Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Jan Brasna]

I think border-radius would be off assistance here
In case you have only rounded corners... What about some kind of "worn" 
design with torn paper etc.?

I think it should be specificable whether you want the main background 
to be visible on the place of these corners...

--
Jan Brasna aka JohnyB :: alphanumeric.cz | janbrasna.com
Stop IE! -  | 
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Andrew Krespanis]

David R wrote:
> Suppose you have a  element and give it 5 background images and a
> background color:
[...]
> ...Wouldn't the background colour of the element show through the
> transparency of the image, thus rendering any round-corner images using
> transparency useless?

Yes, that is my understanding also. I think border-radius would be off
assistance here, provided the edge of the png is a curve...

Sounds like a bit of a gap in the spec, perhaps you should chase them
up about it? :)

Andrew,
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[ByteDreams]

thxs, LH.  Looks llike I'll have to keep an eye on your site then.  :)
- Original Message - 
From: "Lachlan Hardy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2005 4:35 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] CSS3.0


> ByteDreams wrote:
> > I'm a newbie, I admit, so allow me to ask a dumb question.  Are there
any
> > browsers currently supporting some of these CSS3 modules?  I sure would
like
> > to try some experimental stuff with these tags if there are...
>
> Try Blake Scarborough's piece from last November: Looking Around the
> Corner at CSS3 [1]
>
> And Stuart Langridge's article from August 2002(!): External Links the
> CSS Way [2]
>
> The latter illustrates one relatively common use of substring matching
> that the former fails to mention
>
> Personally, I use CSS3 in a 'progressive enhancement' fashion. None of
> my pages rely on it, but if you have a supporting browser you get a few
> bonuses
>
> Enjoy!
> Lachlan
>
> [1] http://www.blakems.com/archives/88.html
> [2] http://www.kryogenix.org/days/2002/08/30/external
> **
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>
>  See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
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>
>
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[ByteDreams]

Thnks all.  It seems the multiple background image ability is not supported
in any of these browsers.  I would have loved to try this out the most.

ByteDreams
- Original Message - 
From: "Philippe Wittenbergh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2005 8:31 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] CSS3.0


>
> On 18 Feb 2005, at 2:42 am, Kornel Lesinski wrote:
>
> >> I'm a newbie, I admit, so allow me to ask a dumb question.  Are there
> >> any
> >> browsers currently supporting some of these CSS3 modules?
> >
> > Yes. Experiments, some using CSS3, are in CSS section on
> > literarymoose.info
> >
> > Gecko support some CSS3 selectors,
> > Opera supports part of CSS3 Generated Content module,
> > and IE is a base for Asian text in CSS3 Text module.
>
> And Safari 1.2 has about the same level of support for CSS3 selectors
> as Gecko. (Safari support ::selection ! Gecko -moz::selection)
> Opacity (color module) is supported by both Gecko and Safari; Safari
> has some more support for this module, but it is uneven (rgba).
> I wish nth-child was supported  -)
>
> Safari 2 might surprise us in this field, when it is released.
>
> IE win supports lots of the CSS3 text-module, although with a different
> syntax sometimes. Esp good for Asian text (text-align:justify;
> text-justify:inter-ideograph is very cool in IE for longer articles).
>
> Philippe
> ---/---
> Philippe Wittenbergh
> now live : <http://emps.l-c-n.com/>
> code | design | web projects : <http://www.l-c-n.com/>
> IE5 Mac bugs and oddities : <http://www.l-c-n.com/IE5tests/>
>
> **
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>
>  See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
>  for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
> **
>
>
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[David R]

ByteDreams wrote:
Thnks all.  It seems the multiple background image ability is not supported
in any of these browsers.  I would have loved to try this out the most.
I've just been reading the spec
But I'm still unclear on one thing:
Suppose you have a  element and give it 5 background images and a 
background color:

one bg image for each corner and a bottom gradient, with a background 
color to fill in the bits not overed by the bottom gradient.

Suppose the corner images are rounded edges (PNG format) with alpha 
transparency.

