OK, here's my response. Now, if this is a waste of my time and you've got a
stick up your ass and won't listen to reason, please post that fact so onone
else wastes their time. Otherwise, I hope this helps your concerns.
Howard Taylor wrote:
> I have been on this little "chat" board for less than 24 hours and I have
> seen enough to confirm to me that Java is a bad tool. I have never in my
> life seen a development tool that is so misunderstood. No one knows how to
> use. It is about as crude as COBOL. I have never seen anything like it.
>
I HAVE seen something like it -- on multiple C++ listservs and on many asp
listservs and on VB listserves (especially on VB listserves). In addition, you
have to understand that I get a few hundred emails a day between the JSP and
servlet lists. I am not tech support, nor is anyone else here. If it's
something odd that we don't feel they can find by picking up a book or that we
happen to know the answer to off of our heads and we don't currently have our
boss breathing down our necks to do real work, we'll answer the question.
Otherwise, we hit the delete button.
> The lack of professional documentation should send a strong message to the
> programming community. Error messages come up and there is no way in this
> world to find out what they mean. Just look at some of the questions that
> come across these emails. I have yet to see someone answer a question
> posted. That is because nobody can say with any degree of confidence that
> their solution will work from machine to machine.
ok, for the second part of this, see the above answer, for the first, there is
a nice set of documentation up on the web -- probably the best I've seen. Also,
many books have been published such as Core Java and Java in a Nutshell which
do a spectacular job of detailing the inner workings of the Java language.
> Isn't Java supposed to
> be OS independent? Why does code work on one machine and not another? Why
> are there so many different development tools that are supposed to do the
> same thing? Why is it that all of these tools install and leave a
> directory structure behind that a person using a different tool can't
> recognize? Java is just a huge shit sandwich that SUN is trying to ram
> down our throats in their little battle with Microsoft.
There is no battle against microsoft, for one. Microsoft released J++ as pure
Java, which it wasn't, and Sun got ticked. Microsoft stopped calling it pure
java, sun was hapy again. Also, Java IS still OS independant. Any problems I've
found with Java are problems with where it is being run. If you run an applet
that uses the newer event handling system, it won't work. Why? because no
browsers support it (at least not to my knowledge). If you run your JSP on
Bluestone's system, some of the standard java doesn't work. Again, because of a
fault with Bluestone. This is not a problem with Java, it is a problem with the
compiler. If you code C++ with all the new fixins and try to compile it in
borland 1.2, expect it not to work right. If you want Java to work no matter
what, run it in a pure java environment.
>
> We have very talented programmers on staff where I work and we cannot get
> any consistency out of Java. PEOPLE, HEAR THIS ... no one will ever have
> success making a car that can accept parts from other cars ... PERIOD.
> There is no way that Java will ever work. There are too many variables
> involved from machine to machine to allow Java to run consistently. Let's
> take a web site that runs applets. You can bet your ass that a good number
> of people who hit the site will have an error when that applet tries to
> run. It happens every day when I get on. As soon as that happens to me I
> am out of there and you just lost my interest/BUSINESS.
If an applet doesn't work, its a QCQA problem, not a tech problem.
> Even if you think you can make it work was it worth all the time it took?
> Hardly. I have been trying to get a very simple servlet to run that I got
> out of the Deitel & Deitel Java How To book. D&D swears it runs on their
> machines. Why won't it run here. I have sent numerous emails to them and
> they have been trying to figure out what is wrong but can't. These guys
> are supposed to know what they are doing. A perfect example of the
> instability of Java.
Well, if you have problems, you are welcome to post to the list what you are
running on, what the code looks like, and what error you are getting and maybe
someone can help you... though, with that rant, I wouldn't expect to many
friendly faces... but it's worth a shot.
> How many millions of man-hours are going to be wasted on Java before IS
> managers realize it doesn't work? We need to get back to the business of
> client server programming and trash this cancer of a tool.
I don't know, the last time I coded anything in Java, it took me half the time
ittook someone in VB, which is supposed to even do all of the work for you.
Where are we wasting man hours again? I think what you need to do is learn the
programming language before you start making accusations, because you obviously
have no knowledge of Java.
Sincerely,
Daniel Lynn
___________________________________________________________________________
To unsubscribe, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and include in the body
of the message "signoff SERVLET-INTEREST".
Archives: http://archives.java.sun.com/archives/servlet-interest.html
Resources: http://java.sun.com/products/servlet/external-resources.html
LISTSERV Help: http://www.lsoft.com/manuals/user/user.html
