Re: [Zope3-dev] Changes to zope3 windows binary installer
Tim Peters wrote: The bad news is that Martin is an extremely capable PhD who worked on this across months; i.e., this was a major undertaking. The good news is that large parts of it are probably easily reusable -- by Martin ;-) Can we tempt him with beer to build a purdie one for Zope too? Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Changes to zope3 windows binary installer
[Tim Peters] >> ... I build the Zope3 Windows installer because nobody else will do it ... [Chris Withers] > If someone can give me instructions assuming I'm starting from > I-am-stupid-and-also-have-no-c-compilers-but-do-have-windows state, I'd > like to try and help :-) See the page referenced before: http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/ZopeWindowsRelease As it says, you do need an appropriate C compiler. > Any chance of us using hte build bot to build binary releases? I haven't used the buildbot code; don't know what it can and can't do; best guess is that it would be easy until it got to the parts of testing the Windows Service support that I do by staring at the Windows Services and Event Log GUIs. Testing that the service auto-starts after a reboot might also be a puzzle. > ... > Hmmm, is this what I'm asking for above? Yes. > ... > Could Mark Hammond be tickled ot help here? Don't know; doubt it (he hasn't shown any interest in doing this yet). > How does Python build its Windows installer? It seems nice enough :-) For 2.4+, it's a slick MSI-based installer, implemented by about 300KB of Python and C code in a Python checkout's Tools/msi/ directory. I believe only its author (Martin v. Löwis) understands it all. He presented a brief paper about it at PyCon in 2004: http://www.python.org/pycon/dc2004/papers/44/ The bad news is that Martin is an extremely capable PhD who worked on this across months; i.e., this was a major undertaking. The good news is that large parts of it are probably easily reusable -- by Martin ;-) ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Changes to zope3 windows binary installer
Tim Peters wrote: -1 on the last suggestion <0.1 wink>. I build the Zope3 Windows installer because nobody else will do it (and if you disagree with that statement, _you_ build it from now on ;-)). If someone can give me instructions assuming I'm starting from I-am-stupid-and-also-have-no-c-compilers-but-do-have-windows state, I'd like to try and help :-) Any chance of us using hte build bot to build binary releases? I wasn't involved in creating it, and I don't even know how it works, beyond that it's a vanilla distutils-based installer. The text I put on: http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/ZopeWindowsRelease came from trial-and-error reverse-engineering, not from an intimate understanding of the Zope3-on-Windows vision. Hmmm, is this what I'm asking for above? auto-install of Windows Services. The only hope for stuff like that is for someone to write MS-specific code to run from a post-installation script (which script distutils will run for you, if it's set up right) -- or move back to a wholly separate Windows-specific installer process (as Zope2 uses). Could Mark Hammond be tickled ot help here? The latter is high maintenance, and given how few "Windows people" contribute to Zope, unlikely to happen. The crushing advantage of a distutils-based installer is that some other project (namely, the Python project) does the hard work. How does Python build its Windows installer? It seems nice enough :-) cheers, Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
RE: [Zope3-dev] Changes to zope3 windows binary installer
Hi Tim [...] > [Roger Ineichen] > > Tim, > > > > don't use InnoSetup, > > I won't -- but then I'm not doing anything here ;-) > > > take a look at www.bitrock.com first. > > How does this relate to Michael Haubenwallner's list of specific > Zope3-on-Windows issues? Here's his list: > > http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-dev/2005-October/025439.html It just was a comment to your idea to write a InnoSetup installer. """ > I'll gladly answer any questions about what I wrote on the Wiki page > above, but I can't volunteer more than that. If I did have time to > work on it, I think I'd write a small InnoSetup script to install > program groups (etc -- this is very hard to do correctly writing to > the raw Windows API; that's why programs like InnoSetup are so > popular), and run _that_ from the distutils post-install script. > There would surely be lots of problems with that approach too. """ Again, don't use InnoSetup before you tried BitRock InstallBuilder from www.bitrock.com. Regards Roger Ineichen Projekt01 GmbH www.projekt01.ch > ___ > Zope3-dev mailing list > Zope3-dev@zope.org > Unsub: > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/dev%40projekt01.ch > > ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Changes to zope3 windows binary installer
[Roger Ineichen] > Tim, > > don't use InnoSetup, I won't -- but then I'm not doing anything here ;-) > take a look at www.bitrock.com first. How does this relate to Michael Haubenwallner's list of specific Zope3-on-Windows issues? Here's his list: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-dev/2005-October/025439.html ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
RE: [Zope3-dev] Changes to zope3 windows binary installer
