Added Sandalwood & Carrion to my reading list, thanks Shobha! Rajesh On Apr 18, 2025 at 10:34 PM -0400, Shoba Narayan via Silklist <[email protected]>, wrote:
> > Hi Rajesh: > There is a lyrical book by James McHugh called Sandalwood & Carrion which > talks about how ancient Indians didn't discriminate between 'good' and 'bad' > smells and it describes all the smells that surrounded our ancestors. His > research is on smells and soma in ancient India if you want to check him out > on Academia. All fascinating stuff. He has written other books on smell > also. I interviewed him during Covid for BIC so a somewhat self-serving clip > here. > > > If you want to read an opposite judgemental approach to how people in this > part of the world dealt with smell, read this piece on the "sniff-kiss." > > > Lastly, I am not versed in Hindu philosophy but I always find the word > "vasanas" which seems to be used for "imprints" fascinating. > > > Yes, I am a bit obsessed with scents/perfumes/smell. > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2025 15:07:36 -0400 > > From: Rajesh Kasturirangan <[email protected]> > > To: [email protected], Intelligent conversation > > <[email protected]> > > Subject: Re: [Silk] Remembrances of Perfumes Past > > Message-ID: <4487de1a-ab44-449b-a9ed-9e6d2e4a525e@Spark> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > > > Our abstractions and technical disciplines are so driven by language, > > vision and hearing (e.g., sabda, darsana and sruti all have epistemic and > > sacred overtones in the Indian traditions) that it?s an interesting thought > > experiment to ask what philosophy might feel like if it were based on > > smell; or more adventurously, what philosophy a dog might invent if it were > > in a Socratic mood. I wrote a short essay about this some years ago, but > > never pursued it further. > > > > Rajesh > > On Apr 18, 2025 at 2:03?PM -0400, Christopher A Kantarjiev via Silklist > > <[email protected]>, wrote: > > > This reminds me of how much I enjoyed the book "The Emperor of Scent" > > > some years back - which was not only a good yarn but dove into competing > > > theories about how our olfactory system works (quite distinct from > > > taste). Unclear to me how much of that was really well-founded, and how > > > the understanding might have changed in the intervening years. > > > > > > A friend of mine has suffered from anosmia for decades, after a blow to > > > the head. He spent years trying various therapies that largely consisted > > > of various forms of amphetamines that were meant to increase his > > > olfactory sensitivity - to minimal effect. He has lately switched to some > > > sort of resensitization therapy - conscious exposure to individual > > > scents, to try to remap the brain's receptive wiring. I think he's been > > > getting some positive results - I'll ask him for a reference. > > > > > > On 4/18/25 10:14 AM, Priyanka Sachar via Silklist wrote: > > > > I can truly identify with smells transporting us elsewhere. AND I'm > > > > also suffering from Anosmia. ?? I've also lost sense of smell gradually > > > > over a period of 1 year Since 2022. Have run from pillar to post but to > > > > no avail. ENT specialists are absolutely clueless and somehow medical > > > > science hasn't progressed much in this regard. No one knows why exactly > > > > it happened.. It could be due to covid (jan 2022) or due to a booster > > > > dose of vaccine (July 2022). > > > > > > > > Any pointers (which work) are welcome! > > > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 18, 2025, 9:42 PM Hari Shenoy via Silklist > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Reading this note made me feel so grateful. Also, the replies from > > > > > the rest of you will give me inspiration. Here's why: > > > > > > > > > > For all of 2024 I lost my sense of smell due to a chronic sinus > > > > > issue. That also led to difficulties breathing, speaking, singing and > > > > > rapping. > > > > > I had surgery in December to get my sinuses operated on, after months > > > > > of strong medication that?didn't help with anything. > > > > > > > > > > Following recovery from the?surgery, I have worked to regain my sense > > > > > of smell gradually. > > > > > Ergo, I paid good money to experience every possible scent. > > > > > > > > > > The other day, I was at a pub in Dublin and the gents loo was > > > > > stinking. > > > > > My first thought was - "Jeez that stinks so bad!" My second was - > > > > > "Yay, wow that stinks so bad!" > > > > > > > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 18, 2025 at 3:03?PM Thaths via Silklist > > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > Smells, more than taste (well, what is taste, but just a weaker > > > > > > > way of smelling?), play the role of bringing?memories of > > > > > > > madelines past for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What are some scents from the past that you would pay good money > > > > > > > to experience again? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://www.ft.com/content/53a3a13b-fe98-4670-9163-be659ccbf4f2 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Inside the hot market for discontinued perfume > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Very few things can be as personal, emotional and sensory > > > > > > > triggering as perfume, which is why some people spend hundreds of > > > > > > > pounds to get their hands on a favourite fragrance that has been > > > > > > > discontinued. