Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
On 9/15/10 8:42 AM, Marvin Hunkin wrote: THINKING ABOUT REWRITING MY STAR TREK SITE AND THINKING ABOUT USING A CMS. MARVIN. That's a big order, Marvin. I am a designer rather than a developer but would think you may want to keep things very simple. This is an open-source XML based lite CMS. http://get-simple.info/start/ It may more than meet your need and will probably be a lot less frustrating in the long run... Best, ~d -- :: desktop and mobile :: http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
Marvin, I suggest you study more before choose any CMS to your project and verify wich better fit in your requirements. I use the three CMS's, and I prefer the Wordpress, because is more simple to configure and install. from my android Em 15/09/2010 12:25, David Laakso da...@chelseacreekstudio.comescreveu: On 9/15/10 8:42 AM, Marvin Hunkin wrote: THINKING ABOUT REWRITING MY STAR TREK SITE AND THINKING ABOUT USING A CMS. MARVIN. That's a big order, Marvin. I am a designer rather than a developer but would think you may want to keep things very simple. This is an open-source XML based lite CMS. http://get-simple.info/start/ http://get-simple.info/start/ It may more than meet your need and will probably be a lot less frustrating in the long run... Best, ~d -- :: desktop and mobile ::http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://websta... *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
Hi Marvin, If you are new to use any CMS me too suggest you start with Wordpress. Charith. Sent via BlackBerry® from Dialog -Original Message- From: Marcos Paulo Machado marcosp...@gmail.com Sender: li...@webstandardsgroup.orgdate: Wed, 15 Sep 2010 12:47:34 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Reply-to: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT Marvin, I suggest you study more before choose any CMS to your project and verify wich better fit in your requirements. I use the three CMS's, and I prefer the Wordpress, because is more simple to configure and install. from my android Em 15/09/2010 12:25, David Laakso da...@chelseacreekstudio.comescreveu: On 9/15/10 8:42 AM, Marvin Hunkin wrote: THINKING ABOUT REWRITING MY STAR TREK SITE AND THINKING ABOUT USING A CMS. MARVIN. That's a big order, Marvin. I am a designer rather than a developer but would think you may want to keep things very simple. This is an open-source XML based lite CMS. http://get-simple.info/start/ http://get-simple.info/start/ It may more than meet your need and will probably be a lot less frustrating in the long run... Best, ~d -- :: desktop and mobile ::http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://websta... *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
You may want to use use Wordpress for a start but consider TYPO3 for a professional development. Sunday John Solutions Provider Phone: 234 802 322 8712, 234 7029513356 Website: www.raphsonsolutions.com Email: sun...@raphsonsolutions.com --- @ WiseStamp Signaturehttp://my.wisestamp.com/link?u=wcxmvmfngt9pqscnsite=www.wisestamp.com/email-install. Get it nowhttp://my.wisestamp.com/link?u=wcxmvmfngt9pqscnsite=www.wisestamp.com/email-install On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 5:01 PM, charit...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Marvin, If you are new to use any CMS me too suggest you start with Wordpress. Charith. Sent via BlackBerry® from Dialog -- *From: * Marcos Paulo Machado marcosp...@gmail.com *Sender: * li...@webstandardsgroup.org *Date: *Wed, 15 Sep 2010 12:47:34 -0300 *To: *wsg@webstandardsgroup.org *ReplyTo: * wsg@webstandardsgroup.org *Subject: *Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT Marvin, I suggest you study more before choose any CMS to your project and verify wich better fit in your requirements. I use the three CMS's, and I prefer the Wordpress, because is more simple to configure and install. from my android Em 15/09/2010 12:25, David Laakso da...