The wording is this:  NFPA 24, 2002, Figure 10.10.1, note (3)

"If dry barrel hydrants are tested with the main valve open so the hydrants are 
under pressure, an additional 5 ounces per minute leakage is permitted for each 
hydrant".

I would interpret the word IF as implying that the test could be conducted with 
the valves closed or open.


Craig L. Prahl, CET   
Fire Protection Specialist
Mechanical Department
CH2MHILL
Lockwood Greene
1500 International Drive
PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC  29304-0491
Direct - 864.599.4102
Fax - 864.599.8439
[email protected]
http://www.ch2m.com 


-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] 
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chris Cahill
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 3:46 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: AHJ right or wong?

Then additional to my first email that's the designer's choice it sounds like.  
AHJ's don't get to choose the methods if more than one is provided in code or a 
standard.  Read the fine print on this - make sure the standard allows either 
open or closed in this case.  

Chris Cahill, P.E.
Fire Protection Engineer
Sentry Fire Protection, Inc.
 
763-658-4483
763-658-4921 fax
 
Email: [email protected]
 
Mail: P.O. Box 69
        Waverly, MN 55390
 
Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW
              Waverly, MN 55390

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of George Church
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 2:11 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: AHJ right or wong?

Allowable leakage in NFPA #24 is calculated on #joints, valves, and if you have 
dry-barrel hydrants open, you get more allowable leakage. So the allowable 
leakage is (from memory) 11 gallons in 2 hours with the hydrants closed; 82 
gallons with the hydrants open.

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of 
[email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 2:56 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: AHJ right or wong?

Explain what you mean by hydrants closed and open?  What exactly was opened and 
closed.  Are you saying there was too much leakage in the system with the 
hydrant control valves closed?  This is the pressure test?




Craig L. Prahl, CET   
Fire Protection Specialist
Mechanical Department
CH2MHILL
Lockwood Greene
1500 International Drive
PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC  29304-0491
Direct - 864.599.4102
Fax - 864.599.8439
[email protected]
http://www.ch2m.com 


-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of George Church
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 2:46 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: AHJ right or wong?

(changed subject from spkr save. BTQW I went to the fire scene, I felt like a 
proud parent of the system that worked this AM)

About to get in pssing contest with local AHJ on UG test per #24.
We sprinklered an 833,000 sf ESFR box, didn't do UG loop.
Site guy couldn't get test to pass with hydrants closed.
We were asked to help, and I suggested testing with hydrants open.
We did that and it passed, only 1/3 allowable leakage allowed.
However, the local AHJ is refusing to pass it, saying he wants it re-tested 
with hydrants closed the way it went initially.

I'm about to ask him where he sees that in #24; but the following wording "and 
as approved by the fire code official" in the IFC (see below) might give him a 
leg to stand on. Can any of you agree or disagree?

Would the below require a local amendment be in place?
My retainage of >$100k, not to mention the GC's, is hanging in limbo.
 
>From IFC 2006
901.5 Installation acceptance testing.
Fire detection and alarm systems, fire-extinguishing systems, fire hydrant 
systems, fire standpipe systems, fire pump systems, private fire service mains 
and all other fire protection systems and appurtenances thereto shall be 
subject to acceptance tests as contained in the installation standards and as 
approved by the fire code official. The fire code official shall be notified 
before any required acceptance testing.
 
George Church'
Rowe Sprinkler
[email protected]
570-837-7647

 


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