...Wouldn't the background colour of the element show through the 
transparency of the image, thus rendering any round-corner images using 
transparency useless?

...Or does the spec call for the background image to be clipped where 
there's a background image? Or perhaps an attribute for the 
background-image property? "background-image-clips-bgcolor: true;" or 
something.

--
-David R
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[ByteDreams]

thxs, LH.  Looks llike I'll have to keep an eye on your site then.  :)
- Original Message - 
From: "Lachlan Hardy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2005 4:35 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] CSS3.0


> ByteDreams wrote:
> > I'm a newbie, I admit, so allow me to ask a dumb question.  Are there
any
> > browsers currently supporting some of these CSS3 modules?  I sure would
like
> > to try some experimental stuff with these tags if there are...
>
> Try Blake Scarborough's piece from last November: Looking Around the
> Corner at CSS3 [1]
>
> And Stuart Langridge's article from August 2002(!): External Links the
> CSS Way [2]
>
> The latter illustrates one relatively common use of substring matching
> that the former fails to mention
>
> Personally, I use CSS3 in a 'progressive enhancement' fashion. None of
> my pages rely on it, but if you have a supporting browser you get a few
> bonuses
>
> Enjoy!
> Lachlan
>
> [1] http://www.blakems.com/archives/88.html
> [2] http://www.kryogenix.org/days/2002/08/30/external
> **
> The discussion list for  http://webstandardsgroup.org/
>
>  See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
>  for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
> **
>
>
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[ByteDreams]

Thnks all.  It seems the multiple background image ability is not supported
in any of these browsers.  I would have loved to try this out the most.

ByteDreams
- Original Message - 
From: "Philippe Wittenbergh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2005 8:31 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] CSS3.0


>
> On 18 Feb 2005, at 2:42 am, Kornel Lesinski wrote:
>
> >> I'm a newbie, I admit, so allow me to ask a dumb question.  Are there
> >> any
> >> browsers currently supporting some of these CSS3 modules?
> >
> > Yes. Experiments, some using CSS3, are in CSS section on
> > literarymoose.info
> >
> > Gecko support some CSS3 selectors,
> > Opera supports part of CSS3 Generated Content module,
> > and IE is a base for Asian text in CSS3 Text module.
>
> And Safari 1.2 has about the same level of support for CSS3 selectors
> as Gecko. (Safari support ::selection ! Gecko -moz::selection)
> Opacity (color module) is supported by both Gecko and Safari; Safari
> has some more support for this module, but it is uneven (rgba).
> I wish nth-child was supported  -)
>
> Safari 2 might surprise us in this field, when it is released.
>
> IE win supports lots of the CSS3 text-module, although with a different
> syntax sometimes. Esp good for Asian text (text-align:justify;
> text-justify:inter-ideograph is very cool in IE for longer articles).
>
> Philippe
> ---/---
> Philippe Wittenbergh
> now live : <http://emps.l-c-n.com/>
> code | design | web projects : <http://www.l-c-n.com/>
> IE5 Mac bugs and oddities : <http://www.l-c-n.com/IE5tests/>
>
> **
> The discussion list for  http://webstandardsgroup.org/
>
>  See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
>  for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
> **
>
>
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Philippe Wittenbergh]

On 18 Feb 2005, at 2:42 am, Kornel Lesinski wrote:
I'm a newbie, I admit, so allow me to ask a dumb question.  Are there 
any
browsers currently supporting some of these CSS3 modules?
Yes. Experiments, some using CSS3, are in CSS section on 
literarymoose.info

Gecko support some CSS3 selectors,
Opera supports part of CSS3 Generated Content module,
and IE is a base for Asian text in CSS3 Text module.
And Safari 1.2 has about the same level of support for CSS3 selectors 
as Gecko. (Safari support ::selection ! Gecko -moz::selection)
Opacity (color module) is supported by both Gecko and Safari; Safari 
has some more support for this module, but it is uneven (rgba).
I wish nth-child was supported  -)

Safari 2 might surprise us in this field, when it is released.
IE win supports lots of the CSS3 text-module, although with a different 
syntax sometimes. Esp good for Asian text (text-align:justify; 
text-justify:inter-ideograph is very cool in IE for longer articles).

