au/ | | | ** | The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ | | See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm | for some hints on posting to the list getting help | ** | | ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Target Attributes
Isn't that what XHTML-1.0-Frameset is for?? http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/#a_dtd_XHTML-1.0-Frameset Well no, the FRAMESET document is the one which defines the frames, i.e. it would say that left.html occupies 25% of the window and right.html occupies the remaining 75%, but I'm talking about the code in left.html and right.html themselves. Those documents cannot be valid strict HTML if they have target attributes in the links. Have You Validated Your Code? John Horner(+612 / 02) 9333 2110 Senior Developer, ABC Online http://www.abc.net.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Target Attributes
I had the same question with the same use in mind: web applications. What you're presumably driving at is that pages look to need be either XHTML 1.0 Transitional or Frameset in order to allow the target attribute. The question that follows from that, albeit somewhat academic at this stage, is where does that leave frames in the future specs? I'm working on an application that uses iframes in it's admin section so I'm also curious about this, yet haven't been able to find a definitive answer. Nick Isn't that what XHTML-1.0-Frameset is for?? http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/#a_dtd_XHTML-1.0-Frameset Well no, the FRAMESET document is the one which defines the frames, i.e. it would say that left.html occupies 25% of the window and right.html occupies the remaining 75%, but I'm talking about the code in left.html and right.html themselves. Those documents cannot be valid strict HTML if they have target attributes in the links. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Target Attributes - alternative to frames
Have you seen Flex from Macromedia? I think digital web did an article on it a couple of week back. http://www.macromedia.com/software/flex/solutions/business/ If you check out the first example on the page about the shopping cart, the forms are very usable. Although I guess it could cost a bit to develop maybe. Tim Hill Computer Associates Graphic Artist tel: +612 9937 0792 fax: +612 9937 0546 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Horner Sent: Tuesday, 26 October 2004 9:28 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WSG] Target Attributes The last thing I want to do is start the can I open new windows debate again -- my question is, are we not allowed to use frames any more? To put it another way, I believe that frames should be avoided in all situations *except* the building of online applications. If one wants to build an online email app for instance, surely the use of frames is still valid (in the colloquial rather than the code sense)? But if I were to build that online application, with a left and right frame, and I wanted to make my links in the left frame targe the right frame, they couldn't ever be valid [X]HTML strict. My thought was that there should be a strict DTD which still allows targets, for use in these contexts, but there doesn't seem to be. What am I missing? Do web standards simply forbid frames outright? Have You Validated Your Code? John Horner(+612 / 02) 9333 2110 Senior Developer, ABC Online http://www.abc.net.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Target Attributes
You are correct, you can not use a strict XHTML doctype if you want to use the target attribute. You can use transitional XHTML. ./tdw On 2004-10-26 3:44 PM, John Horner wrote: Isn't that what XHTML-1.0-Frameset is for?? http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/#a_dtd_XHTML-1.0-Frameset Well no, the FRAMESET document is the one which defines the frames, i.e. it would say that left.html occupies 25% of the window and right.html occupies the remaining 75%, but I'm talking about the code in left.html and right.html themselves. Those documents cannot be valid strict HTML if they have target attributes in the links. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Target Attributes
frames, iframes and targets become modules in XHTML 1.1. So they will still be around, but not in the core XHTML DTD. A brief overview of XHTML and modules can be found here: http://www.juicystudio.com/tutorial/xhtml/index.asp ./tdw On 2004-10-26 5:28 PM, Nick Lo wrote: I had the same question with the same use in mind: web applications. What you're presumably driving at is that pages look to need be either XHTML 1.0 Transitional or Frameset in order to allow the target attribute. The question that follows from that, albeit somewhat academic at this stage, is where does that leave frames in the future specs? I'm working on an application that uses iframes in it's admin section so I'm also curious about this, yet haven't been able to find a definitive answer. Nick ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