@chelseacreekstudio.com escreveu: On 9/15/10 8:42 AM, Marvin Hunkin wrote: THINKING ABOUT REWRITING MY STAR TREK SITE AND THINKING ABOUT USING A CMS. MARVIN. That's a big order, Marvin. I am a designer rather than a developer but would think you may want to keep things very simple. This is an open-source XML based lite CMS. http://get-simple.info/start/ http://get-simple.info/start/ It may more than meet your need and will probably be a lot less frustrating in the long run... Best, ~d -- :: desktop and mobile ::http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://websta... *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** -- Sunday John Solutions Provider Phone: 234 802 322 8712, 234 7029513356 Website: www.raphsonsolutions.com Email: sun...@raphsonsolutions.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
Does nobody see that this email is spam? The email makes no sense. Why would someone write a formal document for a star trek site *they *are /writing /themselves? Here's your first tip starvin Marvin. TURN CAPS LOCK OFF. -- Mark Host On 9/15/2010 7:42 AM, Marvin Hunkin wrote: HI. THINKING ABOUT REWRITING MY STAR TREK SITE AND THINKING ABOUT USING A CMS. LIKE JOOMLA, WORD PRESS, AND DROOPLE 7 WHEN IT COMES OUT. SO DOWNLOADED WAMP SERVER 2, AND GOT JOOMLA. BUT HAVING A BIT OF TROUBLE SETTING IT UP WITH JAWS. ANY ONE HAD EXPERIENCE WITH A CMS SYSTEM. AND WHAT DO I NEED TO SET IT UP. WILL BE WRITING A FORMAL REQUIREMENTS DOCUMENT OF THE PROJECT, AND THE TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS AND OUTLINING WHAT I WANT FOR THE PROJECT. THEN WHICH TOOL TO USE FOR THIS PROJECT. SO NO NEED TO BANG MY HEAD FOR CODING, USING SQL, AND GOT STUCK WITH THE CURRENT PROJECT. GOT WRITERS BLOCK, OR CODERS BLOCK. SO WAS THINKING OF MAYBE GOING WITH THIS APPORACH. IF ANY ONE HAS DONE THIS BEFORE. SO DO I JUST THEN TAKE MY TEXT, LINKS, AND MAYBE SET OUT WHAT NAVIGATION I WILL USE. ETC. ANY HELP WOULD BE GRATEFULLY APPRECIATED. MARVIN. PS: A LBIND COMPUTER USER, USING THE JAWS FOR WINDOWS SCREEN READER FROM HTTP://WWW.FREEDOMSCIENTIFIC.COM http://WWW.FREEDOMSCIENTIFIC.COM *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
RE: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
Hi Mark, In a normal state I would probably second your thoughts, but Marvin is NO spammer. Hes a blind coder, so its very probably that he didnt notice he was writing in Caps. Hes also been working on the Star Trek project for quite a while and besides, hes quite active on this list. So before assuming the obvious search for the user and youll see that hes no spammer. Cheers Raul _ De: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] En nombre de Mark Host Enviado el: miércoles, 15 de septiembre de 2010 18:31 Para: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Asunto: Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT Does nobody see that this email is spam? The email makes no sense. Why would someone write a formal document for a star trek site they are writing themselves? Here's your first tip starvin Marvin. TURN CAPS LOCK OFF. -- Mark Host On 9/15/2010 7:42 AM, Marvin Hunkin wrote: HI. THINKING ABOUT REWRITING MY STAR TREK SITE AND THINKING ABOUT USING A CMS. LIKE JOOMLA, WORD PRESS, AND DROOPLE 7 WHEN IT COMES OUT. SO DOWNLOADED WAMP SERVER 2, AND GOT JOOMLA. BUT HAVING A BIT OF TROUBLE SETTING IT UP WITH JAWS. ANY ONE HAD EXPERIENCE WITH A CMS SYSTEM. AND WHAT DO I NEED TO SET IT UP. WILL BE WRITING A FORMAL REQUIREMENTS DOCUMENT OF THE PROJECT, AND THE TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS AND OUTLINING WHAT I WANT FOR THE PROJECT. THEN WHICH TOOL TO USE FOR THIS PROJECT. SO NO NEED TO BANG MY HEAD FOR CODING, USING SQL, AND GOT STUCK WITH THE CURRENT PROJECT. GOT WRITERS BLOCK, OR CODERS BLOCK. SO WAS THINKING OF MAYBE GOING WITH THIS APPORACH. IF ANY ONE HAS DONE THIS BEFORE. SO DO I JUST THEN TAKE MY TEXT, LINKS, AND MAYBE SET OUT WHAT NAVIGATION I WILL USE. ETC. ANY HELP WOULD BE GRATEFULLY APPRECIATED. MARVIN. PS: A LBIND COMPUTER USER, USING THE JAWS FOR WINDOWS SCREEN READER FROM HTTP://WWW.FREEDOMSCIENTIFIC.COM *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
