Hey Arnold, it's not plagiarism if you put it in quotes and credit it to the source in the footnotes! <grin>
Mike D. > Hi Mike, > As usual, a great explanation. Tell me, how do you feel about > plagiarism? I am usually strongly against it and would not indulge in > it, probably from fear of being discovered. In this case I have a > strong urge to just do a copy and paste. ----- Original Message ----- > From: "M. G. Devour" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, May 03, 2009 4:06 PM Subject: Re: CS>colloidal vs. ionic > silver > > > > Greetings and welcome, Rachel! > > > >> I am new to the list. Your archives are down and so I hope you don't > >> mind if I ask a couple of questions... > > > > Please do... > > > >> ... can somebody tell me what the difference is between colloidal and > >> ionic silver? Is it particle size and method of production? Which is > >> safer to ingest for medicinal purposes, colloidal or ionic silver, in > >> terms of preventing agyria problems? > > > > Good questions, all. > > > > Speaking in technical, rather than marketing terms, a colloid is a > > suspension of particles that are small enough to stay dispersed in a > > liquid just by the random mixing caused by Brownian motion within the > > liquid. That's just the normal movement of the molecules of the liquid > > due to the latent heat energy they posess due to the fact that our > > planet isn't a dark, frozen rock in space. Thank the sun for that! > > > > Colloidal particles could be pretty big, on an atomic scale, > > consisting of 10's or 100's of atoms of a substance, or more. If they > > don't settle out after a long time then they're small enough for the > > suspension to be called a colloid; if they do settle out, they're not. > > > > Fine clay in water can form a colloidal suspension, for example. It'll > > stay cloudy indefinitely and not settle out. > > > > An ion is a particle, too, but specifically an atom or small group of > > atoms that has gained or lost at least one electron and thus has an > > electrical charge. > > > > Common table salt in water breaks apart into equal numbers of: > > > > Na(+) sodium ions with a missing electron and a positive charge > > Cl(-) chlorine ions with an extra electron and a negative charge > > > > Even in plain water, random movement will cause there to be a few > > hydrogen, H(+) ions and hydroxyl, OH(-) ions floating about, as water > > molecules sponaneously break apart. They will recombine and cancel > > each other out, and form again, indefinitely. > > > > Now, talking about silver, including some translation of marketing- > > speak: > > > > What's generically been called "colloidal silver" seems to encompass > > every damn thing anybody has ever bothered to put in a bottle. > > > > Grind up silver metal into a powder, toss it in some liquid, and call > > it colloidal silver... You'd be right, at least until it settles out > > in the bottom of the bottle. Shake before use, no doubt! <shudder> > > > > Put it in a protein gel to keep it suspended better and you'd have one > > of the early "silver protein" products. (There are some recent > > versions of these that are not so crudely made...) > > > > Take a concentrated solution of some silver compound, mix it with > > another chemical, causing the compound to break up and the silver to > > precipitate out as tiny particles... and you'll have one of the > > chemically derived products calling themselves colloidal silver. Some > > of these are bottled and sold by health-food stores. > > > > Take a concentrated solution of some silver compound and dilute it > > with water and sell it directly... and you'll have yet another product > > that, while it might be effective and safe if used sparingly, has also > > been linked more than once to cases of argyria. > > > > Do what most of us do, and buy or build a basic colloidal silver > > generator, and you'll put silver into pure distilled water by low > > voltage direct current electricity. At low concentrations, this will > > produce mostly ions (single atoms) of silver, each bearing a positive > > charge, floating around in the water. Up to the solubility limit > > (about 13ppm, isn't it?) these will mostly stay isolated in the water. > > > > (Which has led to some of our members calling this kind of preparation > > EIS, for Electrically Isolated Silver.) > > > > Near the positive silver electrode, though, the local concentration > > can be pretty high, leading to atoms hitting each other occasionally > > and clumping together to make particles. These particles might or > > might not still have a charge on them, but they're certainly small > > enough to stay in suspension. > > > > If you run the CS maker long enough, the ions of silver will become > > crowded enough in the water to find each other and clump together just > > by random motion. After running it long enough, the clumps of atoms > > can grow big enough to start falling out of suspension. Go on even > > longer and you'll end up with mud. <grin> > > > > Thus, any product made this way is going to end up with some of both > > the ionic and colloidal forms. > > > > Most of us try to make a relatively low concentration "CS" or EIS that > > will generally turn out to be 10 to 30% particles and 70 to 90% ions. > > From a few ppm to about 10ppm is easy to do, safe, stable, and > > generally effective. Exactly what proportion you produce isn't all > > that important. It just works. > > > > Back to marketing hype: People will claim that either ionic or > > particulate (colloidal) silver is the part that's effective, and that > > the other is less or not effective. > > > > They'll say it's only because of the few percent of colloid that forms > > that our simple EIS works at all. > > > > Others will say the particulate part doesn't work and that it's the > > ions that do the job... > > > > A little thought will suggest that it's probably not anything as > > obvious or simple as that, given the complexity of the human body... > > After all, whatever you put in your mouth is going to interact with > > the many salts, enzymes, and other chemicals in your saliva; some will > > be absorbed into the bloodstream through your mucous membranes; > > anything left will then hit the stomach environment, which can span a > > considerable range of conditions depending on recent food or beverage > > intake... before travelling into the intestines and yet another > > complex chemical environment. All told, pretty much any form of silver > > you ingest is going to be radically changed by *one* of those > > environments. > > > > The short version: > > > > Nobody KNOWS how silver actually works in the body, any claims to the > > contrary aside. > > > > Both colloidal and ionic silver seem to work, based on years of > > experience by thousands of people. Almost all products are mixtures of > > both forms anyway. > > > > A low concentration (~5-10 ppm), mixed ionic/colloidal silver > > preparation like we advocate, will drown you from excessive water > > intake long before you can ingest enough silver to cause argyria, at > > least as far as experience has shown so far. > > > > Every case of argyria we know of has involved higher concentrations > > and chemical salts or other compounds or protein-based preparations, > > if the cause is known precisely at all. > > > > In any case, we're all guinea pigs and lab rats, experimenting on > > ourselves with little or no guidance from "proper authorities." In > > other words, we're all on our own. You have to learn everything you > > can from the experience of others and decide for yourself what will be > > the best route for you to take. Consult your chosen medical > > professional for advice and/or coordination with any other treatment > > you may be persuing. > > > > I'm sure if I've left anything out or made any mistakes others will > > dive in with their corrections and additions. That's the way this > > place works! <grin> > > > > Let us know any further questions you have, Rachel, and, again, > > welcome to the group. > > > > Peace, > > > > Mike D. > > > > [Mike Devour, Citizen, Patriot, Libertarian] > > [[email protected] ] > > [Speaking only for myself... ] > > > > > > -- > > The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. > > > > Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org > > > > To post, address your message to: [email protected] > > > > Address Off-Topic messages to: [email protected] > > > > The Silver List and Off Topic List archives are currently down... > > > > List maintainer: Mike Devour <[email protected]> > > > > > [Mike Devour, Citizen, Patriot, Libertarian] [[email protected] ] [Speaking only for myself... ]