Tim, don't use InnoSetup, take a look at www.bitrock.com first. The BitRock InstallBuilder is a amazing pice of software. I use it for build custom installers including Zope3, Tiks and some custom libraries for customer projects. "BitRock is a multiplatform installation tool for Linux, Windows, Mac OS X, FreeBSD, AIX, HP-UX and Solaris you can create native installers that are easy to use and run in GUI, text and unattended modes." I think the posibility to use this software on every platform and build installers for every platform is reason enough for take a look at BitRock. Regards Roger Ineichen > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of Tim Peters > Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2005 8:37 PM > To: Stephan Richter; Michael Haubenwallner > Cc: zope3-dev@zope.org > Subject: Re: [Zope3-dev] Changes to zope3 windows binary installer > > [Michael Haubenwallner] > >> I have put up a page of questions regarding the > installation process at > >> http://zopewiki.org/Zope3OnWindowsInstaller to help > writing down some > >> answers and to create a Howto for windows users. > > [Stephan Richter] > > It would be much better to put such documentation on our > Wiki, since it will > > got more exposure there. You also probably want to > communicate with Tim on > > how to improve the situation. > > -1 on the last suggestion <0.1 wink>. I build the Zope3 Windows > installer because nobody else will do it (and if you disagree with > that statement, _you_ build it from now on ;-)). I wasn't involved in > creating it, and I don't even know how it works, beyond that it's a > vanilla distutils-based installer. The text I put on: > > http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/ZopeWindowsRelease > > came from trial-and-error reverse-engineering, not from an intimate > understanding of the Zope3-on-Windows vision. > > Because it's a standard distutils installer, and because distutils > doesn't really aim at applications (let alone applications on > Windows), there is no support for things like program groups or > auto-install of Windows Services. The only hope for stuff like that > is for someone to write MS-specific code to run from a > post-installation script (which script distutils will run for you, if > it's set up right) -- or move back to a wholly separate > Windows-specific installer process (as Zope2 uses). The latter is > high maintenance, and given how few "Windows people" contribute to > Zope, unlikely to happen. The crushing advantage of a distutils-based > installer is that some other project (namely, the Python project) does > the hard work. > > I'll gladly answer any questions about what I wrote on the Wiki page > above, but I can't volunteer more than that. If I did have time to > work on it, I think I'd write a small InnoSetup script to install > program groups (etc -- this is very hard to do correctly writing to > the raw Windows API; that's why programs like InnoSetup are so > popular), and run _that_ from the distutils post-install script. > There would surely be lots of problems with that approach too. > ___ > Zope3-dev mailing list > Zope3-dev@zope.org > Unsub: > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/dev%40projekt01.ch > > ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Changes to zope3 windows binary installer
[Michael Haubenwallner] >> I have put up a page of questions regarding the installation process at >> http://zopewiki.org/Zope3OnWindowsInstaller to help writing down some >> answers and to create a Howto for windows users. [Stephan Richter] > It would be much better to put such documentation on our Wiki, since it will > got more exposure there. You also probably want to communicate with Tim on > how to improve the situation. -1 on the last suggestion <0.1 wink>. I build the Zope3 Windows installer because nobody else will do it (and if you disagree with that statement, _you_ build it from now on ;-)). I wasn't involved in creating it, and I don't even know how it works, beyond that it's a vanilla distutils-based installer. The text I put on: http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/ZopeWindowsRelease came from trial-and-error reverse-engineering, not from an intimate understanding of the Zope3-on-Windows vision. Because it's a standard distutils installer, and because distutils doesn't really aim at applications (let alone applications on Windows), there is no support for things like program groups or auto-install of Windows Services. The only hope for stuff like that is for someone to write MS-specific code to run from a post-installation script (which script distutils will run for you, if it's set up right) -- or move back to a wholly separate Windows-specific installer process (as Zope2 uses). The latter is high maintenance, and given how few "Windows people" contribute to Zope, unlikely to happen. The crushing advantage of a distutils-based installer is that some other project (namely, the Python project) does the hard work. I'll gladly answer any questions about what I wrote on the Wiki page above, but I can't volunteer more than that. If I did have time to work on it, I think I'd write a small InnoSetup script to install program groups (etc -- this is very hard to do correctly writing to the raw Windows API; that's why programs like InnoSetup are so popular), and run _that_ from the distutils post-install script. There would surely be lots of problems with that approach too. ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Changes to zope3 windows binary installer
On Wednesday 12 October 2005 04:56, Michael Haubenwallner wrote: > I have put up a page of questions regarding the installation process at > http://zopewiki.org/Zope3OnWindowsInstaller to help writing down some > answers and to create a Howto for windows users. It would be much better to put such documentation on our Wiki, since it will got more exposure there. You also probably want to communicate with Tim on how to improve the situation. Regards. Stephan -- Stephan Richter CBU Physics & Chemistry (B.S.) / Tufts Physics (Ph.D. student) Web2k - Web Software Design, Development and Training ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