Mark, Marvin has been a member of this group for a long time and he's to be commended for his never-ceasing efforts to develop websites without the gift of sight. Joseph R. B. Taylor /Web Designer / Developer/ -- Sites by Joe, LLC /Clean, Simple and Elegant Web Design/ Phone: (609) 335-3076 Web: http://sitesbyjoe.com Email: j...@sitesbyjoe.com On 9/15/10 12:30 PM, Mark Host wrote: Does nobody see that this email is spam? The email makes no sense. Why would someone write a formal document for a star trek site *they *are /writing /themselves? Here's your first tip starvin Marvin. TURN CAPS LOCK OFF. -- Mark Host On 9/15/2010 7:42 AM, Marvin Hunkin wrote: HI. THINKING ABOUT REWRITING MY STAR TREK SITE AND THINKING ABOUT USING A CMS. LIKE JOOMLA, WORD PRESS, AND DROOPLE 7 WHEN IT COMES OUT. SO DOWNLOADED WAMP SERVER 2, AND GOT JOOMLA. BUT HAVING A BIT OF TROUBLE SETTING IT UP WITH JAWS. ANY ONE HAD EXPERIENCE WITH A CMS SYSTEM. AND WHAT DO I NEED TO SET IT UP. WILL BE WRITING A FORMAL REQUIREMENTS DOCUMENT OF THE PROJECT, AND THE TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS AND OUTLINING WHAT I WANT FOR THE PROJECT. THEN WHICH TOOL TO USE FOR THIS PROJECT. SO NO NEED TO BANG MY HEAD FOR CODING, USING SQL, AND GOT STUCK WITH THE CURRENT PROJECT. GOT WRITERS BLOCK, OR CODERS BLOCK. SO WAS THINKING OF MAYBE GOING WITH THIS APPORACH. IF ANY ONE HAS DONE THIS BEFORE. SO DO I JUST THEN TAKE MY TEXT, LINKS, AND MAYBE SET OUT WHAT NAVIGATION I WILL USE. ETC. ANY HELP WOULD BE GRATEFULLY APPRECIATED. MARVIN. PS: A LBIND COMPUTER USER, USING THE JAWS FOR WINDOWS SCREEN READER FROM HTTP://WWW.FREEDOMSCIENTIFIC.COM http://WWW.FREEDOMSCIENTIFIC.COM *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
My apologies to Marvin and everyone on the list. Mark Host On 9/15/2010 11:50 AM, Joseph Taylor wrote: Mark, Marvin has been a member of this group for a long time and he's to be commended for his never-ceasing efforts to develop websites without the gift of sight. Joseph R. B. Taylor /Web Designer / Developer/ -- Sites by Joe, LLC /Clean, Simple and Elegant Web Design/ Phone: (609) 335-3076 Web: http://sitesbyjoe.com Email: j...@sitesbyjoe.com On 9/15/10 12:30 PM, Mark Host wrote: Does nobody see that this email is spam? The email makes no sense. Why would someone write a formal document for a star trek site *they *are /writing /themselves? Here's your first tip starvin Marvin. TURN CAPS LOCK OFF. -- Mark Host On 9/15/2010 7:42 AM, Marvin Hunkin wrote: HI. THINKING ABOUT REWRITING MY STAR TREK SITE AND THINKING ABOUT USING A CMS. LIKE JOOMLA, WORD PRESS, AND DROOPLE 7 WHEN IT COMES OUT. SO DOWNLOADED WAMP SERVER 2, AND GOT JOOMLA. BUT HAVING A BIT OF TROUBLE SETTING IT UP WITH JAWS. ANY ONE HAD EXPERIENCE WITH A CMS SYSTEM. AND WHAT DO I NEED TO SET IT UP. WILL BE WRITING A FORMAL REQUIREMENTS DOCUMENT OF THE PROJECT, AND THE TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS AND OUTLINING WHAT I WANT FOR THE PROJECT. THEN WHICH TOOL TO USE FOR THIS PROJECT. SO NO NEED TO BANG MY HEAD FOR CODING, USING SQL, AND GOT STUCK WITH THE CURRENT PROJECT. GOT WRITERS BLOCK, OR CODERS BLOCK. SO WAS THINKING OF MAYBE GOING WITH THIS APPORACH. IF ANY ONE HAS DONE THIS BEFORE. SO DO I JUST THEN TAKE MY TEXT, LINKS, AND MAYBE SET OUT WHAT NAVIGATION I WILL USE. ETC. ANY HELP WOULD BE GRATEFULLY APPRECIATED. MARVIN. PS: A LBIND COMPUTER USER, USING THE JAWS FOR WINDOWS SCREEN READER FROM HTTP://WWW.FREEDOMSCIENTIFIC.COM http://WWW.FREEDOMSCIENTIFIC.COM *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
I've only been on this list for about 6 months or so, but foot has been placed firmly in mouth. Anyways, perhaps I should contribute something constructive. I think Joomla is bloated (though a very good CMS) and requires more of learning curve. Where as WordPress is a great all-around platform, particularly with the new version 3. Drupal is a great CMS, but again, probably too much bloat. I have been developing sites in Stacey http://staceyapp.com/ and playing with Perch http://grabaperch.com/ because they are lightweight and less clutter. Though, Stacey is probably not a great fit because it requires a bit more effort. I wonder how any of these CMS's work with screenreaders, given the long list of menus that aren't always used and heavy use of admin Javascript. Thanks