Some comments on Fabric that we recorded at Siggraph from a few familiar VFX faces: https://vimeo.com/71818285
Eric is in this video, but don't hold that against us ;) On 6 August 2013 09:06, Eric Thivierge <[email protected]> wrote: > Raf basically said what I was trying to say in a shooting from the hip > quick response that probably failed miserably. Either way I'm in agreement > with Raf (look at that, you agree with an American, Raf!). The future > seems to be platforms and frameworks to build out your pipeline tools as > needed and in the way you want. You also have flexibility to change a deep > level of structures your apps are running on. > > As Raf pointed out it's clear to me especially after Siggraph that there > is not going to be a one app to rule them all. It's going to be a mixed bag > of apps with standard formats supported across them to pass the data back > and forth and use the app best for particular parts of the pipeline. > > So many companies branching out and incorporating open source solutions > (again as Raf mentioned) and not being shy about it either. So many > Siggraph talks this year talking about how they implemented an open source > format and used it in their projects. > > Do I want an Uber Autodesk app? No. I've lost trust at this point in AD > and it doesn't make sense. > > Eric Thivierge > =============== > Character TD / RnD > Hybride Technologies > > > > On August-06-13 1:10:47 AM, Matt Lind wrote: > >> I think the ‘age of the platform’ assessment will be restricted to >> film/video as I see a fork in the road developing between games and >> film/video pipelines. Actually, it’s already been happening for many >> years. >> >> Traditionally games have borrowed film/video tools for 3D work because >> needs were simple and the film/video tools could be bent to service. >> But now as graphics hardware improves, games requirements are much >> more demanding and divergent from that which film/video caters. >> >> Film/video has always moved towards larger and larger datasets >> requiring subdivision of labor to the N’th degree. Quality was the >> overriding factor. If it takes N hours to render that one awe >> inspiring frame, you do it. That growth requires asset management to >> manage all the facilities and assets. The assets last only as long as >> the production, unless there is a sequel. Each production typically >> involves reworking and re-inventing the wheel unless you work at one >> of the older mainstays that have significant R+D investment into their >> pipelines. Basically assets are generated, a picture is taken of >> them, then they are dumped into a box where they sit on a virtual >> shelf until needed again. Kind of like the old gag on Popeye cartoons >> where they chop down the redwoods, send them to the saw mill, then >> whittle it down to a single toothpick where it’s shipped off in a box. >> >> In games, it’s a bit different. In the case of the MMO I’m working on >> the assets must have a very long shelf life – measured in decades. >> The assets contribute to live software environments, must be very >> optimal, and are under constant iteration. While growth is also >> occurring in the games pipeline, it’s moving in a different direction >> than film/video. Games is moving fast towards ‘in context’ editing of >> assets, as in, creating/editing the assets in the live game >> environment. To accomplish the feat requires being very tightly bound >> to the runtime environment of the game engine. Therefore a DCC >> application which serves as a ‘platform’ will not serve any role where >> the work is done in the game environment. I would venture to say that >> many games developers are actively pursuing the route of removing DCC >> applications from their pipelines completely. It will be many years >> before it is actually accomplished, however. >> >> I remember a discussion with former Softimage PM Gareth Morgan back in >> the late 1990s where he said they were actively working to make >> ‘sumatra’ a game engine with DCC tools. That vision is not far off >> from reality. The only part he got wrong is the DCC application isn’t >> the host, it’s the guest. >> >> What you’ll see emerge in the games development arena for content >> creation are application(s) which can attach live agents to the >> content being created so it can be merged into the game environment. >> In other words, something a game engine can host. The difficulty >> comes in the area of viewing the work. Something like Fabric Engine >> has its own language for compiling and preparing the assets for >> display. This is the exact same responsibility of the game engine. >> While the DCC application clearly isn’t a solution here, the Fabric >> Engine model isn’t a hands-down winner either (but much closer to the >> correct solution). It’ll be interesting to see how that problem is >> addressed. >> >> Matt >> >> *From:*softimage-bounces@**listproc.autodesk.com<[email protected]> >> [mailto:softimage-bounces@**listproc.autodesk.com<[email protected]>] >> *On Behalf Of >> *Raffaele Fragapane >> *Sent:* Monday, August 05, 2013 9:23 PM >> *To:* [email protected].**com <[email protected]> >> *Subject:* Re: OT: Yost Group - related to the Naiad/SIGGRAPH discussion >> >> >> Why Fanboi, and why conspiracy? >> >> I consider Paul and Co. to be smart enough to know that that is >> EXACTLY what they should be shooting for. >> >> AD knows it themselves IMO, as does SideFX, and the Foundry, and many >> others. >> >> The writing couldn't be plainer on all walls that the industry is >> shifting again. >> >> From blackboxed, fragmented specialistic apps in the end80s to mid >> nineties, to the rise of the artist friendly monolith in the end 90s, >> to the monolithic but moderately open app from end-90s until now, >> we're now moving fast towards a common stream of OSS standards which >> will be injected into by various small footprint, very specialized and >> tailored apps (ZB, Mari, Katana etc.), and have a layer floating on >> top to interface pipe and content/operation management on top of that >> will be platform centric. >> >> You have pointed out bits of that youreself. >> >> Maya and Soft are more and more used as mere scene assembly and >> animation platforms. That type of approach is becoming more widely >> available by the minute to smaller and smaller entities, even to >> individuals. It's only the middle end caught into hard software locks >> at this point. >> >> The age of the platform is coming. >> Everybody already manages shots with shotgun, assets with tank (or >> perforce, or propietary, or what else you have it), models with ZB, >> retopos with 3DC or Topogun, textures with mudbox or mari, does >> effects in Houdini, or Realflow, hair is left to plugins (shave, >> yeti), lights with katana, renders with PRMan, composites with Nuke, >> finals with DaVinci... >> >> Who caches with something other Alembic (or propietary formats) or >> writes images other than EXR? >> >> All UIs are Qt, threading is beind coalesced in fewer solutions by the >> day, libraries emerge to abstract and generalise many things (OCL, >> Thrust etc.). >> >> What little is left out has initiatives that might be caught up on >> (OSL, partIO, openVDB), or will one day see an alternative that will >> become the standard. >> >> What's left for Maya or Soft to do but assemblying assets and >> rig/animation? Which are ultimately just scene Management tasks, a >> specialized type of graph which, of the lot, is the most backwards and >> dated of all sections of the pipe. >> >> There will be churn, as always for a few years one sub-field using CGI >> is left better or worse serviced than others, one size more or less >> competitive, but I don't think there will be a next-gen big app, not >> one as big (proportionally) as Soft was, or Maya is. >> >> Fabric did the right thing, all they have to do is garner the >> attention and sustenance to punch through the industry catching up to >> the obvious through lean years. >> >> On Tue, Aug 6, 2013 at 12:57 PM, Matt Lind <[email protected] >> <mailto:mlind@carbinestudios.**com <[email protected]>>> wrote: >> >> And to throw some fanboi conspiracy theory gas into the flames: >> >> If you integrate with all the DCC apps, you’ve essentially built up >> the trust with all the user bases and have the ability to suck them >> into your DCC of the future to reduce any and all risk of switching a >> production pipeline to another base application. >> >> At least give us a ray of hope, Paul. ;-) >> >> Matt >> >> >