Philippe
---/---
Philippe Wittenbergh
now live : 
code | design | web projects : 
IE5 Mac bugs and oddities : 
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Lachlan Hardy]

ByteDreams wrote:
I'm a newbie, I admit, so allow me to ask a dumb question.  Are there any
browsers currently supporting some of these CSS3 modules?  I sure would like
to try some experimental stuff with these tags if there are...
Try Blake Scarborough's piece from last November: Looking Around the 
Corner at CSS3 [1]

And Stuart Langridge's article from August 2002(!): External Links the 
CSS Way [2]

The latter illustrates one relatively common use of substring matching 
that the former fails to mention

Personally, I use CSS3 in a 'progressive enhancement' fashion. None of 
my pages rely on it, but if you have a supporting browser you get a few 
bonuses

Enjoy!
Lachlan
[1] http://www.blakems.com/archives/88.html
[2] http://www.kryogenix.org/days/2002/08/30/external
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Kornel Lesinski]

On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:02:22 -0500, ByteDreams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I'm a newbie, I admit, so allow me to ask a dumb question.  Are there any
browsers currently supporting some of these CSS3 modules?
Yes. Experiments, some using CSS3, are in CSS section on literarymoose.info
Gecko support some CSS3 selectors,
Opera supports part of CSS3 Generated Content module,
and IE is a base for Asian text in CSS3 Text module.
--
regards, Kornel Lesiński
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Hopkins Programming]

There is some CSS3 support in Firefox and maybe Opera, I believe.

--Zachary


On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:02:22 -0500, ByteDreams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm a newbie, I admit, so allow me to ask a dumb question.  Are there any
> browsers currently supporting some of these CSS3 modules?  I sure would like
> to try some experimental stuff with these tags if there are...
> 
> ByteDreams
> - Original Message -
> From: "Dean Jackson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2005 10:40 AM
> Subject: Re: [WSG] CSS3.0
> 
> > I realise that many people have already responded.
> > Sorry for the echo. I'm not in the CSS working group, but
> > I do work for W3C.
> >
> > On 17 Feb 2005, at 10:31, David R wrote:
> >
> > > Just out of curiosity...
> > >
> > > Is the CSS3.0 Spec finalised, or are they still accepting suggestions
> > > and comments?
> >
> > I'm not sure there will ever be a CSS 3.0 spec. Rather, CSS 3 (the
> > technology) consists of a number of modules. Some modules are further
> > along the standardisation process than others. I'm also not sure that
> > the CSS WG have ruled out adding new modules or removing existing ones
> > (for a good reason of course :). Maybe once all the modules are W3C
> > Recommendations, there will be a proclamation that CSS 3 exists.
> >
> > Are we still accepting comments? Yes. We accept comments at any time in
> > the process. Some Web Essentials 04 attendees may remember somewhere
> > during one of my incomprehensible rants I mentioned that the phases
> > "Last Call" and "Candidate Recommendation" are very important because
> > there is an obligation for the W3C to respond to every comment (no
> > matter from where it comes). Most Working Groups try to respond to all
> > comments all the time, but that can be very time consuming (especially
> > for a popular tech like CSS).
> >
> > So please, send in your comments. On anything W3C-related.
> >
> > In my perfect world, you'd all feel as if you are part of W3C. You
> > already have a huge influence on the work, even though you may not be
> > the ones sitting around a table and fighting.
> >
> > >
> > > Because I really want to suggest "multiple background images" for
> > > CSS3.0 (provided it isn't suggested already)
> >
> > Multiple people have pointed at yesterday's draft which has this
> > feature.
> >
> > [Aside: My personal opinion, as someone who is more graphics oriented,
> > is that this solution still needs work]
> >
> > > Where do I find the "Suggestion Box" for the W3C? ;)
> >
> > For CSS, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >
> > Dean
> > --
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > **
> > The discussion list for  http://webstandardsgroup.org/
> >
> >  See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> >  for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
> > **
> >
> >
> **
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>  for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
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> 
> 


-- 
==
"The best way to predict the future is to invent it." 

