I have seen PVC used on large mains in the Middle East.   Some custodians
of plan review claim that PVC pipe is a big problem and is failing when
fire pump starts up without soft start, because the PVC is an intrinsically
flawed material.   I am not convinced of that claim, as I haven't seen the
problems with the PVC piping using my own eyes.  It could be simply lack of
adequate thrust blocking, inappropriate bedding,  insufficient depth when
crossing roadways,  poor bonding of joints, etc.  Unfortunately, the
problems with PVC were used to taint HDPE, which I have even higher
confidence in.  If installed correctly, HDPE should last a long time... I
believe some Canadian installations are extrapolating close to a 100-year
lifetime.  In defense of HDPE for underground fire water mains, there are a
lot of lower pressure, lower diameter HDPE systems used in the chemically
'hot' soils of the Middle East near the Arabian Gulf, and these are holding
up fine.

So, no, I don't have a problem with use of PVC, CPCV or HDPE.  There are
problems however, with unwanted chemical reactions in CPCV with black pipe
cutting oils, anti-freeze additives, and those problems need thorough
reading in the existing literature.  Your father probably has details on
that, off the top of his head.


Scot Deal
Excelsior Risk and Fire Engineering
gms:  +420 606 872 129

“Human freedom is not in our ability to make decisions. It’s in our ability
to put ourselves in an environment that will lead to better outcomes.” -
Dan Ariely


On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 10:33 PM Skyler Bilbo <[email protected]>
wrote:

> Has anyone installed CPVC piping for an entire fire sprinkler system
> underground?
>
> We are being asked more and more on one story buildings to install wet
> systems where our mains are in the corridor and lines are in the walls.
> This involves a whole lot of drilling of 2x4's and installing a bunch of
> protective nailer plates (a whole lot of man hours).
>
> Seems to me like we could do it faster using a trencher, installing the
> vast majority of the piping underground with stub ups into the walls for
> sidewalls.  I suppose in order to do this correctly, we would have to
> install a drain, perhaps by stubbing into a sump pit somewhere?
>
> I know I have seen a small amount of CPVC piping installed underground in
> apartments that have open stairwells between units, and those don't have a
> way to drain the underground portion, even though this would be after the
> riser controls and fall under NFPA 13(R).
>
> I'm really interested to know if anyone has done it, and/or if there are
> any big reasons not to.  To my knowledge, this isn't specifically addressed
> in our standards.
>
>
> Thanks,
> Skyler Bilbo
> 217-819-6404 Cell
> _______________________________________________
> Sprinklerforum mailing list
> [email protected]
>
> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
>
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