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since 2007 it has been the job of Mathieu Iannarilli, a > > > > > > > Paris-based vintage perfume dealer, to track down rare scents for > > > > > > > clients who spend from ?150 to more than ?3,000 per bottle. ?Some > > > > > > > buyers only wear one perfume. When that is discontinued by a > > > > > > > brand, from one day to the next, they find themselves orphaned of > > > > > > > their olfactory identity. These people then turn to all possible > > > > > > > ways to find their perfume again,? he says. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is no estimate for the market of vintage and discontinued > > > > > > > fragrances, but demand is high. A simple search for ?discontinued > > > > > > > fragrances? on eBay brings up more than 50,000 results. Among the > > > > > > > most expensive listings are Tom Ford Amber Absolute ($4,300, > > > > > > > shipped from the US), Vivienne Westwood Boudoir ($2,784, from > > > > > > > Japan) and Giorgio Armani Prive Myrrhe Imp?riale ($1,500, from > > > > > > > Sweden). The market is partly fuelled by the craze for ?flankers? > > > > > > > ? short-term spin-offs of brands? core fragrances, which are > > > > > > > catnip for collectors. Est?e Lauder Sensuous Noir, a 2008 flanker > > > > > > > for Est?e Lauder Sensuous, goes for ?265 on eBay, for example, > > > > > > > while Thierry Mugler A*Men Pure Malt, a version of Thierry Mugler > > > > > > > A*Men from 2009, goes up to more than ?600. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are a few reasons why a fragrance might be discontinued: it > > > > > > > might not be commercially successful; a long-used ingredient in > > > > > > > its composition might later be banned and prove too difficult to > > > > > > > substitute; or the brand itself might end its license or go into > > > > > > > bankruptcy. ?The prices of some fragrances from iconic British > > > > > > > brands such as Vivienne Westwood and Stella McCartney have > > > > > > > tripled since these brands ceased their perfumery business,? > > > > > > > explains Iannarilli. Other vintage perfumes from heritage brands > > > > > > > such as Guerlain often reach high prices because they are both > > > > > > > sought after by customers who want to wear them and by collectors > > > > > > > who would preserve them. ?[Guerlain] Djedi can exceed ?3,000,? > > > > > > > says Iannarilli. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It?s not just high-end fragrances that stoke demand. Since 2019, > > > > > > > Alexander Fury, fashion features editor at Another magazine and > > > > > > > the FT?s men?s fashion critic, has been buying Ultima II Sheer > > > > > > > Scent for his mother as a Christmas gift. The Revlon fragrance > > > > > > > from 1990 was and still is her favourite, but was discontinued at > > > > > > > the turn of the millennium. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ?I?m not hunting for it every day, but it is something I look for > > > > > > > every week or so. It has become progressively more difficult and > > > > > > > progressively more expensive,? he says over the phone. When Fury > > > > > > > bought it the first time six years ago, the perfume was already > > > > > > > selling on second-hand platforms for about ?500. Today it can be > > > > > > > purchased on Etsy for more than ?700. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In some cases, people are hunting for the original formulation of > > > > > > > perfumes that are still on shop floors today. Starting from the > > > > > > > early 2000s, regulations on cosmetics ingredients have become > > > > > > > stricter, particularly in the EU, forcing many brands to recreate > > > > > > > best-selling scents using alternative ingredients. In some cases > > > > > > > the results have been less than satisfactory ? at least according > > > > > > > to some noses ? prompting the hoarding of older bottles. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ?I have a tiny bottle of Guerlain?s Mitsouko from the 1970s that > > > > > > > smells completely different and so much better than Mitsouko does > > > > > > > now,? says Aimee Majoros, a beauty PR and fragrance collector > > > > > > > from upstate New York who has worked for Guerlain, Givenchy, > > > > > > > Acqua di Parma, Tommy Hilfiger and Donna Karan. Majoros, who > > > > > > > learned to love perfumes from her grandmother, had at some point > > > > > > > 300 bottles in her collection. ?The best thing I have ever > > > > > > > smelled in my life was a sample of L?Air du Temps by Nina Ricci > > > > > > > from the 1960s,? she continues. ?The current formulation smells > > > > > > > awful. I know that in the fragrance community people are upset > > > > > > > when things are reformulated.? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Claire Smith, a cell biologist based in the UK who has a 130-rich > > > > > > > fragrance collection (around half of them are discontinued) > > > > > > > became passionate about perfume in 2019. After reading rave > > > > > > > reviews online of Thierry Mugler Alien Essence Absolue, which had > > > > > > > been recently discontinued, she decided to go on a hunt for it. > > > > > > > ?It goes for hundreds of pounds, but I was very, very lucky and > > > > > > > found a good deal. For a lot of people it?s about the find as > > > > > > > much as the fragrance itself,? she says. ?When I started I would > > > > > > > only buy things that I could afford to lose the money for, until > > > > > > > I learned what I was looking for.? Her self-training included > > > > > > > watching online videos comparing fake and real