 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 http://www.hopkinsprogramming.net
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[ByteDreams]

I'm a newbie, I admit, so allow me to ask a dumb question.  Are there any
browsers currently supporting some of these CSS3 modules?  I sure would like
to try some experimental stuff with these tags if there are...

ByteDreams
- Original Message - 
From: "Dean Jackson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2005 10:40 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] CSS3.0


> I realise that many people have already responded.
> Sorry for the echo. I'm not in the CSS working group, but
> I do work for W3C.
>
> On 17 Feb 2005, at 10:31, David R wrote:
>
> > Just out of curiosity...
> >
> > Is the CSS3.0 Spec finalised, or are they still accepting suggestions
> > and comments?
>
> I'm not sure there will ever be a CSS 3.0 spec. Rather, CSS 3 (the
> technology) consists of a number of modules. Some modules are further
> along the standardisation process than others. I'm also not sure that
> the CSS WG have ruled out adding new modules or removing existing ones
> (for a good reason of course :). Maybe once all the modules are W3C
> Recommendations, there will be a proclamation that CSS 3 exists.
>
> Are we still accepting comments? Yes. We accept comments at any time in
> the process. Some Web Essentials 04 attendees may remember somewhere
> during one of my incomprehensible rants I mentioned that the phases
> "Last Call" and "Candidate Recommendation" are very important because
> there is an obligation for the W3C to respond to every comment (no
> matter from where it comes). Most Working Groups try to respond to all
> comments all the time, but that can be very time consuming (especially
> for a popular tech like CSS).
>
> So please, send in your comments. On anything W3C-related.
>
> In my perfect world, you'd all feel as if you are part of W3C. You
> already have a huge influence on the work, even though you may not be
> the ones sitting around a table and fighting.
>
> >
> > Because I really want to suggest "multiple background images" for
> > CSS3.0 (provided it isn't suggested already)
>
> Multiple people have pointed at yesterday's draft which has this
> feature.
>
> [Aside: My personal opinion, as someone who is more graphics oriented,
> is that this solution still needs work]
>
> > Where do I find the "Suggestion Box" for the W3C? ;)
>
> For CSS, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> Dean
> --
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> **
> The discussion list for  http://webstandardsgroup.org/
>
>  See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
>  for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
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>
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Dean Jackson]

I realise that many people have already responded.
Sorry for the echo. I'm not in the CSS working group, but
I do work for W3C.
On 17 Feb 2005, at 10:31, David R wrote:
Just out of curiosity...
Is the CSS3.0 Spec finalised, or are they still accepting suggestions 
and comments?
I'm not sure there will ever be a CSS 3.0 spec. Rather, CSS 3 (the 
technology) consists of a number of modules. Some modules are further 
along the standardisation process than others. I'm also not sure that 
the CSS WG have ruled out adding new modules or removing existing ones 
(for a good reason of course :). Maybe once all the modules are W3C 
Recommendations, there will be a proclamation that CSS 3 exists.

Are we still accepting comments? Yes. We accept comments at any time in 
the process. Some Web Essentials 04 attendees may remember somewhere 
during one of my incomprehensible rants I mentioned that the phases 
"Last Call" and "Candidate Recommendation" are very important because 
there is an obligation for the W3C to respond to every comment (no 
matter from where it comes). Most Working Groups try to respond to all 
comments all the time, but that can be very time consuming (especially 
for a popular tech like CSS).

So please, send in your comments. On anything W3C-related.
In my perfect world, you'd all feel as if you are part of W3C. You 
already have a huge influence on the work, even though you may not be 
the ones sitting around a table and fighting.

Because I really want to suggest "multiple background images" for 
CSS3.0 (provided it isn't suggested already)
Multiple people have pointed at yesterday's draft which has this 
feature.

