Hi all,

even the if the descripted solution (diffrent retry count) is better
then the old behavoir, me favorit is still the new code which i commit
and is now in trunk.

bye
Norman

Vincenzo Gianferrari Pini schrieb:
> Adding my 2c to Norman's example:
>
> Because of the scenario he described, I changed my config.xml long
> time ago to one day instead of 5 days of retry before giving up.
>
> I was planning to code in RemoteDelivery (and never did it) a kind of
> "warning bounce" feature to trigger after a few hours, while retrying
> for up to five days.
> But it would be much better if we could find a way to check if "my DNS
> server" is failing to resolve the domain because the recursed servers
> fail to resolve, and not because there is a network problem isolating
> my local  network.
>
> Or (a different approach) have a different retry policy (few hours
> instead of 5 days) for DNS resolution failures while keeping the
> longer 5 days period in case of target SMTP server failures: the
> difference is that there is a "world wide" cache system for DNS
> resolution, and if a domain name is not found in such cache it is
> *much* more probable that the domain is non-existent for real and not
> that there are network problems. What do you think?
>
> Vincenzo
>
> Norman Maurer wrote:
>> Noel J. Bergman schrieb:
>>  
>>> Norman,
>>>
>>>      
>>>> Noel J. Bergman schrieb:
>>>>          
>>>>> -1
>>>>>       The handling of this condition as temporary was very
>>>>> intentional, and
>>>>> in no way accidental.  This is a not uncommon problem.  The DNS
>>>>> can be
>>>>> wrong, and later corrected.  The problem is ascertaining whether a
>>>>> domain is non-existent for real (there is no registration record) or
>>>>> because of a temporary DNS configuration error.
>>>>>
>>>>> Consider the debate within the SPF council regarding whether or not
>>>>> NXDOMAIN was to be treated as a PermError or TempFail.
>>>>>               
>>>      
>>>> This was not the final solution. See revision 478589
>>>>           
>>> I am not happy with the change.  As I read it, r478589 is a bit
>>> better only if the local DNS server is down.  That's only one of
>>> several DNS related issues that can result in failure.
>>>
>>> Consider
>>> http://www.mhonarc.org/archive/html/spf-discuss/2005-05/msg00327.html. 
>>> I do consider the author of that particular e-mail to wrong because
>>> the intent of the SMTP specification is to put a very high degree of
>>> reliability on the delivery of mail.  We bias decisions to ensure
>>> delivery.  But the point is for you to read the real-world examples
>>> of DNS failure given to him as examples.  And, FWIW, I have seen
>>> similar errors and had mail lost by qmail that would not have been
>>> lost by JAMES.
>>>
>>> I am OK with optional filters for rejecting mail in-protocol if the
>>> MAIL FROM or even REPLY-TO domains are invalid (even temporarily),
>>> but I am *not* OK with hardcoding the change you are making to
>>> bounce mail because there is a transient DNS glitch on the delivery
>>> side.
>>>
>>> Do you understand now?
>>>
>>>     --- Noel
>>>
>>>       
>>
>> Hi Noel,
>>
>> i not agree with you. First of all if the nameserver is not configured
>> correctly etc we should not try to "take care" and give the admin a
>> chance to correct it He should get sure what he do before change the
>> config.. I think most admins and users want to get the error as soon as
>> possible. Let me  give you an example why the old behavoir is bad:
>>
>> Think about you have a  costumer where you installed james. He sended an
>> email with an importent text out and not notice that he has a misstyping
>> in the domainname. The domain he used as recipient domain does not
>> exists. But he not get the bounce back till the configured retry count
>> was reached.. (about 5 days). Because of that  he not notice that he had
>> a misstyping in the domainname, so he lost a job which whould hat
>> brought him 1 000 0000 Dollars. How you whould explain him this ?
>>
>> This is not acceptable for me.. If we have an other DNS error then a
>> temporary connection problem we should bounce as soon as possible.
>>
>> Don't get me wrong.. im not aggressiv.. I only try to explain you why i
>> think the old behavoir is really bad!
>>
>> bye
>> Norman
>>
>>
>>
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