fragrances to > > > > > > > learn how to spot them (colour is a good giveaway). Smith now has > > > > > > > a YouTube channel called @dr.claire.perfume where she talks about > > > > > > > her collection, explains relevant terminology and tells the > > > > > > > back-story for some famous fragrances, such as Chanel No 5 or > > > > > > > Robert Piguet Bandit, to her 13,900 sub > > scribers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But for certain perfume collectors, the draw is not the scent but > > > > > > > the bottle. Some even collect factices, the oversized display > > > > > > > bottles brands used for advertising in pharmacies and department > > > > > > > stores until the early 2000s. Simon Martynoff, owner of Galerie > > > > > > > Martynoff in Paris, both sells and collects factices. Among his > > > > > > > treasures currently on sale he lists a 30cm-tall Nina Ricci L?air > > > > > > > du Temps bottle for ?5,200 and an even taller (39.5cm) decorative > > > > > > > bottle by Baccarat of Guerlain Shalimar for ?4,100. ?There are > > > > > > > two different consumers: one is a collector who wants an example > > > > > > > of each bottle, and the other is an [interior] decorator,? he > > > > > > > says. Martynoff sources them from auctions or shops that still > > > > > > > have them, but says they are becoming increasingly hard to find > > > > > > > as the number of collectors increases. ?The interest has gone up > > > > > > > and you can see it from the prices. In the 1990s you could find > > > > > > > some at a very good price, now some bottles are 30 to 50 per cent > > > > > > > more expensive.? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Antoine Poujol is the founder of the Perfume Art Museum in Paris, > > > > > > > which houses a collection of almost 8,000 bottles, factices, > > > > > > > press kits and shop catalogues. He says interest in collecting > > > > > > > perfume bottles started in the 1980s, when many of the bottles > > > > > > > designed by artists such as Leonor Fini (Shocking by > > > > > > > Schiaparelli, 1937), Raoul Dufy (Rosine by Paul Poiret, c1925) > > > > > > > and Ren? Lalique (for Lucien Lelong, 1929) started to hit the > > > > > > > 50-year mark. His goal is to ?keep track of everything that was > > > > > > > and is made by the key brands, because the idea is to trace their > > > > > > > evolution from the start to today,? he says, adding that his > > > > > > > expertise has been tapped by some of the largest brands who want > > > > > > > to build their own collections and retrace their histories. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Poujol?s collection includes rare examples such as Lanc?me > > > > > > > R?volte, designed by Georges Delhomme in 1936, which is?a block > > > > > > > of raw rock crystal shaped like the Parisian cobblestones thrown > > > > > > > during the French Revolution (currently valued between ?1,000 and > > > > > > > ?2,000), but also mass-produced bottles that can be purchased for > > > > > > > ?50.??We are in a universe where you have very expensive bottles, > > > > > > > but you also have very nice stuff from ?50 to ?200, which can > > > > > > > make a nice collection. You also have collectors of miniatures > > > > > > > which go for ?5, ?10 and ?15,? he says. ?There are bottles for > > > > > > > everyone.? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > After speaking to Poujol, I took out my own collection of perfume > > > > > > > minis, which I used to hoard as a kid in the 1990s. I used to > > > > > > > spend an unusual amount of time admiring the small bottles and > > > > > > > smelling them and they are still kept in a wicker box in a > > > > > > > bathroom cabinet in my childhood home. I have at least 40 of > > > > > > > them, an assorted selection that includes Miss Dior, Gianfranco > > > > > > > Ferr? Gieffeffe, Fiorucci Vanilla Scent, 4711 Cologne and La > > > > > > > Perla Body Silk. While I?m quite sure there is nothing > > > > > > > particularly rare in there, even if there were, I?m not sure I > > > > > > > could part with it. It?s hard to put a price on something with > > > > > > > the power to trigger such personal memories. > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > Homer: Hey, what does this job pay? > > > > > > > Carl: ?Nuthin'. > > > > > > > Homer: D'oh! > > > > > > > Carl: ?Unless you're crooked. > > > > > > > Homer: Woo-hoo! > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > Silklist mailing list > > > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > > > https://mailman.panix.com/listinfo.cgi/silklist > > > > > -- > > > > > Silklist mailing list > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > https://mailman.panix.com/listinfo.cgi/silklist > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Silklist mailing list > > > [email protected] > > > https://mailman.panix.com/listinfo.cgi/silklist > > -------------- next part -------------- > > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > > URL: > > <https://mailman.panix.com/pipermail/silklist/attachments/20250418/cc0e4c05/attachment.htm> > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Subject: Digest Footer > > > > Silklist mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://mailman.panix.com/listinfo.cgi/silklist > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > End of Silklist Digest, Vol 25, Issue 4 > > *************************************** > > > -- > Silklist mailing list > [email protected] > https://mailman.panix.com/listinfo.cgi/silklist >
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