In some jurisdictions around my area, the fire department wants a quick means of shutting the water off that does not involve getting in a vault or trying to locate the riser room on the interior of a building. If there is access to the riser room from the exterior, a Knox Box with a key to the room is sufficient. If the riser room is only accessed from the interior of the building, they require either a PIV or WIV.
Jeff Brickell, CET Senior Estimator/Designer BIM Coordinator NICET III CERTIFIED CERT #147245 OREGON CERTIFIED COBID FIRM #13272 (EMERGING SMALL BUSINESS) TRIAD FIRE PROTECTION [cid:[email protected]] OREGON . WASHINGTON . ARIZONA OFFICE 503.856.6333 CELL 602.550.4292 FAX 866.766.8862 From: John Denhardt <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, October 20, 2025 11:39 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [Sprinklerforum] Re: PIV The number one cause for a sprinkler system failure is a closed control valve. Let’s add more control valves 🥹. Makes no sense to me to add additional control valves. Thanks, John John August Denhardt, P.E Vice President Engineering and Technical Services American Fire Sprinkler Association 301-343-1457 Are you a member with a technical question? Don't forget one of the most valuable resources that AFSA provides is Technical Reviews by our Technical Services Department. It’s like having an FPE on your staff. Visit www.firesprinkler.org/technicalreview<https://www.firesprinkler.org/technicalreview> to submit a question today! (Member login required.) On Oct 20, 2025, at 11:36, Parsley Consulting <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Tim, Understood, however that prompts my question. Why do you need a PIV? Doesn't the backflow serve as a control valve? It's already difficult enough by having two control valves on a system, on opposite ends of the backflow, why do you need to add a third control valve (PIV)? Doesn't that increase the opportunity for the system to be out of service, particularly if the monitoring (tamper switches, locks, etc) were compromised? sincerely, Ken Wagoner, SET Parsley Consulting 3002 Younger Drive Harrisonville, Missouri 64701-3909 Phone: (760) 745-6181 Visit the website<https://url.usb.m.mimecastprotect.com/s/8OBhCA8EJ5inGNwNc8h1uGk-LF?domain=linkprotect.cudasvc.com> On 10/20/2025 11:45 AM, Tim Easter wrote: Currently only piv. Want to remove piv and just install main control valve at riser. Piv didn't close all the way. Been underground a long time. On Mon, Oct 20, 2025, 12:36 PM Parsley Consulting <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Tim, I won't copy what Craig and Tom have said, only to offer my own thoughts. If the backflow serves only one sprinkler system, the OS&Y valves there function as a system control valve. Indeed §16.9.3.3.5 in the '22 and '25 editions of -13 specifically permits them to serve as a control valve to a sprinkler system provided they are listed for fire protection. And the supervision requirements of §16.9.3.3 would apply as well. Why are you adding a PIV, and installing a control valve at risers? Is there more than one system? sincerely, Ken Wagoner, SET Parsley Consulting 3002 Younger Drive<https://url.usb.m.mimecastprotect.com/s/zT_wCB1GK5iMz7w7HNi3u22GjC?domain=google.com> Harrisonville, Missouri 64701-3909<https://url.usb.m.mimecastprotect.com/s/zT_wCB1GK5iMz7w7HNi3u22GjC?domain=google.com> Phone: (760) 745-6181 Visit the website<https://url.usb.m.mimecastprotect.com/s/8OBhCA8EJ5inGNwNc8h1uGk-LF?domain=linkprotect.cudasvc.com> On 10/20/2025 10:54 AM, [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> wrote: We are trying to remove PIVs, and install a main control valves at risers. AHJ is saying we must have a PIV. Also, we have BFPs before the PIVs. Can anyone help me find in NFPA 13 or 24 the section about PIVs? _________________________________________________________ SprinklerForum mailing list: https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org<https://url.usb.m.mimecastprotect.com/s/muS-Czqg2GcxOMkMu4fAu9RCwT?domain=lists.firesprinkler.org> To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> _________________________________________________________ SprinklerForum mailing list: https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org<https://url.usb.m.mimecastprotect.com/s/muS-Czqg2GcxOMkMu4fAu9RCwT?domain=lists.firesprinkler.org> To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> _________________________________________________________ SprinklerForum mailing list: https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org<https://url.usb.m.mimecastprotect.com/s/muS-Czqg2GcxOMkMu4fAu9RCwT?domain=lists.firesprinkler.org> To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> _________________________________________________________ SprinklerForum mailing list: https://url.usb.m.mimecastprotect.com/s/muS-Czqg2GcxOMkMu4fAu9RCwT?domain=lists.firesprinkler.org To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
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