for being an understanding group of individuals! -- Mark Host On 9/15/2010 12:30 PM, Raul Ferrer wrote: No worries, mate! As I said, if I was in another list I'd have thought probably the same thing. Cheers Raul *De:* li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] *En nombre de *Mark Host *Enviado el:* miércoles, 15 de septiembre de 2010 19:05 *Para:* wsg@webstandardsgroup.org *CC:* Joseph Taylor *Asunto:* Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT My apologies to Marvin and everyone on the list. Mark Host On 9/15/2010 11:50 AM, Joseph Taylor wrote: Mark, Marvin has been a member of this group for a long time and he's to be commended for his never-ceasing efforts to develop websites without the gift of sight. Joseph R. B. Taylor /Web Designer / Developer/ -- Sites by Joe, LLC /Clean, Simple and Elegant Web Design/ Phone: (609) 335-3076 Web: http://sitesbyjoe.com Email: j...@sitesbyjoe.com mailto:j...@sitesbyjoe.com On 9/15/10 12:30 PM, Mark Host wrote: Does nobody see that this email is spam? The email makes no sense. Why would someone write a formal document for a star trek site *they *are /writing /themselves? Here's your first tip starvin Marvin. TURN CAPS LOCK OFF. -- Mark Host On 9/15/2010 7:42 AM, Marvin Hunkin wrote: HI. THINKING ABOUT REWRITING MY STAR TREK SITE AND THINKING ABOUT USING A CMS. LIKE JOOMLA, WORD PRESS, AND DROOPLE 7 WHEN IT COMES OUT. SO DOWNLOADED WAMP SERVER 2, AND GOT JOOMLA. BUT HAVING A BIT OF TROUBLE SETTING IT UP WITH JAWS. ANY ONE HAD EXPERIENCE WITH A CMS SYSTEM. AND WHAT DO I NEED TO SET IT UP. WILL BE WRITING A FORMAL REQUIREMENTS DOCUMENT OF THE PROJECT, AND THE TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS AND OUTLINING WHAT I WANT FOR THE PROJECT. THEN WHICH TOOL TO USE FOR THIS PROJECT. SO NO NEED TO BANG MY HEAD FOR CODING, USING SQL, AND GOT STUCK WITH THE CURRENT PROJECT. GOT WRITERS BLOCK, OR CODERS BLOCK. SO WAS THINKING OF MAYBE GOING WITH THIS APPORACH. IF ANY ONE HAS DONE THIS BEFORE. SO DO I JUST THEN TAKE MY TEXT, LINKS, AND MAYBE SET OUT WHAT NAVIGATION I WILL USE. ETC. ANY HELP WOULD BE GRATEFULLY APPRECIATED. MARVIN. PS: A LBIND COMPUTER USER, USING THE JAWS FOR WINDOWS SCREEN READER FROM HTTP://WWW.FREEDOMSCIENTIFIC.COM http://WWW.FREEDOMSCIENTIFIC.COM *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org mailto:memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org mailto:memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org mailto:memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail
Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 8:47 AM, Marcos Paulo Machado marcosp...@gmail.com wrote: Marvin, I suggest you study more before choose any CMS to your project and verify wich better fit in your requirements. Totally agree with Paulo. In terms of CMS/Blogs, I like these: 1. ExpressionEngine http://expressionengine.com/ 2. Textpattern http://textpattern.com/ They are both more blog than CMS... I guess it really depends on your needs. EE has some good addons for managing flat pages. TXP is free whereas EE has a nominal yearly fee for the licensing. You also might consider a framework. I prefer these: 1. Django (Python) 2. CodeIgniter (PHP) Django is pretty dope... I think I like it better than CI, but the learning curve can be steep depending on your level of experience. You might also look at content management systems built using CI and/or Django: 1. Django-cms http://www.django-cms.org/ 2. Pinax You might also check out this site: Django Packages http://djangopackages.com/ Expression Engine 2.0 (their latest version) is built on CI. PyroCMS looks good (built on CI): http://pyrocms.com/ I do agree with the others who suggest WordPress though... If you are pretty new to CMS/Blog systems, with WP you will probably be up-and-running in no time. :) Good luck! Cheers, Micky *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
Re: [WSG] HELP WITH SETTING UP A CMS PROJECT
On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Micky Hulse mickyhulse.li...@gmail.com wrote: 2. Pinax Ooops, I forgot to include Pinax link: http://pinaxproject.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
