Here's the report. http://www.scribd.com/doc/24417667/Riverview-Report
At 02:45 PM 1/4/2010, you wrote: >George, > >I think this is the fire you're discussing from Wells, NY. Here's the >information from the Albany Times-Union on Dec 23. > >http://www.timesunion.com/AspStories/story.asp?storyID=880991 > >I'm still trying to get the entire grand jury report as the link they >provided isn't complete. >-- >PARSLEY CONSULTING >Ken Wagoner, SET >760.745.6181 voice >760.745.0537 fax >[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> e-mail >www.ParsleyConsulting.com <http://www.ParsleyConsulting.com> website > > > >George Church wrote: > > That "difficult or impossible to evacuate" phrase cost a lot of lives in NY > > State when a group home was protected (over the contractor's objections) to > > 13D when numerous residents were difficult or impossible to evacuate and > > staff couldn't do the impossible. They simply needed more than 10 > minutes to > > clear the building and didn't have it. > > > > Never heard what happened as penalty for the EOR that reiterated > the mistake > > of 13d when the objection was raised. > > > > BROADCASTING THAT PENALTY, if commiserate with the resultant loss > of life in > > the building for what appears to be an obvious failure to properly analyze > > the protection levels with the residents' needs and staff's > abilities, would > > do more to stop incompetent Professionals from practicing outside > their area > > of competence more than anything else we could do. > > > > Anyone in NY know what happened to the bad guy in this one from the recent > > past? I'd sure like to know. Hopefully it is more than what happened to > > Dennis the Coverplate Gluer (apologies to Mr Zevon) who is now working for > > his brother in northern California, I hear, installing sprinklers. There > > ought to be a way for bad guys to be drummed out of this industry. Like the > > union activist who capped piping in walls on its way to dorm room > > sprinklers, so there was no supply to the sprinklers in the rooms, and if > > there was a fire in the rooms affected by this criminal action, the > > residents could have died in a room protected by residential sprinklers. > > That guy, Mr Brian Beyer, should also be prohibited from hanging > pipe again. > > So if you know of Brian and he's hanging pipe, you might want to let his > > boss know the man has no scruples against raping the integrity of an > > installation if it suits his purpose. I was told that Brian was not working > > with any directive from the union to sabotage the installation nor would > > they have allowed sabotage like this......but it happened, and in more than > > one room. > > > > This certainly doesn't mean small group homes can't be properly protected > > with 13d- just that the protection level must be commiserate with the risk. > > > > glc > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [email protected] > > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of John Drucker > > Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 1:37 PM > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: RE: Group 'I' Occupancies > > > > 2006 IBC > > > > 903.2.5 Group I. An automatic sprinkler system shall be provided > > throughout buildings with a Group I fire area. > > Exception: An automatic sprinkler system installed in accordance with > > Section 903.3.1.2 or 903.3.1.3 shall be allowed in Group I-1 facilities. > > > > 308.2 Group I-1. This occupancy shall include buildings,structures or > > parts thereof housing more than 16 persons, on a 24-hour basis, who > > because of age, mental disability or other reasons, live in a supervised > > residential environment that provides personal care services. The > > occupants are capable of responding to an emergency situation without > > physical assistance from staff. This group shall include, but not be > > limited to, the following: > > > > Residential board and care facilities > > Assisted living facilities > > Halfway houses > > Group homes > > Congregate care facilities > > Social rehabilitation facilities > > Alcohol and drug centers > > Convalescent facilities > > A facility such as the above with five or fewer persons shall > > be classified as a Group R-3 or shall comply with the International > > Residential Code in accordance with Section 101.2. A > > facility such as above, housing at least six and not more than 16 > > persons, shall be classified as Group R-4. > > > > So when is an "I-1" not an "I-1" ? Pay special attention to the > > operative stipulation; "The occupants are capable of responding to an > > emergency situation without physical assistance from staff." > > > > Hope that helps, > > > > John Drucker Jr. > > Fire Protection Subcode Official > > Borough of Red Bank, NJ > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [email protected] > > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ralphy > > Henderson > > Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 1:10 PM > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: Group 'I' Occupancies > > > > Are Group i occupancies (10 bed assisted living) considered 13 criteria > > or 13R? > > > > Seeing how it's a group "i" and not an "R" I would say that 13R doesn't > > apply but what's the consensus here? I've seen some smaller Group I's (5 > > bed or less) considered as 13D when they're hospices that are in a > > person's home but not 10 bed in a new building. > > > > > > Thanks, > > RH > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Sprinklerforum mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > > > To Unsubscribe, send an email > > to:[email protected] > > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > _______________________________________________ > > Sprinklerforum mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Sprinklerforum mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > > > >_______________________________________________ >Sprinklerforum mailing list >[email protected] >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > >To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Todd G. Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, Connecticut www.fpdc.com 860.535.2080 _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
