On Sun, Aug 3, 2025, 4:19 PM Daniel Morante <dan...@morante.net> wrote:
> I just took a look at > https://pkg.freebsd.org/FreeBSD:15:amd64/base_latest/ and I am instantly > disappointed. I was a fan of the idea, but seeing how they decided to make > one package for each item is a massive bummer. Why would you split it up > this way? When when you install the Mozilla Firefox via package, you don't > install every file individually as a separate package. > But you do install a boatload of related packages... > It's the same concept for FreeBSD. All these files make up a single entity > "FreeBSD" the operating system. Why on earth would you install each item > that's required to run FreeBSD as a separate package? All this will do is > create increased overhead when installing the system (as each package must > go through it's verification and transaction process), and all sorts of > trouble down the line when dependency hell sets in. > If it hasn't set in when a new dependency was free and it's cost hidden, chances are we are safe. One big problem wi freebsd in embedded space is getting a good subset. Fine grain gives that a fighting chance. Warner > This is not the FreeBSD way. Very sad, concerned, and disappointed at this > design choice. > On 7/30/2025 3:30 AM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote: > > On Wed 30 Jul 02:28, vermaden wrote: > > Hi, > > after short discussion here: > - https://github.com/freebsd/pkg/issues/2485 > > I got REALLY concerned. > > One of THE features and selling points of a FreeBSD UNIX system is the > 'untouchable' Base System. > > untouchable is really subjective and has always been, there are so many build > options and one of the selling point for many is the customizability, in > particular for the wildly deploy use case of appliances. > > But even on desktops people keeps tweaking the build options... > > Without PKGBASE all the features are preserved. > > But when You convert to PKGBASE its ... GONE! > > Consider this command: > > # pkg delete -af > > What it does? > > It removes all third party packages on 'classic' FreeBSD system without > touching the FreeBSD Base System. > > No it remove all the packages. semantic matters. > > What the same "pkg delete -af" command does on a PKGBASE FreeBSD system? > > It kills/destroys almost all of the FreeBSD Base System and leaves only two > PKGBASE packages called: > > - FreeBSD-clibs > - FreeBSD-runtime > > This is why the vital flag are designed for. > > All the rest of Base System is GONE. Destroyed. > > You do not even have vi(1) editor ad /rescue is separate not protected > FreeBSD-rescue package and its also removed. > > WTF?! > > POLA is the principle that made FreeBSD such predictable system. Where is the > POLA now? > > Why the same *pkg delete -af* command on 'classic' FreeBSD system without > PKGBASE only removes all third party packages and the same *pkg delete -af* > literally destroys most of the FreeBSD PKGBASE Base System? > > Its crazy ... > > Before jumping straight into making a drama, maybe ask for the plan? or > discuss > with people involved, or even better propose some help? > > The plan is the following for years: either create meta packages which will be > flagged as vital for various combinaison of pkgbase: base, base-minimal, > base-oci etc., etc. and use groups (marked as vital as well) if they are ready > by then. This part has been delayed because: groups are now ready yet in pkg > but > might be there by the time 15.0-RELEASE is there. > > Bapt > > >
