70% of the failures attributable to improperly closed valves is what I recall, don't know that we hit 97% but it wouldn't surpise me. I also recall 70% with 2 heads, 90-some% with 4 heads or less controlling fires. I'd email Jim Lake, staff liason for both 13 and 25- as close to applicable standards for the study as I can think of.
Sorry to end a sentence with a preposition, Ron. glc -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chris Cahill Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 11:15 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: technical issue NFPA did a report about 3-5 years ago on the topic of failures. My summary is if the valve is open and no one interferes with the system after the fire starts for all systems the failure rate is very, very tiny like to the extent it happens but isn't something we need to really worry about. KEEP THE DAMN VALVE OPEN! It's even divided by occupancy. LH are even smaller failure rate, storage and high hazard were more but still ridiculously low. This is the source of George's 70% comment but I don't recall the number. I thought it was like 97%. Or maybe 97% success and of the 3% failure 70% are from closed valves which leaves 0.9% of all systems would be successful if the valve was open. Who ever reads it please remind me. They, NFPA, also have save data from what the fire departments report. That's about the best you can get on that. And I'll tell you right now even FD's under report sprinkler saves even when they know about them. Less paper work is the motivator here. Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: [email protected] Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of George Church Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 9:38 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: technical issue I'd suggest NFPA as the best source for this. Problem is, there is no nationwide clearinghouse recording this data like our friends Down Under have, so many of our "saves" are buried on page 72 of the newspaper, as in "Sprinkler system floods building" and in the last para they mention- oh, there was a fire.... but they ignore that the building was saved. Another source would be FM Global, or other major risk insurers. I'm trying to recall where I read that 70% of fires spkrs failed to control were caused by improperly closed valves- NFPA source, don't recall where it was published, tho. Along that line of thought, tho- when PA came out of the early 80's BOCA and into the I-Codes world in April, 2004, I asked L&I if they were intending to require compliance with #25 via IBC ref to 13 ref to 25; the answer was that the intent of the legislature was specifically NOT to require any ITM with the new Uniform Construction Code based on IBC. (sigh) glc -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg McGahan Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 10:25 AM To: [email protected] Subject: technical issue You guys are great, sometimes abrupt, sometime too silly, but great. I appreciate and enjoy most of the forum...Thanks, I need to know if anyone has statistics that show any data related to sprinkler system failure due to poor maintenance - for a small in house class I am doing btw. Thanks for your help. Greg McGahan Operations Manager Living Water Fire Protection 1160 McKenzie Road P.O. Box 877 Cantonment, Florida 32533 (850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 [email protected] _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