[Aside: My personal opinion, as someone who is more graphics oriented, 
is that this solution still needs work]

Where do I find the "Suggestion Box" for the W3C? ;)
For CSS, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dean
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[David R]

Jan Brasna wrote:
Maybe once when we'll all be old and CSS3 support will be common thing 
among the browsers, we'll be able to tell our children how this was 
complicated in our times... ;)

"In MY day we had to recreate FOUR DIVS to get rounded corners! *spits* 
YOU don't appreciate the HARD WORK we had to do!"

;)
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Jan Brasna]

But nevertheless  good timing, cause w3.org just released a  Working
Draft of CSS3 Backgrounds and Borders Module.
And it has multiple background images.
Great news!
Maybe once when we'll all be old and CSS3 support will be common thing 
among the browsers, we'll be able to tell our children how this was 
complicated in our times... ;)

--
Jan Brasna aka JohnyB :: alphanumeric.cz | janbrasna.com
Stop IE! -  | 
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Nils Kr. Falch]

On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 23:31:20 +, David R <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Just out of curiosity...
> 
> Is the CSS3.0 Spec finalised, or are they still accepting suggestions
> and comments?
> 
> Because I really want to suggest "multiple background images" for CSS3.0
> (provided it isn't suggested already)
> 
> Where do I find the "Suggestion Box" for the W3C? ;)

No, the CSS3.0 spec is not finished.

But nevertheless  good timing, cause w3.org just released a  Working
Draft of CSS3 Backgrounds and Borders Module.
http://www.w3.org/TR/2005/WD-css3-background-20050216/

And it has multiple background images.
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Andrew Krespanis]

Too late, it's already in there:
http://www.w3.org/TR/2005/WD-css3-background-20050216/#the-background-image

Most of the modules are at working draft stage, see the lot here:
http://www.w3.org/Style/CSS/current-work

Andrew.

http://leftjustified.net/


On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 23:31:20 +, David R <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Just out of curiosity...
> 
> Is the CSS3.0 Spec finalised, or are they still accepting suggestions
> and comments?
> 
> Because I really want to suggest "multiple background images" for CSS3.0
> (provided it isn't suggested already)
> 
> Where do I find the "Suggestion Box" for the W3C? ;)
> 
> Regards
> --
> -David R
> **
> The discussion list for  http://webstandardsgroup.org/
> 
>  See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
>  for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
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> 
> 


--
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Michael Cordover]

CSS 3 Backgrounds and Borders module is in Working Draft stage. 
http://w3.org/Style/CSS/current-work#contribute details the mailing
list which will allow you to make suggestions.

HTH,

Michael

On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 23:31:20 +, David R <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Just out of curiosity...
> 
> Is the CSS3.0 Spec finalised, or are they still accepting suggestions
> and comments?
> 
> Because I really want to suggest "multiple background images" for CSS3.0
> (provided it isn't suggested already)
> 
> Where do I find the "Suggestion Box" for the W3C? ;)
> 
> Regards
> --
> -David R
> **
> The discussion list for  http://webstandardsgroup.org/
> 
>  See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
>  for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
> **
> 
> 


-- 
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Philippe Wittenbergh]

On 17 Feb 2005, at 9:21 am, Philippe Wittenbergh wrote:
Because I really want to suggest "multiple background images" for 
CSS3.0 (provided it isn't suggested already)

Has already been suggested in various ways on the www-style mailing 
list.

Forgot to add, there is a new draft out
< http://www.w3.org/TR/2005/WD-css3-background-20050216>
Philippe
---/---
Philippe Wittenbergh
now live : 
code | design | web projects : 
IE5 Mac bugs and oddities : 
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Re: [WSG] CSS3.0

[Philippe Wittenbergh]

On 17 Feb 2005, at 8:31 am, David R wrote:
ust out of curiosity...
Is the CSS3.0 Spec finalised, or are they still accepting suggestions 
and comments?
Start your visit here

Nothing is finalised yet [1].
Because I really want to suggest "multiple background images" for 
CSS3.0 (provided it isn't suggested already)

Has already been suggested in various ways on the www-style mailing 
list.


[1] Even CSS2.1 isn't finalised yet, and will probably go through 
another round of last comments draft.
Philippe
---/---
Philippe Wittenbergh
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