On Saturday 08 July 2006 23:11, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > Suse Ubuntu
> >
> > Easy for complex server Hard for complex server
> > eg Firewall, MASQ, tun setup &
> > routing
>
> So, I would not describe these as 'complex server' tasks. These are basic
> network things for which Debian/Ubuntu don't provide an *enormous* amount
> of built-in clicky-clicky (CLI or GUI, helper tools are still
> clicky-clicky).
>
> On the other hand, for a truly complex server infrastructure, I would not
> choose anything but Debian/Ubuntu. I have been doing some Red Hat admin
> again recently, and every task reminds me how much easier life is on Debian
> and Ubuntu. Partly, this is because Red Hat chose to marginalise RHEL by
> making it available only to enterprise-paying customers, so the community
> around RHEL is *significantly* smaller than the communities around Fedora,
> Debian and Ubuntu.
>
> For things like mail server systems, web servers and so on, I would choose
> the Debian/Ubuntu world without worry.
I've tried a few, settled on guidedog, guarddog.
I still see no way of adding these to my firewall rules:
iptables -A INPUT -i tun+ -j ACCEPT
iptables -A FORWARD -i tun+ -j ACCEPT
> > Sysadmin works, is easy, is nice Sysadmin patchy, some works, some
> > does not eg system -> administration -> services see tricks later:
> > update-rc.d
>
> I'm surprised you'd say 'patchy' about a distro that is essentially made by
> sysadmins, for sysadmins. That has been a delight for me about Debian since
> I first started using it. When you say 'tricks', I think you mean "things
> that are different and/or that I'm not used to because I don't have as much
> experience on this platform". How different, really, is update-rc.d to,
> say, chkconfig? They're both obtuse command line programs.
I want a desktop image saved in .icons. What did I NOT do to find out that ^L
will let me see hidden dirs? (<grin> I asked SLUG) This is IMHO a trick
rather than things that are different.
An eg of patchy. Specific now: latest dapper 6.06:
System -> Administration -> Services
I want to enable bpalogin (which I installed). It is not listed. I select
'help'. It shows a menu, with checkboxes. That's not an option, despite the
help display. That's patchy!
I'm quite happy with the CLI. If you need the CLI to do stuff then
System -> Administration -> Services should say "For more, use update-rc.d"
> > RPM is usually easy and lots of info apt-get is very easy
> > is available about installed not detailed info about packages
> > packages, changed packages, eg apt-get install kubuntu-desktop
> > adds 800M contents of packaghes apt-get remove
> > kubuntu-desktop dels 40K !!
>
> Others have answered about apt-get vs. aptitude/synaptic/etc, but... Info
> about packages is lacking in Debian/Ubuntu? Dude, this is the platform that
> *drove* modern package management demands. What info are you missing? I'm
> pretty sure this comes down to "I'm familiar with the rpm commands, but not
> familiar with the apt/dpkg commands" - same as above.
I'm sure that you are correct :-), I'm trying to be objective, so your
comments are most usefull.
I guess that having spent years using RedHat, the transition to SuSE was quick
(1 week to say this is better) and easy.
Its clear (and it's been since the release of Dapper) that I'm not finding
this transition easy. Specially since I'm jumping in and trying to do fairly
complex stuff right off (eg openvpn, with associated firewall setup)
>
> > multimedia possible multimedia easy - easyubuntu
> >
> > KDE Very clear and obvious Gnome Full of undocumented (obviously)
> > tricks
Cheers
James
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