Ode Coyote wrote: > Why does silver oxide color vary from grey to brown to black when none of > the componants have any of those colors?
Most likely due to the size of the crystals. For instance you can take black glass and grind it up, and it will be grey, and power it and it will be white. > > Crystal size that varys with different inclusions of oxygen maybe? > What color is a diluted brown? Brown is not a primary color nor is it a > single shade. Brown is an exlusion of blue primarily, along with some of all the other colors. Basically it is a dark orange. > > Peroxide clears all of the various colors. Since the colors are caused by particles, and H2O2 reduces the particles to silver oxide and possible silver atoms, then all color is expected to disappear. > > > The 'color is particle size' and 'oxide is particle color' theories are > not necessarily at cross purposes. > > It's pretty obvious to me that peroxide breaks particles up as it removes > the color. The act of breaking the particles down removes the color, since particle sizes below a certain size absorb in the UV spectrum and cannot be detected with the human eye. > > It's just a question as to exactly what the particles wind up as, > regardless of color. Initially they end up as Silver Oxide which dissolves into the water up to a certain level. It is not clear yet to me if the silver oxide is then reduced back to atomic or diatomic silver particles or not. > > > If you have black CS, it doesn't stay black. The black settles out. Big > particles too heavy to stay suspended. The black would be silver peroxide, it is insoluble. > > If you have deep yellow or brownish CS, it doesn't stay brown or deep > yellow. The color deposits on the bottom and sides of the container > eventually. Larger particles will settle out over time. > > Particles heavy enough to have a mass that imparts a 'sticky' [to be all > so technical in terminology] when it collides with the container, but not > heavy enough to settle out? Possibly. > > > Very Pale yellow CS probaby does the same thing, but the deposit on the > container would be harder to see. > Medium intensity yellow CS certainly does it. > > In dust sized particles, silver looks white. It's a matter of texture, > reflection and the eyes limited ability to distiguish between streams of > photons. > Ground glass looks white too. Yep, as I indicated above. But the absorption characteristics of small particles in a colloid are different depending on if they are conductive or not. Conductive particles, such as silver and gold, resonate at certain frequencies in the light band so that they have strong absorption lines at certain wavelengths, thus making them have colors dependent on the particle size. Marshall > > > Ode > > > >The yellow tint is caused by particle size. This was proven over 100 years > >ago, and all tests since then confirm it. If it was silver oxide, how can > >you explain that it goes to gold, then orange, then red as the particles > >increase in size? > > > >> > >> > >> Ag2O + H2O2 = 2Ag(+) + O2 + H2O > >> > >> http://butler.cc.tut.fi/~penningt/thesis/9701635/ppt/29/tsld018.htm > >> > > > >That is impossible. AG+ can only be formed two ways, first by EIS with > >nothing but pure water, and second by being part of a compound, you have to > >have an anion and cation to get Ag+. > > > >I am not sure why you gave me the above url, that supports me. Ag + H2O2 > >-> AgO + H2O and Ag2O + H2O2 -> Ag2 + H2O. But it does not deal with AgO > >at all, so I am still trying to confirm if AgO + H2O2 give Ag + H2O or not. > >I may have this proven one way or the other experimentally shortly. > > > >You have taken that site that gives the correct reaction for Ag2O of : > > > >Ag2O + H2O2 = 2 Ag + O2 + H2O > >which shows it produces silver atoms, or a silver particle of 2 atoms and > >changed it to: > > > >Ag2O + H2O2 = 2Ag(+) + O2 + H2O > > > >which shows it generating ions, which would not be possible without another > >element to combine with it. Why did you do that, are you trying to confuse > >the issue? > > > > > >> > >> It's not clear that you have established adding H2O2 to cs produces > >> silver oxide. You need to show the equations that support this, and > >> why it happens instead of the H2O2 breaking the oxide into ions. > >> > > > >I already did. > > > >> > >> 2. It's not clear you have established silver oxide is soluble up to > >> 13 ppm. > > > >Uhh, you don't have to prove everything, you can use well known references > >for that, and I cited the reference that is in. CRC handbook of Chemistry > >and Physics. I did prove that it is soluble to some extent and then > >saturates at a fairly low level, just did not measure the silver content to > >verify it was at 13 ppm. > > > >> First, that is probably a figure taken from some chemistry > >> book. There are many different types of silver oxide, and it's not > >> clear they are talking about the same ones we are dealing with. > >> > > > >There are only two compounds that are referred to as silver oxide, Ag2O and > >AgO. I have repeatedly indicated I am talking about AgO. AgO2 and AgO3 > >are both referred to as silver peroxide, one one could call them silver > >dioxide and silver trioxide to differentiate them. > > > >> > >> Anyway, if the soft black stuff that forms on the electrodes at high > >> current density is soluble, why does it remain on the electrodes? > >> > > > >I never said the black was soluble, I said the brown stuff was slightly > >soluble, because it is. I verified that yesterday when I put it in a cup of > >fresh hot distilled water. I said the black is silver peroxide and is > >totally insoluble. > > > >> > >> I think there is some more work to do in these areas. But it helps > >> to base your conclusions on all the relevant facts, generate the > >> relevant equations, then go from there. > > > >That is what I am doing, you seem to be the one twisting the facts. > > > >> > >> > >> Also, it helps to generate a descriptive topic name that relates to > >> the post. I hope you don't mind that I did this for you. But change > >> it to suit yourself if you wish. > >> > > > >I think that experiments with CS, H2O2, NaCl and ammonia is plenty > >descriptive. > > > >Marshall > > > >> > >> Best Wishes, > >> > >> Mike Monett > >> > >> -- > >> The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. > >> > >> Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org > >> > >> To post, address your message to: [email protected] > >> Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html > >> > >> Address Off-Topic messages to: [email protected] > >> OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html > >> > >> List maintainer: Mike Devour <[email protected]> > > > >
